Joyce Meyer -- False Teacher
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B
Many of us have heard full and well of her sermonizing and teaching and still have found them to be unBiblical. Just being honest. I'm glad you've found someone you appreciate as far as encouragement but a spade is a spade, as it's said. It's not anything against you personally at all and I do think you're a woman of God but none of us must risk putting our like of someone or their teachings above God.
I've heard her talk in person and I've read a number of her books. I honestly did think she was being Biblical and I did feel blessed by her talks. But as I grew I found myself referencing her claims against the Bible. The more of her books I read the more I found out....there's a LOT of editing between editions, and not for basic spelling errors either. She's motivational and very enthusiastic and I WANTED her to be on the level SO MUCH because I could understand where she was coming from.
But God is the one who has final decision and His Word is measuring stick. Anyone, man or woman, who comes in His name to teach MUST hold up to the truth of His Word. Joyce simply does not.
Please,please be careful of following teachers and preachers and talkers and encouragers because they deliver a message you like. Please! It's such a horrible maze of twisted doctrine and pain and you never notice how many twists and turns you take when you get the the end of your path and realize how far you've gone. Trust me on this.
I've heard her talk in person and I've read a number of her books. I honestly did think she was being Biblical and I did feel blessed by her talks. But as I grew I found myself referencing her claims against the Bible. The more of her books I read the more I found out....there's a LOT of editing between editions, and not for basic spelling errors either. She's motivational and very enthusiastic and I WANTED her to be on the level SO MUCH because I could understand where she was coming from.
But God is the one who has final decision and His Word is measuring stick. Anyone, man or woman, who comes in His name to teach MUST hold up to the truth of His Word. Joyce simply does not.
Please,please be careful of following teachers and preachers and talkers and encouragers because they deliver a message you like. Please! It's such a horrible maze of twisted doctrine and pain and you never notice how many twists and turns you take when you get the the end of your path and realize how far you've gone. Trust me on this.
Well, read it again and ask God to show you.
If you were filled with the Holy Spirit, you would recognize immediately the truth of what I am saying, no problem. But you have a problem!
I preach the pure gospel of Jesus Christ, and none other, and that you would conclude that I preach another gospel shows me that you have yet to know the truth. You might talk the talk, but in the crunch, it seems you are flailing about. You owe it to yourself to get into the word, ask the Holy Spirit to guide you, and He will.
If you were filled with the Holy Spirit, you would recognize immediately the truth of what I am saying, no problem. But you have a problem!
I preach the pure gospel of Jesus Christ, and none other, and that you would conclude that I preach another gospel shows me that you have yet to know the truth. You might talk the talk, but in the crunch, it seems you are flailing about. You owe it to yourself to get into the word, ask the Holy Spirit to guide you, and He will.
I am sorry. I would immediately recognise what you are saying is from the Holy Spirit. How can you say such a thing.
Firstly you claim walking by the Spirit makes you perfect, but you are not.
So either you do not have the Spirit, or you are wrong, or this is a lie. Your doctrine only works if you can walk it, if you have the Spirit.
But then you slip in, it is ok to try and fail, get up and have another go. Now I agree that is walking with God, and he helps us through our weaknesses. But what you want above anything else is validation of how you feel, not what the word says.
Now the line of sin or failure in following Jesus is sinful actions, doing that which is sin. But you have admitted sin does not bother you anymore, just ignore it because grace overcomes. But if there is no change, no fruit, then your conversion is meaningless, Jesus died for nothing, only to throw a different type of paint over you.
What is telling is love and the cross do not feature in your language, or even your spirituality. Does that not make you wonder who you are following, because this one act defines the universe, the lamb that was slain. The fact I hear nothing, zip from you on this, it speaks everything to me.
If I speak in the tongues of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal.
1 Cor 13:1
I sincerely believe this verse means very little to you. Why is it my fellow christian brothers and sisters who have asked Jesus into their lives, repented of their sins understand the language I speak and you do not. I am happy for you in your fantasy world, but that is what it is. The gospel is not good enough for you, you need to add to it and ignore its core power and truth.
I ask the Lord all the time through the Holy Spirit to guide me into His truth and He has, but it is not what you teach.
But then what you teach is literally insane, and to you I must be evil, because I do not agree with you, but I trust Jesus and His word, I build my house upon the rock, and I forgive you for whatever ill you wish on me. At the end of the day, it is our intentions to our fellow human beings that define us, and I sincerely love you and wish you the best.
As a side note, what is the "pure gospel of Jesus Christ" that you preach, because from your words, it is not mine.
Firstly you claim walking by the Spirit makes you perfect, but you are not.
So either you do not have the Spirit, or you are wrong, or this is a lie. Your doctrine only works if you can walk it, if you have the Spirit.
But then you slip in, it is ok to try and fail, get up and have another go. Now I agree that is walking with God, and he helps us through our weaknesses. But what you want above anything else is validation of how you feel, not what the word says.
Now the line of sin or failure in following Jesus is sinful actions, doing that which is sin. But you have admitted sin does not bother you anymore, just ignore it because grace overcomes. But if there is no change, no fruit, then your conversion is meaningless, Jesus died for nothing, only to throw a different type of paint over you.
What is telling is love and the cross do not feature in your language, or even your spirituality. Does that not make you wonder who you are following, because this one act defines the universe, the lamb that was slain. The fact I hear nothing, zip from you on this, it speaks everything to me.
If I speak in the tongues of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal.
1 Cor 13:1
I sincerely believe this verse means very little to you. Why is it my fellow christian brothers and sisters who have asked Jesus into their lives, repented of their sins understand the language I speak and you do not. I am happy for you in your fantasy world, but that is what it is. The gospel is not good enough for you, you need to add to it and ignore its core power and truth.
I ask the Lord all the time through the Holy Spirit to guide me into His truth and He has, but it is not what you teach.
But then what you teach is literally insane, and to you I must be evil, because I do not agree with you, but I trust Jesus and His word, I build my house upon the rock, and I forgive you for whatever ill you wish on me. At the end of the day, it is our intentions to our fellow human beings that define us, and I sincerely love you and wish you the best.
As a side note, what is the "pure gospel of Jesus Christ" that you preach, because from your words, it is not mine.
A quick side not about inspiration.
If the Holy Spirit dictates to us the understanding of His word, either very few have the Holy Spirit or we do not understand how he teaches us, or we are very bad learners. I would go with we are bad learners and the way he teaches us is different than we think. My personal experience is the word applied to life experience. I know what it means to forgive someone, when someone does something bad against me, and I forgive them from my heart.
I know what it means to go the extra mile, when I am asked to do something and I do more and bring ideas along as well.
I know what it means to give in secret, when I give in secret and rejoice. I know what it is to praise alone in my room, when I sing to the Lord from a grateful heart alone, lost in wonder and praise.
I know what it is to mourn when my heart cries out to the Lord for the lost millions who live, eat and die without ever calling out to Him. I know how much I owe my Lord when I ignore a hungry person, and the Lord shows me how much he provides. I know how unhumble I am when I am told by my children I should not have eaten that bun, or cake, but they are happy to help themselves of everything I provide. I just learn to praise the Lord, and listen. I am always unworthy and always still need to be graceful.
So when people talk only gifts, my heart sinks, when they talk services, church involvement, I see self ministry justification.
So much of what is claimed to be of Christ is very far from basic life reality.
If the Holy Spirit dictates to us the understanding of His word, either very few have the Holy Spirit or we do not understand how he teaches us, or we are very bad learners. I would go with we are bad learners and the way he teaches us is different than we think. My personal experience is the word applied to life experience. I know what it means to forgive someone, when someone does something bad against me, and I forgive them from my heart.
I know what it means to go the extra mile, when I am asked to do something and I do more and bring ideas along as well.
I know what it means to give in secret, when I give in secret and rejoice. I know what it is to praise alone in my room, when I sing to the Lord from a grateful heart alone, lost in wonder and praise.
I know what it is to mourn when my heart cries out to the Lord for the lost millions who live, eat and die without ever calling out to Him. I know how much I owe my Lord when I ignore a hungry person, and the Lord shows me how much he provides. I know how unhumble I am when I am told by my children I should not have eaten that bun, or cake, but they are happy to help themselves of everything I provide. I just learn to praise the Lord, and listen. I am always unworthy and always still need to be graceful.
So when people talk only gifts, my heart sinks, when they talk services, church involvement, I see self ministry justification.
So much of what is claimed to be of Christ is very far from basic life reality.
We are taught with the judgment we judge others we will be judged, if I am not totally mistaken. Thus we do not judge anyone to condemnation lest we receive the same judgment when we meet our Lord once and fora ll.
I do not know about JM's writings for I do not read books on the Book. I have heard her speak and teach on more than one occasion, and I felt the Presence in her words.
Now my trust is only in God Almighty, not in any flesh, not even my own, so no, I am not avi about JM, but I do know she has made capable sermans that were helpful for me.
No one here has ever been 100% correct in all they pass on to others, for our self will get in the way from time to time. Anyone who never experiences this problem is perfect.
If JM is not your cup of tea, you are not bound to listen to her. I kind of like her preaching though.
I do not know about JM's writings for I do not read books on the Book. I have heard her speak and teach on more than one occasion, and I felt the Presence in her words.
Now my trust is only in God Almighty, not in any flesh, not even my own, so no, I am not avi about JM, but I do know she has made capable sermans that were helpful for me.
No one here has ever been 100% correct in all they pass on to others, for our self will get in the way from time to time. Anyone who never experiences this problem is perfect.
If JM is not your cup of tea, you are not bound to listen to her. I kind of like her preaching though.
T
Perhaps you are ok believing the words of every false teacher that comes around but i myself will follow The Word. In other words, i will do as the Bible has told me to and judge whether the teachings are Biblical are not. As seen in this thread, Joyce Meyer is not a biblical preacher even if you "kind of like her preaching."
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]I appeal to you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and create obstacles contrary to the doctrine that you have been taught; avoid them. For such persons do not serve our Lord Christ, but their own appetites, and by smooth talk and flattery they deceive the hearts of the naive.
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]“Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves.
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world.
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not confess the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh. Such a one is the deceiver and the antichrist. 8 Watch yourselves, so that you may not lose what we[a] have worked for, but may win a full reward. 9 Everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God. Whoever abides in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house or give him any greeting,11 for whoever greets him takes part in his wicked works.[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]
Do not judge bu appearances, but judge with Right judgement.
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed. And in their greed they will exploit you with false words. Their condemnation from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]I know your works, your toil and your patient endurance, and how you cannot bear with those who are evil, but have tested those who call themselves apostles and are not, and found them to be false.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]I appeal to you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and create obstacles contrary to the doctrine that you have been taught; avoid them. For such persons do not serve our Lord Christ, but their own appetites, and by smooth talk and flattery they deceive the hearts of the naive.
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]“Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves.
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world.
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not confess the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh. Such a one is the deceiver and the antichrist. 8 Watch yourselves, so that you may not lose what we[a] have worked for, but may win a full reward. 9 Everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God. Whoever abides in the teaching has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house or give him any greeting,11 for whoever greets him takes part in his wicked works.[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]
Do not judge bu appearances, but judge with Right judgement.
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed. And in their greed they will exploit you with false words. Their condemnation from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]I know your works, your toil and your patient endurance, and how you cannot bear with those who are evil, but have tested those who call themselves apostles and are not, and found them to be false.[/FONT]
I really have to wonder what translation you are using. John 10:10 does NOT say "enjoy" life. Here is a reputable word for word translation, and the Greek which is what the New Testament was written in.
" The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy. I came that they may have life and have it abundantly." John 10:10 ESV
"ὁ κλέπτης οὐκ ἔρχεται εἰ μὴ ἵνα κλέψῃ καὶ θύσῃ καὶ ἀπολέσῃ· ἐγὼ ἦλθον ἵνα ζωὴν ἔχωσιν καὶ περισσὸν ἔχωσιν. John 10:10 Greek
Zoen exosin ζωὴν ἔχωσιν say "have life." There is no word "enjoy" in this passage in the orginal language. This is a perfect example of adding to the Word of God which is what all WoF teachers do. They have a false gospel, because they add to the Bible, and twist it to their own devices.
"10 For“Whoever desires to love life
and see good days,
let him keep his tongue from evil
and his lips from speaking deceit;" 1 Peter 3:10 ESV
Again, no word "enjoy" in this passage. And in the Greek:
"γὰρ θέλων ζωὴν ἀγαπᾶν καὶ ἰδεῖν ἡμέρας ἀγαθὰς παυσάτω τὴν γλῶσσαν ἀπὸ κακοῦ καὶ χείλη τοῦ μὴ λαλῆσαι δόλον," 1 Peter 3:10
Zoan agapan or ζωὴν ἀγαπᾶν. Agape is the word for "altruistic love for others." It is the way God loves us. It has nothing to do with us "enjoying" life like one would "enjoy Pepsi."
Please let me know which translation you are using. It is just filled with translational errors.
Perhaps you need to get a Bible that is a decent translation. That might be half the reason why your doctrine is so bad.
I personally have nothing against Joyce Meyer, as I do watch her show " Enjoying Everyday Life" on occasion. I although have not agreed with a (few) things that she has said over the years. I think her strongest message in her ministry is to "be strong in the Lord" even in the most difficult of circumstances, to keep our focus on the Lord & He will get you through the storm. Well I have "hung" on to those words for "dear life" with many storms in my Life. So really just saying God has used her teaching to get me through some very difficult things, and I'm sure many others as well. If there is dishonesty or deception coming from her, I wouldn't watch her show, but I'll hold on to "truth"....
LOL! I never once mentioned perfection!
That I do.
LOL! We do not live by our feelings---our feelings often lie to us---but by the word of God. Where are you getting this stuff, anyway???
Sin doesn't bother me anymore? I ignore sin? Huh??? When I sin, it concerns me a great deal, but I know that I am forgiven and I go right to God and confess my sin, and am restored to Him immediately, remembering that my forgiveness was granted at salvation by the power of the cross of Christ and cleansed of it by His blood!
When one is consistent in this, one grows and is transformed "from glory to glory" into the image of Jesus. We are covered by His blood, not just red paint. Our sins are wiped away completely and not just covered up.
Well, you are influenced by your own personal impressions. I am acquainted with the immense love of Jesus and the power of the cross and His precious blood shed for me---and for you.
Who I follow is Jesus, ONLY.
What presumption! I can see the judgment in you and the measure by which you pronounce it. Sorry for you and the self-righteousness with which you wield it.
Then you must be at cross purposes with the rest of the Body of Christ. I know the truth of the word.
Come on! Do you really think all that? You think I "wish ill" on you? You think that what I teach (the word of God) is "literally insane"?? You "sincerely love" me and wish me the best??
I'm sorry that you do not follow the gospel, then. What do you think the pure gospel of Jesus Christ is??? It is none other than the Good News of Jesus Christ as God incarnate who has come to Earth to be the perfect sacrifice for our sin, His life's blood poured out, His life given in the divine exchange on the cross---giving His life in exchange for ours, our sin punished on His sinless body---so that we can become children of God.
That I do.
LOL! We do not live by our feelings---our feelings often lie to us---but by the word of God. Where are you getting this stuff, anyway???
Sin doesn't bother me anymore? I ignore sin? Huh??? When I sin, it concerns me a great deal, but I know that I am forgiven and I go right to God and confess my sin, and am restored to Him immediately, remembering that my forgiveness was granted at salvation by the power of the cross of Christ and cleansed of it by His blood!
When one is consistent in this, one grows and is transformed "from glory to glory" into the image of Jesus. We are covered by His blood, not just red paint. Our sins are wiped away completely and not just covered up.
Well, you are influenced by your own personal impressions. I am acquainted with the immense love of Jesus and the power of the cross and His precious blood shed for me---and for you.
Who I follow is Jesus, ONLY.
What presumption! I can see the judgment in you and the measure by which you pronounce it. Sorry for you and the self-righteousness with which you wield it.
Then you must be at cross purposes with the rest of the Body of Christ. I know the truth of the word.
Come on! Do you really think all that? You think I "wish ill" on you? You think that what I teach (the word of God) is "literally insane"?? You "sincerely love" me and wish me the best??
I'm sorry that you do not follow the gospel, then. What do you think the pure gospel of Jesus Christ is??? It is none other than the Good News of Jesus Christ as God incarnate who has come to Earth to be the perfect sacrifice for our sin, His life's blood poured out, His life given in the divine exchange on the cross---giving His life in exchange for ours, our sin punished on His sinless body---so that we can become children of God.
P
Could be the amplified version.
She probably did it to show inference.
I do not think argueing against "enjoying life" will enhance anyone's walk with the Lord.
If you invert it ,it sounds like someone hoping to have a miserable life "and that more abundantly"
"The word says "the joy of the Lord is my strength"
Would "Joy" be evil also?????
She probably did it to show inference.
I do not think argueing against "enjoying life" will enhance anyone's walk with the Lord.
If you invert it ,it sounds like someone hoping to have a miserable life "and that more abundantly"
"The word says "the joy of the Lord is my strength"
Would "Joy" be evil also?????
I listened to Joyce about hope.
She did not distinguish between good hopes and selfish hopes, because the hope we have invested in Jesus, the deposite of love in our hearts, the fruit of the spirit at work in us and our relationships. No it was God will deliver to you the hope you have, if not now, but in heaven.
This is pure selfishness, not seeking the Lords will in a situation, or getting yourself to a position where you can see the next step, it is merely whatever hope list you dream up, petition God and He will deliver. This is just about the opposite of what I have in Jesus. Nothing I have is mine, it is the Lords. All I have I lay before Him to do as he pleases. I seek to understand His will and share what I can when I can to meet the needs before me.
The problem is once you say what is a good hope and what is a selfish hope, people will turn off, feel put down, walk away, because they want their hopes, no matter how insane, to be told they will happen, just hold out for them. This is a lie.
This is called merely salesmanship, giving the listener what they want to hear, which is not get real, learn the way of humbleness, sacrifice and pain, powered by the love Jesus has for you, but take all your comforts and dreams and continue to live in fairy land.
She did not distinguish between good hopes and selfish hopes, because the hope we have invested in Jesus, the deposite of love in our hearts, the fruit of the spirit at work in us and our relationships. No it was God will deliver to you the hope you have, if not now, but in heaven.
This is pure selfishness, not seeking the Lords will in a situation, or getting yourself to a position where you can see the next step, it is merely whatever hope list you dream up, petition God and He will deliver. This is just about the opposite of what I have in Jesus. Nothing I have is mine, it is the Lords. All I have I lay before Him to do as he pleases. I seek to understand His will and share what I can when I can to meet the needs before me.
The problem is once you say what is a good hope and what is a selfish hope, people will turn off, feel put down, walk away, because they want their hopes, no matter how insane, to be told they will happen, just hold out for them. This is a lie.
This is called merely salesmanship, giving the listener what they want to hear, which is not get real, learn the way of humbleness, sacrifice and pain, powered by the love Jesus has for you, but take all your comforts and dreams and continue to live in fairy land.
I don't follow ANYONE, but Jesus Christ and His word. However, I have been walking with God for 53 years, have had great, anointed teachers in my life, and I have heard Joyce and been to her conferences, and have yet to hear anything that is contrary to God's word. I am able to discern error well, and do so.
P
You are letting them take you for a ride.
In case you haven't noticed,they try to get the argument on general terms,but attack you personally at the same time.
MAKE THEM GO ONE ITEM AT A TIME.......SPECIFIC "Error" that they think is wrong.
Then take them to the word.
Most of them do not know the word,they are just programmed by the cessationist prism,and feed on the utube smears.
In case you haven't noticed,they try to get the argument on general terms,but attack you personally at the same time.
MAKE THEM GO ONE ITEM AT A TIME.......SPECIFIC "Error" that they think is wrong.
Then take them to the word.
Most of them do not know the word,they are just programmed by the cessationist prism,and feed on the utube smears.
T
The joy of the Lord is your strength.
doesnt mean you will have the life she preaches for. Im guessing she thinks Peter just didnt have happy enough thoughts when he was crucified upside down for his faith.
also, the amplified throws context out the window By making the Bible into a form of mad libs instead of using the contextually correct word
doesnt mean you will have the life she preaches for. Im guessing she thinks Peter just didnt have happy enough thoughts when he was crucified upside down for his faith.
also, the amplified throws context out the window By making the Bible into a form of mad libs instead of using the contextually correct word