The 1 John 1:9 Lie: More New.Modern.Hyper Grace blasphemy
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You received Christ, and in Him is your forgiveness. You have said yourself that your salvation is secure...good, it is. And the reason it is secure is because the only thing that could cause you to lose your salvation, is sin. And God has already dealt with your sin, once and for all. In Christ you have forgiveness. Believe it.
I experienced/received the unconditional love and forgiveness extended through Jesus Christ before I ever confessed Jesus as Lord and Savior. I was looking for answers, at the lowest point of my life, and went to see a film on the life of Jesus Christ, based on the gospel of Luke, at a nearby church around Easter time. I had been brought up in a fairly strict religious home but did not know Jesus. I was feeling the weight of all my failures in life... really knowing in my heart of hearts what a lost wretched person I was, but I could not say I believed in God when He literally filled me with the Light of His love and forgiveness. It meant a lot to me, even as I carried on in my disbelief for many years afterward. Of course it did eventually become a foundation stone in my eventual belief and surrender to Him 
Again, I have to refer people back to what was written, and what is being discussed. No one ever stole any money. It was a $5 bill that you discovered a cashier over paid you in giving change.
For Pete's sake, if anyone SAW they had too much at the counter, they wouldn't keep it. I would never have done that in the days when I actually stole cars and beat up people.
For Pete's sake, if anyone SAW they had too much at the counter, they wouldn't keep it. I would never have done that in the days when I actually stole cars and beat up people.
C
Tomorrow I plan to rob a bank. I robbed a bank last week, the week before, that's me, I'm a bank robber. So glad I don't have to confess it all the time now. Saves me time to plan a new bank robbery. Good day sir. Give me your money. I'm a christian bank robber.
This whole thing is just unbelief and not knowing who you are in Christ.
Hey sweetheart, I found out that you cheated on me a dozen times. Yeah I know, but I don't have to confess it all the time. Come on now. I may do it again tomorrow. I'm just a weak sinner you know, saved by grace.
This whole thing is just unbelief and not knowing who you are in Christ.
Hey sweetheart, I found out that you cheated on me a dozen times. Yeah I know, but I don't have to confess it all the time. Come on now. I may do it again tomorrow. I'm just a weak sinner you know, saved by grace.
Hey crossnote, I've noticed you keep saying the Holy Spirit convicts believers of sin (around the forums/different posts). Do you mind giving me some verses?
I understand correction and chastisement, but conviction is something entirely different. Jesus does say the Holy Spirit convicts the world of sin and clarifies by saying, "Because they believe not on Me." Obviously, we believe in Jesus and this verse is in reference to an unrepentant sinner in need of Jesus. The Holy Spirit is addressing unbelief.
So I am curious, what verses do you use to back up this doctrine of Holy Spirit's conviction of sin for believers? From what I understand most feelings of guilt and condemnation are from our own conscience and not from God. Even at times from the enemy, as the accuser of the brethren.
Something to point out, that I was just reading, is that our hearts can condemn us and it isn't God doing the condemning.
1 John 3:20-21King James Version (KJV)
20 For if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things.
21 Beloved, if our heart condemn us not, then have we confidence toward God.
I understand correction and chastisement, but conviction is something entirely different. Jesus does say the Holy Spirit convicts the world of sin and clarifies by saying, "Because they believe not on Me." Obviously, we believe in Jesus and this verse is in reference to an unrepentant sinner in need of Jesus. The Holy Spirit is addressing unbelief.
So I am curious, what verses do you use to back up this doctrine of Holy Spirit's conviction of sin for believers? From what I understand most feelings of guilt and condemnation are from our own conscience and not from God. Even at times from the enemy, as the accuser of the brethren.
Something to point out, that I was just reading, is that our hearts can condemn us and it isn't God doing the condemning.
1 John 3:20-21King James Version (KJV)
20 For if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things.
21 Beloved, if our heart condemn us not, then have we confidence toward God.
K
I am not making stuff up, you are the one doing that fine enough...........
This is what happens when you don't use the whole word of God and instead want to take your responsibility as a believer in Christ and pass if off as somebody else's problem.
1 Corinthians 5 is an extension from what Jesus said in Matthew 18:15-18, and that was to all believers not just leaders in the church.
Also in 1 Timothy 5:19-20 it talks about members of the congregation bringing an allegation against a elder/leader, and if two or more have come forward than the reprove or rebuke is rightfully so !!!
This is what happens when you don't use the whole word of God and instead want to take your responsibility as a believer in Christ and pass if off as somebody else's problem.
1 Corinthians 5 is an extension from what Jesus said in Matthew 18:15-18, and that was to all believers not just leaders in the church.
Also in 1 Timothy 5:19-20 it talks about members of the congregation bringing an allegation against a elder/leader, and if two or more have come forward than the reprove or rebuke is rightfully so !!!
Think again, and read. It seems maybe the words are hard to digest...
And have you forgotten the exhortation that addresses you as sons? "My son, do not regard lightly the discipline of the Lord, nor be weary when reproved by him. For the Lord disciplines the one he loves, and chastises every son whom he receives." It is for discipline that you have to endure. God is treating you as sons. For what son is there whom his father does not discipline? If you are left without discipline, in which all have participated, then you are illegitimate children and not sons. Besides this, we have had earthly fathers who disciplined us and we respected them. Shall we not much more be subject to the Father of spirits and live? For they disciplined us for a short time as it seemed best to them, but he disciplines us for our good, that we may share his holiness. For the moment all discipline seems painful rather than pleasant, but later it yields the peaceful fruit of righteousness to those who have been trained by it.
(Heb 12:5-11)
It has nothing to do with our upbringing...it is Scripture.
Maybe those with legalistic Church upbringings gravitate to ones like Prince, but that is like overcorrecting a wrong problem...you end up falling off the horse on the other side.
And have you forgotten the exhortation that addresses you as sons? "My son, do not regard lightly the discipline of the Lord, nor be weary when reproved by him. For the Lord disciplines the one he loves, and chastises every son whom he receives." It is for discipline that you have to endure. God is treating you as sons. For what son is there whom his father does not discipline? If you are left without discipline, in which all have participated, then you are illegitimate children and not sons. Besides this, we have had earthly fathers who disciplined us and we respected them. Shall we not much more be subject to the Father of spirits and live? For they disciplined us for a short time as it seemed best to them, but he disciplines us for our good, that we may share his holiness. For the moment all discipline seems painful rather than pleasant, but later it yields the peaceful fruit of righteousness to those who have been trained by it.
(Heb 12:5-11)
It has nothing to do with our upbringing...it is Scripture.
Maybe those with legalistic Church upbringings gravitate to ones like Prince, but that is like overcorrecting a wrong problem...you end up falling off the horse on the other side.
Yes we know you need to look to Jesus, Yes we know there is now no condemnation for those in Christ, yes we know you won't lose your salvation, yes we know we have been forgiven in christ, yes we know we are saints, yes we know we are God's holy ones etc etc etc..how many times do we have to tell you guys this, and yet...... never mind.
I am not or was saying you would do this. But the same question stands:
IF - you were to steal the $5 even though you are in christ, you know you are saved by grace alone/faith alone etc etc etc, would you not feel ashamed and guilty and remorseful?? I would hope you would being a believer. Considering you have greatly Displeased your Father?
I am not or was saying you would do this. But the same question stands:
IF - you were to steal the $5 even though you are in christ, you know you are saved by grace alone/faith alone etc etc etc, would you not feel ashamed and guilty and remorseful?? I would hope you would being a believer. Considering you have greatly Displeased your Father?
K
Actually what you say here is not so in your second paragraph, because you look at unbelief as just not believing in Jesus as in His existence.
However unbelief is shown within the bible as also being a person who may claim Jesus as Lord and Savior, but does not do as He said. This is also unbelief !!!
So if you have Him as your Lord and Savior but walk around with a mindset that I don't have to repent, or get baptized, or forgive others, or confess, and such you are still walking in unbelief.
Plus the part that always seems to get overlooked in John 16 is the other parts of the convicting of the Holy Spirit, people focus just on the sin and thus come away not for us.
Truth is the Holy Spirit convicts:
To turn us from sinful ways to walk in His righteousness.......
Of righteousness to make sure we continue to walk in His ways........
Of judgment so that we will not be condemned with the rest of the world and die in our sinful ways, but be confirmed to His ways that lead to eternal life........
We must not take only part of John 16 without using the whole context of the convicting of the Holy Spirit, and the Holy Spirit can not convict people who do not have Him !!!