OSAS supporters, explain these, if you will please.

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notuptome

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May 17, 2013
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Then show the verse that says one can be apart of the group Christian unconditionally or that an individual can be sealed unconditionally apart from the group Christian.
The problem here is that you impress into the discussion the things you find in yourself. Proverbs 10:12 Believers have no interest in living apart from Christ their beloved. Only when you see God's grace in the absolute purity of His love can you glimpse God's desire to give the gift of salvation unconditionally to those who are unconditionally unworthy.

An angry sea stirs up mire and dirt. Isa 57:20

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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1 John 3:6 No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him.
So then how many know him? truthfully, it sounds as I some others are better than others, and from Fathers viewpoint, there is not one better than another is there?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
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Christ died for all men Heb 2:9 so if salvation were unconditional as Eternal Securists claim, then ALL men should be saved. But all men are not saved for all will not CONDITIONALLY obey Heb 5:9
He, Yeshua, went to the cross for all and died for all sins of mankind, that part is done.
Yet not all have new life, an that is what is left to get here today, in the resurrected life of Yeshua, in Spirit and truth
Saved by the risen life not by the death. Death was needed to put us in presence of Father where we are made as if we are perfect, to get the free gift of new life from Father in Spirit and truth, thus loving all, as Christ loved us, and still does to this very day.
Do you get this?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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The sealing is conditional...to be sealed one must be CONDITIONALLY in the group.

No individual can be sealed outside the group.

The issue is one can fall from that sealed group and therefore no longer be sealed unconditionally apart from the group.

So once a person is in the group he is sealed and remains that way..as long as he remains in the group. No verse says it is impossible to fall from the sealed group.

The group is made up of individuals but it was NEVER the individual sealed apart from the group, it was the group God foreknew and sealed, not the individual. You cannot show one example of an individual that is sealed apart from the group.

seabass, bless you to come to what is needed for you if anything is needed, and the same for me and all the rest of us

It sounds like you are special, what group? please tell me what denomination you belong to, and if you leave it you are condemned?
I surely do not want to be condemned, so what Church am I to attend to be a part of the group you are speaking of?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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If the Scripture says quench not the Spirit.....then the Spirit can be quenched ...we can conclude these things are the will of God for us and if we don't do them the Spirit can be quenched
[SUP]12 [/SUP]And we beseech you, brethren, to know them which labour among you, and are over you in the Lord, and admonish you; [SUP]13 [/SUP]and to esteem them very highly in love for their work’s sake. And be at peace among yourselves. [SUP]14 [/SUP]Now we exhort you, brethren, warn them that are unruly, comfort the feebleminded, support the weak, be patient toward all men. [SUP]15 [/SUP]See that none render evil for evil unto any man; but ever follow that which is good, both among yourselves, and to all men.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]Rejoice evermore. [SUP]17 [/SUP]Pray without ceasing. [SUP]18 [/SUP]In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you. [SUP]19 [/SUP]Quench not the Spirit.
Yep, self righteousness quenches the Spirit of truth from Father, yeweh. So maybe die to self daily as Paul said to do?
Phil 3:10-11
 
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So then how many know him? truthfully, it sounds as I some others are better than others, and from Fathers viewpoint, there is not one better than another is there?
The scriptures are explicit. No one comes to God unless God calls them. Remember those scriptures that relate to predestination. God has predestined every single life on earth before the foundation of the earth was set.

John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 6:65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.


Meanwhile, scripture tells us that until those whom God knows and calls to him heed the call, they, like everyone, are dead in their sin. That is why no one can ever not be saved after finding their way to that explicit call from God to arrive at salvation. And that is why those who denounce "OSAS", as they call it, are wrong.
 
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homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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Jesus is not dead my friend......
I am glad to know that you know God does just love you. Yet in reading your posts I see you riding the fence and have not come to know the full truth in this love of God poured all over this world to us all through Son, Yeshua
Maybe look in a mirror, for I see you taking out of two sides of your mouth
Asking for you to see an hold self accountable, to not be just worshiping with your lips, and the heart not a part of that
 

homwardbound

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Oct 24, 2012
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Oh and good luck with that? For noone has ever pleased God in the flesh, but Christ Jesus alone

Without the resurrected Christ, we are still in our sins, and Christ is risen for us here and now in Spirit and truth only[/QUOTE No one has ever pleased God in the flesh , but if you take out the word "flesh" yes then many have pleased God.Which is true. I have thought about this ,like you, alot. Many things have gone through my mind, Maybe its like a spiritual turrets syndrome, I mean the way we jerk and change context and the train of though. May be we have people here who just are still spiritually illiterate and will grow. Iv" thought about not all being the same member , The eye can not say to the hand ' I have no need of you". Sometimes It makes me feel like I want to never listen to this rehashed, same old,Prideful,contentious ect. stuff any more . And there are a few other topics. One seems to be lately the Sabbath,The thread can be on"Jesus wept" and some how the seven day sabbath comes out of it. Then how the Sabbath really is not the first day of the week , then a hundred ways to divide the law up to prove a point," oh thats really not the law, no the law stops here, oh that a civil law ,no its only the ten commandments, I feel I know the scripture moderately well, But after reading what's being said my mind fill with confusion and contention and probably some other "quenching the Spirit" type thoughts, all to my own doing, You get my point, it is ridiculous.Some of us are young in Jesus ,some older, Some or all with some pre christian personal baggage. "Knowledge puffs up but love edifies"Why do I or we insist upon proving our doctrine and ourselves always right? We might say oh we have to speak the truth, or Thats just wrong and might send some one down the wrong path,Did you ever meet people who have to constantly make drama ,to start a division even when there is not one, Do they have to much spare time or what? Maybe this time should be spent in ministering to others, the poor ,Or really studying the scripture as some thing new, asking God for new insight that we did not have before. Sometimes I think people here think it's their ministry to cause these divisive contentions. We would be better of having a few mistakes that God will reveal , Than to "sow discord among the brethren".And where does it fit in where bro Paul says we know the idol nothing and can eat the meat offered to it with a clear conscience but then goes on to discuss a weaker brother,who because of his weaker conscience would be embolden to sin because of our fuller understanding?Will we be all things to all men that we might save some, would we never eat meat again so that some one else doesn't perish ,because of my "knowledge?" Conscience ,yes but not your own but of the weaker person.That takes place here every day.Some one is offended. Many are not receiving Jesus.Many go away confused when looking for love and support.I should stop and let other talk pray for me . My health is about at it's end. God bless
To begin with, God does just love you, period a fact beyond many others recognition.
For while we all were yet failures in being perfect ever from Adam on to this very day, God came in the body of Son, to redeem us as if we are perfect, even though we all know we aren’t.
But this world has denied this sovereignty of God through Christ, by trying to be perfect after belief, and by this trying one can’t.
Brother my health is at its end as well, and that is not easy to accept, until maybe you can see that when your time comes, you will no longer be in an unredeemed flesh body that you are in now that gets sick.
I was 1 year and 10 months ago, in surgery, was not expected to live, and even said I am ready to go, and was, ready, yet I made it through this surgery, went to a wheel chair, to a walker to a cane. Now walking, and some other problems still hanging around to buffet me maybe? I do not know for sure.
But I do know this now, that whatever is, is. When I could not accept it is what it is, I never could heal at all, I was toooooooooo busy with not wanting what is to not be what is. So when I accepted and willing to stay in a wheel chair, I amazingly got out of it, and have been healing to the best of the ability this body that is dying since first birth can.
Reality Friend, we all physically die, 100% and there is no improvement in sight is there?
But we can live here and now in Spirit and truth as in
John 4:24Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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The scriptures are explicit. No one comes to God unless God calls them. Remember those scriptures that relate to predestination. God has predestined every single life on earth before the foundation of the earth was set.

John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 6:65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.


Meanwhile, scripture tells us that until those whom God knows and calls to him heed the call, they, like everyone, are dead in their sin. That is why no one can ever not be saved after finding their way to that explicit call from God to arrive at salvation. And that is why those who denounce "OSAS", as they call it, are wrong.
Sister God has called all, and God hopes by all’s free choice all will believe God, in that God by Son did all for us that was needed for us to get new life in God. It is the Mercy of God that does the saving of the Soul, and when one receives this Mercy in sincerity, one pours it out, as God leads not us any longer
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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Where does it say Christ fetched the Prodigal son? I'm not saying Christ did or didn't, but it seems to me that the Father waited for the son to come home and didn't go after him. However, if by the circumstances is the means by which God will use to bring someone back home, I will not deny, but then again, not everyone comes home.
So true, and he never leaves us nor forsake amazing, always there for us in love to us
So I is the

Romans 2 Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)2 Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things. [SUP]2 [/SUP]But we are sure that the judgment of God is according to truth against them which commit such things. [SUP]3 [/SUP]And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God? [SUP]4 [/SUP]Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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Proverbs 26:11
As a dog returneth to his vomit, so a fool returneth to his folly.


the original quote from proverbs...and this is what Peter wrote
2 Peter 2:22
But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

Not once did he call or refer to anyone as a dog... telling someone they acted like a dog is different from telling someone they are a dog.....the action is like that of a dog...the fact remains they returned which means they had left before...No one forces the dog back to his vomit , the pig to the mud nor the believer back to sin and unbelief...some have itching ears and fall prey to false doctrines
So are you doing this and wish not to?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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Col 1:18 the body is the church, the group Christian.
Eph 5:23 Christ is the Saviour of the body.

Nowhere is the verse that says Christ will unconditionally save the individual outside the body/church?
Who is this Church you keep speaking of?
 
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maybe I am ...it is you who stated Paul never knew the living Jesus
That's right. He didn't. Paul never knew the living Jesus. Meaning, Jesus in the flesh.


So now you tell me which Jesus did he know?
He didn't know Jesus at all. This is evident in his ministering when he speaks largely in first person. And very often contradicts all that the living Jesus taught in his ministry.
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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But, Paul told Timothy to "take heed to himself and to his doctrine, he would save himself and those who hear him. " A little doubt in our selves would make us trust and worship God more.! Love Hoffco
But no doubt in God save us eternally, even as we make mistakes. God never leaves us nor forsakes us. Have doubt in this and the serpent is temporarily winning. But God has already won us back by Son, Its done, so do you believe or have to add somthing?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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Then show the verse that says one can be apart of the group Christian unconditionally or that an individual can be sealed unconditionally apart from the group Christian.
So it's " group Christian" tell me please where is the true (Church) Tabernacle at?
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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Gal 1:12 what Paul preached was from Christ.

The apostles preaching was the same as Christ preaching Eph 2:17.
I am of Apolos , I am of Paul, I am, I am and Paul said he is glad he Baptized none of you, he came to preach the Gospel, the new life in the resurrected Christ, after receiving Christ’s death as your death to self
 

homwardbound

Senior Member
Oct 24, 2012
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That's right. He didn't. Paul never knew the living Jesus. Meaning, Jesus in the flesh.


He didn't know Jesus at all. This is evident in his ministering when he speaks largely in first person. And very often contradicts all that the living Jesus taught in his ministry.
Sister, Paul as Peter stated is not easy to understand, yet Peter and all the Apostles gave him the right hand of fellowship
 
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Sister God has called all, and God hopes by all’s free choice all will believe God, in that God by Son did all for us that was needed for us to get new life in God. It is the Mercy of God that does the saving of the Soul, and when one receives this Mercy in sincerity, one pours it out, as God leads not us any longer
If that is what you feel you need to believe. But it isn't supported by scripture.