50 Reasons For a Pretribulational Rapture By Dr. John F. Walvoord

[Truth7t7]

again, you mix lies and conjecture as does the wicked one, the accuser of the saints.

My response is to cv5 regarding claims made, your on the outside looking in and dont have a clue

Yes this poster has made the claims stated

If you believe and teach the same, then join his company

5 covenants between God and man?

God is going to instruct and bless future animal sacrifice for sin?

1 Timothy 4:1KJV
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

 

[DJZawada]

mitzvot (plural) simply means commandment - I see you're an antisemite.

There are many sect within Judaism, Talmud ideology is but 1 sect that believes differently, and of course they reject Jesus as Mashiach. Many rabbi have come to realize that Yeshua (the modern Hebrew name for Jesus) is their savior after indoctrination since their youth.

 

[Truth7t7]

and the answer is simple - yes we are.

It is a perpetual commandment for all our generations, as is wearing tzitzit, and our Lord followed His own commandments when He walked amongst humanity.

Those who are NOT born of the covenant can enter into the rest through Jesus Ἰησοῦς
the King of Kings and Lord of Lords as ALL "Jews" must do so as well.

Colossians 2:8-14KJV
8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

 

[Truth7t7]

mitzvot (plural) simply means commandment - I see you're an antisemite

Your claim of Antisemite is false, my Lord Jesus Christ and his Twelve Apostles were Jews

Your fall back "False Claim" of Antisemite, to those who would disagree with your teachings

 

[cv5]

This claim has been thoroughly debunked using scirtpure.

TDW has pretty much mopped the floor with the detractors. It's a little bit like watching Mike Tyson sparring with peewee Herman. Somewhat embarrassing but highly amusing...

 

[Truth7t7]

James was an apostle to the circumcised (Jews). That's why he is addressing the 12 tribes in that letter.

Galatians 2:8-9
8(For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles)9And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.

James wrote to the Church, the Twelve Tribes Scattered Abroad, How Far Will One Go In Promoting The False Teachings In (Dual Covenant Theology) Jew/Church

James 1:1KJV
James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.

James 5:13-15KJV
13 Is any among you afflicted? let him pray. Is any merry? let him sing psalms.
14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
15 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.

Galatians 3:26-29KJV
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

 

[Truth7t7]

TDW has pretty much mopped the floor with the detractors. It's a little bit like watching Mike Tyson sparring with peewee Herman. Somewhat embarrassing but highly amusing...

There is no such thing as a pre-trib rapture found in scripture, as you take nothing more than the (Second Coming) of Jesus Christ, and "Falsely Claim" it's a Pre-Trib rapture

Your analogy of Mike Tyson is a distraction in diversion, in your inability to show your claim of pre-trib rapture, because it dosent exist in Gods words

 

[DJZawada]

If you believe in Christ then you should accept the fact that Jesus followed all the MITZVOT of YHWH.

That mitzvot that you speak against, is the word of God. HIS MITZVOT.

So you do not speak against me, and my witness is Christ Jesus in whom I trust, you speak against following the word of God. I told you the scripture and I will show you Adonai' words again.

17 “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one [b]jot or one [c]tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven.

You may enter the rest of Christ and be the least in the kingdom of heaven and you may also teach His mitzvot and do His mitzvot and be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

It is very easy to fall under confusion doctrine as sewn by the enemy about Paul, from the tribe of Benjamin , and become hateful of Jews (mitzvot, word of God) and equate this with false Talmud doctrine. Salvation comes from Jesus from the tribe of Judah, not from the tribe of Catholics, Presbyterians, Luther, or covenant theologists.

 

[Truth7t7]

James was an apostle to the circumcised (Jews). That's why he is addressing the 12 tribes in that letter.

Galatians 2:8-9
8(For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles)9And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.

Correction To Post #2,026

James wrote to the Church, the Twelve Tribes Scattered Abroad

James 1:1KJV
James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.

James 5:13-15KJV
13 Is any among you afflicted? let him pray. Is any merry? let him sing psalms.
14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
15 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.

Galatians 3:26-29KJV
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

 

[Truth7t7]

If you believe in Christ then you should accept the fact that Jesus followed all the MITZVOT of YHWH.

That mitzvot that you speak against, is the word of God. HIS MITZVOT.

So you do not speak against me, and my witness is Christ Jesus in whom I trust, you speak against following the word of God. I told you the scripture and I will show you Adonai' words again.

17 “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one [b]jot or one [c]tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven.

You may enter the rest of Christ and be the least in the kingdom of heaven and you may also teach His mitzvot and do His mitzvot and be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

It is very easy to fall under confusion doctrine as sewn by the enemy about Paul, from the tribe of Benjamin , and become hateful of Jews (mitzvot, word of God) and equate this with false Talmud doctrine. Salvation comes from Jesus from the tribe of Judah, not from the tribe of Catholics, Presbyterians, Luther, or covenant theologists.

Once again your claim of myself hating Jews is "False"

A Christian is instructed to follow the 66 books within the cannon of inspired scripture, this is all the Christian needs

2 Timothy 3:16-17KJV
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

Wikipedia: Mitzvah (/ˈmɪtsvə/, meaning "commandment", מִצְוָה‎, [mit͡sˈva], Biblical: miṣwah; plural מִצְווֹת‎ mitzvot [mit͡sˈvot], Biblical: miṣwoth; from צִוָּה‎ ṣiwwah "command") refers to a commandment commanded by God to be performed as a religious duty. Jewish law (halakha) in large part consists of discussion of these commandments. Traditionally, it is held that there are 613 such commandments.

In its secondary meaning, the word mitzvah refers to a deed performed in order to fulfill such a commandment. As such, the term mitzvah has also come to express an individual act of human kindness in keeping with the law. The expression includes a sense of heartfelt sentiment beyond mere legal duty, as "you shall love your neighbor as yourself" (Leviticus 19:18).[1]

The opinions of the Talmudic rabbis are divided between those who seek the purpose of the mitzvot and those who do not question them. The latter argue that if the reason for each mitzvah could be determined, people might try to achieve what they see as the purpose of the mitzvah, while rejecting the mitzvah itself. The former believe that if people were to understand the reason and the purpose for each mitzvah, it would actually help them to observe and perform the mitzvah. For some mitzvot, the reason is specified in the Torah.

 

[cv5]

If you believe in Christ then you should accept the fact that Jesus followed all the MITZVOT of YHWH.

That mitzvot that you speak against, is the word of God. HIS MITZVOT.

So you do not speak against me, and my witness is Christ Jesus in whom I trust, you speak against following the word of God. I told you the scripture and I will show you Adonai' words again.

17 “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one [b]jot or one [c]tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven.

You may enter the rest of Christ and be the least in the kingdom of heaven and you may also teach His mitzvot and do His mitzvot and be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

It is very easy to fall under confusion doctrine as sewn by the enemy about Paul, from the tribe of Benjamin , and become hateful of Jews (mitzvot, word of God) and equate this with false Talmud doctrine. Salvation comes from Jesus from the tribe of Judah, not from the tribe of Catholics, Presbyterians, Luther, or covenant theologists.

Gentiles need not be circumcised nor keep the codified ritual law of Moses. I hope you can agree with that.

 

[Runningman]

There is no such thing as a pre-trib rapture found in scripture, as you take nothing more than the (Second Coming) of Jesus Christ, and "Falsely Claim" it's a Pre-Trib rapture

Your analogy of Mike Tyson is a distraction in diversion, in your inability to show your claim of pre-trib rapture, because it dosent exist in Gods words

Couldn't agree more. The literary device he used about boxing is called a non sequitur. It really proves nothing and means nothing.

This thread is over 100 pages long and I'm more convinced than ever of a post-trib rapture. It has really pushed me to dig deeper and look longer at the Bible. The pre-trib rapture they say exists is literally no where, not even hinted at, in scripture.

 

[DJZawada]

Once again your claim of myself hating Jews is "False"

A Christian is instructed to follow the 66 books within the cannon of inspired scripture, this is all the Christian needs

That is called following the mitzvot, the commands as Jesus told us to do. Your perceived wiki and selected form of "mitzvot" is an incorrect analogy and again you are fighting against the word of God which Jesus commands us to follow.

Jesus does not command gentiles to become "Jews" nor does Paul as you cannot. Entering into the kingdom should be enough for you as it is written,

Matthew 15:

19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies. 20 These are the things which defile a man, but to eat with unwashed hands does not defile a man.” Jesus answering Israeli tradition misconceptions that "became doctrine".

25 Then she came and worshiped Him, saying, “Lord, help me!”

26 But He answered and said, “It is not good to take the children’s bread and throw it to the dogs.”

27 And she said, “Yes, Lord, yet even the little dogs eat the crumbs which fall from their masters’ table.”

28 Then Jesus answered and said to her, “O woman, great is your faith! Let it be to you as you desire.” And her daughter was healed from that very hour.

Do you understand the verse above?

 

[Truth7t7]

Couldn't agree more. The literary device he used about boxing is called a non sequitur. It really proves nothing and means nothing.

This thread is over 100 pages long and I'm more convinced than ever of a post-trib rapture. It has really pushed me to dig deeper and look longer at the Bible. The pre-trib rapture they say exists is literally no where, not even hinted at, in scripture.

Runningman the most deceptive part of the false teaching is a literal Millennial Kingdom on this earth

This false teaching has a physical Jesus returning to Jerusalem, taking a throne of King David, this will be the Antichrist/Man Of Sin "Beware"

Dispensationalism falsely teaches the book of Revelation is taught in chronological order, a false teaching that restrains the reader from understanding the parallel teachings and events, This false teaching allows for multiple resurrections and battles (A Lie)

This false teaching also hides the fact of the (Two Witnesses) the main theme of the tribulation, as this false teaching has the two witnesses 1260 days as the first part of a 7 year tribulation, with the antichrist/Beast 42 months being a separate time after the witnesses are gone (A Lie)

The time frames of the two witnesses 1260 days, and the beast 42 months are seen in parallel,the same time frame of 3.5 years, as the two witnesses will be present during the antichrist/beast the entire time, bringing all plagues as often as they will, a complete remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of Egypt

Their complete false teaching is to elevate (The Beast) in fear, promoting a false pre-trib rapture to escape, when in reality as you have been clearly shown, the Two Witnesses through God rule the tribulation, as the sealed church is protected

Dispensationalism is a lie on many fronts, not just the pre-trib rapture

(Beware)

 

[DJZawada]

REVELATION 22

12 “And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.”

14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

16 “I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star.”

17 And the Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.

COME! Drink of the water of life through HaMashiach Jesus.

 

[Truth7t7]

.Jesus does not command gentiles to become "Jews" nor does Paul as you cannot. Entering into the kingdom should be enough for you as it is written,

Matthew 15:

19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies. 20 These are the things which defile a man, but to eat with unwashed hands does not defile a man.” Jesus answering Israeli tradition misconceptions that "became doctrine".

25 Then she came and worshiped Him, saying, “Lord, help me!”

26 But He answered and said, “It is not good to take the children’s bread and throw it to the dogs.”

27 And she said, “Yes, Lord, yet even the little dogs eat the crumbs which fall from their masters’ table.”

28 Then Jesus answered and said to her, “O woman, great is your faith! Let it be to you as you desire.” And her daughter was healed from that very hour.

Do you understand the verse above?

Roman's 2:28-29KJV
28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Galatians 3:26-29KJV
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

 

[Truth7t7]

REVELATION 22

12 “And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.”

14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

16 “I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star.”

17 And the Spirit and the bride say, “Come!” And let him who hears say, “Come!” And let him who thirsts come. Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely.

COME! Drink of the water of life through HaMashiach Jesus.

God's Commandments, I Believe In And Follow These Commandments

Exodus 20:20:1-17KJV
1 And God spake all these words, saying,
2 I am the Lord thy God, which have brought thee out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage.
3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.
5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;
6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.
7 Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain; for the Lord will not hold him guiltless that taketh his name in vain.
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
12 Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee.
13 Thou shalt not kill.
14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.
15 Thou shalt not steal.
16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.
17 Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's.

 

[Runningman]

Runningman the most deceptive part of the false teaching is a literal Millennial Kingdom on this earth

This false teaching has a physical Jesus returning to Jerusalem, taking a throne of King David, this will be the Antichrist/Man Of Sin "Beware"

Dispensationalism falsely teaches the book of Revelation is taught in chronological order, a false teaching that restrains the reader from understanding the parallel teachings and events, This false teaching allows for multiple resurrections and battles (A Lie)

This false teaching also hides the fact of the (Two Witnesses) the main theme of the tribulation, as this false teaching has the two witnesses 1260 days as the first part of a 7 year tribulation, with the antichrist/Beast 42 months being a separate time after the witnesses are gone (A Lie)

The time frames of the two witnesses 1260 days, and the beast 42 months are seen in parallel,the same time frame of 3.5 years, as the two witnesses will be present during the antichrist/beast the entire time, bringing all plagues as often as they will, a complete remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of Egypt

Their complete false teaching is to elevate (The Beast) in fear, promoting a false pre-trib rapture to escape, when in reality as you have been clearly shown, the Two Witnesses through God rule the tribulation, as the sealed church is protected

Dispensationalism is a lie on many fronts, not just the pre-trib rapture

(Beware)

Yes notice this here. This tells us who will be sitting in the temple. If they remake a temple in Jerusalem there will be no doubt what it will be for.

Notice below the anti-Christ is going to be sitting in the temple of God. There isn't a temple of God anymore so this is a prophecy of a future event. This means there will be a temple reconstructed at some point and that temple will probably fit the Biblical dimensions of it described in the Old Testament.

2 Thessalonians 2:3-4
3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; 4Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

 

[lamad]

How is the beast to set his mark upon anybody after the rapture? he has been slain in the temple at the coming of the Lord. There is no more beast after 2.Thessalonians. 2.

You mix up tribulation and the great tribulation with God's wrath, they are two different things.

Tribulation comes from the world, "in the world you will have tribulation" and while Paul clearly teaches we are saved from God's wrath yet he warns "through great tribulation must we enter the kingdom of God"

Tribulation is persecution, the great tribulation is the great end times persecution we are warned to expect.

You can stay behind and "tribulate" if you want to. Many are going to take God's escape plan and spend the 70th week or "trib' in heaven. I'll look you up at the marriage and supper in heaven, and ask how you beliefs worked out for you.

Where you missed it: the 70th week is ALL God's wrath because the Day of His wrath started first. Then, during the last half of the week, those days of GT, both God's wrath and Satan's wrath will be happening concurrently. There is NO WAY to divide God's wrath and Satan's wrath according to time.

Don't take my word for it: go back and look: THE DAY of His wrath at the 6th seal starts before the 70th week that begins at the 7th seal.

 

[lamad]

Paul writing to the Thessalonians tells them exactly who is to be gathered and in what order. The dead in Christ will rise first then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them to meet the Lord in the clouds ... these are Gentile christians and Paul is writing to assure them that those who were saved but since have died will not miss the resurrection.

My answer was to your statement that the rapture would be "after the tribulation of those days. In Revelation that would be in Rev. 19 at His coming to Armageddon.

Your answer here is just a need sidestep rather that the real question as to WHEN Paul's rapture will take place. Paul goes on in chapter 5, after His classic rapture verse in chapter 4, telling us WHEN: it will come just before God's wrath begins. In Revelation that would be just before the 6th seal. The great crowd too large to number was seen in heaven just after that. You see, it all fits if you refuses to rearrange the text to fit some wrong theory.

Again, the great crowd in heaven is the just raptured church - in chapter 7. Jesus coming "after the trip of those days is in chapter 19 - 12 chapters of EVENTS between. These are the events of the 70th week.