POLL: The Deity of Christ

oldhermit · Jun 19, 2015

Ok, let's start at the beginning and take one thing at a time. The theme of this text is not the deity of Jesus it is humility. Paul merely uses the fact of the incarnation to demonstrate what true humility is. In verse six, Paul begins with the acknowledgment that Jesus is God and provides us with a revealed analysis of his redemptive function. Paul does not begin his discussion of Jesus from the vantage point of the incarnation but from that of eternity. What Paul stresses in the first part of this chapter is the example of humility that Jesus modeled for us in his willingness to divest himself of this form for a time on our behalf. This of course does not suggest that he ceased be God. He does not strip himself of deity. I am quite sure that we will never fully understand all that is involved in Jesus’ emptying himself of divine form and equality. All we can rely on is the language of the text. “ἐέ” is third person singular aorist first indicative of “ό” which means to empty or to lay aside. How do we explain that even in the flesh he is still God yet remains so without retaining anything that defines divine nature? Perhaps ‘to lay aside’ offers the best explanation. He lays it aside as one would a garment and in Hebrews chapter one we will see him take it up again. But, what does it mean for Jesus to "exist in the FORM ( ῇ ) of God?."

I had discussed earlier about what we mean when we speak of the nature of God and described the nature of a person or a thing as bi-cameral. Anything that is bi-cameral is two chambered. I have selected this term because I believe it most aptly describes how scripture portrays the essence and character of God.
1. The essence is what I regard as signature traits. These traits qualify God as God.
Intrinsically, the essence of God is:
* Spirit * Ever-present * Immortal
* Holy * Eternal * Self-existing
* All-powerful * Invisible * Self-sustaining
* All-knowing * Unified * Transcendent
2. The character of God is what I would regard as attributes that define His moral
integrity. The character of God is:
* Holy * Good * Faithful * Patient
* Righteous * Honest * Loving
* Just * Fair * Forgiving
* Pure * Consistent * Merciful
These are some of the qualities we find ascribed to the Word of God in the scriptures. Every attribute of essence and character that scripture assigns to God are assigned also to Jesus.

Are you with me so far?

SarahM777 · Jun 19, 2015

oldhermit said:

Ok, let's start at the beginning and take one thing at a time. The theme of this text is not the deity of Jesus it is humility. Paul merely uses the fact of the incarnation to demonstrate what true humility is. In verse six, Paul begins with the acknowledgment that Jesus is God and provides us with a revealed analysis of his redemptive function. Paul does not begin his discussion of Jesus from the vantage point of the incarnation but from that of eternity. What Paul stresses in the first part of this chapter is the example of humility that Jesus modeled for us in his willingness to divest himself of this form for a time on our behalf. This of course does not suggest that he ceased be God. He does not strip himself of deity. I am quite sure that we will never fully understand all that is involved in Jesus’ emptying himself of divine form and equality. All we can rely on is the language of the text. “ἐέ” is third person singular aorist first indicative of “ό” which means to empty or to lay aside. How do we explain that even in the flesh he is still God yet remains so without retaining anything that defines divine nature? Perhaps ‘to lay aside’ offers the best explanation. He lays it aside as one would a garment and in Hebrews chapter one we will see him take it up again. But, what does it mean for Jesus to "exist in the FORM ( ῇ ) of God?."

I had discussed earlier about what we mean when we speak of the nature of God and described the nature of a person or a thing as bi-cameral. Anything that is bi-cameral is two chambered. I have selected this term because I believe it most aptly describes how scripture portrays the essence and character of God.
1. The essence is what I regard as signature traits. These traits qualify God as God.
Intrinsically, the essence of God is:
* Spirit * Ever-present * Immortal
* Holy * Eternal * Self-existing
* All-powerful * Invisible * Self-sustaining
* All-knowing * Unified * Transcendent
2. The character of God is what I would regard as attributes that define His moral
integrity. The character of God is:
* Holy * Good * Faithful * Patient
* Righteous * Honest * Loving
* Just * Fair * Forgiving
* Pure * Consistent * Merciful
These are some of the qualities we find ascribed to the Word of God in the scriptures. Every attribute of essence and character that scripture assigns to God are assigned also to Jesus.

Are you with me so far?

Up to a point and that being

1. The essence is what I regard as signature traits. These traits qualify God as God.
Intrinsically, the essence of God is:
* Spirit * Ever-present * Immortal
* Holy * Eternal * Self-existing
* All-powerful * Invisible * Self-sustaining
* All-knowing * Unified * Transcendent

Where did Jesus say He is any of those things in and of Himself?

oldhermit · Jun 19, 2015

SarahM777 said:

Jesus does not actually refer to many of these signature traits regarding himself but others in scripture do. For example, we know that Micah tells us that Messiah would be one who "is from old, out of everlasting" and Isaiah say he is the "Father of eternity" as well as "Holy, Holy, Holy, is the Jehovah of hosts." Paul in Phil 2 speaks of his transcendency as does the Hebrew writer in Heb 1.

p_rehbein · Jun 19, 2015

SarahM777 said:

??? You actually believe it is possible for God to die ???

Are our spirits eternal? Is He I Am?

Do you not know that Scripture says........it is appointed once for all to die? (save those alive upon His return, and, even then, their corruptible earthly bodies will be changed............thus cease to exist)

Can you not think of Scripture concerning this? Wut? Your Bible got pages missing?

SarahM777 · Jun 19, 2015

oldhermit said:

Jesus does not actually refer to many of these signature traits regarding himself but others in scripture do. For example, we know that Micah tells us that Messiah would be one who "is from old, out of everlasting" and Isaiah say he is the "Father of eternity" as well as "Holy, Holy, Holy, is the Jehovah of hosts." Paul in Phil 2 speaks of his transcendency as does the Hebrew writer in Heb 1.

Can you please post those passages within the context?

oldhermit · Jun 19, 2015

SarahM777 said:

Sure, give me a moment to pull them up.

SarahM777 · Jun 19, 2015

p_rehbein said:

No I don't believe God can die,the question I asked is if Jesus is God how can He die and not die at the same time,and how can He be tempted and not tempted at the same time? And where does scripture state that?

SarahM777 · Jun 19, 2015

oldhermit said:

No problem,I will be in and out some what today so take your time.

oldhermit · Jun 19, 2015

SarahM777 said:

This is the Messianic prophesy from Micah - "But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting."

Isaiah 9:6 - This text offers a varied list of names appropriate to the Son all of which reveal separate characteristics of the Messiah both of his intrinsic nature and in his relationship to man, i.e the nation of Israel. "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace."

In Isaiah 6:1-5 we are given the context of the vision which was the death of Uzziah, the king of Judah. While the nation mourns the death of the king Isaiah looks into heaven and sees the true King of Israel and he is still on the throne. The TRUE King still lives and he is still in control. "In the year that king Uzziah died I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up, and his train filled the temple. Above it stood the seraphims: each one had six wings; with twain he covered his face, and with twain he covered his feet, and with twain he did fly. And one cried unto another, and said, Holy, holy, holy, is the Jehovah of hosts: the whole earth is full of his glory. And the posts of the door moved at the voice of him that cried, and the house was filled with smoke. Then said I, Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips: for mine eyes have seen the King, the Jehovah of hosts." Then, verse 10 reads, "Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and convert, and be healed." So, here is the question, just is this Jehovah that Isaiah saw?

In John 12:37-41 John gives us an inspired explanation of Isaiah's vision and reveals to us just who it was that Isaiah saw."But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him: That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed? Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again, He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them. These things said Esaias, when he saw his glory, and spake of him."
Questions:
1. Who is the subject of John's revelation here?
2. Who does John say that Isaiah saw on the throne of heaven?
3. Who is the Jehovah in Isaiah 6?

These two we will examine later. You may also want to remember that the phrase ἐγὼ εἰμί - "I AM", means self-existing one.

Elin · Jun 19, 2015

senzi said:

In the new covenant, the Ten Commandments have been replaced with the two laws of Christ
(Mt 22:37-40), written in the mind and on the heart (Heb 8:8-10) of those in Christ.

SarahM777 · Jun 19, 2015

oldhermit said:

Isaiah 9

[SUP][a][/SUP]Nevertheless, there will be no more gloom for those who were in distress. In the past he humbled the land of Zebulun and the land of Naphtali, but in the future he will honor Galilee of the nations, by the Way of the Sea, beyond the Jordan— [SUP]2 [/SUP]The people walking in darkness
have seen a great light;
on those living in the land of deep darkness
a light has dawned.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]You have enlarged the nation
and increased their joy;
they rejoice before you
as people rejoice at the harvest,
as warriors rejoice
when dividing the plunder.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]For as in the day of Midian’s defeat,
you have shattered
the yoke that burdens them,
the bar across their shoulders,
the rod of their oppressor.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]Every warrior’s boot used in battle
and every garment rolled in blood
will be destined for burning,
will be fuel for the fire.
[SUP]6 [/SUP]For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given,
and the government will be on his shoulders.
And he will be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Of the greatness of his government and peace
there will be no end.
He will reign on David’s throne
and over his kingdom,
establishing and upholding it
with justice and righteousness
from that time on and forever.
The zeal of the Lord Almighty
will accomplish this.

If the last half of verse is speaking of the son and the son will be called all those things,doesn't that in reality point to modalism? If the son is called both FATHER AND SON why wouldn't that verse as written in English be pointing that way?

We have to deal with the verse from Isaiah first before we go on because that is the key that unlocks John 12.

senzi · Jun 19, 2015

Elin said:

Whereas love fulfills the law you are wrong. If I stole for example I would have an inner conviction-a conscience I had done wrong before God. That is because that law has been placed on my heart and written on my mind by the spirit.

oldhermit · Jun 19, 2015

SarahM777 said:

Yes, on the surface it you seem to suggest Modalism or as it is otherwise known Sabellianism and is a form of monotheism. If the entire topic rested on this passage alone I can understand why this theology might have some merit. As it is, this is not all that scripture has to say on the matter.

The term Everlasting Father is also rendered in some translations as eternal Father or Father of eternity. There are some suttle differences between Father of eternity and everlasting Father that broadens the scope of function. Perhaps we can look at this a little later. What this passage confirms to us is that Messiah is both God and eternal. What this means in the relationship to the Godhead will be developed a little later.

SarahM777 · Jun 19, 2015

oldhermit said:

I agree Moadalism is a huge mess and can not be proven from scripture. Monothesim itself should not be a problem at all
because all that says is there is one God.

So there is a question on HOW that verse should be translated. So what does the Hebrew say on that verse?

And I do have a question on HOW John is using theos in John 1:1 and John 20:28.
We know John uses it theos this way also

John 10

[SUP]34 [/SUP]Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are “gods”’[SUP][d][/SUP]? [SUP]35 [/SUP]If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the word of God came—and Scripture cannot be set aside— [SUP]36 [/SUP]what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’? [SUP]37 [/SUP]Do not believe me unless I do the works of my Father. [SUP]38 [/SUP]But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father.” [SUP]39 [/SUP]Again they tried to seize him, but he escaped their grasp.

Thayers lists the 4th definition which is the way John uses it in chapter 10 as this

whatever can in any respect be likened to God or resembles Him in any way,Hebraistacally equivalent to God's representative or vicegerent,of magistrates and judges.

Strong's Greek: 2316. θεός (theos) -- God, a god

So then HOW do we know that on John 1:1 and John 20:28 that this is NOT the meaning John is using in those two verses? Factoring in John is an Israelite believes that the Lord our God is One,and tells us in John 20:31

[SUP]31 [/SUP]But these are written that you may believe[SUP][b][/SUP] that Jesus is the Messiah, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name.

Knowing John wrote the Gospel of John,and he is an Israelite why doesn't he clarify it further for the Israelite who reads his gospel to plainly say Jesus is God the Son and God is a trinity if that is what John is actually getting at?

oldhermit · Jun 19, 2015

SarahM777 said:

In John 1:1 John uses two declensions of the noun θεῷ. In the second clause he says and "the Word was with τὸν Θεόν." Θεόν is accusative masculine singular. The accusative shows the direct object of a transitive verb. In the third clause he says "and the Word was Θεὸς". Θεὸς is nominative masculine singular. The use of the nominative spelling marks the subject as well as the predicate nominative. Neither case of noun in this verse represent a plural form such as we see in John 10. Here John uses the plural form Θεοί which is never used in the NT to refer to God.
The context of John 10 is Jesus as the Shepherd.

“The Jews picked up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, “I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?” The Jews answered Him, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God.” This is a criminal charge.

They knew who the Shepherd of Israel was and just who Jesus was claiming to be. Their response was to pick up stone to stone him for blasphemy, “You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God.” Although Jesus never said in his illustration “I am God” they immediately and correctly made the connection. Now, if Jesus is not God, then they not only had a right to stone him to death for blasphemy, they had an obligation to do so. If on the other hand, Jesus is God as he represented in the illustration then the people were wrong for wanting to stone him.

Jesus offers two arguments for defense against the charge of blasphemy to show the foolishness of their charge, 34-39.
1.The technical argument from the evidence of scripture
“Jesus answered them, “Has it not been written in your Law, ‘I said, you are gods? If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken), do you say of Him, whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, You are blaspheming, because I said, I am the Son of God?”

The passage to which Jesus refers is Psalms 82:6.
“God takes His stand in His own congregation; He judges in the midst of the rulers. How long will you judge unjustly and show partiality to the wicked? Vindicate the weak and fatherless; Do justice to the afflicted and destitute. Rescue the weak and needy; Deliver them out of the hand of the wicked. They do not know nor do they understand; They walk about in darkness; All the foundations of the earth are shaken. I said, “You are gods, and all of you are sons of the Most High. “Nevertheless you will die like men and fall like any one of the princes.” Arise, O God, judge the earth! For it is You who possesses all the nations.”

The first thing that needs to be understood is who God was speaking to in Psalms 82. He was not speaking to all men. In fact, he was not even speaking to all of those of Israel. He was speaking to those who were appointed as judges over the people "YOU are gods." So, this declaration is very limited in its scope. Calling them gods is related not to their intrinsic nature but to their appointed function as those who were responsible for giving the Law of God to the people. In the very next verse God reminds them of their intrinsic nature, “you will die like mere mortals.” These 'gods' were those who sat in the seat of Moses to whom God said, “See, I make you as God to Pharaoh.” Like Moses before Pharaoh, these judges stood before the people as gods to the people. As such, their function was to “defend the weak and the fatherless, uphold the cause of the poor and the oppressed,” to “rescue the weak and the needy,” and “deliver them from the hand of the wicked.” They had abandoned this appointed function and had defended the unjust and shown partiality to the wicked.Of them God says, “The ‘gods’ know nothing, they understand nothing. They walk about in darkness.” All of these charges are contrary to the intrinsic nature of God. Since God cannot defy his own nature we know that the term gods then defines not their nature but their function. For this reason, God says he will render judgment among these gods, verse one.

In John 10 we find Jesus being accused of blasphemy “because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God.” The Jews understood the implication of Jesus statement. When they threatened Jesus with stoning, Jesus reminded them of the 82 Psalm. Apparently they had properly understood the Psalm and did not equate being called gods as a declaration of man's equality with God. They knew to whom this Psalm was directed. “He called them gods, to whom the word of God came.” They knew this was talking about those who were charged with giving the Law of God to the people. Yet, now, Jesus is himself “sanctified and sent into the world” by the Father to impart the word of God again to the people. This is the exact same function that was given to the judges yet, when Jesus calls himself the Son of God they want to stone him for it. Jesus is simply pointing out the lunacy of their reasoning.

2. The pragmatic argument form the evidence of his works
Ellicott makes a good point that “Whether He is a blasphemer or not depends upon whether He represents God or not, and to prove this He appeals again to (His) works.”
“If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the- Father.” “Therefore they were seeking again to seize Him, and He eluded their grasp.”
a. Even if they took issue with his words, they were still confronted with the reality of the miracles. There is no way to account for the miracles except to attribute them to the power of God. His works prove who he is. These two lines of argumentation served only to infuriate them further and they again attempted to arrest him.
b. We know not the manner in which Jesus eluded the grasp nor can this be determined by the force of the language. We do not know whether this was accomplished through extraordinary means or if he simply hid himself in the crowd and fled the temple. We simply are not told.

Elin · Jun 19, 2015

flob said:

Nor are they one (Jn 10:30).

Here's what we know:

1) Jn 10:38 indicates it is their oneness, as in v. 30 and previously discussed, which does not make them the same person.
The Son was in the Father in that he knew the whole mind of the Father, not by being told by the Father, but by the shared knowledge of being in the Father's bosom (Jn 1:18) when he came down from heaven (Jn 3:13, 6:38, 42, 62).

2) The fullness of the Godhead dwelt (the essence of deity was present in totality) in the humanity (body) of Jesus, the Son of God (Col 1:19).

3) The Son comes forth, issues out from within the Father (Jn 8:42, 16:27, 28, 17:8),
as does God the Holy Spirit (Jn 15:26).

This is all we know.
Scripture does not say they "dwelled within" one another.
And where Scripture makes an end to teaching, we must make an end to knowing. . .and simply believe.

Jn 10:38 indicates it is the same as their oneness, previously addressed,
and operates like their oneness.

Keeping in mind that now the humanity of Jesus has entered into the divine equation.

And note which equation I refer to, one that includes the humanity of Jesus,
or one that is spirit only in the Trinity.

Yes. . .and it is also us (1Jn 3:9).

Yes, and the Father is with us.

No, not a figure of speech, a statement involving the humanity ofJesus in the divine equation.

That is not "the idea of the Father....the memory of the Father....my imagination of the Father..."
No. This is the Person of the Father. He Abides in His Son. And His Son abides in Him. = Indwells.[/quote]
No text states "abide in" nor "indwell" regarding the spirit Trinity.

Yes, that all applies to the man Jesus, not to the spirit Trinity.

Scripture does not state the spirit Trinity "indwells" or "abides in" one another.
The equation with the Trinity is not the same as the equation with humanity.

Scripture does not state the Trinity "indwell" nor "abide in" one another.

The contradiction is of Jn 8:42, 16:27, 28, 17:8 for Jesus, and of Jn 15:26 for the Holy Spirit,
who do not indwell the Father, but issue out from within the Father.

I can stand only to what the texts state, and they do not state "indwell" nor "abide in" within the spirit Trinity.
The divine equation of the spirit Trinity is not the same as the divine equation of the humanity of the Son of God.

Elin · Jun 19, 2015

flob said:

We have no authorization in the NT for the mingling of flour and oil as a type of Jesus and the Holy Spirit.

"Mingle" in the OT means "to mix."

You're going to have to decide if the persons of the Trinity are "distinct" or "mixed,"
they can't be both.

They are not contrary, they are in total agreement with Jn 1:14, altering nothing.

An analogy is not the reality itself, only a representation.

Jesus is not actually a vine or a door, and does not actually swallow death.

Elin · Jun 19, 2015

senzi said:

If anyone acknowledges Jesus is the son of God, God lives in him and he in God 1john 4:15

I write these things to you who believe in the name son of God so that you may know you have eternal life 1john 5:13

Do not go beyond what is written 1cor4:6

The holy spirit illumines that to me, but anyone trusting in their own intellect to learn spiritual truth cannot accept it.

Straw man. . .

Elin · Jun 19, 2015

senzi said:

Remember, Jn 1:1, 13 states that Christ is God himself.

". . .and the Word was God. . .The Word became flesh. . ."

SarahM777 · Jun 19, 2015

oldhermit said:

But is there anything that says that John couldn't use the singular use of theos for Jesus because He is God's representative (Anointed one of God) and THE VICEGERENT? Of course John is using the plural form for theos is John 10 because he is speaking of more than one but does that mean he can't use the singular form in John 1:1 or John 20:28?

oldhermit said:

First you actually should start here

John 10

[SUP]22 [/SUP]Then came the Festival of Dedication[SUP][b][/SUP] at Jerusalem. It was winter, [SUP]23 [/SUP]and Jesus was in the temple courts walking in Solomon’s Colonnade. [SUP]24 [/SUP]The Jews who were there gathered around him, saying, “How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly.”

[SUP]25 [/SUP]Jesus answered, “I did tell you, but you do not believe. The works I do in my Father’s name testify about me, [SUP]26 [/SUP]but you do not believe because you are not my sheep. [SUP]27 [/SUP]My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. [SUP]28 [/SUP]I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. [SUP]29 [/SUP]My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all[SUP][c][/SUP]; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. [SUP]30 [/SUP]I and the Father are one.”

[SUP]31 [/SUP]Again his Jewish opponents picked up stones to stone him, [SUP]32 [/SUP]but Jesus said to them, “I have shown you many good works from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?”
[SUP]33 [/SUP]“We are not stoning you for any good work,” they replied, “but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God.”
[SUP]34 [/SUP]Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are “gods”’[SUP][d][/SUP]?[SUP]35 [/SUP]If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the word of God came—and Scripture cannot be set aside— [SUP]36 [/SUP]what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’? [SUP]37 [/SUP]Do not believe me unless I do the works of my Father. [SUP]38 [/SUP]But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father.” [SUP]39 [/SUP]Again they tried to seize him, but he escaped their grasp.

The question they ask Jesus is if He is the Messiah. The works of the Father are the works that were to point them to the fact that Jesus is the Messiah,the Christ,the anointed One of God. Jesus over and over and over again points to the fact that He can do nothing on His own,the words He speaks are not His own,the Father is greater then He is,the Father has granted the Son also to have life in himself. Jesus never qualifies those statements. So then that bodes the question if all those things are true then how can Jesus be all powerful,all knowing,co-equal and co-eternal? How is that possible to be both? How does that make sense?

This is the very first thing that is recorded that Jesus said at the start of His ministry

Luke 4

[SUP]14 [/SUP]Jesus returned to Galilee in the power of the Spirit, and news about him spread through the whole countryside. [SUP]15 [/SUP]He was teaching in their synagogues, and everyone praised him.
[SUP]16 [/SUP]He went to Nazareth, where he had been brought up, and on the Sabbath day he went into the synagogue, as was his custom. He stood up to read, [SUP]17 [/SUP]and the scroll of the prophet Isaiah was handed to him. Unrolling it, he found the place where it is written:

[SUP]18 [/SUP]“The Spirit of the Lord is on me,
because he has anointed me
to proclaim good news to the poor.
He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners
and recovery of sight for the blind,
to set the oppressed free,
[SUP]19 [/SUP] to proclaim the year of the Lord’s favor.”[SUP][f][/SUP]

And Peter clearly says this in Acts 2

[SUP]22 [/SUP]“Fellow Israelites, listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you yourselves know. [SUP]23 [/SUP]This man was handed over to you by God’s deliberate plan and foreknowledge; and you, with the help of wicked men,[SUP][d][/SUP] put him to death by nailing him to the cross. [SUP]24 [/SUP]But God raised him from the dead, freeing him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for death to keep its hold on him. [SUP]25 [/SUP]David said about him:

“‘I saw the Lord always before me.
Because he is at my right hand,
I will not be shaken.
[SUP]26 [/SUP]Therefore my heart is glad and my tongue rejoices;
my body also will rest in hope,
[SUP]27 [/SUP]because you will not abandon me to the realm of the dead,
you will not let your holy one see decay.
[SUP]28 [/SUP]You have made known to me the paths of life;
you will fill me with joy in your presence.’[SUP][e][/SUP]

[SUP]29 [/SUP]“Fellow Israelites, I can tell you confidently that the patriarch David died and was buried, and his tomb is here to this day. [SUP]30 [/SUP]But he was a prophet and knew that God had promised him on oath that he would place one of his descendants on his throne. [SUP]31 [/SUP]Seeing what was to come, he spoke of the resurrection of the Messiah, that he was not abandoned to the realm of the dead, nor did his body see decay. [SUP]32 [/SUP]God has raised this Jesus to life, and we are all witnesses of it. [SUP]33 [/SUP]Exalted to the right hand of God, he has received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit and has poured out what you now see and hear. [SUP]34 [/SUP]For David did not ascend to heaven, and yet he said,

“‘The Lord said to my Lord:
“Sit at my right hand
[SUP]35 [/SUP]until I make your enemies
a footstool for your feet.”’[SUP][f][/SUP]

[SUP]36 [/SUP]“Therefore let all Israel be assured of this: God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Messiah.”

POLL: The Deity of Christ

The Deity of Christ?

YES

NO

???

Senior Member

Banned

Senior Member

Senior Member

Banned

Senior Member

Banned

Banned

Senior Member

Banned

Banned

senzi

Guest

Senior Member

Banned

Senior Member

Banned

Banned

Banned

Banned

Banned