Minnesota Shooting (Lets Start Over)

[badger58]

I have a difficult time saying "Castile got himself killed because triggered an alert reaction." It appears he was complying with the first command from the officer before/after he informed the officer he had a weapon and permit for it. Maybe it was unwise or not the best decision he made, but nevertheless, it does not warrant being killed in front of your daughter and fiance. Castile was in complete compliance with the law from what we know.

That's like saying a woman wearing a mini skirt "got herself raped" by triggering a hormonal male. No no no no... the victim didn't do anything [legal or illegal] to get raped.

This is a national tragedy, we are entering a very dark time. We have to say something! Do something! Be there for those that have been torn apart by decent events.
I suggest all of you google, a police chief by the name of Sjolander.
He has been taking a leadership role in starting a dialog of healing.
I sent him this message on facebook this morning.
Dear Chief Sjolander,
I was inspired(I'm sure im not the only one) by your essay or open letter after what has happened this week.
I realize that you heartfelt views may be partially due to the demographics of the community that you serve(at least some may think that) but that being said, your take on this subject, is enough reason to hope for a way out of the darkness.
My prayer is that whom ever is sworn in, as the next president of the united states would have the good sense to give you some sort of platform to address and come along side, all the police chiefs of the country(heck, the world), at least a weekend retreat on a lake in the mountains .
I'm going to be voicing this view wherever I can, and see what happens. I won't ask you if your up to the challenge, I'll just say that we need more men with vision in leadership roles, to replace the career politicians.
I know that our Father in Heaven would have your back!
Anyway, I just wanted to say thank you,for your service, for your courage and honoring the call of duty. May God bless you and yours.
P.S I've got penguin pajama bottoms too!
I hope you have a great day Sir.

 

[PennEd]

It is hard to dialogue while misinformation is being spread.
1. There is no record of this individual having a permit to carry.
2. The officer in question is Hispanic of Mexican descent.
3. There are several videos of both adults smoking pot in the car WITH the small child in it.
4. Driver matched description of recent robbery perpetrator.
5. Driver did not comply with officer's order to not move.

We are being used by the media to further racial hatred and division. DON'T be a part of it!

 

[Voldemort]

It is hard to dialogue while misinformation is being spread.
1. There is no record of this individual having a permit to carry.
2. The officer in question is Hispanic of Mexican descent.
3. There are several videos of both adults smoking pot in the car WITH the small child in it.
4. Driver matched description of recent robbery perpetrator.
5. Driver did not comply with officer's order to not move.

We are being used by the media to further racial hatred and division. DON'T be a part of it!

The unfortunate thing is, you may be right. And if it turns out that this woman lied, and the media pawned it as facts, she should be incredibly remorseful considering a gunman was inspired to kill innocent police officers because of her blatant and deceitful lies. I hope that when and if it turns out the information is false, the media spends several days reiterating the true facts so we can set the record straight and allow for the two sides, police and protestors, to amend their relations.

 

[hornetguy]

The unfortunate thing is, you may be right. And if it turns out that this woman lied, and the media pawned it as facts, she should be incredibly remorseful considering a gunman was inspired to kill innocent police officers because of her blatant and deceitful lies. I hope that when and if it turns out the information is false, the media spends several days reiterating the true facts so we can set the record straight and allow for the two sides, police and protestors, to amend their relations.

I hope if that is the case, the media will do that, as well...... but they won't. They will be on to the next item, sensationalizing it for more viewers.... truth or not.

 

[PennEd]

The unfortunate thing is, you may be right. And if it turns out that this woman lied, and the media pawned it as facts, she should be incredibly remorseful considering a gunman was inspired to kill innocent police officers because of her blatant and deceitful lies. I hope that when and if it turns out the information is false, the media spends several days reiterating the true facts so we can set the record straight and allow for the two sides, police and protestors, to amend their relations.

I did not watch the whole video so I'm not sure about language.
Philando Castile Child Abuse=> Video Surfaces of Castile and Girlfriend Smoking Pot Driving with Child in Car

 

[peacenik]

I could be wrong but something tells me that he most likely wasn't looking to get into a violent altercation with a police officer with his girlfriend and child in the car after they had just come back from purchasing groceries

But you know how some people are: ''always blame the black guy!''

 

[hornetguy]

But you know how some people are: ''always blame the black guy!''

.... and some people are: "always make excuses for why the black guy did the crime"

It would be really nice if NOBODY offered any opinions until actual facts are released by the investigators, wouldn't it?

 

[peacenik]

videos present prima facie ​factual evidence

 

[hornetguy]

all a video gives is one angle of observation.

Why do you think they have multiple cameras in use for "instant replay" in sports? From one angle, the guy gets tagged out at home. From another angle, the catcher completely misses touching him.

Never assume you know the facts from one camera angle. You cannot see if the guy on the ground had his hand reaching for his pocket, or the cop's gun... You simply don't know... and to assume guilt because of that is foolhardy.

It may very well have been an un-justified shooting, but I am not going to jump to that conclusion based on one shaky video from one angle.

There are many EXPERTS that are doing forensic work on that case.... I will wait to hear what they have to say.

 

[peacenik]

.... and some people are: "always make excuses for why the black guy did the crime"

It would be really nice if NOBODY offered any opinions until actual facts are released by the investigators, wouldn't it?

some right wingers have even gone so far as to say that he had been convicted of a felony - but here's hint for the scoffers: had he been convicted of a felony, he

1) would not have been allowed to have a gun license

2) would not be allowed to work in a school where there are vulnerable children

3) likely would have had a restriction on his license plate so that he would know cops would be on the look out for him




As for camera angles, knowing how blacks are dealt with in the courts, I'm betting that even if it is shown that the cop did not follow proper procedure, he will get off scot free and the taxpayers will have to foot the bill of a civil lawsuit from the victim's family.

 

[hornetguy]

some right wingers have even gone so far as to say that he had been convicted of a felony - but here's hint for the scoffers: had he been convicted of a felony, he

1) would not have been allowed to have a gun license

2) would not be allowed to work in a school where there are vulnerable children

3) likely would have had a restriction on his license plate so that he would know cops would be on the look out for him




As for camera angles, knowing how blacks are dealt with in the courts, I'm betting that even if it is shown that the cop did not follow proper procedure, he will get off scot free and the taxpayers will have to foot the bill of a civil lawsuit from the victim's family.

You have a very negative view of our society...

I feel sorry for anyone stumbling through life with that approach to things.

There are many things that bother me about societal conditions right now, but I suppose I'm more a glass half full kind of person... I try to NOT see bad in every situation, with conspiracy theories about "the man"....
I think that things will get better, once we remove the sources of discord.

MOST people, I believe, want to live in a world where we all treat each other fairly, no matter what our skin looks like.

 

[Sirk]

You have a very negative view of our society...

I feel sorry for anyone stumbling through life with that approach to things.

There are many things that bother me about societal conditions right now, but I suppose I'm more a glass half full kind of person... I try to NOT see bad in every situation, with conspiracy theories about "the man"....
I think that things will get better, once we remove the sources of discord.

MOST people, I believe, want to live in a world where we all treat each other fairly, no matter what our skin looks like.

Exactly. What good is there in fostering and enabling a victim hood mentality? The left is pretty good at it. Honestly it is criminal to think that way. Nothing good can come from it.

 

[peacenik]

You have a very negative view of our society...

I feel sorry for anyone stumbling through life with that approach to things.

There are many things that bother me about societal conditions right now, but I suppose I'm more a glass half full kind of person... I try to NOT see bad in every situation, with conspiracy theories about "the man"....
I think that things will get better, once we remove the sources of discord.

MOST people, I believe, want to live in a world where we all treat each other fairly, no matter what our skin looks like.

You may view it as "negative" while I view it as realism.

Recall that much of the USA was shocked and outraged at the Wilding Incident where four black men viciously attacked a white woman and sexually assaulted her. The cops caught them red handed and they readily confessed to the crime. It was so bad that Rush Limbaugh spent an entire week telling the world on his radio how this case affirmed every stereotype about black men. In fact, several blacks spoke out against black male youths and said that this case hurts blacks terribly and that they should each be terribly ashamed of their crimes.


Years later we discovered that the four men were innocent. That police made up the story of "Wilding" and that they had engaged in a conspiracy to beat up and force these innocents to confess to a crime they never committed. Thereafter the city taxpayers were forced to pay millions for the crimes committed by the criminal cops. Not one of those police ever spent a minute in jail for their crimes. They retired on fat pensions financed by taxpayers and are living happily thereafter despite this tremendous crime.

Taxpayers have been forced to pay over one billion for these and other police crimes:


Cost of Police-Misconduct Cases Soars in Big U.S. Cities - WSJ



For those of us who live in the world of reality as opposed to those who live in the illusory world of right wing political correctness, this causes us shock and outrage. For those of you who claim to be Christian and believe Mosaic law's rule of lex talionis you should be demanding that the punishment fit the crime for these police criminals.

 

[Sinnerman]

some right wingers have even gone so far as to say that he had been convicted of a felony - but here's hint for the scoffers: had he been convicted of a felony, he

1) would not have been allowed to have a gun license

2) would not be allowed to work in a school where there are vulnerable children

3) likely would have had a restriction on his license plate so that he would know cops would be on the look out for him




As for camera angles, knowing how blacks are dealt with in the courts, I'm betting that even if it is shown that the cop did not follow proper procedure, he will get off scot free and the taxpayers will have to foot the bill of a civil lawsuit from the victim's family.

The wording should be; should not have been allowed to have a gun license and should not be allowed to work in a school. We are talking about the government. The people who can't deliver mail on time or run the DMV or really any government agency efficiently or effectively.

It takes overwhelming evidence to convict a police officer of criminal negligence, or homicide. It takes merely a preponderance of the evidence in a civil lawsuit. The difference is maybe 90% certainty vs. 51% certainty. Plus, juries tend to be generous when doling out other peoples money to a dead person's family. Even if the dead person was a pot smoking fool.

 

[peacenik]

The wording should be; should not have been allowed to have a gun license and should not be allowed to work in a school

Why? He had demonstrated enough good character to qualify for both.

 

[Sirk]

You may view it as "negative" while I view it as realism.

Recall that much of the USA was shocked and outraged at the Wilding Incident where four black men viciously attacked a white woman and sexually assaulted her. The cops caught them red handed and they readily confessed to the crime. It was so bad that Rush Limbaugh spent an entire week telling the world on his radio how this case affirmed every stereotype about black men. In fact, several blacks spoke out against black male youths and said that this case hurts blacks terribly and that they should each be terribly ashamed of their crimes.


Years later we discovered that the four men were innocent. That police made up the story of "Wilding" and that they had engaged in a conspiracy to beat up and force these innocents to confess to a crime they never committed. Thereafter the city taxpayers were forced to pay millions for the crimes committed by the criminal cops. Not one of those police ever spent a minute in jail for their crimes. They retired on fat pensions financed by taxpayers and are living happily thereafter despite this tremendous crime.

Taxpayers have been forced to pay over one billion for these and other police crimes:


Cost of Police-Misconduct Cases Soars in Big U.S. Cities - WSJ



For those of us who live in the world of reality as opposed to those who live in the illusory world of right wing political correctness, this causes us shock and outrage. For those of you who claim to be Christian and believe Mosaic law's rule of lex talionis you should be demanding that the punishment fit the crime for these police criminals.

Maybe you should apply the same logic to Hillary? Deblasio fan I assume?

 

[Sinnerman]

Why? He had demonstrated enough good character to qualify for both.

Sorry. I didn't make it clear. I meant had he been a convicted felon, he "should" not have been allowed those two things, not would not be allowed those two things. Lazy and inept government workers often fail to do their jobs and people slip through the cracks. Killers are accidentally released from prisons. Illegal immigrants who have committed serious crimes are released on the streets rather than being turned over to ICE for deportation. Schools hire pedophiles. Etc.

Men or women who smoke pot while driving and in front of small children lack character and should not be hired to work around children at a school. He clearly didn't understand the proper way to handle a gun in front of a police officer or he'd be alive and smoking pot with his girlfriend right now, probably in front of that small child.

When our President said that if he had a son, he'd look like Trayvon Martin, did you climb on board the bandwagon and defend that thug and accuse George Zimmerman of murder? It seems consistent with your way of thinking. I'm assuming you watched some of his trial and got a chance to learn at least some of the facts that his supporters seemed to have little interest in, including our President.

 

[Sinnerman]

You may view it as "negative" while I view it as realism.

Recall that much of the USA was shocked and outraged at the Wilding Incident where four black men viciously attacked a white woman and sexually assaulted her. The cops caught them red handed and they readily confessed to the crime. It was so bad that Rush Limbaugh spent an entire week telling the world on his radio how this case affirmed every stereotype about black men. In fact, several blacks spoke out against black male youths and said that this case hurts blacks terribly and that they should each be terribly ashamed of their crimes.


Years later we discovered that the four men were innocent. That police made up the story of "Wilding" and that they had engaged in a conspiracy to beat up and force these innocents to confess to a crime they never committed. Thereafter the city taxpayers were forced to pay millions for the crimes committed by the criminal cops. Not one of those police ever spent a minute in jail for their crimes. They retired on fat pensions financed by taxpayers and are living happily thereafter despite this tremendous crime.
.

Care to discuss the wilding attack in Central Park? I mean the actual truthful story, not the one you just made up. It was a vicious attack. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Park_jogger_case that is for sure. Those young men were monsters, evil monsters. They freely confessed to their crimes. They were not caught red handed, as you stated. They were caught in Central Park after they had attacked a number of innocent victims. The police didn't make up anything. Perhaps the word wilding was a misunderstanding because some blacks speak in something referred to as ebonics. They probably said they were doing the wild thing, not wilding. I once arrested a young black burglar who I asked repeatedly what his name was and he said Justice Memphis. At least that is what it sounded like he said. I said it back to him repeatedly and he replied in the affirmative. He was then fingerprinted and charged with giving false information. His lawyer stated he tried to give his real name and I misunderstood him.

There was no conspiracy. They didn't beat confessions out of these thugs. They made most of their confessions while in custody of arresting officers patrol cars or before most of detectives even spoke to them. They voluntarily stated that one of them raped the woman. One of them was certain they had killed her, and they almost did kill her. The mentality of thugs is such that the younger ones felt compelled to also climb on her and rape her, even though they may not have ejaculated or even had an erection. They merely performed a mock rape for their older thug buddies. Then then left the scene and the victim unconscious. It is likely that is when this serial rapist arrived and did unspeakable things to her. That is why they were never found innocent. You do know the difference between being found innocent and having a conviction vacated? Well, no, it seems you do not know the difference. The city would not have lost a lawsuit. However, it was a political move by a liberal mayor trying to gain favor in the black community that resulted in a large settlement. Those young thugs were guilty and properly convicted. DNA evidence in the 1980's was non-existent. They did freely confess and their lawyers were able to convince some of the public that they were forced confessions. They were not.

 

[hornetguy]

Why? He had demonstrated enough good character to qualify for both.

You do not have to demonstrate "good character" to obtain a concealed carry permit.
Simply take the training, pass the shooting test, and be cleared by law enforcement as to no felonies, or some misdemeanors.

And I DO insist that people that hold the public trust, police, firefighters, lawyers, doctors, ministers/priests.... ALL be held to a higher standard.
I believe that if one of those folks takes advantage of someone because of their position, the penalty should be DOUBLE what it would be for a regular civilian.

You are not the only person here with moral and righteous indignation about injustice. You are just too ready to throw it around, before you know the facts in a case.

 

[peacenik]

Maybe you should apply the same logic to Hillary? Deblasio fan I assume?

Actually, it would be more apropos to Bush and Blair but none of these people are at issue in this thread.