Marriage Skills Discussion

Olerica · Jul 13, 2015

I was talking to a friend and the man she is seeing about my experience in marriage and making one work... or the behaviors that can destroy a marriage. In our discussion, we noted that there are a few regular posters in the Singles form who are married, like me have been married and widowed, and there are those who have been married and divorced.

I'm not going to come at this like I have all the answers, but I have seen a few things. Mostly, I think it would be great to have a discussion, share some experience, perhaps answer questions... help each other find healing in the bits that have hurt us or where we have concerns and questions about how some of this works out.

Men and women, in a lot of respects, have a lot of differences based on perspective. Our needs can be similar, but many are different. One of the first things I will point out is that we so often give what we need to receive - which unless you are involved with or married to someone very similar to you can have disastrous results. Often neither partner feels their needs are met and feels like they are giving into a vacuum and that's just no good for anyone. (I use the word partner here, because it's not specific to either gender nor marital status.)

So... for fun, and to follow through with the first thought of needs being met, do you know what your 'love language' is? This is a really nice tool so you understand yourself. I took it both as a single person and a married person (because I've BEEN both) and honestly, some of the answers are different because my behavior is different as a single person than when I was married... there is no real physical component to my life now, obviously. And not to put too fine a point on it, I like a lot of non-sexual touch when I am married, but not so much as a single person not in a relationship. (go figure) But, it's a nice tool to help you understand what things are important to you right now.

Here's the link: Home | The 5 Love Languages® | Improving Millions of Relationships… One Language at a Time.

Later, I'll bring up things like communication style, building up a bank account, and how to walk through conflicts.

I know I don't know everything. I won't presume that my methods are going to work in your relationship, but hopefully there may be some suggestions that get you thinking on how to handle conflict when you are in a relationship/marriage, as well as actual tools to use.

Marriage isn't easy. Though in my experience, once we got through the kinks of the first few years where we were really getting to know each other in an in-person, day-to-day, in your face all the time way... it really wasn't that difficult either.

In reading this over, I haven't really posed a question to create a discussion. Maybe the question on this one is: Do you know what works for you in giving and getting your needs met? Do you know how to communicate those needs and areas you can give to? How do you start that conversation?

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*DISCLAIMER: I know there are posters here who are anti-marriage for various reasons, and while I think you have the absolute right to feel however you feel, would it be ok for us to have a conversation about marriage here without you warning us all off? I hope so.*
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Perk · Jul 13, 2015

I think that in marriage the chief purpose is to glorify God. Marriage is symbolic of Christ and the church first and foremost. So when you live out a biblical marriage that glorifies God I think then your needs will be satisfied. I know a lot of people like the five love languages and things like that but I think it is best to forget all those things. They just complicate everything. Just do what the Bible says about marriage. I.e. Husbands love your wives. Etc. When you just get back to the basics in scripture everything will work according to God's will.

Olerica · Jul 13, 2015

Have you been married, Perk?

While I agree that living out a Biblical marriage that glorifies God is an absolute imperative, there are a lot of flavors to that. For example: If how you express love to your spouse by Doing Things 'for her': taking out the trash, mowing the lawn, paying the bills, generally being busy and DOING stuff for her... but for her: spending time 1:1, or telling her how much she is loved is how she HEARS love? You aren't going to have a good time because she won't hear you.

And you'll be frustrated because she's not on top of dinner, or she has projects that are unfinished and you can't understand why she's just not completing ANYTHING... while she's wanting to Spend Quality Time and hang out with you all the time, and tell you ALLLLLL about her day to the minutest detail and in your head you can't stop thinking, "GET TO THE POINT!" She isn't going to have a good time either.

Knowing how your partner works, and what makes them tick is imperative. Understanding how we speak love and how they hear love is going to get you a lot further a lot faster. Do you understand what I'm saying? Can you see that might be true?

CatHerder · Jul 13, 2015

Good thread!
I'll make a longer post later - I always put my foot in my mouth when I answer from my phone.
So I will resist my inner Horschak (ooh! ooh! Mr. Kotter!!) for now and post later.

gypsygirl · Jul 13, 2015

while i haven't been married, i can personally attest to the value and helpfulness of understanding something as relevant as love languages to better identify the things that help us recognize love and feel loved in a relationship.

for me, my love language is in order:

words of affirmation
quality time
physical touch

axe of service of service and gifts were either very low or zero.

and perk, the difference between understanding that and not, is what i experienced a great deal with a boyfriend. looking back, i have to smile when i think of how hard he was trying. he gave me flowers. lots. he would do things for me, like hang stuff on the wall, bring me things that he thought i needed. and i did really appreciate the gestures, but i can remember even on the flowers i'd scour them for a card, ANYTHING that said something. i was starved for a lovely word from this guy.

but compliments? ehhh. acknowledgement? hardly. and worst of all, i felt like i was constantly mining to get inside his head because it was a lot of work to figure out what he was thinking. and worst of all, whatever progress made was lost whenever the day ended because next time, i'd have to drag out my drill and jackhammer all over again because there was no recognition of "accomplished ground".

and me, being so oriented to express my thoughts, so driven to need to articulate the song in my heart i would write these things and give them to him, and he would be like. neat.

i'd sulk off, feeling exposed by my feelings and gaining nothing more than barely an acknowledgement. looking back, had either of us understood these things better, i'm sure we'd have found out that my ex was mostly a gifts and axe of service "guy" while i am who i am.

after that, i learned the value of making sure that test is on the gyspygirl dating application form ; p

p.s. olerica, i look forward to reading what you guys share. : )

Olerica · Jul 13, 2015

Hahahah, Gypsy! I know why we are friends and attracted to having a friendship with each other: my top three are the same as your's. When I'm in a relationship, Physical Touch is my #1, Quality Time and Words of Affirmation are equal #2 &#3. When I'm not in a relationship, Physical Touch moves to #3, and Quality Time moves to #1.

Cathearder, I am looking forward to your response and contributions!

To anyone else: I think if we are wise, we've thought about where we've missed it in our past relationship and where we may have some gifting. I think it's good for us to acknowledge the understanding we've gleaned from the past.

Mitspa · Jul 13, 2015

Never been married fell in love a few times

Are you gals looking for a guy who makes a conscience effort to display these things...or a guy who seems to have these skills already?

Olerica · Jul 13, 2015

Well, I am looking for a man who can do both, I guess. I am likely to be attracted to a man who can speak to me in a way I can hear on the outset, but also who can adapt his expression of care/love to me in the way I might indicate I can hear well.

In the same breath, I am absolutely looking for a man who can communicate to me when something isn't working for HIM in our relationship. Because I'm likely to do things to please him because I want to nurture his care of me... by caring for him.

(You see how that works? One giving to the other giving to the other? It's a really lovely... and truly a win-win situation. Who can't see how God would be glorified in a marriage where each partner is trying to outdo the other in blessing each other? Can you imagine being raised in THAT family?)

Mitspa · Jul 13, 2015

Olerica said:

Well, I am looking for a man who can do both, I guess. I am likely to be attracted to a man who can speak to me in a way I can hear on the outset, but also who can adapt his expression of care/love to me in the way I might indicate I can hear well.

In the same breath, I am absolutely looking for a man who can communicate to me when something isn't working for HIM in our relationship. Because I'm likely to do things to please him because I want to nurture his care of me... by caring for him.

(You see how that works? One giving to the other giving to the other? It's a really lovely... and truly a win-win situation. Who can't see how God would be glorified in a marriage where each partner is trying to outdo the other in blessing each other? Can you imagine being raised in THAT family?)

Im sorry I just don't understand that kinda stuff

Rosesrock · Jul 13, 2015

While i respect the discussion....
Ive been married 23 years. It's dayby day. Prayer by prayer. Learning him and how he is, him learning me and us coming together loving the Lord. Honestly in the end it all comes together. The only skill is focusing aleays on the Lord

Olerica · Jul 13, 2015

Rosesrock said:

Yes Dear, this is what we're talking about here. Skills in learning to learn your partner. On the last point in your post, I agree and disagree. If we're not hearing our spouse, it's very difficult for us to submit to God TOGETHER. A marriage can do two things: Draw us towards a deeper relationship with God together, or distract us from the same. Marriage conflict is a factor in questioning God's goodness.

Olerica · Jul 13, 2015

Mitspa said:

I know I can be complicated in my word usage. Can you help me see what you aren't understanding and maybe I can explain better?

Mitspa · Jul 13, 2015

Olerica said:

I don't think their is any hope for me, unless I find a lady who likes what I am and accepts that I am what God has made me.
But I remember that love causes us to be willing to change ...maybe it just don't make sense unless your in love?

gypsygirl · Jul 13, 2015

Rosesrock said:

okay, i think you might be missing the value of the discussion. you're viewing this as extraneous to doing what you say, which is focusing on the Lord. these are not divergent points, at least not in my mind.

as a woman married 23 years, i would love to read what "focusing on the Lord always" looks like to you. i've never been married, but i've read more books, articles, and focused bible studies on the subject. that still doesn't replace practical experience.

see, i think we love to talk in principle and abstract as Christians, lacking the recognition that we often don't know what that granular detail looks like. a great number of men and women don't grow up in christian homes, and yet, there are generations of folks who will choose to be married (in spite of repeated warnings of peril from those who are less enthusiastic about the concept).

at church, in the bible studies, every where we look, folks are are imploring believers to do what God asks us. but in general God gives us guiding principle as well. so we are left to examine our actions and determine how to accomplish this.

there are many verses that speak to the older women teaching the younger, that we bear each others' burdens, and many more than tell us the christian walk isn't designed to go it alone, solitary at our computer, and lacking the input and value of others who are walking with us. we cannot do this alone.

i can't tell you how tired i get of people telling me (here on cc or church, elsewhere) to simply
lean on God" while i ponder what that means, to me, to you, to any of us. it's kind of fascinating to me.

and people who broach at things they don't understand, calling them unnecessary. i look at that and wonder, "why would something that has been so widely proven and used as an effective tool to help us love one another better" be deemed unnecessary?

it's like in our desire to be godly no one wants to be on the hook for something specific or practical. perhaps the safety of "lean on God" is what we would prefer. but it doesn't help our brothers and sisters as much as the specific help AND the principle behind it as well. : )

p.s. i apologize if it sounds like i'm picking on you. i'm really not. but we can't accomplish God's purposes alone. : )

Olerica · Jul 13, 2015

Mitspa said:

That's what we're all looking for, Mitspa.

slave · Jul 13, 2015

Ok, Christ is already in it...let's get to the "Where the rubber meets the road " stuff right?!! The personal "Love language" inventory is awesome. Mine is unlike most men I am a romantic I desire touch and time spent as well as many in here, [Men hush, I don't want to hear it..smile]. Yet time spent is actually an axiom truth; or self-evident truth for all relationships. We all bond from it, one way or another, successfully or unsuccessfully I mean when it is applied. we are either building or tearing down the relationship every time we spend time together. I love the specifics here being mentioned because "doing" is much better than "hoping."

There are two most important things to me in a relationship of any "significant other": Listening skills, and communication skills. And yes, as simple as it seems, they both are skills we need to learn how to apply better.

Ever hear the phrase: "Familiarity breeds contempt?" Who hasn't right?!! Well married couples suffer from that a lot. Remember when you weren't married?... the courting and the extra this and that? What happens 10 years into that marriage? OOPS! False security and a lose of connection to the other if you have not gotten the work ethic out in this institution of togetherness and have applied it. "This can be less than fulfilling," he said sarcastically. We need to own up to our commitment to one another in the cost of investing in it. We need to be reenergized by God to be in prayer for our partner. To look at their point of view more than our own then to communicate our needs more specifically and transparently. Of coarse that won't happen if there has been a history of swatting the concepts down in the fight for either the "Right" and "wrong" answers , or the "best" answer continuum.

God created men and women differently. I used to want to say "Thanks God!" But if you could hear my tone of voice you would discern my heart on that matter better. But now I say "Thank you God!" without the negative tone. Because it is in those differences God makes us fill in the gaps of each other when surrendered to Him.

Big "IF." ... smile. If God wants us to love the other more than ourselves then start with hope of learning more about ourselves by looking at things from their point of view. This starts from "listening" properly. We need to come as a clean slate before our mate, not having pre-conceived answers out to prove your Godly insight God just invested in you hours prior, trying to apply those answers to her or his needs, relentlessly, that don't apply to them specifically. It is the submissive quiet, calm stillness of letting the other talk and focusing on what they are not saying, as well,as what they are saying. If you are looking to meet their needs it is in sometimes the "unspoken needs" that the Holy Spirit is in you to discern.. To aid and encourage not to win any differences of opinions. Or, To build a case in the court of law.

God says, "...give food at the proper time...." Matt. 24:45. Husbands, as leaders of the family take this to heart. Sit before her and look to invest in her. Decide, and plan to love in being patient and listen to her real needs. But to do this one who talks must communicate affectively or all is lost. Not based on "Well you know what I meant" --mentality, but taking ownership of your feelings and staying things appropriately for the sake of them hearing your needs correctly.

. Basically We assume the partner knows how I feel so i can say it any any aggressive manner I want to. NO, wrong answer. Learning to take ownership of your feelings and stating things correctly is imperative to the love language of the relationship.

In every word spoken in our relationships those words are doing one of two things: 1]. Either building the relationship. or; 2]. tearing it down. You are either investing or selfishly expecting. your words and behavior is never a message of neutrality. We need to not sit on our laurels. Listening and communicating skills are imperative.

Jilly81 · Jul 13, 2015

I only have a few minutes, and kind of skimmed over the OP, but there's something I've seen MANY times when selling.

Countless times in my business and former business (particularly when there's a new pet involved), when a couple comes to choose something, it's more the wife's thing. It's kind of supposed to be in this case; the husband is happy that the family is getting the animal, but mainly because the wife wants it, and he wants her to be happy. However, the lady of the pair will ask him his opinion. This is fine, but when he says "whichever one you want; it's your choice", she'll keep pestering him, asking him which one he likes better. Occasionally (according to a few guys I know who went through this) she wants to later be able to guilt him because then she can say "well, YOU chose it!". I learned to say "he just wants you to be happy" to the female, and the guy would nearly always brighten up and say cheerily "yes; that's exactly right!". They usually do just want us to be happy. No, not every single one of them. An AWFUL lot of them do, though

.

I realize that listening to what each other's really saying and love languages come into play as well, and feel free to expound on my post, folks; there are a few more points I'd like to make, but I gotta scoot

.

Mitspa · Jul 13, 2015

You know most men don't want to know how they "feel" themselves...feelings are secondary to most guys and it don't seem they often think about the emotional condition of others as often as women do?

Olerica · Jul 13, 2015

Mitspa said:

Yes, Mitspa. That's why we're attempting to help you, and ourselves, with life skills that would help foster a healthy and robust marriage.

I could put this in a say that might help some rubber hit the road well: Were you aware that if a woman consistently feels validated and fulfilled in sharing her feelings with her husband, feels that THOSE needs are met, she is uh... rather enthusiastic to meet his PHYSICAL/sexual needs?

I know it's not a natural state... well, rather, I think it's well socialized (meaning you men mock and destroy each other) for boys and then men to not validate and own their feelings. But I think you can learn to foster kindness and tenderness and care for both each other and women.

Think of it as demonstrating the character of Christ. Jesus was remarkably tender and validating to women. He showed care and compassion. He did the same to his 12 as well. He cared about how stuff landed on them... but frankly he was the manliest God-man ever... wouldn't you agree?

mailmandan · Jul 13, 2015

A woman gets the last word in any argument. Anything a man says after that is the beginning of a new argument.

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