OSAS doctrine denies the faith
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J
Though we must not fault those who don't want to get involved. If I were in my right mind, I'd be doing something else now, would have heavily used the Page Down key, as most days, earlier today. The irksome are those who feign some namby pamby routine they call love: now, it's not Christ-like to pick on that poor viper. "Shutup, and pass the Kool-Aid." "All aboard, last call for the 6:16 to hell!"
We have already been over the Samson and Solomon issue before. Here is my reply to you that I said before,
"No, you are again twisting around what I have said out of context. I said Solomon and Samson are examples in the Bible of how NOT to live. They are not examples for us to point to so as to think we can live that way, too. I never said that, nor implied such a thing. You are forcing that false belief upon me (of which I reject). Samson and Solomon were not looking at other believers who lived like they did thinking they can get away with sin. God knew their heart and knew that while they did live sinful lives, they turned at the last moment at the end and made things right with the Lord. This is not a support of the Antinomian or Classic OSAS type belief. It runs contrary to it because the Antinomian believer will just continue to live like an evil sinful version of Solomon or a Samson until they die. For they will not admit in what they have done is wrong. For they believe all future sin is paid for and that nothing can remove them from Christ because they are sealed by the Spirit. Sin is only physical death and not spiritual death to the Antinomian believer. Hence, why holiness is rarely ever stressed as being a requirement in being a true believer.
Anyways, on your other point on how Samson and Solomon were not saved: Well, ...
As for Samson:
Samson was saved for two reasons. One, God granted His request and gave Samson the strength to take down the two pillars. Why would God answer the prayer of an evil unsaved man and make it look like He was in favor with Him by giving Him the strength by the Spirit? Two, why is Samson mentioned in Hebrews 11 among the heroes of faith if He was unsaved? If you want to discuss this point more, go here:
http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/97572-samson-did-not-commit-suicide.html
As for Solomon:
2 Samuel 7:12-16 tells us God would take away his mercy from Saul but he would not take away it away from Solomon. For God says that He will be a father to Solomon and he will be like his son, if he commits iniquity he will be chastened by the Lord with a rod of iron. We know this passaged is clearly speaking about Solomon because verse 13 describes him as one who will build a house in his name (i.e. the Temple). It is also evident that Solomon was the author of Ecclesiastes, too.
If you want to discuss this more, you can do so here (if you are interested):
http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/105157-solomon-saved.html"
Anyways, on your other point on how Samson and Solomon were not saved: Well, ...
As for Samson:
Samson was saved for two reasons. One, God granted His request and gave Samson the strength to take down the two pillars. Why would God answer the prayer of an evil unsaved man and make it look like He was in favor with Him by giving Him the strength by the Spirit? Two, why is Samson mentioned in Hebrews 11 among the heroes of faith if He was unsaved? If you want to discuss this point more, go here:
http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/97572-samson-did-not-commit-suicide.html
As for Solomon:
2 Samuel 7:12-16 tells us God would take away his mercy from Saul but he would not take away it away from Solomon. For God says that He will be a father to Solomon and he will be like his son, if he commits iniquity he will be chastened by the Lord with a rod of iron. We know this passaged is clearly speaking about Solomon because verse 13 describes him as one who will build a house in his name (i.e. the Temple). It is also evident that Solomon was the author of Ecclesiastes, too.
If you want to discuss this more, you can do so here (if you are interested):
http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/105157-solomon-saved.html"
hahah not talking everyone...just one or two who I have noticed never really make a stand on anything, but openly brag about fence sitting......
J
It's nothing short of stupifying that you don't realize you just negated every argument you've ever made against eternal security.
If "no believer saves themselves" then explain how they then have power to keep themselves saved! Not only is that a huge contradiction, it is simply ignorant of biblical truth.
If "no believer saves themselves" then explain how they then have power to keep themselves saved! Not only is that a huge contradiction, it is simply ignorant of biblical truth.
When I used to read more of all that drivel, two things were evidence. One, the contradicting one's self. Two, a complete lack of understanding of scripture used to "prove" points, sometimes the scripture they used destroying their own claims. Stupefying is true, and poetic of it all. Give them enough rope, and they hang themselves.
No you didn't....you gave an example where men got mad because they were rightfully accused of murder....try again...and my verse was a direct bible quote...reject it like you do most of the bible in favor of your COC tainted view.....no biggie to me..it will be you that pays the ultimate price.....!
If I recall you had no answer to this: Matthew 12:48-5048 But He answered and said to the one who told Him, “Who is My mother and who are My brothers?” 49 And He stretched out His hand toward His disciples and said, “Here are My mother and My brothers! 50 For whoever does the will of My Father in heaven is My brother and sister and mother.”Matthew 18:21-2221 Then Peter came to Him and said, “Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? Up to seven times?”
22 Jesus said to him, “I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven."
How can we forgive a BROTHER from sinning, and remember JESUS HIMSELF calls us His BROTHER, if, according to you, we can't,or if we do we are no longer a BROTHER, sin?
I'm going to take the Lord's word. I pray in His name you would too.
22 Jesus said to him, “I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven."
How can we forgive a BROTHER from sinning, and remember JESUS HIMSELF calls us His BROTHER, if, according to you, we can't,or if we do we are no longer a BROTHER, sin?
I'm going to take the Lord's word. I pray in His name you would too.
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V
No, it is actually you, denying God's power.
This is statement represents a complete ignorance of the passage. The Greek phrase dunamai fulasso istemi aptaistoß amomoß (dunamai phulasso histemi aptaistos amomos) is a passive imperative, meaning "the power to guard and cause to stand firm without blemish." In other words, He has taken that accountability on Himself, and you are trying to force Him to give it up and put it back on yourself. That's sheer ignorance, denying His imputation of His righteousness on you because you have none of your own and cannot acquire it on your own. You are, without Christ, totally depraved, unable to do any good whatsoever, even unable to form an untainted selfless thought. With Christ, you are still depraved because you still abide in the flesh, but He has "the power to guard you and cause you to stand firm without blemish." It truly is on Him, not you.
Jn 10:27,28 one hears and follows of his volition and therefore can quit hearing and following of his own volition.[/quote]That's sheer arrogant assumption on your part, with no biblical support. Please provide the passages that "prove" what you say here.
Still lying. Revelation 2:1-7 commends the Ephesian church for its perseverance in the face of persecution, but chastises it for having failings in worldly matters. No where does that passage say the lampstand is removed, and in fact, we know that John returned to Ephesus from Patmos after Domitan died. Nice try, but epic fail.
I guess that means you aren't "any other created thing," huh? Just continuing to show your ignorance, and cluelessness to the fact that you are a tool of Satan.
This is statement represents a complete ignorance of the passage. The Greek phrase dunamai fulasso istemi aptaistoß amomoß (dunamai phulasso histemi aptaistos amomos) is a passive imperative, meaning "the power to guard and cause to stand firm without blemish." In other words, He has taken that accountability on Himself, and you are trying to force Him to give it up and put it back on yourself. That's sheer ignorance, denying His imputation of His righteousness on you because you have none of your own and cannot acquire it on your own. You are, without Christ, totally depraved, unable to do any good whatsoever, even unable to form an untainted selfless thought. With Christ, you are still depraved because you still abide in the flesh, but He has "the power to guard you and cause you to stand firm without blemish." It truly is on Him, not you.
Jn 10:27,28 one hears and follows of his volition and therefore can quit hearing and following of his own volition.[/quote]That's sheer arrogant assumption on your part, with no biblical support. Please provide the passages that "prove" what you say here.
Still lying. Revelation 2:1-7 commends the Ephesian church for its perseverance in the face of persecution, but chastises it for having failings in worldly matters. No where does that passage say the lampstand is removed, and in fact, we know that John returned to Ephesus from Patmos after Domitan died. Nice try, but epic fail.
I guess that means you aren't "any other created thing," huh? Just continuing to show your ignorance, and cluelessness to the fact that you are a tool of Satan.
No, dear sir. Anyone can read what I had posted for themselves and back track in what I had written previously. There is no contradiction in what had written.
Anyways, here is my original post #312 (If folks want to read the original post and then back track it from there).
I have nothing to hide.
I am not afraid to admit when I am wrong. There are several times I have made a mistake and admitted to it openly. This was not one of them. You are seeing error where none exists. But this is not the first time you misunderstood what I wrote before, though.
In any event, may God's love and grace shine upon you.
Anyways, here is my original post #312 (If folks want to read the original post and then back track it from there).
I have nothing to hide.
I am not afraid to admit when I am wrong. There are several times I have made a mistake and admitted to it openly. This was not one of them. You are seeing error where none exists. But this is not the first time you misunderstood what I wrote before, though.
In any event, may God's love and grace shine upon you.
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