Predestination

[eternally-gratefull]

Faith

πίστις, -εως, ἡ, (πείθω [q. v.]), fr. [Hes., Theogn., Pind.], Aeschyl., Hdt. down; Sept. for אֱמוּנָה, several times for אֱמֶת and אֲמָנָה; faith; i. e.
1. conviction of the truth of anything, belief,


Thayer, J. H. (1889). A Greek-English lexicon of the New Testament: Being Grimm's Wilke's Clavis Novi Testamenti (512). New York: Harper & Brothers.

πίστις, ἡ, gen. εως: dat. πίστει, Ion. πίστῑ: Ion. nom. and acc. pl. πίστῑς; dat. πίστισι: (πείθομα&#953:—trust in others, faith, Lat. fides, fiducia, Hes., Theogn., Att.; c. gen. pers. faith or belief in one, Eur.:—generally, persuasion of a thing, confidence, assurance, Pind., Att.

Liddell, H. (1996). A lexicon : Abridged from Liddell and Scott's Greek-English lexicon (641). Oak Harbor, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.

4102. πίστις pistis, pis´-tis; from 3982; persuasion, i.e. credence; mor. conviction (of religious truth, or the truthfulness of God or a religious teacher), espec. reliance upon Christ for salvation; abstr. constancy in such profession; by extens. the system of religious (Gospel) truth itself:—assurance, belief, believe, faith, fidelity.

Strong, J., S.T.D., LL.D. (2009). Vol. 1: A Concise Dictionary of the Words in the Greek Testament and The Hebrew Bible (58). Bellingham, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.

1. putis (πίστις, 4102), “faith,” has the secondary meaning of “an assurance or guarantee

Vine, W. E., Unger, M. F., & White, W. (1996). Vol. 2: Vine's Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words (43). Nashville, TN: T. Nelson.

πίστις 4102
In accordance with its common NT usage, πίστις is used of “faith,” “confidence” in a person


Moulton, J. H., & Milligan, G. (1930). The vocabulary of the Greek Testament (515). London: Hodder and Stoughton.

Through Gods pursuational work. I am confident in his promise, In his work and his guarantee. Because of this confidence. I CHOSE TO TRUST GOD. THIS IS WHAT SAVES ME.

 

[zone]

Faith

πίστις, -εως, ἡ, (πείθω [q. v.]), fr. [Hes., Theogn., Pind.], Aeschyl., Hdt. down; Sept. for אֱמוּנָה, several times for אֱמֶת and אֲמָנָה; faith; i. e.
1. conviction of the truth of anything, belief,


Thayer, J. H. (1889). A Greek-English lexicon of the New Testament: Being Grimm's Wilke's Clavis Novi Testamenti (512). New York: Harper & Brothers.

πίστις, ἡ, gen. εως: dat. πίστει, Ion. πίστῑ: Ion. nom. and acc. pl. πίστῑς; dat. πίστισι: (πείθομα&#953:—trust in others, faith, Lat. fides, fiducia, Hes., Theogn., Att.; c. gen. pers. faith or belief in one, Eur.:—generally, persuasion of a thing, confidence, assurance, Pind., Att.

Liddell, H. (1996). A lexicon : Abridged from Liddell and Scott's Greek-English lexicon (641). Oak Harbor, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.

4102. πίστις pistis, pis´-tis; from 3982; persuasion, i.e. credence; mor. conviction (of religious truth, or the truthfulness of God or a religious teacher), espec. reliance upon Christ for salvation; abstr. constancy in such profession; by extens. the system of religious (Gospel) truth itself:—assurance, belief, believe, faith, fidelity.

Strong, J., S.T.D., LL.D. (2009). Vol. 1: A Concise Dictionary of the Words in the Greek Testament and The Hebrew Bible (58). Bellingham, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.

1. putis (πίστις, 4102), “faith,” has the secondary meaning of “an assurance or guarantee

Vine, W. E., Unger, M. F., & White, W. (1996). Vol. 2: Vine's Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words (43). Nashville, TN: T. Nelson.

πίστις 4102
In accordance with its common NT usage, πίστις is used of “faith,” “confidence” in a person


Moulton, J. H., & Milligan, G. (1930). The vocabulary of the Greek Testament (515). London: Hodder and Stoughton.

Through Gods pursuational work. I am confident in his promise, In his work and his guarantee. Because of this confidence. I CHOSE TO TRUST GOD. THIS IS WHAT SAVES ME.

ok EG.
i CHOOSE to believe Hebrews 12:12

Hebrews 12:12

Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

 

[zone]

Check out what God had to do for Moses to get him to do what He wanted. Ex 3 and 4

did he do what He wanted?
mission accomplished for God through Moses?

 

[Strangelove]

I told you I am not playing your stupid mind games. I do not study the bible by making up stupid examples. so why would I want to discuss it that way?

Its a simple exercise in logical reasoning to prove a point.

The only reason you wont answer is that you are STUCK.

This is the question:

If you say 'I know I'm gonna take a bath tonight'. Does it mean that you have travelled forward in time and seen yourself taking a bath, or does it simply mean you know that you have the power and control over how you use your units of time and you have the ability to absolutely state that you are gonna have a bath tonight because you know you are gonna?

What does that have to do with this conversation? Why do you continue to ask questions which do not pertain to the discussion at hand?

You can t answer coz your STUCK

Heree the question:

Does God have satan on a leash yes or no?

Does God allow satan to do what he does yes or no?

Was it God's will for a man to brutally rape and murder a 13 y/o girl.. yes or no..

No it wasnt Gods will it was satans will, and God let him do it.

Depends. Satan wanted to destroy Peter. Did God allow him to? Allowing someone to do something or not has nothing to do with our discussion. Have you ever stopped and wondered how many times God stopped you from doing something by putting a barrier in place to prevent you which saved your life?? Thank God for his foreknowledge.

And what does satan have to do with an evil man raping a 13 year old?? Going off on your tangents again??

Does God allow satan to do his thing yes or no?

Is God SOVEREIGN over all things YES OR NO?

Ok. So God wills a man to brutally rape a girl. and millions uppon millions to go to hell.

Thanks, but no thanks

Satan wills sin. People do the sin. This is why sin is of the devil.

God allows satan to influence men to sin.

What are your thoughts on the matter?

I never said this is what happens. you like twisting peoples words don't you?

So was God influenced by your future decision to accept Him YES OR NO?

Or did He simply know that you would accept Him coz that was His plan all along...right from the beginning.

We're nearly there now EG.

What does time travel have to do with it? If God knew I would receive him and my brother would reject him before time began. Did God will my brother to reject him? Or elect to not save him because he knew he would would reject him.

He willed your brother to reject Him of course. Some are predestined to be sheep, others arnt. Your brother was not chosen.

Now you answer my questions. You see I'm not scared to answer yours.

Why do you have to make everything that does not conform to your believe sound so bad? Are you that proud?

Because my beliefs are scriptural. Sorry. If it makes you sound bad then thats Gods truth speaking.

If you would have read I answered that question. But since you never read anything to understand it. And just look for "words" which you have been taught people can say so you can say, Got ya!@. You never see when people answer you

You didnt answer. Again. Look how you evade. Doesnt that tell you summinks wrong?

It's a simple question.

(2 Peter 3:8) But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

(2 Peter 3:9) The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Who is Peter talking to here?

 

[Strangelove]

Through Gods pursuational work. I am confident in his promise, In his work and his guarantee. Because of this confidence. I CHOSE TO TRUST GOD. THIS IS WHAT SAVES ME.

LOLZ!

YOUR choice is what SAVED YOU!

SELF-IDOLATRY!!!

 

[shroom2]

did he do what He wanted?
mission accomplished for God through Moses?

Yep, because after much persuading by God, Moses chose to obey.

 

[Strangelove]

Yep, because after much persuading by God, Moses chose to obey.

Just like God persuades us all to come to Him right shroomer?

Coz its according to HIS WILL.......correct?

And our decisions all happen according to HIS WILL?

Or does God need a De Lorian before He predestinates us?

 

[shroom2]

Just like God persuades us all to come to Him right shroomer?

He sure isn't able to persuade everyone.

Coz its according to HIS WILL.......correct?

His will is for all to be saved. It ain't happening.

And our decisions all happen according to HIS WILL?

Nope. God makes His will known. It's entirely up to us to obey.

Or does God need a De Lorian before He predestinates us?

I heard He prefers Ferraris.

Christians as a body were predestined.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

ok EG.
i CHOOSE to believe Hebrews 12:12

Hebrews 12:12

Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

I do to Zone, God has persuaded me with his word. and the light which shines in those who are his. that his enduring the cross on my behalf has paid the price in full for me. As scripture says, He is the author of the plan. And he finished the work on the cross "It is finished" I have an assurance, and confidence based on the hope (eternal life) which God, Who I do not think can lie, promised before time began. That is what my faith is in, As all the definitions I posted showed. It is not my work. it is Gods.

I could have rejected it. But I didn't.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

LOLZ!

YOUR choice is what SAVED YOU!

SELF-IDOLATRY!!!

So I take it a persons choice to reject and because of this choice they are doomed to outer darkness for eternity is self idolotry also?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

No it wasnt Gods will it was satans will, and God let him do it.

Oh so your one of them who blames satan for your sin. Good to know

Satan wills sin. People do the sin. This is why sin is of the devil. God allows satan to influence men to sin. What are your thoughts on the matter?

Satan is not God, Satan is not capable of being 2 places at once, He is limited to his sphere wherever he is. He can't standing in front of Christ accusing people, and down here on earth at the same time tempting EG and Strangelove to sin.

Man has a freedom to chose to sin or chose not to sin. That is why they are held accountable for their won sin. The lie that "satan made me do it" is a lie straight form the pits of hell. and only given when people do not want to take credit for their own sin.

Satan did not make that man rape the 13 y/o. Even if satan tempted him. The man had the ability to resist and not do it.

the more we talk the more screwed up I see your doctrines are!

So was God influenced by your future decision to accept Him YES OR NO?

Is God influenced by someone rejecting him? It does not affect God whatsoever, except maybe the fact he is saddened. But no one will go to outer darkness because they did not make a free will decision to reject him now will they? It is not Gods fault they did not come to him

Or did He simply know that you would accept Him coz that was His plan all along...right from the beginning. We're nearly there now EG.

Nope. We will never be together. Yes God knew I would accept his gift. That's why he chose to save me. Thats why he sent someone to come after me and rescue me, Because he knew I would accept.

If you had people behind enemy lines, and you could know nothing you could do would save them. would you risk others lives to go do the impossible? At the same time, If you knew you not only could, but would save someone, Would you send people in to risk their lives to save them? I would.

God says we are in a spiritual battle. God knows who he can save, and who he can't no matter how hard he tries. He sends people and the HS to those he knows he can save. He is not obligated to send them to those he knows he has no hope of saving no matter how hard he tries.

Jesus said the gates of hell will not prevail over the church. A gate is an defensive weapon to hold the enemy out. God sent the church into enemy territory (Satan's domain) to rescue people out from under the slavery of that world. God send them to people he KNOWS will come with them. He does not have to send them to people who know him (rom 1) but he knows no matter how hard he tries would never chose to follow him.

He willed your brother to reject Him of course. Some are predestined to be sheep, others arnt. Your brother was not chosen.

This is a lie from the depths of Hell. God did not will anyone to reject him. That is why I could never follow your God.

Because my beliefs are scriptural. Sorry. If it makes you sound bad then thats Gods truth speaking.

Only in your mind. A catholic thinks the same thing about their scripture. Does not make it right. It does not sound bad. I am actually saddened you believe God is the way you do. You could have so much more. But thats ok. Believe you God is that way. I will believe my God is the loving father of Creation he claims to be

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You didnt answer. Again. Look how you evade. Doesnt that tell you summinks wrong?

It's a simple question.

(2 Peter 3:8) But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

(2 Peter 3:9) The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Who is Peter talking to here?

I was not even going to respond to this. But since you wish to look like a fool and wish to be proven wrong again and again. I will REPOST what I said. Just to prove I DID ANSWER YOU

What does this prove? That God is patient allowing evil to continue until all whom he has elected to salvation is saved?

If you can't figure out by this the answer. I don't know what else to say!

 

[Strangelove]

He sure isn't able to persuade everyone.


His will is for all to be saved. It ain't happening.


Nope. God makes His will known. It's entirely up to us to obey.


I heard He prefers Ferraris.

Christians as a body were predestined.

This is terrible Shroom.

Your saying stuff that God WILLS doesnt happen.

Just awful.

What kind of god do you have?

 

[Strangelove]

I could have rejected it. But I didn't.

And so do you deserve some kinda credit for that?

What dy'a want a medal?

 

[Strangelove]

So I take it a persons choice to reject and because of this choice they are doomed to outer darkness for eternity is self idolotry also?

Whats the question again?

Can you try and structure the sentence correctly?

 

[BlueLagoon]

2peter3:9 .. God does not want anyone to perish but to come to repentance. This verse indicates that through his patience he waits for people to repent. Therefore it is a choice to repent, is it not? For instance, strangelove, if you pray for your neighbor to be saved and it takes 10 years for that prayer to be answered, were you not one of the tools God used in your neighbors life? It is God who draws....but we are his workmanship. And you really should shed some of that sarcasm in your posts and replace it with love and kindness.

 

[Strangelove]

Oh so your one of them who blames satan for your sin. Good to know

I take responsibility for my own sin. Satan tempts me to sin. I can choose to give into that temptation or not.

We have FREEWILL ya know!

Satan is not God, Satan is not capable of being 2 places at once, He is limited to his sphere wherever he is. He can't standing in front of Christ accusing people, and down here on earth at the same time tempting EG and Strangelove to sin.

I dunno what yer talking about. He is a spirit. Satan is the god of this world. He has agents, demons and many methods of tempting people without having to be everywhere at once.

Are you saying that sin is NOT of the devil?

Man has a freedom to chose to sin or chose not to sin. That is why they are held accountable for their won sin. The lie that "satan made me do it" is a lie straight form the pits of hell. and only given when people do not want to take credit for their own sin.

Totally agree.

Satan did not make that man rape the 13 y/o. Even if satan tempted him. The man had the ability to resist and not do it.

All I'm saying is that satan tempted him.

the more we talk the more screwed up I see your doctrines are!

Huh?

Is God influenced by someone rejecting him? It does not affect God whatsoever, except maybe the fact he is saddened. But no one will go to outer darkness because they did not make a free will decision to reject him now will they? It is not Gods fault they did not come to him

WHY cant you answer simple questions?

Was God influenced by your future decision to accept Him YES OR NO?

Nope. We will never be together. Yes God knew I would accept his gift. That's why he chose to save me. Thats why he sent someone to come after me and rescue me, Because he knew I would accept.

If you had people behind enemy lines, and you could know nothing you could do would save them. would you risk others lives to go do the impossible? At the same time, If you knew you not only could, but would save someone, Would you send people in to risk their lives to save them? I would.

Are you saying that God looks through the corridors of time?

God says we are in a spiritual battle. God knows who he can save, and who he can't no matter how hard he tries. He sends people and the HS to those he knows he can save. He is not obligated to send them to those he knows he has no hope of saving no matter how hard he tries.

Oh my word...you are as bad as Shroom.

God? Not ABLE TO DO SOMETHING? Are you serious??!

Jesus said the gates of hell will not prevail over the church. A gate is an defensive weapon to hold the enemy out. God sent the church into enemy territory (Satan's domain) to rescue people out from under the slavery of that world. God send them to people he KNOWS will come with them. He does not have to send them to people who know him (rom 1) but he knows no matter how hard he tries would never chose to follow him.

Absolutely awful.

Stop and think what your saying for a second will ya?

This is a lie from the depths of Hell. God did not will anyone to reject him. That is why I could never follow your God.

Then you dont believe scripture.

(Romans 9:20) Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?

(Romans 9:21) Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?

(Romans 9:22) What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

(Romans 9:23) And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,

Only in your mind. A catholic thinks the same thing about their scripture. Does not make it right. It does not sound bad. I am actually saddened you believe God is the way you do. You could have so much more. But thats ok. Believe you God is that way. I will believe my God is the loving father of Creation he claims to be

How do you handle the above verses then?

 

[shroom2]

This is terrible Shroom.

Your saying stuff that God WILLS doesnt happen.

Just awful.

What kind of god do you have?

1 Tim 2:4) Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

2 Pet 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Tell me, Dr. Strange: Will all men be saved?

 

[Strangelove]

I was not even going to respond to this. But since you wish to look like a fool and wish to be proven wrong again and again. I will REPOST what I said. Just to prove I DID ANSWER YOU

If you can't figure out by this the answer. I don't know what else to say!

So he's talking to the elect then ya?

So therefore when Peter says not willing that any should perish , he's saying God is not willing that any of THE ELECT should perish....

.......right?

 

[BlueLagoon]

1 Tim 2:4) Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

2 Pet 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Tell me, Dr. Strange: Will all men be saved?

Unfortunately a few will end up in hell but why should we care right? They made a choice and if they never knew about Him or heard the gospel, who would be held responsible? what strangelove doesnt get is that God uses actual breathing people to do His work.