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I don't know why you don't think this is important.... it was commanded by both Jesus and the apostles.
And, you really need to stop trying to put words in my mouth. I can find you probably 100 quotes of me saying "we are saved by grace through faith".... I have not said that baptism "saves" us. That is only you projecting what you want me to be saying, so that you can denounce me.... games at best, slander and lies at worst.
And, you really need to stop trying to put words in my mouth. I can find you probably 100 quotes of me saying "we are saved by grace through faith".... I have not said that baptism "saves" us. That is only you projecting what you want me to be saying, so that you can denounce me.... games at best, slander and lies at worst.
E
your the one who says baptism is required. Either you believe it or not.
Neither one of the passages you posted say baptism is a requirement to be saved.
talk about slander. Can you tell me where I said baptism was not important? Or i have slammed baptism as something one can just ignore. And should not obey?
Your the one slandering my friend, All I am doing is asking you to stop saying baptism is a requirment when it is not. It is a command yes, A requirement? That would make salvation by works, not grace.
Neither one of the passages you posted say baptism is a requirement to be saved.
talk about slander. Can you tell me where I said baptism was not important? Or i have slammed baptism as something one can just ignore. And should not obey?
Your the one slandering my friend, All I am doing is asking you to stop saying baptism is a requirment when it is not. It is a command yes, A requirement? That would make salvation by works, not grace.
You responded to hornetguy's post which you quoted, and which also made it clear that he does not believe that baptism is required for salvation. So what was the reason for making this statement? I believe that most of us understand that water baptism is a command to believers, so it is a requirement. But it does not save anyone.
At the same time, there are two Bible passage which *appear* to say that baptism is required for salvation. Mark 16:15,16 and Acts 2:38. However, the rest of the New Testament makes it clear that water baptism FOLLOWS conversion and salvation.
At the same time, there are two Bible passage which *appear* to say that baptism is required for salvation. Mark 16:15,16 and Acts 2:38. However, the rest of the New Testament makes it clear that water baptism FOLLOWS conversion and salvation.
E
He says baptism is required. (My only beef is the word required)
either it is required or it is not. People need to make up their minds, then stick with it.
As I explained, sayi9ng something is required MAKES it a prerequisite.
If you do not think it is required to be saved, then STOP saying it is required. Thats all I ask. Otherwise, You are giving people a false impression of what you believe.
As for the two chapters. Acts 2 sis peter commanding all who have been given the HS because they repented to be baptised because they recieved remission of sin.
Mark 16 is not even in most bibles and can not be trusted, It is not repeated anyplace else. Even thought the same conversation is recorded other places with no mention of baptism.
And many people teach one must be baptised to be saved, So please. Do not say no one teaches it.
I don't agree.
How can HS baptism "bury"us?
Your POV cancels out Col 2:11-13.
As I stand by water baptism being our "immersion" into Christ's death, resulting in the death of the old man and his burial and resurrection with Christ, perhaps we should look at the finished result; listed in Rom 6:7??
"For he that is dead is freed from sin."
Did your HS baptism result in a life free from sin?
That would be the indicator of it's efficiency.
Before you ask...yes, I am free from sinning. Thanks be to God in Jesus' name.
E
How can your pastor bury you in christs death when it happened over 2000 years ago? All he can do is immerse you in water,
but God can, he can take us back 2000 years and immerse us into the death and burial of christ (the literal translation of romans 6, baptism is just a transliteration, not a translation)
I did not say HS baptism burys us by the way, I said the HS Bury's us, that is HS baptism.
Col 2 agrees with me, it is not the physical circumcision done but man, or the water baptism done by man, it is the spiritual circumcision done by the hands of God through the spirit baptism done by the HS Himself.
There is no water baptism in romans 6 or Col 2.
Also, Titus 3: 5 explains it, Not by works of righteousness which we have done (water baptism would be a work of righteousness we do) but by HIS MERCY, HE SAVED US by the WASHING and renewal (new birth) of the HS.
but God can, he can take us back 2000 years and immerse us into the death and burial of christ (the literal translation of romans 6, baptism is just a transliteration, not a translation)
I did not say HS baptism burys us by the way, I said the HS Bury's us, that is HS baptism.
Col 2 agrees with me, it is not the physical circumcision done but man, or the water baptism done by man, it is the spiritual circumcision done by the hands of God through the spirit baptism done by the HS Himself.
There is no water baptism in romans 6 or Col 2.
Also, Titus 3: 5 explains it, Not by works of righteousness which we have done (water baptism would be a work of righteousness we do) but by HIS MERCY, HE SAVED US by the WASHING and renewal (new birth) of the HS.
Thanks for answering your own question.
In spite of your added confusings.
Scripture please.
If not, then the results written of by Paul in Romans 6:7 should be evident in you. ie "He that is dead is freed from sin."
Are you a non-sinner since the death, burial, and resurrection (with Christ) of your old self?
Romans 6:7 would be the proof of your POV
Thanks for answering your own question.
In spite of your added confusings.
Scripture please.
If not, then the results written of by Paul in Romans 6:7 should be evident in you. ie "He that is dead is freed from sin."
Are you a non-sinner since the death, burial, and resurrection (with Christ) of your old self?
Romans 6:7 would be the proof of your POV
They are both reality.
Yes, I do teach, and live, sinless perfection.
It is the result of a true repentance from sin, and of the death of the old man.
In Acts 2:38, Peter said that you would receive the gift of the Holy Ghost AFTER repentance and baptism.
Only once was a different sequence shown in scripture, and that was Cornelius's household and the first of the Gentiles to be converted...a special case.
Yes, I do teach, and live, sinless perfection.
It is the result of a true repentance from sin, and of the death of the old man.
In Acts 2:38, Peter said that you would receive the gift of the Holy Ghost AFTER repentance and baptism.
Only once was a different sequence shown in scripture, and that was Cornelius's household and the first of the Gentiles to be converted...a special case.