OSAS doctrine denies the faith
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J
It's nothing short of stupifying that you don't realize you just negated every argument you've ever made against eternal security.
If "no believer saves themselves" then explain how they then have power to keep themselves saved! Not only is that a huge contradiction, it is simply ignorant of biblical truth.
If "no believer saves themselves" then explain how they then have power to keep themselves saved! Not only is that a huge contradiction, it is simply ignorant of biblical truth.
2 Peter 2:20-22 “For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.[SUP]21 [/SUP]For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.[SUP]22 [/SUP]But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.”
OSAS'er don't like that one.
OSAS'er don't like that one.
the bottom line is this: people will chose to believe what the will, this is after all given to us, choice, that said it is pointless to discuss this matter as there is (like predestination verse freewill) proponents of both sides all armed with scripture and all reasonably certain they are correct, we stand or fall before the author and finisher of our faith, not before man, we do not have the task of convincing anyone but rather to peaceably give answer for the hope that is in us... this Hope is we will be raised on the great day and each will give account for what they were given and what they did with it. the Spirit of truth will lead and guide all into all truth if they choose to be lead, not dragged, The father of us all has each in His hand and His will is that none should parish, but some (many) will choose death rather then life, all who abide in Him, none will be lost NONE, its when we choose not to abide in Him that we are in a dark and dangerous place... seek peace, choose Love, and learn of Him, everyday. no matter what you believe now, if you do this, He will surely lead you, His arm is not shortened that He cannot save... Shalom.
Nice.
I was betting all 3 of them would ignore this post.
They can't answer it.
Pride over truth.
Or as one of them would put it.....The " Save Lite , Save Ourselves, Save the Whales, OSAS lite, Bud Light, Marlboro Lite, Night Lite. " way....he has invented. He needs to stick to it.
Let me bump it.......so they can ignore me also.
If someone has been born from above of the Holy Spirit they have received ETERNAL LIFE. If they could lose it, it would not be eternal. And that life within them will keep them desirous after God. Thus someone who permanently falls is clearly demonstrated as not having been born of the Spirit.
OK lets consider it.
What does it mean to be enlightened? Israel were enlightened at the Red Sea deliverance and at Sinai but most were not truly saved. As chapter 3 tells us they continued permanently in unbelief. The Scribes had been enlightened when they saw Jesus casting out evil spirits. In their hearts they knew that it was of God. And Jesus warned them that to continue to harden their hearts would render them incapable of forgiveness. But they had never been saved. He warned (as here) that if they quashed God's enlightening they would be without hope. It would be impossible to renew them to repentance.
The writer is saying - DO NOT BE LIKE THEM. Respond to Christ, do not harden your hearts.
Looking at the CONTEXT in chapter 3. If anyone had tasted of the heavenly gift it was Israel in the wilderness. They had the manna. They had the quails. They had miraculous water. They saw God's deliverance again and again. They experienced the activity of the Holy Spirit (e.g. Isaiah 63.11-14). Indeed in a real sense they were in partnership with the Holy Spirit. And yet they hardened their hearts in unbelief. The Scribes had seen Jesus perform amazing miracles. They had seen Him cast out the most powerful of evil spirits. They truly tasted of the heavenly gift and went on alongside the Holy Spirit (they were in danger of blaspheming against Him) . But they hardened their hearts and turned away.
The writer is saying, DO NOT BE LIKE THEM.
No one tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come like Israel in the wilderness. But they hardened their hearts and did not enter into His rest. All who heard Jesus, including the Scribes and Pharisees, tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, as Jesus made clear, but they too were in danger of putting themselves beyond repentance. The people to whom the writer was writing had tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come (Heb 2.3-4). So he warns them of the danger of neglecting what they have heard and not responding to God's salvation.
Unlike most of us these people had experienced God's word and God's power from unusual sources. This was why their final decision was irrevocable. To close their minds to what they had heard and seen was to put themselves beyond repentance..
Israel fell away in the wilderness and they were not finally given another chance. The Scribes and Pharisees received Jesus' words and saw His miracles, and saw evil spirits yielding to Him, and Jesus warned them that if they hardened their hearts they may not have another chance. But they fell away from Him and His words. Here the Jews who had experienced revival were warned of the same. They had experienced revival power, they had been faced up with the cross and He Who hung on it and rose again in the most vivid of ways. If they now turned away and fell away from what they had seen and heard they would literally be taking the deliberate decision to crucify Him afresh and shame Him. They had to choose. respond fully to Christ, or be permanently lost. Once they had opted to remain in Judaism they would have no other chance.
It is clear that these words do not apply to most people today. Many turn away from Christ again and again, only to come to Him at last. But it does not apply to them because they have not experienced the work of the Holy Spirit in true revival. They have never experienced what these readers had experienced, being involved in powerful Holy Spirit activity and supernatural illumination of a most intense kind. Anyone who reads these words need not fear that they have sinned so grievously that there is no way back for them. God's arms are still open to them. Let them but repent and seek Him and they will experience His mercy. But let them do it NOW before it is too late.[SUP]
[/SUP]
For every one who hears these words is one or the other. Either they are receptive ground, which drinks in the rain (of the Spirit) who will become fruitful because they receive the words of Jesus, and are blessed by God, or they will prove to be barren ground which is unable to produce fruit, and are in danger of being cursed. .It is the parable of the sower all over again.
quite right, you are interpreting the Scriptures wrongly
But I will not accuse YOU of twisting them, merely misinterpreting them Yes a warning to those who have been faced up with Christ, and have been spoken to by the Holy Spirit, not to turn back and fall away from what they have heard. They may not have another opportunity. Tomorrow they may be dead. Let them become Christians while they may.
Many will fall away from faith, and even from the faith, because they have never truly responded. Bu t no one who is in Christ's saving hands can finally fall away BECAUSE HE WILL NOT LET THEM. WE serve a powerful God.
That my dear friend is our plea to you. Do not deny the words of God when He assures us of our eternal security. Do not be deceived by the doctrines of devils who want to shake people's faith.
And so they will. And some of them, because they are truly His will be won back again. Whilst those who had not been truly His will continue to be astray. The REAL Christians will be distinguished from the nominal ones.
B
Jason, if I had the chance to spend a couple of weeks with you I could point out specific sins in your life, transgressions and carnal thinking so much so that you would have to believe that even you have forsaken the right way. It would not be difficult for me to do. If I could do it so easily, how much more could God do this leaving you trembling with condemnation and great guilt.
My goodness Jason, every man of God had some form of sin in his life and God covered it until he was ready to reveal it to them. All those verses you quoted have nothing to do with refuting OSAS. You have been disillusioned. The greatest self deception we face is when light turns into darkness and how great that darkness becomes. It is a darkness that is confessed as the light and as ministers of righteousness. It has no grace, no mercy and no truth.
Satan can quote the scriptures but there is no truth in for he is a liar from the beginning. If your eye be single your whole body shall be FULL of the light of truth. God is light and in him is no darkness at all.
My goodness Jason, every man of God had some form of sin in his life and God covered it until he was ready to reveal it to them. All those verses you quoted have nothing to do with refuting OSAS. You have been disillusioned. The greatest self deception we face is when light turns into darkness and how great that darkness becomes. It is a darkness that is confessed as the light and as ministers of righteousness. It has no grace, no mercy and no truth.
Satan can quote the scriptures but there is no truth in for he is a liar from the beginning. If your eye be single your whole body shall be FULL of the light of truth. God is light and in him is no darkness at all.
V
OSAS'er don't like that one.
Oh, on the contrary! We love the apostles condemnation of false prophets such as yourself! Because that is what this passage is, You just wish we wouldn't respond to it because these three verses are the end of a very long condemnation of false prophets. Funny you should call attention to it.
Deal in context much? Obviously not. It is no wonder you like this passage. It speaks of you -- a false prophet. Let's look at the whole paragraph, shall we? It goes all the way back to verse 1.
2 Peter 2, NASB
1 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.
2 Many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned;
3 and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.
4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to pits of darkness, reserved for judgment;
5 and did not spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah, a preacher of righteousness, with seven others, when He brought a flood upon the world of the ungodly;
6 and if He condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to destruction by reducing them to ashes, having made them an example to those who would live ungodly lives thereafter;
7 and if He rescued righteous Lot, oppressed by the sensual conduct of unprincipled men
8 (for by what he saw and heard that righteous man, while living among them, felt his righteous soul tormented day after day by their lawless deeds ),
9 then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from temptation, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment for the day of judgment,
10 and especially those who indulge the flesh in its corrupt desires and despise authority. Daring, self-willed, they do not tremble when they revile angelic majesties,
11 whereas angels who are greater in might and power do not bring a reviling judgment against them before the Lord.
12 But these, like unreasoning animals, born as creatures of instinct to be captured and killed, reviling where * they have no knowledge, will in the destruction of those creatures also be destroyed,
13 suffering wrong as the wages of doing wrong. They count it a pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are stains and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, as they carouse with you,
14 having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children;
15 forsaking the right way, they have gone astray, having followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
16 but he received a rebuke for his own transgression, for a mute donkey, speaking with a voice of a man, restrained the madness of the prophet.
17 These are springs without water and mists driven by a storm, for whom the black darkness has been reserved.
18 For speaking out arrogant words of vanity they entice by fleshly desires, by sensuality, those who barely escape from the ones who live in error,
19 promising them freedom while they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by what a man is overcome, by this he is enslaved.
20 For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first.
21 For it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them.
22 It has happened to them according to the true proverb, "A DOG RETURNS TO ITS OWN VOMIT," and, "A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire."
1 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.
2 Many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned;
3 and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.
4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to pits of darkness, reserved for judgment;
5 and did not spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah, a preacher of righteousness, with seven others, when He brought a flood upon the world of the ungodly;
6 and if He condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to destruction by reducing them to ashes, having made them an example to those who would live ungodly lives thereafter;
7 and if He rescued righteous Lot, oppressed by the sensual conduct of unprincipled men
8 (for by what he saw and heard that righteous man, while living among them, felt his righteous soul tormented day after day by their lawless deeds ),
9 then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from temptation, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment for the day of judgment,
10 and especially those who indulge the flesh in its corrupt desires and despise authority. Daring, self-willed, they do not tremble when they revile angelic majesties,
11 whereas angels who are greater in might and power do not bring a reviling judgment against them before the Lord.
12 But these, like unreasoning animals, born as creatures of instinct to be captured and killed, reviling where * they have no knowledge, will in the destruction of those creatures also be destroyed,
13 suffering wrong as the wages of doing wrong. They count it a pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are stains and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, as they carouse with you,
14 having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children;
15 forsaking the right way, they have gone astray, having followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
16 but he received a rebuke for his own transgression, for a mute donkey, speaking with a voice of a man, restrained the madness of the prophet.
17 These are springs without water and mists driven by a storm, for whom the black darkness has been reserved.
18 For speaking out arrogant words of vanity they entice by fleshly desires, by sensuality, those who barely escape from the ones who live in error,
19 promising them freedom while they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by what a man is overcome, by this he is enslaved.
20 For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first.
21 For it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them.
22 It has happened to them according to the true proverb, "A DOG RETURNS TO ITS OWN VOMIT," and, "A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire."
From the first verse to the last of chapter two, Peter condemns false prophets. He condemns you. Repent and believe.
Having the knowledge of Jesus Christ does not save a person if there is no heart submission to that knowledge. For this knowledge to be of any spiritual value, there must be a heart submission to that knowledge. A person who rejects this knowledge will be more accountable at the judgment. The latter end is worse than the beginning. The "way of righteousness" and "holy commandment" emphasize the ethical content of the knowledge the false teachers had. They knew what was right and holy, but they deliberately chose to reject it. They had knowledge of salvation, but they lacked that true saving experience with the Lord. Just like in Hebrews 10:39, they had the knowledge of the truth (vs. 26) but chose to draw back to perdition and did not believe to the saving of the soul.
Compare 2 Peter 1:4 - "partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption - Strongs #5356 that is in the world through lust with 2 Peter 2:20 - they escaped the pollutions - Strongs #3356 (different Greek word) of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, yet they are again entangled therein, and overcome. Notice that 2 Peter 2:20 did not mention them being "partakers of the divine nature."
Corruption (Strongs #5356) (to shrivel or wither, spoil , ruin , deprave, corrupt , defile, to destroy by means of corrupting, to spoil as does milk). Corruption - describes decomposition or rotting of an organism and the accompanying stench. The utter depravity of the fallen flesh and the resultant moral decomposition of the world opposed to God is driven by it sinful lusts or evil desires. Internal corruption.
Pollutions/Defilements (Strongs #3393) ("pollutions", "filthy things", "contaminations", "world's filth") describes the state of being tainted or stained by evil and refers to impurity, impure, tainted, defilement, foulness or pollution. Pollutions/Defilement refers to what is on the outside (2 Peter 2:20). But genuine believers have escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust (2 Peter 1:4).
Corruption is deeper than pollutions/defilements on the outside: it is decay on the inside. True believers have received a new nature, a divine nature, and they have new and different appetites and desires. They have been transformed from pigs and dogs into sheep. The change is more than just cosmetic, as in 2 Peter 2:20.
I don't mind that one at all. Look a little deeper. False teachers are the main subject of the whole chapter. 2 Peter 2:1 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves. 2 Many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned; 3 and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.
Notice that Peter did not mention that those who escaped the "pollutions of the world" were "Christians," "born again" or "saved."
Compare 2 Peter 1:4 - "partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption - Strongs #5356 that is in the world through lust with 2 Peter 2:20 - they escaped the pollutions - Strongs #3356 (different Greek word) of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, yet they are again entangled therein, and overcome. Notice that 2 Peter 2:20 did not mention them being "partakers of the divine nature."
Corruption (Strongs #5356) (to shrivel or wither, spoil , ruin , deprave, corrupt , defile, to destroy by means of corrupting, to spoil as does milk). Corruption - describes decomposition or rotting of an organism and the accompanying stench. The utter depravity of the fallen flesh and the resultant moral decomposition of the world opposed to God is driven by it sinful lusts or evil desires. Internal corruption.
Pollutions/Defilements (Strongs #3393) ("pollutions", "filthy things", "contaminations", "world's filth") describes the state of being tainted or stained by evil and refers to impurity, impure, tainted, defilement, foulness or pollution. Pollutions/Defilement refers to what is on the outside (2 Peter 2:20). But genuine believers have escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust (2 Peter 1:4).
Corruption is deeper than pollutions/defilements on the outside: it is decay on the inside. True believers have received a new nature, a divine nature, and they have new and different appetites and desires. They have been transformed from pigs and dogs into sheep. The change is more than just cosmetic, as in 2 Peter 2:20.
OSAS'er don't like that one.
Notice that Peter did not mention that those who escaped the "pollutions of the world" were "Christians," "born again" or "saved."
Oh, on the contrary! We love the apostles condemnation of false prophets such as yourself! Because that is what this passage is, You just wish we wouldn't respond to it because these three verses are the end of a very long condemnation of false prophets. Funny you should call attention to it.
Deal in context much? Obviously not. It is no wonder you like this passage. It speaks of you -- a false prophet. Let's look at the whole paragraph, shall we? It goes all the way back to verse 1.
2 Peter 2, NASB
1 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.
2 Many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned;
3 and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.
4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to pits of darkness, reserved for judgment;
5 and did not spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah, a preacher of righteousness, with seven others, when He brought a flood upon the world of the ungodly;
6 and if He condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to destruction by reducing them to ashes, having made them an example to those who would live ungodly lives thereafter;
7 and if He rescued righteous Lot, oppressed by the sensual conduct of unprincipled men
8 (for by what he saw and heard that righteous man, while living among them, felt his righteous soul tormented day after day by their lawless deeds ),
9 then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from temptation, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment for the day of judgment,
10 and especially those who indulge the flesh in its corrupt desires and despise authority. Daring, self-willed, they do not tremble when they revile angelic majesties,
11 whereas angels who are greater in might and power do not bring a reviling judgment against them before the Lord.
12 But these, like unreasoning animals, born as creatures of instinct to be captured and killed, reviling where * they have no knowledge, will in the destruction of those creatures also be destroyed,
13 suffering wrong as the wages of doing wrong. They count it a pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are stains and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, as they carouse with you,
14 having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children;
15 forsaking the right way, they have gone astray, having followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
16 but he received a rebuke for his own transgression, for a mute donkey, speaking with a voice of a man, restrained the madness of the prophet.
17 These are springs without water and mists driven by a storm, for whom the black darkness has been reserved.
18 For speaking out arrogant words of vanity they entice by fleshly desires, by sensuality, those who barely escape from the ones who live in error,
19 promising them freedom while they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by what a man is overcome, by this he is enslaved.
20 For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first.
21 For it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them.
22 It has happened to them according to the true proverb, "A DOG RETURNS TO ITS OWN VOMIT," and, "A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire."
1 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.
2 Many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned;
3 and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.
4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to pits of darkness, reserved for judgment;
5 and did not spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah, a preacher of righteousness, with seven others, when He brought a flood upon the world of the ungodly;
6 and if He condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to destruction by reducing them to ashes, having made them an example to those who would live ungodly lives thereafter;
7 and if He rescued righteous Lot, oppressed by the sensual conduct of unprincipled men
8 (for by what he saw and heard that righteous man, while living among them, felt his righteous soul tormented day after day by their lawless deeds ),
9 then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from temptation, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment for the day of judgment,
10 and especially those who indulge the flesh in its corrupt desires and despise authority. Daring, self-willed, they do not tremble when they revile angelic majesties,
11 whereas angels who are greater in might and power do not bring a reviling judgment against them before the Lord.
12 But these, like unreasoning animals, born as creatures of instinct to be captured and killed, reviling where * they have no knowledge, will in the destruction of those creatures also be destroyed,
13 suffering wrong as the wages of doing wrong. They count it a pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are stains and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, as they carouse with you,
14 having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children;
15 forsaking the right way, they have gone astray, having followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
16 but he received a rebuke for his own transgression, for a mute donkey, speaking with a voice of a man, restrained the madness of the prophet.
17 These are springs without water and mists driven by a storm, for whom the black darkness has been reserved.
18 For speaking out arrogant words of vanity they entice by fleshly desires, by sensuality, those who barely escape from the ones who live in error,
19 promising them freedom while they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by what a man is overcome, by this he is enslaved.
20 For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first.
21 For it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them.
22 It has happened to them according to the true proverb, "A DOG RETURNS TO ITS OWN VOMIT," and, "A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire."
From the first verse to the last of chapter two, Peter condemns false prophets. He condemns you. Repent and believe.
Amen to that....context solves many issues for sure......so does verb tense and the actual definitions of words when they are simply believed because God inspired them.....!
ISIT,
Heb 6:4-6
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
KJV
Here we have a clear statement that " if it is possible to lose Salvation; there is certainly NO WAY TO GET IT BACK!
1Jn 2:1 tells us that when we sin, and confess Jesus does in fact restore us.
This clearly implies that falling into sin does NOT cause us to loose our salvation; and in fact no way of losing our Salvation, because losing our salvation would make restoration impossible and restoration is indeed possible.
You never dealt with this earlier; you just side stepped it with my typo.
Heb 6:4-6
4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
KJV
Here we have a clear statement that " if it is possible to lose Salvation; there is certainly NO WAY TO GET IT BACK!
1Jn 2:1 tells us that when we sin, and confess Jesus does in fact restore us.
This clearly implies that falling into sin does NOT cause us to loose our salvation; and in fact no way of losing our Salvation, because losing our salvation would make restoration impossible and restoration is indeed possible.
You never dealt with this earlier; you just side stepped it with my typo.
It's like I said in the OP all they will do is say the interpretation is wrong, or it's out of context, or it's not written for us, or it's the wrong translation yada, yada, yada. The scriptures are very clear, many will fall away from the faith as written. OSAS teaches this can not happen. Those who endorse it, and teach it are liars and deceivers, teaching a false gospel not in line with the scriptures, nor abiding in the Truth.
V
You cannot find one or post one that says believers will fall away. No where are those who "fall away" called "believers." They are hangers-on, "tasters," exposed to the truth but never believing in spirit, "faithful" only in action -- faithful in deeds that do not save, nor do they indicate the condition of the spirit and heart. The sooner you realize that, the sooner you will realize that Satan has deluded you into fear and doubt, something those of us eternally secure will never experience for more than a moment.
No I didn't, I said there is a difference between a stumble and a fall. If a man does not willfully sin, and repents of the sin, and turns to the Lord for forgiveness, the Lord is merciful to forgive, yes.
But if a man after receiving the faith and being born again willfully sin and turn away from following the Lord, and does not repent, he will die in his sins. It's much like here in Ezekiel 18:24
But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die.
So yes, some will repent and turn back to the Lord, but some will willfully turn away and not repent and shall be lost. But to say none will lose his or her salvation by rejecting the faith, is also to say that there will not be any falling away from the faith as written. This is a lie.
But if a man after receiving the faith and being born again willfully sin and turn away from following the Lord, and does not repent, he will die in his sins. It's much like here in Ezekiel 18:24
But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die.
So yes, some will repent and turn back to the Lord, but some will willfully turn away and not repent and shall be lost. But to say none will lose his or her salvation by rejecting the faith, is also to say that there will not be any falling away from the faith as written. This is a lie.
Here you go, I'll let you try to explain it away like the rest of em.
Hebrews 6:4-8 “For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,[SUP]5 [/SUP]And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,[SUP]6 [/SUP]If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.[SUP]7 [/SUP]For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:[SUP]8 [/SUP]But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.”
Hebrews 6:4-8 “For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,[SUP]5 [/SUP]And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,[SUP]6 [/SUP]If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.[SUP]7 [/SUP]For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:[SUP]8 [/SUP]But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.”