Contradiction of WORDS
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and yet again you miss the point where we believe the word of God over doctrine of Man...
James 2:21-25King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]21 [/SUP]Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
[SUP]22 [/SUP]Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
James 2:21-25King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]21 [/SUP]Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
[SUP]22 [/SUP]Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
You can lie, twist, ignore all you want....your false accusations prove who you are following as the devil was a liar from the beginning....so...not only does your actions belie who you really are, but your false doctrine of works/water also testifies to your immediate lost state....now....put your glasses on and open your eyes before you read the following dude....
Originally Posted by dcontroversal
No doubt.....and I agree lost-->hear the word-->believe the word-->saved, justified, sanctified and then works... SO.....keep on taking away from what is said and lying about what I teach as ALL LIARS shall have their part in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone!
Faith cometh BY HEARING and HEARING BY THE WORD OF GOD NOT WORKS
THOSE whom he saved HE JUSTIFIED and the ones JUSTIFIED have been SANCTIFIED as NO one can do WORKS for GOD until they are saved, justified and (SET APART) as useable....open your eyes before it is too late for you!
No doubt.....and I agree lost-->hear the word-->believe the word-->saved, justified, sanctified and then works... SO.....keep on taking away from what is said and lying about what I teach as ALL LIARS shall have their part in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone!
Faith cometh BY HEARING and HEARING BY THE WORD OF GOD NOT WORKS
THOSE whom he saved HE JUSTIFIED and the ones JUSTIFIED have been SANCTIFIED as NO one can do WORKS for GOD until they are saved, justified and (SET APART) as useable....open your eyes before it is too late for you!
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this blindness is about time and dates. and the different relationship to the law.
for exampl, when could an gentile go to a temple of stone,(for forgiveness via animal sac etc)
when did he get the the full law and degrees. (gentile)
what disciple was one to a gentile.
(paul)
7 On the contrary, when they saw that I had been entrusted with the gospel to the uncircumcised, just as Peter had been entrusted with the gospel to the circumcised 8 (for he who worked through Peter for his apostolic ministry to the circumcised worked also through me for mine to the Gentiles),Galatians 2:
when was a gentile excepted out side christian circles. (ie by none christian jews)
play on words.
James 2:21-25King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]21 [/SUP]Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
[SUP]22 [/SUP]Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
we know james is jewish and was at act 15
6 just as Abraham "believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness"?
7 Know then that it is those of faith who are the sons of Abraham.8 And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith,preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, "In you shall all the nations be blessed."9 So then, those who are of faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith.Galatians 2:
we know paul is jewish both were at act 15.
both are heirs because of believing in jesus.(jewish and gentiles)
27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.29 And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise.Galatians 3:
there relationship to law had to follow to ad 70 because the requirement the law had via the temple of stone.
after 70ad how could they get forgiveness via animal (jewish) and the the rest it required etc.
when acts 15 asks what law is a gentile to follow, again they could have said 10 commandments or full law etc but they did not.
paul explains this in galatians to the jewish people there. or word to that affect. etc
for exampl, when could an gentile go to a temple of stone,(for forgiveness via animal sac etc)
when did he get the the full law and degrees. (gentile)
what disciple was one to a gentile.
(paul)
7 On the contrary, when they saw that I had been entrusted with the gospel to the uncircumcised, just as Peter had been entrusted with the gospel to the circumcised 8 (for he who worked through Peter for his apostolic ministry to the circumcised worked also through me for mine to the Gentiles),Galatians 2:
when was a gentile excepted out side christian circles. (ie by none christian jews)
play on words.
James 2:21-25King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]21 [/SUP]Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
[SUP]22 [/SUP]Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
we know james is jewish and was at act 15
6 just as Abraham "believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness"?
7 Know then that it is those of faith who are the sons of Abraham.8 And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith,preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, "In you shall all the nations be blessed."9 So then, those who are of faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith.Galatians 2:
we know paul is jewish both were at act 15.
both are heirs because of believing in jesus.(jewish and gentiles)
27 For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.29 And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's offspring, heirs according to promise.Galatians 3:
there relationship to law had to follow to ad 70 because the requirement the law had via the temple of stone.
after 70ad how could they get forgiveness via animal (jewish) and the the rest it required etc.
when acts 15 asks what law is a gentile to follow, again they could have said 10 commandments or full law etc but they did not.
paul explains this in galatians to the jewish people there. or word to that affect. etc
You can lie, twist, ignore all you want....your false accusations prove who you are following as the devil was a liar from the beginning....so...not only does your actions belie who you really are, but your false doctrine of works/water also testifies to your immediate lost state....now....put your glasses on and open your eyes before you read the following dude....
Originally Posted by dcontroversal
No doubt.....and I agree lost-->hear the word-->believe the word-->saved, justified, sanctified and then works... SO.....keep on taking away from what is said and lying about what I teach as ALL LIARS shall have their part in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone!
Faith cometh BY HEARING and HEARING BY THE WORD OF GOD NOT WORKS
THOSE whom he saved HE JUSTIFIED and the ones JUSTIFIED have been SANCTIFIED as NO one can do WORKS for GOD until they are saved, justified and (SET APART) as useable....open your eyes before it is too late for you!
No doubt.....and I agree lost-->hear the word-->believe the word-->saved, justified, sanctified and then works... SO.....keep on taking away from what is said and lying about what I teach as ALL LIARS shall have their part in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone!
Faith cometh BY HEARING and HEARING BY THE WORD OF GOD NOT WORKS
THOSE whom he saved HE JUSTIFIED and the ones JUSTIFIED have been SANCTIFIED as NO one can do WORKS for GOD until they are saved, justified and (SET APART) as useable....open your eyes before it is too late for you!
>hear the word-->believe the word(faith)-->saved,=faith without works to be saved... What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
I am reminded of the illustration in Proverbs about grinding someone in a mortar with a pestle, to get thru the ol NewB cabeza.
NewB,
Do you admit that saving faith is depending on the Savior, not merely affirming that certain facts are so?
If you were studying the internal combustion engine, would you admit
1) intake,
2) compression,
3) power,
4) exhaust?
Can you admit the order of the operations as in Eph 2?:
sinner, faith, salvation, works?
1)sinner2) God's grace with man's faith
3) Salvation; Re-creation by God
4) Good Works
1) Lost man is a hopeless sinner.
2:1 And you did he make alive, when ye were dead through your trespasses and sins, 2 wherein ye once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the powers of the air, of the spirit that now worketh in the sons of disobedience; 3 among whom we also all once lived in the lusts of our flesh, doing the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest:
2) God's grace with man's faith
— but God, being rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace have ye been saved), and raised us up with him, and made us to sit with him in the heavenly places, in Christ Jesus: that in the ages to come he might show the exceeding riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus: 8for by grace have ye been saved
through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
not of works, that no man should glory.
3) Salvation; Recreation by God, New Birth
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus
4) Good Works
for good works, which God afore prepared that we should walk in them.
NewB,
Do you admit that saving faith is depending on the Savior, not merely affirming that certain facts are so?
If you were studying the internal combustion engine, would you admit
1) intake,
2) compression,
3) power,
4) exhaust?
Can you admit the order of the operations as in Eph 2?:
sinner, faith, salvation, works?
1)sinner2) God's grace with man's faith
3) Salvation; Re-creation by God
4) Good Works
1) Lost man is a hopeless sinner.
2:1 And you did he make alive, when ye were dead through your trespasses and sins, 2 wherein ye once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the powers of the air, of the spirit that now worketh in the sons of disobedience; 3 among whom we also all once lived in the lusts of our flesh, doing the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest:
2) God's grace with man's faith
— but God, being rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace have ye been saved), and raised us up with him, and made us to sit with him in the heavenly places, in Christ Jesus: that in the ages to come he might show the exceeding riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus: 8for by grace have ye been saved
through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
not of works, that no man should glory.
3) Salvation; Recreation by God, New Birth
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus
4) Good Works
for good works, which God afore prepared that we should walk in them.
what is your point?...what time and dates...Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to all who believe
Galatians 3:27-29King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]27 [/SUP]For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
[SUP]28 [/SUP]There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
[SUP]29 [/SUP]And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
Colossians 3:11
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.
Romans 4:16
Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,
Romans 10:3-5King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP]For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
Galatians 3:27-29King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]27 [/SUP]For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
[SUP]28 [/SUP]There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
[SUP]29 [/SUP]And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
Colossians 3:11
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.
Romans 4:16
Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,
Romans 10:3-5King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]3 [/SUP]For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
Romans 10:4
For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
their relationship has to be in Christ now....one has to believe and do as Christ says now....
For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
their relationship has to be in Christ now....one has to believe and do as Christ says now....
your post
and yet again you miss the point where we believe the word of God over doctrine of Man...
James 2:21-25King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]21 [/SUP]Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
[SUP]22 [/SUP]Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
compared to
5 Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith---6 just as Abraham "believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness"?
7 Know then that it is those of faith who are the sons of Abraham.8 And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, "In you shall all the nations be blessed."9 So then, those who are of faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith.
so following what god tells you, is this work or faith.
15 To give a human example, brothers: even with a man-made covenant, no one annuls it or adds to it once it has been ratified.16 Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. It does not say, "And to offsprings," referring to many, but referring to one, "And to your offspring," who is Christ.17 This is what I mean: the law, which came 430 years afterward, does not annul a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to make the promise void.18 For if the inheritance comes by the law, it no longer comes by promise; but God gave it to Abraham by a promise.
21 Is the law then contrary to the promises of God? Certainly not! For if a law had been given that could give life, then righteousness would indeed be by the law.2
and yet again you miss the point where we believe the word of God over doctrine of Man...
James 2:21-25King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]21 [/SUP]Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
[SUP]22 [/SUP]Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
compared to
5 Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith---6 just as Abraham "believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness"?
7 Know then that it is those of faith who are the sons of Abraham.8 And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, "In you shall all the nations be blessed."9 So then, those who are of faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith.
so following what god tells you, is this work or faith.
15 To give a human example, brothers: even with a man-made covenant, no one annuls it or adds to it once it has been ratified.16 Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. It does not say, "And to offsprings," referring to many, but referring to one, "And to your offspring," who is Christ.17 This is what I mean: the law, which came 430 years afterward, does not annul a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to make the promise void.18 For if the inheritance comes by the law, it no longer comes by promise; but God gave it to Abraham by a promise.
21 Is the law then contrary to the promises of God? Certainly not! For if a law had been given that could give life, then righteousness would indeed be by the law.2
would that be with .work or faith or with law
are you trying to use all teachings, that came from past to follow through change. but dont understand what has changed
how can you follow the full law of moses without a temple of stone, after 70 ad
so act 15 is proven correct.
1 But some men came down from Judea and were teaching the brothers, "Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved
5 But some believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees rose up and said, "It is necessary to circumcise them and to order them to keep the law of Moses."
8 And God, who knows the heart, bore witness to them, by giving them the Holy Spirit just as he did to us,9 and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.
10 Now, therefore, why are you putting God to the test by placing a yoke on the neck of the disciples that neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear?11 But we believe that we will be saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus, just as they will."
19 Therefore my judgment is that we should not trouble those of the Gentiles who turn to God,20 but should write to them to abstain from the things polluted by idols, and from sexual immorality, and from what has been strangled, and from blood.21 For from ancient generations Moses has had in every city those who proclaim him, for he is read every Sabbath in the synagogues."
are you trying to use all teachings, that came from past to follow through change. but dont understand what has changed
how can you follow the full law of moses without a temple of stone, after 70 ad
so act 15 is proven correct.
1 But some men came down from Judea and were teaching the brothers, "Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved
5 But some believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees rose up and said, "It is necessary to circumcise them and to order them to keep the law of Moses."
8 And God, who knows the heart, bore witness to them, by giving them the Holy Spirit just as he did to us,9 and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.
10 Now, therefore, why are you putting God to the test by placing a yoke on the neck of the disciples that neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear?11 But we believe that we will be saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus, just as they will."
19 Therefore my judgment is that we should not trouble those of the Gentiles who turn to God,20 but should write to them to abstain from the things polluted by idols, and from sexual immorality, and from what has been strangled, and from blood.21 For from ancient generations Moses has had in every city those who proclaim him, for he is read every Sabbath in the synagogues."
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what part of ........
For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
their relationship has to be in Christ now....one has to believe and do as Christ says now..
Don't you understand...
Did I mention Moses? ... I mention law....the END of the law for righteousness to everyone that believes? I made no mention of those who don't believe.....so stop bringing up this rubbish about temple of stone...this is the stone I know about...
1 Peter 2:4-6King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]4 [/SUP]To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious,
[SUP]5 [/SUP]Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded.
For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
their relationship has to be in Christ now....one has to believe and do as Christ says now..
Don't you understand...
Did I mention Moses? ... I mention law....the END of the law for righteousness to everyone that believes? I made no mention of those who don't believe.....so stop bringing up this rubbish about temple of stone...this is the stone I know about...
1 Peter 2:4-6King James Version (KJV)
[SUP]4 [/SUP]To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious,
[SUP]5 [/SUP]Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded.