I was just showing you the use of we does not necessarily mean me. As is the case with 1 John. We does not include him as the person having the need to repent and believe on Jesus Christ, because as he stated, he is already in that fellowship with the Father and Son (he already believes the Gospel, he is inviting them into that fellowship). He uses we, not so much as to lighten the blow, but as shown above, a means to narrate to an audience the method and means to salvation. The process.
Obsession with Confession (1 John 1:9, sin confession)
- Thread starter BenFTW
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Confessing of one's sin does not mean the person does not have faith in the Lord, it means they do trust in Him to cleanse them and thus we pray to Him out of love and respect for committing those sins to be forgiven of them.
If you as a believer sin you take yourself out of that fellowship in the light because sin is darkness.
The way to restore that fellowship into the Light is to confess your sins and the Lord being just will forgive us of those.
To take the confession out of it then you are saying a person can still continue to serve those sins and be saved, which is completely unbiblical as it says you can not serve both flesh and the Spirit both. Apostle Paul shows that if you continue to serve sin everyday that is your master, not the Lord Jesus Christ.
How do we stop serving sin: By repenting and confessing of them !!!
If you as a believer sin you take yourself out of that fellowship in the light because sin is darkness.
The way to restore that fellowship into the Light is to confess your sins and the Lord being just will forgive us of those.
To take the confession out of it then you are saying a person can still continue to serve those sins and be saved, which is completely unbiblical as it says you can not serve both flesh and the Spirit both. Apostle Paul shows that if you continue to serve sin everyday that is your master, not the Lord Jesus Christ.
How do we stop serving sin: By repenting and confessing of them !!!
V
Man alive! I couldn't follow this thread because it made the simple relationship we have with Jesus Christ look like a gloomy labyrinth of "trying to get back into God's good graces." 
Yoiks!!!
All we have to do is stop our carnal thoughts from running amok for a few minutes to hear Jesus say, "This is the way. Walk in it."
And we can say, "Oh, of course! You are right, Lord Jesus!"
That's all the confessing I ever do. I confess Jesus Christ is right. He's ALWAYS right. \/ He's Truth!
Yoiks!!!All we have to do is stop our carnal thoughts from running amok for a few minutes to hear Jesus say, "This is the way. Walk in it."
And we can say, "Oh, of course! You are right, Lord Jesus!"
That's all the confessing I ever do. I confess Jesus Christ is right. He's ALWAYS right. \
/ He's Truth!A Christian who is oppressed with guilt lacks a revelation of grace and the gift of no condemnation. On the contrary to your opinion and belittling of what you deemed to be my "little theological* system", the belief actually sets people free from guilt and condemnation, even so giving them confidence before the Father. It gives them a clean conscience because it gives them rest.
Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Jesus Christ...
Knowing we are not condemned, what does this mean?
1 John 3:21 Beloved, if our heart condemns us not, then we have confidence toward God.
Notice, that in having a revelation of His grace and gift of no condemnation we then have a confidence towards God. We can come boldly into His presence. We aren't condemned. He loves to spend time with us, and we with Him. There is no barrier, the veil is broken! We have reconciliation and our conscience is ever clean in knowing that His blood cleanses us from all sin.
You come to false conclusions. Grace is the only means to a clean conscience. In Hebews 10 it says that if the blood of bulls and goats actually took sin away (like Jesus' blood) the worshipers would've been free from guilt. They would've been purged and had no more conscience of sins. So on the contrary to what you are saying about sin confession, that is not the means to a clean conscience. The clean conscience comes with a revelation and a growing in the grace and knowledge of Jesus Christ. It comes through an understanding of His grace. Not through sin confession, but through Christ.
Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Jesus Christ...
Knowing we are not condemned, what does this mean?
1 John 3:21 Beloved, if our heart condemns us not, then we have confidence toward God.
Notice, that in having a revelation of His grace and gift of no condemnation we then have a confidence towards God. We can come boldly into His presence. We aren't condemned. He loves to spend time with us, and we with Him. There is no barrier, the veil is broken! We have reconciliation and our conscience is ever clean in knowing that His blood cleanses us from all sin.
You come to false conclusions. Grace is the only means to a clean conscience. In Hebews 10 it says that if the blood of bulls and goats actually took sin away (like Jesus' blood) the worshipers would've been free from guilt. They would've been purged and had no more conscience of sins. So on the contrary to what you are saying about sin confession, that is not the means to a clean conscience. The clean conscience comes with a revelation and a growing in the grace and knowledge of Jesus Christ. It comes through an understanding of His grace. Not through sin confession, but through Christ.
David was a man after God's own heart, I'll gladly follow his example as God's heart doesn't change.
2 Samuel 24:10 (KJV) And David's heart smote him after that he had numbered the people. And David said unto the LORD, I have sinned greatly in that I have done: and now, I beseech thee, O LORD, take away the iniquity of thy servant; for I have done very foolishly.
1 Chronicles 21:17 (KJV) And David said unto God, Is it not I that commanded the people to be numbered? even I it is that have sinned and done evil indeed; but as for these sheep, what have they done? let thine hand, I pray thee, O LORD my God, be on me, and on my father's house; but not on thy people, that they should be plagued.
Psalms 51:1-4, 7 (KJV)
1 Have mercy upon me, O God, according to thy lovingkindness: according unto the multitude of thy tender mercies blot out my transgressions.
2 Wash me throughly from mine iniquity, and cleanse me from my sin.
3 For I acknowledge my transgressions: and my sin is ever before me.
4 Against thee, thee only, have I sinned, and done this evil in thy sight: that thou mightest be justified when thou speakest, and be clear when thou judgest.
7 Purge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean: wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow.
2 Samuel 24:10 (KJV) And David's heart smote him after that he had numbered the people. And David said unto the LORD, I have sinned greatly in that I have done: and now, I beseech thee, O LORD, take away the iniquity of thy servant; for I have done very foolishly.
1 Chronicles 21:17 (KJV) And David said unto God, Is it not I that commanded the people to be numbered? even I it is that have sinned and done evil indeed; but as for these sheep, what have they done? let thine hand, I pray thee, O LORD my God, be on me, and on my father's house; but not on thy people, that they should be plagued.
Psalms 51:1-4, 7 (KJV)
1 Have mercy upon me, O God, according to thy lovingkindness: according unto the multitude of thy tender mercies blot out my transgressions.
2 Wash me throughly from mine iniquity, and cleanse me from my sin.
3 For I acknowledge my transgressions: and my sin is ever before me.
4 Against thee, thee only, have I sinned, and done this evil in thy sight: that thou mightest be justified when thou speakest, and be clear when thou judgest.
7 Purge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean: wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow.
Isaiah 1:18King James Version (KJV)
18 Come now, and let us reason together, saith the Lord: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.
What is the current reality you walk in crossnote? Are not your sins of scarlet as white as snow, having been washed in the blood of Jesus Christ? Does not the Lord remember your sins no more?
Psalm 32King James Version (KJV)
32 Blessed is he whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is covered.
2 Blessed is the man unto whom the Lord imputeth not iniquity, and in whose spirit there is no guile.
This is mentioned in Romans.
Romans 4:6-8King James Version (KJV)
6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,
7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.
Even David pointed to the reality we walk in. Not the one of which he walked with his confession, but one in which sin was not imputed. The reality you are in, as a child of God. To what ends are you confessing sin to seek mercy as David did, when you have Jesus Christ and His finished work on the cross? Don't go under law, don't fall from grace. Rest in Jesus.
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No, that's not what I meant. The Holy Spirit will always guide us to a closer relationship with God. He will lead us to confess many things ,since our relationship is to be more than a strictly legal one.
I don't believe that we jump out of salvation every time we sin and we must confess to be back in. If that were the case then who could be saved? Who could perfectly confess and thus cleanse themselves from all sin. Who could stay in that condition of forgiveness? You would only be forgiven until you sinned again. I would need to spend all day , every day confessing lest I die in a sinful state. That would be the worst kind of bondage based on my ability alone.
What I believe John is speaking of is confession to restore proper relationship. My son can have broken relationship with me because of his disobedience, but he is still my son. I will not disown him because he is being stubborn or disobedient. I think Jesus perfectly illustrated this concept in "the prodigal son." Remember how the father ran to meet the son. All things were restored just as if he had never left. That father had always considered his wayward son, still a son.
I don't believe that we jump out of salvation every time we sin and we must confess to be back in. If that were the case then who could be saved? Who could perfectly confess and thus cleanse themselves from all sin. Who could stay in that condition of forgiveness? You would only be forgiven until you sinned again. I would need to spend all day , every day confessing lest I die in a sinful state. That would be the worst kind of bondage based on my ability alone.
What I believe John is speaking of is confession to restore proper relationship. My son can have broken relationship with me because of his disobedience, but he is still my son. I will not disown him because he is being stubborn or disobedient. I think Jesus perfectly illustrated this concept in "the prodigal son." Remember how the father ran to meet the son. All things were restored just as if he had never left. That father had always considered his wayward son, still a son.
Maybe I should've said part of, and not just plainly OT. Sorry for the misunderstanding. Regardless, the point still stands that we are under a new covenant. Jesus death and resurrection changed how sin is dealt with, and also why we don't confess sin for forgiveness or mercy. We already have that forgiveness in Jesus Christ. You don't sin as David did and seek mercy. You are already in Jesus Christ, He is as the mercy seat on the Ark of the Covenant and His blood as the lambs blood covers you. He takes your sins away. God doesn't look at you, but at Jesus. He doesn't see you, but sees Jesus.
Broad stroke? I am one of maybe two or three people on this forum that actually knows the history of this doctrine, it's origins, and what elements are borrowed from which doctrines. I could get into detail however, most advocates of this theology have little to no knowledge of theology, doctrine, or their historical roots so there is no point of getting to it. Hyper grace advocates are very well known for their refusal to accept anything outside of their very limited theological perspective. So rather than engage you myself, it is best to allow God to reveal himself to you. That is if you are willing to humble yourself and allow Him to do so.
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I do agree with everything you posted here. At the same time we often miss the mark. There is nothing wrong with running to our father with our problems, confessing where we have missed it, and seeking advise and help. I don't believe that our sins cause us to loose our position in Christ, but that doesn't mean that there isn't great benefit in confession.