Where does Jesus Speak about the Millennium?

[Depleted]

Hi everyone. Just wanted to give my thoughts and I hope I don't come accross as dismissive concerning this post and to anyone who has posted here.

All of the above is beyond me. I've researched myself concerning this and pre-trib, post-trib, pre millennial and post millennial and so on.

It does my head in so much so I lost it up my backside.

I agree it is good to discuss such things but for me it really isn't a hill to die on, if we try to prove what we believe concerning such matters then we can miss the bigger picture.

The bigger picture being the hill Jesus died on, when he said "It is finished"
Reconciled to the Father, sins forgiven for those who place their faith in him.

Jesus gave 2 new commandments and took it further, love your enemies.

I focus on that myself now. So regardless whilst we are on this earth just let's be like Jesus and leave it up him

Next time, pick an easier topic. Teddy bears have only been around since the 1890's, so studying their history is even much easier than studying your country's history.

 

[Locutus]

So in other words you cant find anything about the millennium in the gospels or Paul's, Peter's or John's letters.

PS my country England has tea bags older than yours...

 

[Depleted]

You missed the point. There is no symbolism regarding the reference of a thousand years. The thousand years in revelation has no need of outside application as to its meaning. It is very clear and up front in its meaning of a literal thousand years. The confusion only comes when expositors attempt to apply a symbolic meaning to the time given.

What is it in the context that is leading you to look for anything other than what the scripture states?

Actually, it is you who constantly misses the point. You tend to think the whole Bible is there to prove your point. And yet, you are so focused on your point, you left no room for the obvious point. He is the Lord, and the entire point of the Bible is him.

I really don't have problems with anyone choosing whichever version they want on what happens in the future. BUT since that is the one and only topic you ever talk about -- forever proselytizing towards that view, instead of God -- you really have no point.

 

[Locutus]

And you lot still owe the Brits for that tea yer dumped in the Briny...

 

[Depleted]

Well, the Lord will never be able to say to me, why didn't you believe what I wrote. You and others who change the meaning on the other hand ......

When in history has the lion eaten straw like the Ox?

When in history has a young child been able to play near a Cobra's den and stick his hand in there a not be hurt at all?

When have prey and predator animals and their young ever been able to lie down together and a young child lead them around?

These are just some of the characteristics of the millennial period.

My fear for you is when you have your face-to-face, the Lord will say, "Truly, I say to you, I do not know you."

 

[Elizabeth619]

I've wasted about as much time on figuring out my views of eschatology as I have studying the history of the teddy bear. (Oh, and I really have "wasted time" on both topics, simply because I felt like learning something at the time.)

Correct me if I'm wrong, because I really know I'm not that knowledgeable, but are there any full-preterists around? I have never met anyone who thinks Jesus' second coming already happened. So, I'm thinking there is no such creature as a Preterist.

(I am a semi-preterist specifically because we're still here/Jesus hasn't returned for the big finale yet.)

There used to be one guy who was a member here who said he was full preterist. It was a rather interesting view. He claimed Gods judgement already happened and when we die we go directly to heaven or hell.

 

[Locutus]

Full preterism does say that upon death a Christian receives the spiritual body, what happens to the none Christian is up to the Lord.

 

[Depleted]

I haven't got a clue what you are saying here Depleted.

Yeah, after reading this thread, I don't blame you. Most intelligent arguments in eschatology can be done including some of Jesus' words, some of the epistles, and Revelation. I honestly didn't know, (until reading the thread), that there are people who have so consumed themselves with a fleeting viewpoint as to never leave Revelation and they believe everything God ever wanted us to know is found in that one book only. Back when I was a millienialist, I was taught the theory from throughout all of the NT.

I just didn't know some have become so utterly deceived.

But question for you. Why keep posting toward their deception? Isn't that like trying to talk a person out of the compulsion to never step on sidewalk cracks by pointing out the cracks in the sidewalk? They're already obsessed, so why fuel the obsession? What purpose in you going for it?

 

[valiant]

Well if we want to stick with the topic it is not John but Jesus who has revealed to us that there will be a Millennium, and it will only be established after His second coming. That is why Revelation 20 follows Revelation 19.


1And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

2And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

3And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

4And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

5But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

6Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

7And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,...

and we all know that in the OT 'a thousand' with a time word always means 'a long unmeasured period of time.

 

[valiant]

e,g. 1000generations is NEVER literal

 

[shrume]

My fear for you is when you have your face-to-face, the Lord will say, "Truly, I say to you, I do not know you."

Why would you say this?

Do you think a person's views on eschatology determine whether Jesus "knows" a Christian or not?

FWIW, I mostly agree with Ahwatukee's understanding of the end times. Does that mean Jesus will say he never knew me?

 

[shrume]

e,g. 1000generations is NEVER literal

Why can't this verse be understood literally?

2 Pet 3:
8) But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Why can't the thousand years here be literal?

Rev 20:
1) And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2) And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3) And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4) And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5) But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6) Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7) And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

Just because?

 

[Willie-T]

Why can't this verse be understood literally?

2 Pet 3:
8) But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Why can't the thousand years here be literal?

Rev 20:
1) And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2) And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3) And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4) And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5) But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6) Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7) And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

Just because?

Look at what you just wrote:

Do you honestly think Hell has metal locks and keys? Or that a chain forged into links is going to ever be used to keep Satan restrained? Do you honestly think there are people somewhere in the air who just sit on chairs all day and night? And do you think the marks of either God or Satan in foreheads and hands are actually physical marks.

That book is swamped with symbolic metaphors. My goodness, John even starts of telling us he was "in the spirit" when he "saw" all these things. What on Earth do you think "in the spirit" means, anyway? The guy was zoned-out.

 

[oldhermit]

Well, the Lord will never be able to say to me, why didn't you believe what I wrote. You and others who change the meaning on the other hand ......

When in history has the lion eaten straw like the Ox?

When in history has a young child been able to play near a Cobra's den and stick his hand in there a not be hurt at all?

When have prey and predator animals and their young ever been able to lie down together and a young child lead them around?

These are just some of the characteristics of the millennial period.

I started not to respond to this for reasons stated earlier but I think for the sake of some others it is necessary that I do so.

This is what both Isaiah and Micah had prophesied.
A. The restoration of Edinic conditions.
“And the wolf will dwell with the lamb, and the leopard will lie down with the young goat, and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; And a little boy will lead them. Also the cow and the bear will graze, their young will lie down together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox the nursing child will play by the hole of the cobra, and the weaned child will put his hand on the viper’s den. They will not hurt or destroy in all My holy mountain, for the earth will be full of the knowledge of the LORD as the waters cover the sea.” In other words, the are not devouring one another.Isaiah. 11:6-9
This is not to be understood as literal language. This is not talking about literal lions or vipers. We know this is symbolic language because Isaiah 35:9 tells us, “No lion will be there, Nor will any vicious beast go up on it; These will not be found there. But the redeemed will walk there”).

1. This a symbol of natural enemies existing in peace with one another and with man.
2. It is ONLY “In all My holy mountain” that we are told these conditions would exist. The holy mountain of God is Zion – the Church, Hebrews 12:18-23.
3. This would happen when “the whole earth is full of the knowledge of Jehovah.” The filling of the earth was the commission given to the apostle and jointly to us, Matthew 28:18-20, Mark 16:15-16, Luke 24:46-49. John 20:19-20 It began here in Acts 2 and continues still.

B. These peaceful conditions would be then extended to the nations.
“And it will come about in the last days that the mountain of the house of the LORD will be established as the chief of the mountains. It will be raised above the hills, and the peoples will stream to it. Many nations will come and say, “Come and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD and to the house of the God of Jacob, that He may teach us about His ways and that we may walk in His paths.” For from Zion will go forth the law, even the word of the LORD from Jerusalem. And He will judge between many peoples and render decisions for mighty, distant nations.” Micah 4:1-8 and Isaiah 2:2-4

1. All the nations would stream into the mountain of the house of the Lord. Here is the exclusive place of peace.
2. The purpose of the assembly of the nations was to learn his ways so that they could walk in his paths.
3. It is ONLY HERE that men will abide in peace. “Then they will hammer their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks; Nation will not lift up sword against nation, and never again will they train for war. Each of them will sit under his vine and under his fig tree, with no one to make them afraid for the mouth of the LORD of hosts has spoken. Though all the peoples walk each in the name of his god, as for us.” Only in the Church do all the nations of men dwell in peace with one another for it is only here that the nations “will walk in the name of the LORD our God forever and ever.”

 

[stonesoffire]

Hi everyone. Just wanted to give my thoughts and I hope I don't come accross as dismissive concerning this post and to anyone who has posted here.

All of the above is beyond me. I've researched myself concerning this and pre-trib, post-trib, pre millennial and post millennial and so on.

It does my head in so much so I lost it up my backside.

I agree it is good to discuss such things but for me it really isn't a hill to die on, if we try to prove what we believe concerning such matters then we can miss the bigger picture.

The bigger picture being the hill Jesus died on, when he said "It is finished"
Reconciled to the Father, sins forgiven for those who place their faith in him.

Jesus gave 2 new commandments and took it further, love your enemies.

I focus on that myself now. So regardless whilst we are on this earth just let's be like Jesus and leave it up him

I don't know about what's going to happen according to Revelations, but what I think we all should do right now? Form a line behind Bill to pull his head out of his backside!

lol.....hilarious Bill!

 

[shrume]

Look at what you just wrote:

Do you honestly think Hell has metal locks and keys? Or that a chain forged into links is going to ever be used to keep Satan restrained? Do you honestly think there are people somewhere in the air who just sit on chairs all day and night? And do you think the marks of either God or Satan in foreheads and hands are actually physical marks.

That book is swamped with symbolic metaphors. My goodness, John even starts of telling us he was "in the spirit" when he "saw" all these things. What on Earth do you think "in the spirit" means, anyway? The guy was zoned-out.

"Zoned out"?

Wow, you and I apparently hold completely different viewpoints on the Apostle John.

Certainly some of Revelation is figurative, but I think a lot more of it is literal than most people believe.

 

[joefizz]

Why can't this verse be understood literally?

2 Pet 3:
8) But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Why can't the thousand years here be literal?

Rev 20:
1) And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
2) And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3) And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
4) And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5) But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6) Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7) And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

Just because?

well many things in the bible are expressed as in the spiritual sense,by saying words,like "as" to indicate that it is not literal depending on the situation in the bible,like one scripture of a thousand years is literal while some scriptures aren't,this is why we require the holy spirit for understanding because much can be seen as literal yet it isn't,for example your first scripture of 1000 years one day,a day 1000 years with God is referring to that time with God can be incomprehensible with God,because God can slow time to a crawl to where it can be perceived as 1000 years passing by in one day or a day not passing by in a 1000 years,for just like God is no respecter to persons he can bend time to his will.

 

[BillG]

I don't know about what's going to happen according to Revelations, but what I think we all should do right now? Form a line behind Bill to pull his head out of his backside!

lol.....hilarious Bill!

That made me laugh.

Please all, be gentle

 

[shrume]

well many things in the bible are expressed as in the spiritual sense,by saying words,like "as" to indicate that it is not literal depending on the situation in the bible,like one scripture of a thousand years is literal while some scriptures aren't,this is why we require the holy spirit for understanding because much can be seen as literal yet it isn't,for example your first scripture of 1000 years one day,a day 1000 years with God is referring to that time with God can be incomprehensible with God,because God can slow time to a crawl to where it can be perceived as 1000 years passing by in one day or a day not passing by in a 1000 years,for just like God is no respecter to persons he can bend time to his will.

Thanks for your opinion.

The holy spirit has led me to believe that the millennial kingdom, once it gets here, will be 1000 years long. Apparently you believe he has led you to believe something else. How do we handle the difference?

Where does the Bible say God can "bend time to His will"?

 

[shrume]

I started not to respond to this for reasons stated earlier but I think for the sake of some others it is necessary that I do so.

This is what both Isaiah and Micah had prophesied.
A. The restoration of Edinic conditions.
“And the wolf will dwell with the lamb, and the leopard will lie down with the young goat, and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; And a little boy will lead them. Also the cow and the bear will graze, their young will lie down together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox the nursing child will play by the hole of the cobra, and the weaned child will put his hand on the viper’s den. They will not hurt or destroy in all My holy mountain, for the earth will be full of the knowledge of the LORD as the waters cover the sea.” In other words, the are not devouring one another.Isaiah. 11:6-9
This is not to be understood as literal language. This is not talking about literal lions or vipers. We know this is symbolic language because Isaiah 35:9 tells us, “No lion will be there, Nor will any vicious beast go up on it; These will not be found there. But the redeemed will walk there”).

1. This a symbol of natural enemies existing in peace with one another and with man.
2. It is ONLY “In all My holy mountain” that we are told these conditions would exist. The holy mountain of God is Zion – the Church, Hebrews 12:18-23.
3. This would happen when “the whole earth is full of the knowledge of Jehovah.” The filling of the earth was the commission given to the apostle and jointly to us, Matthew 28:18-20, Mark 16:15-16, Luke 24:46-49. John 20:19-20 It began here in Acts 2 and continues still.

B. These peaceful conditions would be then extended to the nations.
“And it will come about in the last days that the mountain of the house of the LORD will be established as the chief of the mountains. It will be raised above the hills, and the peoples will stream to it. Many nations will come and say, “Come and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD and to the house of the God of Jacob, that He may teach us about His ways and that we may walk in His paths.” For from Zion will go forth the law, even the word of the LORD from Jerusalem. And He will judge between many peoples and render decisions for mighty, distant nations.” Micah 4:1-8 and Isaiah 2:2-4

1. All the nations would stream into the mountain of the house of the Lord. Here is the exclusive place of peace.
2. The purpose of the assembly of the nations was to learn his ways so that they could walk in his paths.
3. It is ONLY HERE that men will abide in peace. “Then they will hammer their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks; Nation will not lift up sword against nation, and never again will they train for war. Each of them will sit under his vine and under his fig tree, with no one to make them afraid for the mouth of the LORD of hosts has spoken. Though all the peoples walk each in the name of his god, as for us.” Only in the Church do all the nations of men dwell in peace with one another for it is only here that the nations “will walk in the name of the LORD our God forever and ever.”

How do you make these not literal?

Isa 11:7) And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.

Isa 65:25) The wolf and the lamb shall feed together, and the lion shall eat straw like the bullock: and dust shall be the serpent's meat. They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain, saith the LORD.

In the original creation, all the animals ate plants (Gen 1:29-30). I believe that in the millennial kingdom the animals will once again eat plants.