We Have Forgotten That The Way Is Narrow

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
S

sevenseas

Guest
#221
#221
eternally-gratefull said:

I think what he was trying to say, and I agree with, Is there can be a difference.

A non believer can serve the poor.. A believer can serve the poor..

Both of these works can be considered works of self righteousness.. (depending on the believers reason for doing it) but only one of them is capable of doing this work as a work of righteousness of God.
Click to expand...

I personally would not call it self-righteousness unless the person is seeing the works as building a stairway to heaven

(sorry now everyone has that song in their head. meh heh heh)

some people actually do have the gift of helping others and look for ways to do so

it's not generally a gift people are jumping up and down to have though :(
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#222
#222
sevenseas said:
I personally would not call it self-righteousness unless the person is seeing the works as building a stairway to heaven

(sorry now everyone has that song in their head. meh heh heh)

some people actually do have the gift of helping others and look for ways to do so

it's not generally a gift people are jumping up and down to have though :(
Click to expand...

I agree, some do not like it..they want grreater gifts..lol

As for self righteousness, If I do it for the praise of men, I do it for selfish reasons,, Even if I am not doing it to make steps for a stairway to heaven, It is still a self righteous deed. And we will not be rewarded for that deed, it will be burnt.
 
S

sevenseas

Guest
#223
#223
Grace777x70 said:
I agree 100%.

The deceitfulness of sin tells us that if we do good works - we will be righteous. Sin is so deceitful in it's desire to trick us into not believing in what Christ has done in the area of righteousness - that He alone is our righteousness because of what He has done.

The trick of sin deceitfully says "do good works and it will establish your righteous".

Good works do benefit the one receiving them but they do not make one righteous.

Get this backwards and we end up creating a religion of self-righteousness/holiness that actually denies the very grace of God in Christ needed for His life and fruit to be manifested by His good works in and through us to a hurt world that needs to see and know the love and grace our Father really has for them.
Click to expand...
haha

now some will say but doesn't doing the righteous works of God create righteousness in us?

personally, I NEED to know I am doing something 'righteous' (please understand that word here in context of what I am trying to say) to feel good. I am not counting it as righteousness I create, but something to please God with

does God create that desire in us? do we want to please God?

leave no stone unturned may be a part of my personality. maybe LOL!
 
S

sevenseas

Guest
#224
#224
eternally-gratefull said:

I agree, some do not like it..they want grreater gifts..lol

As for self righteousness, If I do it for the praise of men, I do it for selfish reasons,, Even if I am not doing it to make steps for a stairway to heaven, It is still a self righteous deed. And we will not be rewarded for that deed, it will be burnt.
Click to expand...


yeah, ok, I see your point

people will follow or flock around or attach themselves to those they perceive as being closer to God or doing whatever that seems to indicate that God has blessed them, as in given His approval through things that happen in their life

gee I'm getting complicated now but no I do not supply the advil to go along with my questions.

further, we don't ask God to make us humble, we humble ourselves before Him and apparently He thinks the best leaders are humble

Moses for example
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#225
#225
sevenseas said:
yeah, ok, I see your point

people will follow or flock around or attach themselves to those they perceive as being closer to God or doing whatever that seems to indicate that God has blessed them, as in given His approval through things that happen in their life

gee I'm getting complicated now but no I do not supply the advil to go along with my questions.

further, we don't ask God to make us humble, we humble ourselves before Him and apparently He thinks the best leaders are humble

Moses for example
Click to expand...

You can ask god to help make you humble, Just like asking him to teach you patience, you better be ready, Because HE WILL!!
 
S

sevenseas

Guest
#226
#226
I would never ask God to make me humble

now comes the barrage.

late breakfast is now digested enough to go work so be back later to pick up the pieces :eek:
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#227
#227
sevenseas said:
I would never ask God to make me humble

now comes the barrage.

late breakfast is now digested enough to go work so be back later to pick up the pieces :eek:
Click to expand...
I asked him to help me with my patience once or twice.. I regretted it a few times..

It is like lifting weights, You have to go through pain until that weight becomes easy,, Patience and humility sometimes is the same concept. You have to suffer situations,, Until you learn to rely on God, because sometimes it is hard to get rid of thinking you can do it.. and it NEVER works.
 
PeterJens

PeterJens

Banned
#228
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#228
I was surprised at people condemning good works.

But over time it is apparent they mean the hypocrisy appearing nice yet not being inside.

I will relate an impression someone said. They felt people coming round to their house where
like cockroaches coming to visit.

So the good deeds become equated to the evil within. But this is a lie. Until you know people
you do not know the reality, and good is still good.

Once you begin to see people are blind and lost, and all they see is fake, while trying to make
the best of things, all appears different.

I have seen the same here. I am told I must be evil, lying, false and the indicators are pulled
out but it is all cynicism, not reality, disbelief and not faith. I know this world but I also love
you and know if you see this in me, your heart needs to know love and the cross and see He
will never fail, He loves you.

Speaking from the heart is reality, Jesus's way. But you need to be clean, pure, alive.
Then you will see.
 
G

gb9

Senior Member
#229
Jan 18, 2011
11,893
6,399
113
#229
last paragraph. speaking from the heart is NOT reality, if it does not agree with reality and facts and standards. I could really strongly from the heart feel that I am 7 feet tall and weigh 300 pounds. but if the standards of weight and measure do not say 7 feet and 300 pounds , then I am NOT, no matter what my heart feels.
facts, not feelings should have most influence on how we see life.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#230
#230
gb9 said:
last paragraph. speaking from the heart is NOT reality, if it does not agree with reality and facts and standards. I could really strongly from the heart feel that I am 7 feet tall and weigh 300 pounds. but if the standards of weight and measure do not say 7 feet and 300 pounds , then I am NOT, no matter what my heart feels.
facts, not feelings should have most influence on how we see life.
Click to expand...
I agree, Not to mention, This is what scripture says about this.

Jeremiah 17:9
“The heart is deceitful above all things, And desperately wicked; Who can know it?
 
PeterJens

PeterJens

Banned
#231
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#231
gb9 said:
last paragraph. speaking from the heart is NOT reality, if it does not agree with reality and facts and standards. I could really strongly from the heart feel that I am 7 feet tall and weigh 300 pounds. but if the standards of weight and measure do not say 7 feet and 300 pounds , then I am NOT, no matter what my heart feels.
facts, not feelings should have most influence on how we see life.
Click to expand...
My friend you are your heart. If you cannot speak from your heart you do not know
yourself.

In your heart dwells who you are, how you respond to the world, what you have concluded.
All ones decisions, perceptions, observations start here, and work there way out into life.

If you have not learnt this, then you must have shut out a lot, and are too scared to look
at who you really are.

I am the worst of sinners, lost, incapable of being good, until Jesus came into my heart
and washed me clean. This is why the cross is so powerful, and how we will not agree
until you have seen this reality in yourself.

And as you like to say facts, this is always the facts of who we are.
Anything that impacts us above this is always window dressing.
 
PeterJens

PeterJens

Banned
#232
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#232
gb9 said:
last paragraph. speaking from the heart is NOT reality, if it does not agree with reality and facts and standards. I could really strongly from the heart feel that I am 7 feet tall and weigh 300 pounds. but if the standards of weight and measure do not say 7 feet and 300 pounds , then I am NOT, no matter what my heart feels.
facts, not feelings should have most influence on how we see life.
Click to expand...
The heart is our reality.
This is why Jesus says we must forgive from the heart.

In our hearts the Holy Spirit dwells. Love has its foundation in our hearts.
We repent from our hearts or else it is superficial.

This is so basic, you are definning a surface response or skin deep faith.

Lord, May you help us all to open our hearts to you and let you in, because of the cross
we know you will love and heal us, in Jesus's name, amen
 
PeterJens

PeterJens

Banned
#233
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#233
We need a thread on the heart, because some do not know who they are.
 
G

gb9

Senior Member
#234
Jan 18, 2011
11,893
6,399
113
#234
PeterJens said:
We need a thread on the heart, because some do not know who they are.
Click to expand...
wow, you really do not like to talk about facts, standards, hitting the mark, knowing to do good and not doing so.

the title of this thread is about the narrow way. well, I promise you, letting your feelings determine reality will never, ever be the narrow way.

facts, peter, not emotional opinions.
 
F

FreeNChrist

Guest
#235
#235
PeterJens said:
I was surprised at people condemning good works.

But over time it is apparent they mean the hypocrisy appearing nice yet not being inside.

I will relate an impression someone said. They felt people coming round to their house where
like cockroaches coming to visit.

So the good deeds become equated to the evil within. But this is a lie. Until you know people
you do not know the reality, and good is still good.

Once you begin to see people are blind and lost, and all they see is fake, while trying to make
the best of things, all appears different.

I have seen the same here. I am told I must be evil, lying, false and the indicators are pulled
out but it is all cynicism, not reality, disbelief and not faith. I know this world but I also love
you and know if you see this in me, your heart needs to know love and the cross and see He
will never fail, He loves you.

Speaking from the heart is reality, Jesus's way. But you need to be clean, pure, alive.
Then you will see.
Click to expand...
No one condemns good works, but many of us do appropriately condemn dead works of the flesh that some want to pass off as good works.
 
PeterJens

PeterJens

Banned
#236
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#236
FreeNChrist said:
No one condemns good works, but many of us do appropriately condemn dead works of the flesh that some want to pass off as good works.
Click to expand...
This is news speak. You condemn "dead works" which are good deeds but judged by you as
wrong. I know this trick, and it is always miss-leading, relabelling an action so it appears ok
but actually it is wrong.

I never thought be!levers would do this but now you have.
 
PeterJens

PeterJens

Banned
#237
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#237
gb9 said:
wow, you really do not like to talk about facts, standards, hitting the mark, knowing to do good and not doing so.

the title of this thread is about the narrow way. well, I promise you, letting your feelings determine reality will never, ever be the narrow way.

facts, peter, not emotional opinions.
Click to expand...
All I can say is God bless, you do not see your heart determines how you see the world.
It is no surprise you are where you are then.

Jesus came to set us free from sin which binds our hearts. No matter what I share if
the words never make it, they mean very little. It appears unless the Lord is invited in
things stay as they are. Born from on high has its signs and this is one.

The problem I have is I profile this type of response and you meet it 100%.
Christ wept for Lazerus, but why? Christ wept for Jerusalem? But why?
We are more than facts and faith.
 
F

FreeNChrist

Guest
#238
#238
PeterJens said:
This is news speak. You condemn "dead works" which are good deeds but judged by you as
wrong. I know this trick, and it is always miss-leading, relabelling an action so it appears ok
but actually it is wrong.

I never thought be!levers would do this but now you have.
Click to expand...
Ummmmm, its the re-labeling of dead works of the flesh as good works that is the misleading trick. :rolleyes:
 
PeterJens

PeterJens

Banned
#239
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#239
For those wondering. Who loves you and who hates you? Who do you love and how do
you show it?

Our lives are bounded by these feelings built on perceptions.
You would not go into a room of enemies without preparation and fear would be close at hand.
So what tells you which scenario you are facing? Facts or feelings?
Both can be right and wrong, and both determine ones reactions.
 
PeterJens

PeterJens

Banned
#240
Feb 24, 2015
13,204
168
0
#240
FreeNChrist said:
Ummmmm, its the re-labeling of dead works of the flesh as good works that is the misleading trick. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
I work from high categories to lower. A good work is just that, a good deed. You then decide
which category to put it under. It is just a way of avoiding the idea all can do good things.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.