Is the great biblical flood real or not?
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Look at biblehub.com: Strong's Greek: 5591. ψυχικός (psuchikos) -- natural, of the soul or mind
Of course its about resurrection, that was not the point. The point was our current body should be translated literaly as an animal one. Does it scare your literalism? Or... theistic evolution is knocking on your door? ;-) But this was meant for another thread, this one is about global flood, so I posted it to the right thread.
Of course its about resurrection, that was not the point. The point was our current body should be translated literaly as an animal one. Does it scare your literalism? Or... theistic evolution is knocking on your door? ;-) But this was meant for another thread, this one is about global flood, so I posted it to the right thread.
Where in the bible does it say exactly this, the water came from melted ice?
For more information what God has told me concerning this topic, click HERE.
^i^
††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††
DiscipleDave
Should we believe Scriptures or what men teach?
Gen 6:17 And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy ALL flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die.
This would be a lie if it were indeed a local event.
Gen 7:19 And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth; and all the high hills, that were under the whole heaven, were covered.
Gen 7:20 Fifteen cubits upward did the waters prevail; and the mountains were covered.
Gen 7:21 And ALL flesh died that moved upon the earth, both of fowl, and of cattle, and of beast, and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth, and every man:
This too would be a lie if the event was a local event.
Gen_9:11 And I will establish my covenant with you; neither shall all flesh be cut off any more by the waters of a flood; neither shall there any more be a flood to destroy the earth.
This verse teaches that the flood destroyed the Earth, this too would be a lie if the flood was a local event.
Gen_9:15 And I will remember my covenant, which is between me and you and every living creature of all flesh; and the waters shall no more become a flood to destroy all flesh.
This verse teaches that God destroyed ALL FLESH. If the event was a localized event then God did NOT destroy ALL flesh but only the flesh of the localized event.
2Pe_2:5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
That verse teaches that the flood was a world event, not a local event like this generation likes to teach.
So should i believe man which teaches it was a localized event, or believe Scriptures which teach it was a world wide event?
Well since i am a Christian i choose to believe the Word of God over what the word of man teaches.
^i^
††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††
DiscipleDave
Gen 6:17 And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy ALL flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die.
This would be a lie if it were indeed a local event.
Gen 7:19 And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth; and all the high hills, that were under the whole heaven, were covered.
Gen 7:20 Fifteen cubits upward did the waters prevail; and the mountains were covered.
Gen 7:21 And ALL flesh died that moved upon the earth, both of fowl, and of cattle, and of beast, and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth, and every man:
This too would be a lie if the event was a local event.
Gen_9:11 And I will establish my covenant with you; neither shall all flesh be cut off any more by the waters of a flood; neither shall there any more be a flood to destroy the earth.
This verse teaches that the flood destroyed the Earth, this too would be a lie if the flood was a local event.
Gen_9:15 And I will remember my covenant, which is between me and you and every living creature of all flesh; and the waters shall no more become a flood to destroy all flesh.
This verse teaches that God destroyed ALL FLESH. If the event was a localized event then God did NOT destroy ALL flesh but only the flesh of the localized event.
2Pe_2:5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
That verse teaches that the flood was a world event, not a local event like this generation likes to teach.
So should i believe man which teaches it was a localized event, or believe Scriptures which teach it was a world wide event?
Well since i am a Christian i choose to believe the Word of God over what the word of man teaches.
^i^
††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††
DiscipleDave
My first question was; where did all that water come from?
Then I googled it
The findingappears to add solid evidence to the theory of an ancient "snowball Earth."
The discoveryhinged on proving that the right rocks had been covered by glaciers in theright place at the right time.
Study leader FrancisMacdonald, an Earth scientist at Harvard University,and colleagues worked with volcanic rocks in Canada that were found sandwichedbetween glacial deposits. Such deposits are recognizable by the presence ofdebris left behind by melting glaciers and sediments deformed by glacialmovement.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2010/03/100304-snowball-earth-ice-global-warming/
and this~~~~~
https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2010/03/100304-snowball-earth-ice-global-warming/
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Then I googled it
The findingappears to add solid evidence to the theory of an ancient "snowball Earth."
The discoveryhinged on proving that the right rocks had been covered by glaciers in theright place at the right time.
Study leader FrancisMacdonald, an Earth scientist at Harvard University,and colleagues worked with volcanic rocks in Canada that were found sandwichedbetween glacial deposits. Such deposits are recognizable by the presence ofdebris left behind by melting glaciers and sediments deformed by glacialmovement.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2010/03/100304-snowball-earth-ice-global-warming/
and this~~~~~
https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2010/03/100304-snowball-earth-ice-global-warming/
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My first question was; where did all that water come from?
Then I googled it
The findingappears to add solid evidence to the theory of an ancient "snowball Earth."
The discoveryhinged on proving that the right rocks had been covered by glaciers in theright place at the right time.
Study leader FrancisMacdonald, an Earth scientist at Harvard University,and colleagues worked with volcanic rocks in Canada that were found sandwichedbetween glacial deposits. Such deposits are recognizable by the presence ofdebris left behind by melting glaciers and sediments deformed by glacialmovement.
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2010/03/100304-snowball-earth-ice-global-warming/
and this~~~~~
https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2010/03/100304-snowball-earth-ice-global-warming/
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Here is the Truth which God told me. The water came from a layer of water that use to be where our ozone layer is now. It took 40 days to drain onto the Earth. This layer of water will be returned back to whence it came from during the 7 year Tribulation period. That is why in Rev 21:1 teaches there are no more seas (oceans)
For more information what God has told me...
Should we believe Scriptures or what men teach?
I do not know if you realize it, but this is kinda funny
^i^
††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††
DiscipleDave
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Here is the Truth which God told me. The water came from a layer of water that use to be where our ozone layer is now. It took 40 days to drain onto the Earth. This layer of water will be returned back to whence it came from during the 7 year Tribulation period. That is why in Rev 21:1 teaches there are no more seas (oceans)
For more information what God has told me concerning this topic, click HERE.
^i^
††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††
DiscipleDave
And how are you certain that Psalms 148:4 is not prophetic? Something that is going to happen? If you would have read the article concerning this topic that i testify God revealed to me, then you would have seen that water above the heavens will Return one day. So tell me, what makes you think Psalms 148:4 is to be applied to the present ONLY, and can't apply to the Past or to the Future?
Psalms 148 last verse indicates the chapter is prophetic because it refers to the Saints, which are NOT with Him yet.
^i^
††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††
DiscipleDave
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There is a side here that no one has contemplated, or at least any that I have seen. Weare aliens on this planet. We did not somehow come from molten rock that oncecovered earth, we came from afar.
And those aliens that planted the seed of life on this planet are still with us today and yes, they played a part in the creation of Genesis
At least in my view-
There is a side here that no one has contemplated, or at least any that I have seen. Weare aliens on this planet. We did not somehow come from molten rock that oncecovered earth, we came from afar.
And those aliens that planted the seed of life on this planet are still with us today and yes, they played a part in the creation of Genesis
At least in my view
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What does the Bible actually say about the Genesis Flood? In Genesis 1:6-9 we read,
Gen. 1:6. And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
Gen. 1:7. And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
Gen. 1:8. And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.
Gen. 1:9. And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so. (KJV)
In verse 6, we read that God created a firmament that divided the waters that were under the firmament from the waters that were above the firmament—but what was the firmament? Merriam Webster’s online dictionary (which in print is Merriam Webster’s Collegiate Dictionary—Eleventh Edition) give us the following definition:
: the vault or arch of the sky :heavens
The Oxford University dictionaries, of which there are several, concur. The English word ‘firmament’ is a translation of the Hebrew word, רָקִיעַ. In the Cyclopedia of Biblical, Theological, and Ecclesiastical Literature, we find an excellent article (Vol. III, pp. 568-569 [two lengthy columns of fine print per page] on the word רָקִיעַ. Of special importance is the following from the article,
The verb רָקַע, raká, means to expand by beating, whether by the hand, the foot, or any instrument. It is especially used, however, of beating out metals into thin plates (Exod. xxxix, 3, Numb. xvi, 39), and hence the substantive רַקֻּעַים “broad plates” of metal (Numb. 16:38). (The italics are theirs).
Furthermore, the Hebrew and English Lexicon of the Old Testament by Brown, Driver, and Briggs published by Oxford University gives us the following meaning of word רָקִיעַ in Gen. 1:7, “the vault of heaven, or ‘firmament,’ regarded by Hebrews as solid, and supporting ‘waters’ above it.” (p. 956). Moreover, John Skinner, the late Principal and Professor of Old Testament Language and Literature at Westminster College, Cambridge, in his commentary on the Hebrew text of Genesis, writes,
6-8 Second Work: The Firmament.—The second fiat calls into existence a firmament, whose function is to divide the primeval waters into an upper and lower ocean, leaving a space between as the theater of further creative developments. The “firmament” is the dome of heaven, which to the ancients was no optical illusion, but a material structure, sometimes compared to an “upper chamber” (Ps. 104:12, Am 9:6) supported by “pillars” (Jb 26:11), and resembling in its surface a “molten mirror” (Jb 37:18). Above this are the heavenly waters, from which the rain descends through “windows” or “doors” (Gn 7:11, 8:2, 2 Ki 7:2, 19) opened and shut by God at His pleasure (Ps 78:23).
For further and much more extensive proof that this word רָקִיעַ is correctly translated as “dome” rather than “expanse” as some people incorrectly claim, please see this article :
https://faculty.gordon.edu/hu/bi/te...s/text/articles-books/seely-firmament-wtj.htm
The KJV and many other translations use the word firmament which comes from the Latin word firmamentum. Firmamentum is the Latin word for ‘support’! And indeed, that support, the dome, would have to be immensely strong to hold up the weight of the water above it—enough water to cover even Mount Everest! (Just one gallon of water weighs approximately 8.35 lb (about 3.785 kg).
Some may ask, why do not our English translations of the Bible translate the word רָקִיעַ as dome? The answer to that question is simple—the translation ‘dome’ throws a monkey wrench into the traditional interpretation of Genesis 1-11, and readers of the Bible more often than not prefer the traditional interpretation of Genesis 1-11 over a precisely accurate interpretation. However, the translators of the New Revised Standard Version sought to appeal to readers who care much more about biblical accuracy than they do about tradition, and hence they correctly translate the word רָקִיעַ as ‘dome’. The New American Bible also translates the word רָקִיעַ as ‘dome’.
If the ‘windows’ (NRSV) or ‘floodgates’ (KJV) in the dome through which “The rain fell on the earth forty days and forty nights” (Gen 7:12) were real—it necessarily follows that the dome was also real. [In Gen. 1:8, God called the dome ‘heaven’ (Heb. שָׁמַיִם), and, therefore, the windows of heaven (Heb. שָׁמַיִם) in Gen. 7:11 were windows in the dome]. Believing in the flood while denying the reality of the windows in the dome, as some do, is disbelieving the historicity of Genesis 1-11. Either both are historical—or neither are historical, and the earth was not, in 2349 B.C., a flat disk or square plate covered with a dome with floodgates in it! God is not a liar, and He never said that Genesis 1-11 is an accurate account of historical events. Indeed, Genesis 1-11 is a collection of divinely inspired stories written and woven together to teach us basic truths about ourselves and our Creator. Genesis 6-8 is one of these stories, and how sad it is that some Christians use it to castigate men and women who have devoted their lives to the study of God’s word on an academic rather than elementary level.
Gen. 1:6. And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
Gen. 1:7. And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
Gen. 1:8. And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.
Gen. 1:9. And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so. (KJV)
In verse 6, we read that God created a firmament that divided the waters that were under the firmament from the waters that were above the firmament—but what was the firmament? Merriam Webster’s online dictionary (which in print is Merriam Webster’s Collegiate Dictionary—Eleventh Edition) give us the following definition:
: the vault or arch of the sky :heavens
The Oxford University dictionaries, of which there are several, concur. The English word ‘firmament’ is a translation of the Hebrew word, רָקִיעַ. In the Cyclopedia of Biblical, Theological, and Ecclesiastical Literature, we find an excellent article (Vol. III, pp. 568-569 [two lengthy columns of fine print per page] on the word רָקִיעַ. Of special importance is the following from the article,
The verb רָקַע, raká, means to expand by beating, whether by the hand, the foot, or any instrument. It is especially used, however, of beating out metals into thin plates (Exod. xxxix, 3, Numb. xvi, 39), and hence the substantive רַקֻּעַים “broad plates” of metal (Numb. 16:38). (The italics are theirs).
Furthermore, the Hebrew and English Lexicon of the Old Testament by Brown, Driver, and Briggs published by Oxford University gives us the following meaning of word רָקִיעַ in Gen. 1:7, “the vault of heaven, or ‘firmament,’ regarded by Hebrews as solid, and supporting ‘waters’ above it.” (p. 956). Moreover, John Skinner, the late Principal and Professor of Old Testament Language and Literature at Westminster College, Cambridge, in his commentary on the Hebrew text of Genesis, writes,
6-8 Second Work: The Firmament.—The second fiat calls into existence a firmament, whose function is to divide the primeval waters into an upper and lower ocean, leaving a space between as the theater of further creative developments. The “firmament” is the dome of heaven, which to the ancients was no optical illusion, but a material structure, sometimes compared to an “upper chamber” (Ps. 104:12, Am 9:6) supported by “pillars” (Jb 26:11), and resembling in its surface a “molten mirror” (Jb 37:18). Above this are the heavenly waters, from which the rain descends through “windows” or “doors” (Gn 7:11, 8:2, 2 Ki 7:2, 19) opened and shut by God at His pleasure (Ps 78:23).
For further and much more extensive proof that this word רָקִיעַ is correctly translated as “dome” rather than “expanse” as some people incorrectly claim, please see this article :
https://faculty.gordon.edu/hu/bi/te...s/text/articles-books/seely-firmament-wtj.htm
The KJV and many other translations use the word firmament which comes from the Latin word firmamentum. Firmamentum is the Latin word for ‘support’! And indeed, that support, the dome, would have to be immensely strong to hold up the weight of the water above it—enough water to cover even Mount Everest! (Just one gallon of water weighs approximately 8.35 lb (about 3.785 kg).
Some may ask, why do not our English translations of the Bible translate the word רָקִיעַ as dome? The answer to that question is simple—the translation ‘dome’ throws a monkey wrench into the traditional interpretation of Genesis 1-11, and readers of the Bible more often than not prefer the traditional interpretation of Genesis 1-11 over a precisely accurate interpretation. However, the translators of the New Revised Standard Version sought to appeal to readers who care much more about biblical accuracy than they do about tradition, and hence they correctly translate the word רָקִיעַ as ‘dome’. The New American Bible also translates the word רָקִיעַ as ‘dome’.
If the ‘windows’ (NRSV) or ‘floodgates’ (KJV) in the dome through which “The rain fell on the earth forty days and forty nights” (Gen 7:12) were real—it necessarily follows that the dome was also real. [In Gen. 1:8, God called the dome ‘heaven’ (Heb. שָׁמַיִם), and, therefore, the windows of heaven (Heb. שָׁמַיִם) in Gen. 7:11 were windows in the dome]. Believing in the flood while denying the reality of the windows in the dome, as some do, is disbelieving the historicity of Genesis 1-11. Either both are historical—or neither are historical, and the earth was not, in 2349 B.C., a flat disk or square plate covered with a dome with floodgates in it! God is not a liar, and He never said that Genesis 1-11 is an accurate account of historical events. Indeed, Genesis 1-11 is a collection of divinely inspired stories written and woven together to teach us basic truths about ourselves and our Creator. Genesis 6-8 is one of these stories, and how sad it is that some Christians use it to castigate men and women who have devoted their lives to the study of God’s word on an academic rather than elementary level.
I haven't read the whole thread, so if someone has already posted this, forgive me.
When I was studying geography, geology and biology in university, one fact really stood out for me.
The earth's surface is 75% sedimentary rocks. You know, the type that would be laid down in a flood. A very big and global flood. It is not limited to local areas, but literally found on every continent.
However, sedimentary rocks are mainly found on the surface, and only comprise 5% of the rocks of the crust of the earth. So all this flood material, on the top of the earth.
And not just a tiny bit. We saw the Grand Canyon this year, and it is a mile deep! And the Colorado River cuts down through a mile of sedimentary rocks. Now, we did all the exhibits, and there was lots of trying to prove that the sediments were laid down in various ways, none of which was a global flood. Or that the layers represented different time periods.
However, I am firmly convinced of a young earth, created by God. So, when I just looked at the Canyon, to say nothing of other areas we visited, like Utah, or the Rocky Mountains in Alberta, I see a LOT of sediments laid down, and ocean fossils on the tops of mountains, etc. I also lived in various metamorphic mountain ranges. A very different kind of rock, and very worn down. I would imagine it predates the Flood. and uplift, etc, has uncovered them.
I will say, geology is complex. I looking forward to hearing the whole story, when Jesus returns!
When I was studying geography, geology and biology in university, one fact really stood out for me.
The earth's surface is 75% sedimentary rocks. You know, the type that would be laid down in a flood. A very big and global flood. It is not limited to local areas, but literally found on every continent.
However, sedimentary rocks are mainly found on the surface, and only comprise 5% of the rocks of the crust of the earth. So all this flood material, on the top of the earth.
And not just a tiny bit. We saw the Grand Canyon this year, and it is a mile deep! And the Colorado River cuts down through a mile of sedimentary rocks. Now, we did all the exhibits, and there was lots of trying to prove that the sediments were laid down in various ways, none of which was a global flood. Or that the layers represented different time periods.
However, I am firmly convinced of a young earth, created by God. So, when I just looked at the Canyon, to say nothing of other areas we visited, like Utah, or the Rocky Mountains in Alberta, I see a LOT of sediments laid down, and ocean fossils on the tops of mountains, etc. I also lived in various metamorphic mountain ranges. A very different kind of rock, and very worn down. I would imagine it predates the Flood. and uplift, etc, has uncovered them.
I will say, geology is complex. I looking forward to hearing the whole story, when Jesus returns!
1. How do you account for the fact that approximately 3,000,000 scientists who have earned at least one doctorate in a filed of science believe that the earth is billions of years old; and that all (everyone of them) of the approximately 45 scientists who have earned at least one doctorate in a field of science believe that the earth is les than 12,000 years old?
2. How do you account for the fact that the approximately 3,000,000 scientists who have earned at least one doctorate in a filed of science and believe who that the earth is billions of years old represent every major Christian denomination, and everyone of the worlds major religions; while all of the 45 scientists who have earned at least one doctorate in a field of science and believe that the earth is less than 12,000 years old are radicalized Christian fundamentalists—none of whom can read so much as a little bit of Hebrew, and who know nothing at all about how biblical scholars for the past 150 years have interpreted the first eleven chapters of Genesis?
3. Are you aware that the age of the earth has been VERY reliably measured and found to be 4.54 billion years old?
For an excellent article written from a theologically conservative Christian perspective that explains in detail how the age of the earth has been measured, please follow this link:
Radiometric Dating
2. How do you account for the fact that the approximately 3,000,000 scientists who have earned at least one doctorate in a filed of science and believe who that the earth is billions of years old represent every major Christian denomination, and everyone of the worlds major religions; while all of the 45 scientists who have earned at least one doctorate in a field of science and believe that the earth is less than 12,000 years old are radicalized Christian fundamentalists—none of whom can read so much as a little bit of Hebrew, and who know nothing at all about how biblical scholars for the past 150 years have interpreted the first eleven chapters of Genesis?
3. Are you aware that the age of the earth has been VERY reliably measured and found to be 4.54 billion years old?
For an excellent article written from a theologically conservative Christian perspective that explains in detail how the age of the earth has been measured, please follow this link:
Radiometric Dating