Obsession with Confession (1 John 1:9, sin confession)

[valiant]

Originally Posted by valiant

You omit the crucial fact that it is IF and WHEN they sin that they need their advocate. Thus as he has made clear in 1 John 1. He is aware that at some stage they will sin. So he is declaring that they need forgiveness whenever they sin. This in itself demonstrates that 1 John 1 is not written to Gnostics. And in fact we have no record of what Gnostics in the first century taught. There were many types of Gnostic. The majority were antinomians who saw no harm in sinning, for in their eyes such sins were merely the product of the flesh which they would leave behind when they were finally saved by gnosis. Thus 1 John 1 would not apply to them. The article in the OP is simply using a self-defined gnosticism in order to prove a false exegesis. It is of course true that John had a kind of gnosticism in mind when writing his letter (although we know little of the details). It is NOT true that 1 John 1 had them specifically in mind. Had it done so it would have been worded otherwise.



'These things have I written to you concerning those who would lead you astray. This confirms that 1 John 1 & 2 were written to Christians not to gnostics. Certainly he had gnostics in mind but he was NOT addressing gnostics. He was pointing out to Christians that they must not be deceived about sin and treat it as unimportant. But must immediately deal with it. . Thank you for proving my point.

Written to the believers about those who see trying lead them astray.

For which there is no evidence at all. READ IT MAN. He was writing to Christians about what THEY had to do and the position that THEY were in

 

[VioletReigns]

Hmmm 'Forgive us our sins as we forgive those who have sinned against us,?

Here's a question: Why would Jesus, who never sinned, pray to the Father, "Forgive us our sins..."???

 

[VioletReigns]

Hmmm 'Forgive us our sins as we forgive those who have sinned against us,?

Another question: Why would Jesus instruct us to pray, "Give us this day our daily bread....." and then tell us not to worry about what to wear or what to eat because God already knows what we need and will take care of it?

And why would Jesus pray to God, "Lead us not into temptation," when it is also written that God does not tempt man, and that man is tempted by his own lust???

Do you think perhaps there is a spiritual understanding that you're missing because you're trying to justify God's Word in your carnal mind?

 

[FreeNChrist]

For which there is no evidence at all. READ IT MAN. He was writing to Christians about what THEY had to do and the position that THEY were in

Ummmm, the evidence is right there...."I am writing these things to you, about those who are trying to lead you astray."

 

[Willie-T]

Nope! Jesus does not expose the sin in me. He shines HIMSELF in me and everything in my flesh is rendered ineffective. He lifts Himself up on the throne of my heart and MAKES me follow Him. Jesus Christ is Lord in reality!! HE REIGNS OVER ALL!

You know I love you, Vi, but I would have to word this a little differently. For me, at least, The Holy spirit DOES show me when, because I am the righteousness of God in Christ, my thoughts and/or actions in certain situations might not be reflecting who (and whose) I really am.

And Jesus in me does not MAKE me follow Him. It makes we WANT to follow Him. (Sadly, I don't always do that........ the old lament that Paul expressed.)

 

[VioletReigns]

You know I love you, Vi, but I would have to word this a little differently. For me, at least, The Holy spirit DOES show me when, because I am the righteousness of God in Christ, my thoughts and/or actions in certain situations might not be reflecting who (and whose) I really am.

And Jesus in me does not MAKE me follow Him. It makes we WANT to follow Him. (Sadly, I don't always do that........ the old lament that Paul expressed.)

Yes, I understand what you're saying, Willie. But honestly, I used to think that God shows me my sin. But in spiritual reality, He doesn't. Christ Himself, the Light of Life shines so brightly that anything in my flesh that contradicts His spirit truly burns up in His Truth. His truth sets me free to see Him and I have no choice but to follow the Truth He reveals to me.

It's like when you pick up a glass of water to drink - your mind thinks it, and your hand just does it. Well, Jesus puts his mind in us and when we see Him, we just do as He wills.

We're not judged on the outward anymore. We're validated in the spiritual realm by the grace of Jesus Christ, by His Blood. Tho you may see that I look obedient at times and other times I don't look so obedient is of no concern to God. He is the One doing the work in me and making me more into the image of His Son Jesus. My carnal man is dead and I'm less and less aware of it daily and made more and more aware of only Jesus. I know it is Him performing His will in me. And I can't stop Him. Glory to God!

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Nope! Jesus does not expose the sin in me. He shines HIMSELF in me and everything in my flesh is rendered ineffective. He lifts Himself up on the throne of my heart and MAKES me follow Him. Jesus Christ is Lord in reality!! HE REIGNS OVER ALL!

Wow! That sounds magical!

 

[Willie-T]

Wow! That sounds magical!

No point in trying to make fun. As far as our feeble abilities to understand Spiritual things extend, it might as well be magic since we sure have no idea how God does it.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

GOD interrogated them and they confessed to their crime - I did eat. Simple. After the confession they were brought back into fellowship when their nakedness was covered.

And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God amongst the trees of the garden. And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou? And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself. And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat? And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat. And the LORD God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat. Genesis 3:8-13
​

This is blame shifting, Not admiting you have sinned. this is a sin in and of itself. It is no different than me saying I committed this crime but only because so and so made me do it.

So when did they repent or confess of doing this evil thing of refusing to admit they have no one to blame but themselves?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I can see that you weren't a philosophy major. Your assertion that because gnostics existed at the time John was addressing them is a non-sequitur. It doesn't follow. There is no evidence.

lol. Most biblical historians agree John wrote to combat gnosticism..

So they are all wrong?

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Even you made the quite obvious change of "convict" to "convince".... which is the truth of the Scripture. And make no mistake, there IS a very distinctive difference in those two words and what they mean.

IMO it's a distinction without a difference. Convicting the conscience can have the same effect as convincing the mind.

 

[VioletReigns]

Wow! That sounds magical!

Glory to God! You are absolutely right - - - it does sound magical to our flesh. But it is the miraculous grace of God in the spiritual realm. It is Jesus Christ is our new reality. That is the good news - we are forgiven, He is alive and He reigns in us changing us from glory to glory. He is faithful to do it!

We don't have to examine our flesh to see if there be any sin in us. There is NO good in our carnal man, in our flesh. NONE! Our own hearts condemn us every day, we fight fear and guilt and try so hard to obey and keep failing. We can condition ourselves to do certain "good" things but deep in the recesses of our carnal hearts are hidden pride, envy, anger, jealousy, greed, unforgiveness.

But Jesus paid the price for all of those sins. And when we finally realize that there is N-O-T-H-I-N-G good in our outward man, we can finally focus on Jesus alone. When your eyes are upon Jesus, you only see His holiness. You only see His Light. When your heart is on Jesus, you don't see sin. You see LIFE!

Let me ask you this: when you are all through confessing every sin you think you're guilty of, what's left? Is your flesh finally holy? And are you now acceptable in the sight of God because you spotted some blackness in your heart and confessed it to God? How much confessing is enough to cleanse you and make you holy enough to come into God's Presence?

 

[ladylynn]

Hi lynn, thx. I tried twice to respond...one really lengthy reply, only to have them both disappear. I'm so AARRGGHHravated! I cant do it all again, this tablet is Really malfunctioning, except it's usually only when I'm on c chat, and the experts cant figure it out. Seems like sabotage. All I can say is thank you and I'll try again later. Hope this posts now. Peace.

Sorry about your computer sydlit, have had that happen before too., spent lot's of time on a response and then it disappeared!
And then it's hard to recapture the same enthusiasm again. Thanks for your taking the time to answer me. Blessings!

 

[Magenta]

No point in trying to make fun. As far as our feeble abilities to understand Spiritual things extend, it might as well be magic since we sure have no idea how God does it.

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[eternally-gratefull]

Who do you think does convince a believer of sin he has committed?

according to Scripture. the HS.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

IMO faith without works is merely mental belief, whereas true faith works out of both the heart and mind. True faith is being persuaded by GOD's words, placing confidence in what he says, and trusting him to do what he says he will do.

You are so close.. It is almost like you finally get it.

Your right. Dead faith can not save..

So a dead faith can not lose salvation because they never had it.

 

[ladylynn]

Confess what? Jesus already forgave us ALL of our sins. From the point that you become His child, His Holy Spirit in us is our Teacher. We now can follow the Shepherd’s Voice. If we get weak and fall, He picks us up. If we get tempted, He gives us a way of escape. If we are in error, He shows us the right way. If someone accuses us, He is our Advocate. We are forgiven. IT’S FINISHED!! THAT’S THE END OF IT!! No more groveling around like an unholy worm in false humility. You are a holy vessel of God in the spiritual realm and He is making you more and more into the image of His Son Jesus Christ. IT IS THE MIRACULOUS WORK OF GOD!

We do not live in the carnal world anymore. We are validated only in the spirit by Jesus Christ. We don’t judge things by appearances any more. It is a spiritual life now. Jesus says, “This is the way, walk in it.” Walk according to the spirit of life in Jesus Christ, not according to your “logical” mind.

Since when does Jesus ever say, “Wait - - - what did you do wrong today? Did you sin against me? Ooops, you must first confess all your sins before proceeding further. Wait… you forgot to mention yesterday’s sins. And what about last week when you messed up. Oops, you just had an evil thought. That’s another strike. Do you also recall all the worthless things you said to the neighbors? You forgot to mention all the vain words you spoke. And all the times you didn't say prayers. And all the times you watched television instead of reading the Bible. What about your envy and your anger and your unforgiveness? And didn’t you eat junk food for dinner last night? Wow, these demerits are adding up fast! Looks like you're unworthy. Start confessing them sins. You got a bunch of 'em and time's a'wastin!"

THAT'S INSANE!!!!!!!!!!

We would be on our knees forever if we were to confess all of our sins because THERE’S NOTHING GOOD IN OUR FLESH!! Good luck finding anything pure in your carnal mind. We don’t rely on our own efforts, we are banking everything on the Spirit of Jesus Christ in us. Nothing of ourselves. You are crucified with Christ, it is no longer YOUR FLESH which has any merit. It is CHRIST in YOU! He gets all the glory. You get to rest now and just follow Him.

People try so hard to be obedient to God in their flesh and try to understand His Word in their carnal nature. They follow laws, create formulas, and try to explain things logically that only God Himself can reveal to us by His Holy Spirit. It's never gonna happen in the carnal realm! Your flesh will never, ever change or become holy and acceptable. Nor your carnal “common sense” mind.

We are never going to be congratulated by God for anything we are quite capable of doing in the flesh by our own free will and being aware of our own performance. That is totally carnal! Only when we are aware of Jesus Christ alone in a matter is God pleased.

All we can do is seek the Lord Himself, speak to Him, listen to His voice, focus your heart's desires on Him, rest in Him, hope in Him, cast everything onto Him. A relationship with Christ Jesus. That is all He wants from us. The LORD wants our heart. When we are empty of the flesh, He will do His will through us, there won't be any praying about, "What is Your will for me?" He would be working His purposes out through you when you are surrendered to Him like that. And we will find rest.

Unless God builds the house, we labor in vain trying to do works for Him. If it's not God doing His will through us, it is wood, hay and stubble. And when we stand before Him, all of those self-willed works will be consumed in a fire as no good. If it isn't God Himself doing the thing, it is worthless. We cannot conjure up in our own flesh anything worthy of the holiness of God.

An empty vessel. That's what God wants. The Lord works out His purposes through a totally surrendered soul. To trust God is to believe He can do as He says. He performs His will through us. He gets all the glory forever. And we get HIM!!!!

BY GEORGE I THINK SHE'S GOT IT!!!!!!!!! AMEN VIOLET!

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Let me ask you this: when you are all through confessing every sin you think you're guilty of, what's left? Is your flesh finally holy? And are you now acceptable in the sight of God because you spotted some blackness in your heart and confessed it to God? How much confessing is enough to cleanse you and make you holy enough to come into God's Presence?

I don't do that. I have never done that. I accepted when I was saved that the guilt of my sins was washed away. I look at it as a relationship. If the other party has a problem with me, I'm going to leave it up to that party to let me know if something is wrong. And if I am convicted that something is wrong, or sinful, I acknowledge it as wrong, and make it right if I have wronged somebody (if I am able). That's all I can do.

 

[VioletReigns]

IMO it's a distinction without a difference. Convicting the conscience can have the same effect as convincing the mind.

The word convicted is religious jargon. The only time "convict" is used is when Jesus tells us in the gospel of John that when He sends the Comforter to us, the Holy Spirit will prove to the whole world that they are wrong about sin, judgment and righteousness. In other words, whatever we can conjure up in our intellectual minds is WRONG. There's no good in our outward man but inwardly we are made new because the Holy Spirit dwells in us and is changing us day to day.

Let me put it this way, Jesus gets all the glory for everything He does through us. Anything we say WE are doing is not giving Him glory. So, it's either Jesus working in you - - - or you doing the work. Guess which one is right?

 

[VioletReigns]

Here's another test: The Lord said you will know them by their fruit (fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control). Most of the regular members on here are pretty familiar with one another and are also aware how we are being changed by the Lord Jesus from day to day. We can clearly see by the words posted whether it's written from a carnal attitude or by the Holy Spirit's leading just by the fruit exhibited. If it is exalting Jesus, it will bring light and life to people. Because Jesus' love is perfect and will not fail. On the other hand, if it is from the flesh, it will cause division and debate. Because the flesh can't produce anything except more flesh.