Why Joseph Prince is a Cancerous Growth within God's People

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UnderGrace

Guest
For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation for all people, training us to renounce ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright, and godly lives in the present age, waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ,
(Tit 2:11-13)
Amen!
For the grace of God has appeared (who is Jesus) bringing salvation for all people (Jesus is the grace of God and has brought salvation) training us (Jesus trains us by His Grace when we abide in Him) to renounce ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright, and godly lives in the present age, waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ,
(Tit 2:11-13)
It is all Jesus working in us to complete His good will. Faith in God’s grace produces this transformation.
 
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Depleted

Guest
He exalts grace above Jesus. minimizes Gods commandments. Any teaching that does so, is opposed to God. Grace is not to minimize Gods Word, but the power to uphold it in our lives. Anyone with the holy spirit will teach Gods commandments. The holy spirit in us will never have issue with Gods directives to us. The 10 commandments are summed up in Love one another, because they have always been Love. to have no other gods before the One True God is Love, to not kill, steal, lie to one another is love. To honor parents, to be faithful in marriage is love. to not bear false witness is Love, to not covet your neighbors things and wife is love. the commandments will never change, they are right from the beginning. Grace is that God sent His Son to die for our transgression, and sent His spirit to live in us and enable us to live pleasing and upright lives in the sight of God. true teaching will always agree with Gods word. never exalt an attribute that feels good above keeping Gods word. This newer grace doctrine, along with many, many other doctrines are all false. The only true doctrine is taught By God through Jesus. It has been and always will be fear God and keep His commandments. Because of Grace, we no longer have an excuse that we are unable, Grace made The spirit of God Live in us with power and changes death to life.

I'm surprised the original poster didn't have more of an issue with , not so much jp, but the doctrine he spreads. He is not the only one. And I think people should understand the difference between a brother or sister and a teacher of false doctrine. Love is not always accepting flaws when it comes to doctrine being spread that is destroying the righteousness commanded by God. A person could make murder a doctrine if they wanted by taking scripture out of context. God taught what He taught for a reason, and caused it to be written, so that those who believe do not have to trust in man.
Hi! OPer here. I picked him because his cult members are descending with force on this site to give him more followers. Sure, he's not the only one, but he is a repeating theme. I was actually hoping for the upside of what he does. A little defense from his supporters to see if maybe I got this wrong. But, as you can see, what I got instead, from his supporters is an attack on me -- always with a tsktsk-we're-so-loving-so-it-must-be-you-you-unfortunate-sadsack attached to it. (Passive-aggressive, and I'm pretty sure I'm hearing The Beatle's song All We Need is Love with the brass section in the background playing the same tune. I keep expecting a single flower and a peace sign any minute now, except for that aggressive thing hiding its ugly head.)

The thing that truly surprised me was believers who tsktsk me for daring to speak up. "Not my business." "Who cares?" "Can't we call just get along." "You're being too harsh." "I don't know who he is so he can't be a problem or anything." "If we just love one another and stop paying attention to anything said, life is much easier."

But, yeah. Just the one. He's the one with the most followers on this site, and they tend to take over just about every thread about anything to pat each other on the back to do their All We Need is Love brass section, while the giant sleeps.

And, yeah. I notice the antinomianism too, but frankly, I remember spending a few hours researching that word online just to come away scratching my head on exactly how anyone can do that, because I don't get that kind of delusionalism at all.

I get why people think if they click their heels three times just right, keep chanting "God has healed me" even after obvious evidence they're not healed yet, all in the hope of becoming healed. And, somehow, the chant needs to be duplicated by quite a few others to the point that people aren't taking their meds for anything from diabetes to bipolar all in the hope God will heal them at the last minute before they do stuff that will either ruin the rest of their lives or kill them.

THAT I get, because I was tempted into doing it myself, except I did see the damage done after a friend kept falling for that lie over and over again to the point of sheer torture for herself and her husband. I'm disabled so end up being friends with a lot of other disabled people. And I can't stop many of them from going down that destructive path because someone keeps preaching "just believe because your belief releases God's tied hands." BUT I sure hope I can stop some.

It's my pet peeve. It's the thing that hurts many of my friends.

Fortunately, the other (antinomianism) is crossnote's pet peeve. So we're doing all right exposing the deceit even with the very loud brass section trying to drown us out in hopes Joseph Prince will be happy with their adoration somehow and maybe bequeath them with...

Actually, I don't know what they think he'll bequeath them with. I know they bequeath him with more and more people willing to add to his money by buying his self-help-posing-as-Christianity-but-doing-a-lousy-job publications. After all. Always good to come up with a product that cost the seller nothing and means nothing, but will fade away per user in 1-5 years. Especially when there is the possibility of talking millions more into buying the nonsense, just at the time when the delusion finally filters through to the last group.
 
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Depleted

Guest
Lynn,
I am new to these board so I am not able to discern yet from your posts if it is the Gospel of Grace you oppose or Joseph Prince or both.
I can say I have figured it out thirty years ago when I was born again and learned that abiding in Christ is abiding in Grace.. it is the Gospel, the Good news. I do not need to figure out anything in the future. Jesus did it all and I rest in Him and in that knowledge until that final day when I will see Him.
People who rail against grace preachers do not yet understand Grace.
Grace is not a doctrine or a podcast or a tweet. Grace is not a season to walk through or a midweek seminar. Grace is not one aspect of God’s character to be balanced against his other, less gracious aspects.
Grace is a Person who loves you, died for you, and now lives for you. The gospel of grace is the gospel of Jesus – there is no difference.
The grace of the Lord Jesus be with you!
UnderGrace…where I belong!
Yes, because only those who follow "grace preachers" understand "grace." There is no Gospel of Grace. There is the Good News of Christ. There is God's grace. But there is more to God than grace and people who follow "the gospel of grace" keep pretending "30 years" makes them an expert simply because they recently found some guy willing to preach only what they want to hear.

Under God is where you should be.

I don't understand grace?

Grace -- God's unmerited favor.

So, what am I missing? (I have known that definition for so long I can't even remember which church taught it to me. lol)
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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Amen!
For the grace of God has appeared (who is Jesus) bringing salvation for all people (Jesus is the grace of God and has brought salvation) training us (Jesus trains us by His Grace when we abide in Him) to renounce ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright, and godly lives in the present age, waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ,
(Tit 2:11-13)
It is all Jesus working in us to complete His good will. Faith in God’s grace produces this transformation.
Yes, all glory goes to Him. But can you explain why there are different levels of progress amongst christians if it is all Jesus?
 
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Depleted

Guest
I'm not going to defend the Grace message or even argue, I do disagree. I thank God that I have true fulfillment in my life because I'm able to know who God really is. God's grace and the goodness of God is why we are here, it's why Jesus died on the cross, it's why Jesus took the beating and the name calling, spiting and our sins. His LOVE for us is what saved us, it's what put Jesus on that cross. His GRACE is what allows people to even be saved if it weren't for the GRACE of God none of us would be here, thank God for his Grace, Mercy and Love. Thank God that he is God, Paul of the Bible is the real teacher of Grace, it originated from him and God gave it to him. Joseph Prince is one of the people who's kept the Grace message going. Just like Martin Luther did in the 1500's. This isn't some "new" message.
You disagree with what? And I really wish someone would argue for Prince, because all any of his followers do is pick parts of God, ignore the rest, then sound like those who have legitimate charges against Prince don't deserve anything but pity and an All We Need is Love singalong.

Particular you, since you spent quite some time telling a sister in Christ to ditch her husband, how happy you are for doing it, and how never to focus on the negatives of God like wrath and anger.
 
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Depleted

Guest
Do y'all think that God and Jesus are going to send people to hell? If so why? How is He righteous for doing so? God is long suffering and slow to anger and full of grace. But, will He send people to burn in an eternal flame where their worm does not die?
You're free to start your own post to get those answers.
 
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Depleted

Guest
If you have the answers, then you tell me.
But if you don't, and I'm not trying to be mean, then try listening.
I would hardly call what I believe, "Modern...", but frankly, I could care less what lables anyone puts on me or my doctrines.
And regardless of that, to me the important thing to finding and receiving truths, is to seek God with a pure heart, desiring to know without holding on to your babies and biases. (babies- that which you hold dear to you, such as OSAS)
God is indeed sovereign, but He also watches over and hastens to perform His word.
And because of that, He has to do what He said He would do. If He doesn't, then He lied. And God CANNOT lie.
And because of that, Paul calls it a law, such as the law of faith or life in Christ Jesus.
A law works the same way every time, without fail. And it never fails to work as it was designed.
If it did, then it would cease to be a law.
And God is the one who uphold ALL things. That would include ALL laws, both physical and spiritual.
For example, in Mk 11:23, the word of God says (paraphrasing), 'that whosoever shall say or speak to whatsoever, and believe in their heart that what they have said shall come to pass without any doubt, they shall have whatsoever they said'.
That is what is written, and that is what will be done, for it is the will of God.
The problem is that it can be for both good or bad, for blessing or cursing.
Even as He said, "Death and life are in the power of the tongue, and they... shall eat the fruit thereof."
Whose tongue is it that God says has the power of both death and life?
That would be our tongue.
Where is God's will in that which proceeds out of our mouths.
His will is to create the fruit of our lips. His will is that a man shall eat the fruit of his mouth and his belly shall be filled with that fruit with the increase of his lips.
Did God say that His people are destroyed for a lack of knowledge and vision, for nothing. Can't He do anything about what happens to us? If He can, then why doesn't He? And why tell us that a lack of knowledge is why we are destroyed?
We not only reap what we sow by our doing, which God upholds, but equally by our saying or speaking.
Even as a good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth or causes that which he said or spoke, to manifest itself in the natural, so in like manner, an evil or corrupt man, having deposited evil or corrupt things or treasure in his heart, such as thinking that the WOF is a lie and of the devil, causes evil, bad, or corrupt things that he said or spoke to manifest itself in the natural as well.
This applies to not only the unbelievers, but the believers as well.
What do most people say when they start feeling symptoms of a cold or flu coming on them? They say, "I have the cold or I have the flu". They just agreed with the devil, and accepted the cursed for themselves.
For, out of the abundance of his heart, which is where the forces of life flow from, his mouth speaks.
So in light of that, I say that many have spoken to their own hurt and to that of their loved ones.


Deu 30:19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:
Whose choice is it to receive life or death, blessing or cursing?
Isn't it God's will for them to have life, and that's why He told them to choose life?
Then why is the outcome dependent on what we choose to say and do?
Is it going to be any different for us, seeing God is no respecter of persons?
I could go on as to say why, on most accounts, we are to blame for what happens to ourselves and loved ones later in our lives.
When we were younger, not so much us, but God still visits the sins of the fathers on the children as He did back then. He doesn't change.
There are many factors involved in such things, aside from the ones I mentioned, but at the very least, we should search our hearts to see if there is any fault in us and look to God and Jesus, His Word, for deliverance.
I figure I answered this before I got here. You didn't read it yet, so not holding anything against you. BUT, if I figure wrong, (which I've been known to do),and didn't answer this, get back to me when you get here, and I'll go back and try again. (Earless soldier was my answer, just in case you didn't get that was my answer. lol)
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,844
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(Passive-aggressive, and I'm pretty sure I'm hearing The Beatle's song All We Need is Love with the brass section in the background playing the same tune. I keep expecting a single flower and a peace sign any minute now, except for that aggressive thing hiding its ugly head.)
here you are, sis

flower-peace-sign-tattoos-4.jpg

feet shod with peace :)

((no, that is not post's foot. just the result of post's image-search))
 
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Depleted

Guest
Ma'am, I have a great deal of scriptural evidence, but to them who refuse to even look, trying to show them would be more of a wasted of my time.
If you are okay with keeping whatever it is that ails you, that you failed to get healed of, then, more power to you.
I was one step above your being "pretty sure" kind of believing, and I failed to receive as well.
A while back, I was sure I had something, before it manifested, and I thought I had really believed. It was only after it failed to manifest itself, that it was revealed to me that I did not truly believe in my heart. Though at first I thought I was believing, but I saw after, that the faith wasn't really there. I proved that, when I was too afraid to act on that belief. Without corresponding action to that which you believe, God says your faith is dead. He also said to such a person, "let not that man think that he shall receive ANYTHING of the lord, a double-minded man is unstable in all his ways.
That definitely came to pass in my life at that moment.
Like I said before, I've been on both sides of the faith fence, and I know what works and what doesn't. And every time I knew in my heart without any doubt, I always received, without fail.
But if I had even the slightest doubt or even the smallest question or wonderment, I would end up with nothing.That too happened on a consistent basis.
If this works for my family and I, and as many as believe, and fails to word for as many as doubt, then you are not so special that it's going to work any different for you.
Would it matter if you believed God doesn't exist?
Would it prevent God from existing?
Neither will the laws God has written change because you refuse to believe them.
The fact remains that you use words of faith all the time without realizing it, both for and against yourself.
It is how you came to receive Christ as your lord and savior.
You had to act on the gospel before you were born again. God didn't do that just because He loved you. He moved when you moved in faith, and not a moment before.
Healing is the same way. Most just don't know that.
I'm "okay with it" only because God has taught me this is my thorn. Annoying, however that's the characteristic of a thorn. And absolutely no way are you ever going to convince me salvation ever came through something I did.

Jesus was clear on it having nothing to do with "acting." He told us how we act. And then what he did with how we acted anyway. (John 3:16-21 nd John 6:35-40.)

I don't know if you noticed this about me or not yet, but I'm very opinionated, outspoken and heavy on the defiance. (Defiant of garbage, not of God.) I'll tell you why. Because somewhere along the line I got sick and tired of people telling me it's my fault I'm disabled (or the evil twin sister "God couldn't help it.") Do you have any clue what that LIE does to people new in the Lord? People newly disabled? (Hint: I came close enough to killing myself I figured out a way to do it that makes it look like an accident so my husband could get my $10,000 life insurance.) People struggling to make sense of it? To be told God is taking it out on us because we are lesser than?

And do you know who ALWAYS tell that lie? Either those who have never struggled with a disability or those who are but haven't figured it out yet, so they're buying whatever anyone hands over to them. THIS IS WRONG!

Want to know why God doesn't heal all his peeps? Because some of us are just cocky enough to go off and start preaching how well we healed ourselves! (At least one is on this thread.)

God keeps me disabled for the really obvious reason. Without being disabled, I'm just stupid enough to go off and think I only need God in a pinch, and today isn't that pinch. I'm disabled because God has graced me with a nonstop reminder that I need him constantly. Not for MY evil. Not for the evil of previous generations. Not because I don't trust God enough and just couldn't click my heels just right. Unmerited favor to constantly be reminded to seek him, because I'm just cocky enough to need that!

So, nope. Never going to buy the gospel is all about you's abilities and acts. And I wish you'd stop crushing people with that lie.
 
D

Depleted

Guest
Does anybody realize that a HYPER- CALVINIST started this thread? I don't know if it is just me, but I REMEMBER what others have posted on other threads and have a pretty good Idea of what people believe that post a lot on this forum.


Joseph Prince is a God send compared to a HYPER- CALVINIST that can't even get the Gospel right.

Calvinism and Lordship salvation and loss of salvation is THE false teaching that will catch believers. At least JP teaches grace and just believe for a mans salvation.

Calvinism and "we can't even believe on our own!" is WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYY worse than JP.
LOL. Do you have stock in the word "hyper?"

What's with that word as of late? I'm not a hyper Calvinist I'm just a plain old fashioned Calvinist. I'm not hiding it, although good for you to distinguish between which is eviler out of the two. LOL

BTW, I tend to think Arminians/Wesleyans are also saved, so I really don't know why you're going off other than you've got stock in the word "hyper."

So, honestly? This is what it is about you that drives me nuts? All along you've been a Grace follower? Geesh! I can be dense sometimes. LOL

Ooo, ooo-ooo. Does this mean grace-only has a thing against Calvinist? I didn't know.

I have enjoyed studying the differences between Semi-Pelagianism and Reformed, and in the end came to the obvious conclusion. You can get some stuff wrong and still be saved. I was an Arminian/semi-pelagian for the first 20 years of being a Christian, so I know that. But if Grace Followers have this real thing against "Calvinist," then it doesn't interest me enough to pursue. Kind of like seeing someone starving to death and arguing over the person likes the Dallas Cowboys. So unrelated and useless, why bother?

But, oooo, "HPYER-CALVINST" started this thread, like suddenly you can't remember my name? Thank you!

That was hillarious and a good spot to leave for the night. I always enjoy a good joke.
 
Aug 15, 2009
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I could only post one video in the previous comment. Here's another.

Mother Grace (@ 1:37 mark)

[video=youtube;6HuH_3xua9c]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HuH_3xua9c#t=103[/video]
Notice how he uses an OT scripture of a favorite bible story to set up the people to believe they're a Benjamin generation.

Every false preacher seems to lead the people to believe only "good times" are for the christian while in the world. Who among them are preaching the judgement that's coming? NONE!
 
Aug 15, 2009
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More "twisting" in what is being said.....Anyone with an honest mind can see that it's just an analogy. I encourage people to listen to what he is saying and it is clearly used as an analogy.

I'll just leave this thread now for those that want to malign fellow believers in Christ. ( I know I said before this was my last post..lol...it's the deceitful things being said that urge me to respond to this post...but I am done now....:rolleyes:.)

I will leave this thread now for people to continue to slander a fellow Christian as much as they desire. I encourage people to go check out what is really being said in other teachers videos and you will fins out for yourself what is being said about the Lord Jesus.

Everyone is a heretic to someone else on the internet if they don't believe exactly like "I" do....it's the nature of the beast in action.


1 Peter 2:1-3 (NASB)
[SUP]1 [/SUP] Therefore, putting aside all malice and all deceit and hypocrisy and envy and all slander,

[SUP]2 [/SUP] like newborn babies, long for the pure milk of the word, so that by it you may grow in respect to salvation,

[SUP]3 [/SUP] if you have tasted the kindness of the Lord.

Let's be crystal clear..... If you back a heretic & promote a heretic's doctrine, that makes you a heretic & you will reap a heretic's reward unless you repent..... & I truly wish you would, I would that your eyes be opened to see this monster for who he is. Don't cry foul & judging, for you have judged others on here as slanderers for standing up for the truth. Repent before you reap what you sow.
 
L

ladylynn

Guest
I think some have pointed out flaws of Prince but others are going to defend him at all costs.


Well, the thing is., I like JP yes I do.., But seriously, he is able to take care of himself. My motivation is knowing the way people can wrongly accuse others. Not only here on CC but in our country and also in the world via news media/internet public opinion etc.... But that is also on a small scale such as in our daily lives. I come across it all the time in life. Gossip here at work is treated as the truth. But if I don't jump in and give it my attention quite often I can be a tool that slows down it's momentum.

I have decided at all opportunity I will not join in but actively go against gossip by not being added to the number. And by giving grace instead of judgment.

I see it all the time how God's Word is true. "A kind word turns away wrath". it seriously does. I'm called to be salt and light. Again, I don't think JP needs defending by me since many more talented and able have already done that very adequately. I read JGIGs posts and am in awe of her ability to research and write the way she does.

Even though I like JP very much, what I am truly motivated by is watching how words can be poison when used with a wrong motivation. We believers are told to weigh our words and to love people not poison them.

And why does the Bible say that love covers a multitude of sin? What does that really mean? I see it means Jesus loved us and not only were sins covered in the old testament., now sins are actually taken away., washed away and what was once red as crimson is now white as snow. Clean. Will I go and add to the throwing of the dirt? No., that is not my calling.
 
Jun 1, 2016
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right...because that worked so easy the first time

and you were worried about Joseph Prince

does anyone here actually think it is ok to continue a life of sin? if not, why do these new people keep saying we do?

I don't believe we have the option of discussion with them either...indoctrination would actually be the target IMO

lol that's exactly how the false doctrines are taken from pauls words haha a few lines here n there. its amazing how this particular doctrine turns people away from Gods word. its appealing to think Gods gonna make us obey or not expect obedience. Yet he is the same. Grace is what makes a person able again. what do you think paul means by put to deth your sinful nature? if you live by it you will die? but you show perfectly how the false doctrines start. like reading a line in the middle of a novel and telling people its the whole story. Paul himself teaches repentence and obedience all throughout his own letters also. those parts are utterly avoided as any are that require obedience to Gods word. not at all surprised, thanks for the great example of how the false doctrines start. Grace is for obedience to Jesus. that's its purpose. obedience brings blessing and life. shout grace grace all you wish as everyone its a choice. I will follow the grace that makes new life and gives the way to eternal life. The grace that teaches No to sin, and GIVES US RIGHTEOUSNESS, that we are to Live in.

see if you can grab a line out of this one as well and twist it, seems to be pretty useful on this site :) does paul teach repentance? obedience? or does he teach say grace? or have you read paul?
 
Jun 1, 2016
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For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation for all people, training us to renounce ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright, and godly lives in the present age, waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ,
(Tit 2:11-13)

also try ephesians 4:17-5:7......just a sample 5:3-7 but among you there MUST NOT BE even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed.v5 for of this you can be sure no immoral, impure or greedy person- such a man is an idolater has any inheritance in the Kingdom of Christ and of God. Let NO ONE DECEIVE you with empty words for because of such things THE WRATH OF GOD COMES ON THOSE WHO ARE DISOBEDIENT....

these things are throughout most of pauls letters, but like all the other things they are disregarded because they don't fit Grace grace....Grace is true, it is mistaught and leading many the wrong direction. paul taught repentance, obedience just like the rest of the bible does. Grace is Jesus dying for us, giving His holy spirit enabling us to live as God says to live. because God wants us to live eternally with Him. its not oppressive to obey God. Hes good, as are all of His ways. Grace in truth is for the purpose of obedience to God through Jesus Christ who offered grace, but grace is only a drop of what He gives.
 
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bikerchaz

Guest
A bit like grace777x70 I wasn't going to post on here again, but come on children! Stop behaving like little children, children. This grace thing comes up again and again in different forms. when we were told to confess our sins and pray for each other, we were told just that. Why do we try and make something out of it that re-enforces our own point of view?

If we accept what God has allowed into the cannon of scripture and prayerfully read it with the Holy Spirits guidance then what wrong is there? Is not God big enough to bring our hearts into unity with Him if that is what we truly desire? Even Jesus said "Those who are for me are not against me".

It is not our place to pull up the weeds, do you hear? it is not our place. Have you ever noticed that the weeds don't show until the heads of wheat are starting to form? God knows the heart and test the heart in all of us and while we bicker and falter what do we do? we take our eyes of the main prize, being with Jesus.

If anyone has had a direct vision of what God wants you to do then speak up so the spirit can be tested. If it is to defend grace then speak up! If it is to dig out the tares then speak up! This is a discussion forum so lets discuss and test the spirit, even God will allow testing to find what is of Him. If you feel passionately about something, yes God may have given you that passion, but that passion is yours from God as a gift for you, not a club to brow beat your brothers and sisters.

And yes I can hear the Beatles in the back ground with a bass and brass section singing "Love, love, love." because this is a direct order from Jesus to love one another as He loved us, not to find fault. If we judge then we will be judged by the same standards, if we love then we will also be loved with that same love, there is no secret in this it is not hidden by thought provoking words that need searching out, it is plain.

The upshot of all this is, it is Gods Church, He is able to bring change to those who need it through the relationship He has within them through the Holy Spirit, else-wise they as we shall be known by our fruit. "good tree can not bring forth bad fruit and a bad tree can not bring forth good fruit." and "By their fruit you shall know them"
 
P

popeye

Guest
lol that's exactly how the false doctrines are taken from pauls words haha a few lines here n there. its amazing how this particular doctrine turns people away from Gods word. its appealing to think Gods gonna make us obey or not expect obedience. Yet he is the same. Grace is what makes a person able again. what do you think paul means by put to deth your sinful nature? if you live by it you will die? but you show perfectly how the false doctrines start. like reading a line in the middle of a novel and telling people its the whole story. Paul himself teaches repentence and obedience all throughout his own letters also. those parts are utterly avoided as any are that require obedience to Gods word. not at all surprised, thanks for the great example of how the false doctrines start. Grace is for obedience to Jesus. that's its purpose. obedience brings blessing and life. shout grace grace all you wish as everyone its a choice. I will follow the grace that makes new life and gives the way to eternal life. The grace that teaches No to sin, and GIVES US RIGHTEOUSNESS, that we are to Live in.

see if you can grab a line out of this one as well and twist it, seems to be pretty useful on this site :) does paul teach repentance? obedience? or does he teach say grace? or have you read paul?
Cessationists are almost 100% cross centered.

Is that ok with some people?
It is OK with me,that is the entire package to them. The power and resurrection is abstract and foolish to those believers.

Prince is resurrection centered.

Now I can be both resurrection centered and cross centered simultaneously,but not the other way around.

"A man tells a drivers ed student,'do you keep the car centered in the lane'?.

No,we were taught to " NOT STRAY INTO THE OTHER LANE",so it must be wrong to "keep it centered".

That is how I see the "but,but do they preach AGAINST SIN?, then they are false"
 
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popeye

Guest
Ever see a dog cower when someone raises their hand to them?

My dog is oblivious to that concept.

I operate my relationship with her in a 90% positive,and reward structure.

She was taught "NO" as a puppy.

She doesn't need daily refresher courses on a no brainer.

Cross centered produces flinching believers
 
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Depleted

Guest
Let's be crystal clear..... If you back a heretic & promote a heretic's doctrine, that makes you a heretic & you will reap a heretic's reward unless you repent..... & I truly wish you would, I would that your eyes be opened to see this monster for who he is. Don't cry foul & judging, for you have judged others on here as slanderers for standing up for the truth. Repent before you reap what you sow.
Whoa, Dude! And people think I'm tough! I agree, but didn't even think to say that, so thanks.
 
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