Gods Mercy,Why the Jews are Still Gods Chosen People

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john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
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That's because in God's consistent language of the Bible, "thousand" always means an "indeterminate length of time". Never an exact period on a calendar as the futurists teach.
Dr. Strong disagrees...

G5507

χίλιοι
chilioi
khil'-ee-oy
Plural of uncertain affinity; a thousand: - thousand.
Total KJV occurrences: 11

The Diaglott disagrees...

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones; and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them; and the souls of those having been cut with an axe because of the testimony of Jesus and because of the word of the God, and who not worshipped the wild-beast not the image of him, and not received the mark on the forehead and on the hand of themselves; and they lived, and they reigned with the Anointed one the thousand years.

And every translation you read disagrees with this.

The word Millennium is not found in the Bible but thousand is.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
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Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection:
on such the second death hath no power,

but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.
This is the first resurrection.

And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan,
and bound him a thousand years,

And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him,
that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: a
nd after that he must be loosed a little season.

And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,


I believe it means a thousand years.

So did the translators, Dr. James Strong and Benjamin Wilson who published the Diaglott.
 

john832

Senior Member
May 31, 2013
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@kennethcadwell
No, that is not false. That is a sure truth as a rock, unless you are not of His sheep. And you are one of them.

I believe that the Tribulation and God's wrath fell on Jesus at the Cross.
He drank the full cup, wrung out, the cup intended for the unfaithful woman.
There surely is some literal application but I am not yet sure which one is correct.
Then who are these?

Rev 7:13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
Rev 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Did they come out of Christ's tribulation on the cross?
 
Mar 12, 2014
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Yep. just like paul said in romans 11 (blinded in part) or do you not understand what "in part" means?




No it does not. Romans 9 is about salvation, romans 11 refutes post mills, and amills.. Nice try though.



rom 9 showed God did not save a jew just because they were a jew, And God did not make a mistake picking Isreal. it does not refute romans 11, which says Israel is blind in part. until a future date..

Nice try though

Romans 9 Paul is refuting Jewish argument about God having cast them off. The first part of Rom 9 Paul refutes the Jews main argument that God had to choose them simply because they were the fleshly descendants of Abraham. Paul refutes that by showing how Jacob (Israel) and Esau (Edom) were both decendents of Isaac whom the Jews considered to be Abraham and Sara's true son. Edom was just as much true fleshly descendants of Abraham as Israel but Edom was not chosen. Thereby proving God does NOT have to base His promises/choices solely on physical decendency totally refuting the Jews argument.
It has nothing to do with the personal salvation of Jacob or Esau, that is the wresting of Calvinism.
 
Mar 12, 2014
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Your right,

The law is our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ, It proves we are ALL sinners, and need Gods grace, this should lead us to Christ, but some of us still want to get their by law. The law has yet to lead them to Christ, They still think they can be good enough.

There was grace in the OT too but that grace did not nullify law.
 

SoulWeaver

Senior Member
Oct 25, 2014
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Yes, tribulation is persecution.
His prophets and saints and all the righteous have been persecuted since the beginning because Word of God (Jesus) was in them.
I think the timetable is what is causing confusion. It happened, it is happening and it shall happen.
God is eternal and what you cite is the eternal truth.
 
Mar 12, 2014
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we are not discussing staying in land, we are discussing the return to the land as prophesied AFTER they repent. so why do you keep repeating the same stuff over and over, which does NOT directly relate to the thread?

God removed the OFF the land. No verse says God will return it to them. When God gave them the land and they possessed it that FULFILLED God's promise so that promise will not, cannot be fulfilled AGAIN.
 
Mar 12, 2014
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So Hitler boo boo'd exterminating millions of so called Jews?

The Roman army (AD 70) providentially destroyed all ancestral documents making it impossible for anyone today to trace their ancestry back to one of the 12 tribes. Many people today claim to be a Jew but cannot prove it. Can you prove that any Hitler murdered was a Jew? Can you trace their ancestry back to one of the 12 tribes?
 
Mar 12, 2014
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I do have to disagree with this my friend. Israel is yet to become the nation God chose it to be. Israel will lead the Gentiles to salvation in the Millennium.
Gospel salvation went to the Gentiles back in Acts 10, some 2,000 years ago.
 
Mar 12, 2014
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But they couldn't believe God, it was not given to them...

Mat 13:11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
Mat 13:12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
Mat 13:13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
Mat 13:14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
Mat 13:15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.

They were blinded so that God could have mercy on them at the Last Great Day.

Verse 15 above, they closed their own eyes and ears is why they could not understand. If God caused men to be lost against their will, then I for one would not waste my time worshipping such a sorry god.
 
Mar 12, 2014
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What makes an unconditional covenant has nothing to do with temporary conditions put on the subjects of the covenant but on the unconditional promise by the maker of the covenant that He will ultimately bring the promises to pass, regardless of the unfaithfulness of the 2nd party.

Who said the conditions were only temporary?
 
Mar 12, 2014
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Where does Jesus rule from then when He comes again and reigns for 1,000 years on earth before He releases Satan again ?
Jesus will not return and reign for a 1000 years. Premillennialism is a teaching of man, not biblical.

Jer 22:28-30 says Christ will not reign on earth with an earthly kingdom/throne as does Jn 18:36; 1 Thess 4:17, etc.
 
Oct 24, 2014
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this exemplifies the problems one runs into when 'spiritualizing' the texts. Take another look at what happens with the valley...didn't happen during his prayer in Gethsemane. ..

Zechariah 14:3-4
3 Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.
4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.
Ever notice that the only folks who have a problem with "spiritualizing" something are only those who are blind to what the spirit is revealing right in front of them? The New Testament IS the Spirtual Fulfillment of the Natural Old Testament.

Try to keep this in mind;

(1Co 15:46)
Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

This principal will NEVER change, which in itself knocks the stuffing out of anything you've ever opined quite frankly.

EVERYONE HELLO IMPORTANT DEMONSTRATION...

Here's how you study to find out what O.T. prophecies mean. You go to the place in the N.T. that talks about it! DOH! Let's try it!

Ok, ALL of Zecharia is about Salvation to Israel, right?

So BOOM!
(Luk 1:54)
He hath holpen his servant Israel, in remembrance of his mercy;

(Luk 1:55)
As he spake to our fathers, to Abraham, and to his seed for ever.

See? Ya can't argue with that haHaaAA! When Jesus came He fulfilled the Covenant of Abraham and His Seed.

You can stand on this and satan can never take it from you friends :) It is a Rock of Salvation knowing this. Israel is Saved.

Now, let's look at some of these verses that also demonstrate Zecharia those verses;

Zechariah 14:3-4
3 Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.
4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south
5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains: for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the day of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee

(Joh 16:33)
These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.
(1Jn 5:4)
For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.


(Rev 19:11)
And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
(Rev 19:12)
His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
(Rev 19:13)
And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
(Rev 19:14)
And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
(Rev 19:15)
And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
(Rev 19:16)
And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

(Mat 21:1)
And when they drew nigh unto Jerusalem, and were come to Bethphage, unto the mount of Olives, then sent Jesus two disciples,


(Mar 11:1)
And when they came nigh to Jerusalem, unto Bethphage and Bethany, at the mount of Olives, he sendeth forth two of his disciples,


(Act 1:9)
And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.


(Act 1:12)
Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.





(Luk 21:27)
And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.


(Act 1:8)
But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.


(Mat 25:31)
When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:





(Eph 2:6)
And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:


(1Th 3:13)
To the end he may stablish your hearts unblameable in holiness before God, even our Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints.





(Jud 1:14)
And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,


(1Co 14:33)
For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
 
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Mar 12, 2014
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So again, that teaching writes off billions who have lived prior to this "present and last dispensation". It also writes off the billions who will be born and live their lives during the Millennial reign of Christ.

No, Christ died for all before and after the cross, Heb 9:15.
 
K

kennethcadwell

Guest
Yes, tribulation is persecution.
His prophets and saints and all the righteous have been persecuted since the beginning because Word of God (Jesus) was in them.
I think the timetable is what is causing confusion. It happened, it is happening and it shall happen.
God is eternal and what you cite is the eternal truth.

Yes, but you must know there is a difference in personal tribulations and the tribulation period the bible speaks of.
We all face personal tribulations in our lives, death of love ones, financial hardships, being downgraded, and so on......
But this is not the tribulation period the bible speaks of in the last days, where the antichrist will rise to power, the temple rebuilt, and the final two battles to take place.
Along with the severe rise in pestilence, hunger, and death that will come to an all time high as never before.
Plus the 200 million man army the antichrist will control which has never happened before.

There is still a lot to happen before the 1,000 year reign can take place, and then only after these things and our Lords reign does the new heaven and new earth are formed, and then the new Jerusalem comes down on to earth.
 
Oct 24, 2014
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Yes, but you must know there is a difference in personal tribulations and the tribulation period the bible speaks of.
We all face personal tribulations in our lives, death of love ones, financial hardships, being downgraded, and so on......
But this is not the tribulation period the bible speaks of in the last days, where the antichrist will rise to power, the temple rebuilt, and the final two battles to take place.
Along with the severe rise in pestilence, hunger, and death that will come to an all time high as never before.
Plus the 200 million man army the antichrist will control which has never happened before.

There is still a lot to happen before the 1,000 year reign can take place, and then only after these things and our Lords reign does the new heaven and new earth are formed, and then the new Jerusalem comes down on to earth.
Oh no! Lol. This is quite the prophecy Kennethcadwell. Hope you know what you're doing hehe.

Everyone, Google "Harold Camping" just for fun...
 

SoulWeaver

Senior Member
Oct 25, 2014
4,889
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I do believe the evil will increase and Jesus is coming back and then everything will burn and the cosmos come to an end as we know it.
2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
There will be things such as these coming to pass. Literal? Apparently.

I am only not sure that we have the timetable right when interpreting the things that will literally come to pass.
Jesus said it was "at hand" and that He is coming back "quickly" which tells me that the timetable should be understood a little differently. He is about Now and Today.
 
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Oct 24, 2014
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Dr. Strong disagrees...

G5507

χίλιοι
chilioi
khil'-ee-oy
Plural of uncertain affinity; a thousand: - thousand.
Total KJV occurrences: 11

The Diaglott disagrees...

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones; and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them; and the souls of those having been cut with an axe because of the testimony of Jesus and because of the word of the God, and who not worshipped the wild-beast not the image of him, and not received the mark on the forehead and on the hand of themselves; and they lived, and they reigned with the Anointed one the thousand years.

And every translation you read disagrees with this.

The word Millennium is not found in the Bible but thousand is.
Refer back to the scriptures I gave you before you get yourself all tied up in your theological ball of yarn. Yes of course it says "thousand". DOH!

But NOW READ THE SCRIPTURES TO KNOW WHAT THOUSAND MEANS. I gave them to you. They are repeated three times, threeeeeee times so you might get it. Bonk bonk this thing on?
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
30,742
3,670
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That's because in God's consistent language of the Bible, "thousand" always means an "indeterminate length of time". Never an exact period on a calendar as the futurists teach.

Here's some examples, and again, always from the Word of God of course :)... (This way we know WHO to believe!)

(Deu 7:9)
Know therefore that the LORD thy God, he is God; the faithful God, which keepeth covenant and mercy with them that love him and keep his commandments to a thousand generations;

(1Ch 16:15)
Remember his covenant for ever, the word which he commanded to a thousand generations;

(Psa 105:8)
He hath remembered his covenant for ever, the word which he commanded to a thousand generations;


It's an Everlasting Never Ending Covenant to us who Receive Christ :) The Blood of the Everlasting Marriage Covenant woohoo thank you Jesus for saving Israel in your Blood a thousand generations even as FOREVER!



(Heb 13:5)
Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.


(Mat 28:20)
Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway,evenunto the end of the world. Amen.
has nothing to do with futurists, some take it as a literal thousand years, some say a long period...both say it's future and a literal reign.
 
K

kennethcadwell

Guest
Oh no! Lol. This is quite the prophecy Kennethcadwell. Hope you know what you're doing hehe.

Everyone, Google "Harold Camping" just for fun...

I am not making a prophecy.

I am just speaking of the things the bible says has to take place.
Even Jesus said there would be signs that we will see to usher in the last days, and He told us what those signs would be.

All you have to do is look at what the Lord said in the gospel like in Matthew 24, take also Revelations, Daniel, Ezekiel, Isaiah, and the other OT prophets said to get an understanding. And if you believe all the prophecies in the bible have already been fulfilled then you have not looked into them fully yet.

And as I have stated before when some one gives a prophecy, they state something is going to happen as absolute.
I have not done that, I have only stated what the bible says will take place. Not what I say will take place.