The New Covenant Is Not What Many Have Been Taught

[SabbathBlessing]

The whole law had to be changed. Can't pick and choose.

For the priesthood being changed, out of necessity also a change of law takes place. Hebrews 7:12​

It doesn’t say this. It only speaks of the law of the priesthood and what was under that agreement Deut31:24-30

Jesus came from the tribe of Judah but the law said the priest had come from Levi, it says this plainly in Heb7

The law is holy, just and good Rom7:12 why would anyone want to change that? There is more than one law in Scripture and thats where the confusion comes in, not allowing the Bible to explain itself. Jesus said there is a law not a jot or tittle can pass from- He came to magnify one law Isa 42:21 and put an end to another law Dan9:27

 

[Dino246]

Jesus said there is a law not a jot or tittle can pass from

And what does He say just after that? Finish the sentence!

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Rom 7: 12 For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law. 13 For He of whom these things are spoken belongs to another tribe, from which no man has [b]officiated at the altar.
14 For it is evident that our Lord arose from Judah, of which tribe Moses spoke nothing concerning [c]priesthood.

Only the tribe of Levi could be priests, we can read about this in Heb7 and in the OT after all the tribes except Levi bowed to the goldIn calf. Jesus came from the trine of Judah- obviously this law had to change. Its the context of this passage, but believe as you wish.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

And what does He say just after that? Finish the sentence!

Until all is fulfilled, which is just that- heaven and earth have to pass and all the prophecies about Him have been fulfilled, which means just that, all, He did not come to destroy the law or prophets Mat 5:17 including the prophecies of His second coming yet to be fulfilled. Why He said not to break the least of these commandments Mat5:19 and in doing so one will be in danger of sin and judgement if one keeps reading….Mat5:19-30

 

[Mem]

I am okay agreeing to disagree but wish you well.

I never expected that we'd agree, and wish you well also.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

It doesn’t say this. It only speaks of the law of the priesthood and what was under that agreement Deut31:24-30

Jesus came from the tribe of Judah but the law said the priest had come from Levi, it says this plainly in Heb7

The law is holy, just and good Rom7:12 why would anyone want to change that? There is more than one law in Scripture and thats where the confusion comes in, not allowing the Bible to explain itself. Jesus said there is a law not a jot or tittle can pass from- He came to magnify one law Isa 42:21 and put an end to another law Dan9:27

The law was based on the Levitical priesthood. Through it the law was enacted upon Israel. If the priesthood changed (which it did), then the law had to change as well (which it did).

If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, for it enacted law upon the people, what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron? Hebrews 7:11​

​

 

[SabbathBlessing]

The law was based on the Levitical priesthood. Through it the law was enacted upon Israel. If the priesthood changed (which it did), then the law had to change as well (which it did).

If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, for it enacted law upon the people, what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron? Hebrews 7:11​

​

Yes, but keep reading….it is providing the context

Rom 7: 12 For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law. 13 For He of whom these things are spoken belongs to another tribe, from which no man has [b]officiated at the altar.
14 For it is evident that our Lord arose from Judah, of which tribe Moses spoke nothing concerning [c]priesthood.

The priesthood always came from the tribe of Levi, Jesus came from Judah.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Num 3:5 And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying: 6 “Bring the tribe of Levi near, and present them before Aaron the priest, that they may serve him. 7 And they shall attend to his needs and the needs of the whole congregation before the tabernacle of meeting, to do the work of the tabernacle. 8 Also they shall attend to all the furnishings of the tabernacle of meeting, and to the needs of the children of Israel, to do the work of the tabernacle. 9 And you shall give the Levites to Aaron and his sons; they are given entirely to [c]him from among the children of Israel. 10 So you shall appoint Aaron and his sons, and they shall attend to their priesthood; but the outsider who comes near shall be put to death.”

The law excludes all other tribes

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

Yes, but keep reading….it is providing the context

Rom 7: 12 For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law. 13 For He of whom these things are spoken belongs to another tribe, from which no man has [b]officiated at the altar.
14 For it is evident that our Lord arose from Judah, of which tribe Moses spoke nothing concerning [c]priesthood.

The priesthood always came from the tribe of Levi, Jesus came from Judah.

And the law of Moses was based on the Levitical priesthood. When it went away, so did its law. A new priesthood means a new law. We are not governed by the Levitical priesthood, therefore we are not governed by its law.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

And the law of Moses was based on the Levitical priesthood. When it went away, so did its law. A new priesthood means a new law. We are not governed by the Levitical priesthood, therefore we are not governed by its law.

The laws under the Levitical priesthood

Deut 31:24 So it was, when Moses had completed writing the words of this law in a book, when they were finished, 25 that Moses commanded the Levites, who bore the ark of the covenant of the Lord, saying: 26 “Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there as a witness against you

The laws that had to do with animal sacrifices and offerings what Jesus came to put an end to Dan9:27

He came to magnify another law- His Isa 42:21 not what was written by Moses, but what God Himself wrote Exo31:18 and was inside the ark of the covenant Exo40:20 , the Ten Commandments the Testimony of God, what God Himself claimed as His Exo20:6

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

The laws under the Levitical priesthood

Deut 31:24 So it was, when Moses had completed writing the words of this law in a book, when they were finished, 25 that Moses commanded the Levites, who bore the ark of the covenant of the Lord, saying: 26 “Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there as a witness against you

The laws that had to do with animal sacrifices and offerings what Jesus came to put an end to Dan9:27

He came to magnify another law- His Isa 42:21 not what was written by Moses, but what God Himself wrote Exo31:18 and was inside the ark of the covenant Exo40:20 , the Ten Commandments the Testimony of God, what God Himself claimed as His Exo20:6

The 10 commandments were written in the book of the law.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

The 10 commandments were written in the book of the law.

The Ten Commandments were written by God Himself and placed inside the ark of the covenant, not besides like the book of the law.

God wrote the Ten Commandments and it was inside His ark, not besides the ark like the Book of the law.

Exo 31:18 And when He had made an end of speaking with him on Mount Sinai, He gave Moses two tablets of the Testimony, tablets of stone, written with the finger of God.

Exo 25:21 You shall put the mercy seat on top of the ark, and in the ark you shall put the Testimony that I will give you

Deut 40:20 He took the Testimony and put it into the ark, inserted the poles through the rings of the ark, and put the mercy seat on top of the ark.

Deut 31:24 So it was, when Moses had completed writing the words of this law in a book, when they were finished, 25 that Moses commanded the Levites, who bore the ark of the covenant of the Lord, saying: 26 “Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there as a witness against you

You can believe as you wish, but the clear Scripture says something else. The law of God was not written by Moses, was not placed besides the ark, it was written by God and placed inside His ark of the covenant. This is why there is so much confusion in God’s Word. We just will not allow God to define His own Law that He wrote. Even Moses refused to take credit for it Exo32:16

Only the Ten Commandments is under the mercy seat of God, no more was added to the Ten Commandments Deut5:22 Deut4:13 its the law of God that God Himself wrote and claimed as His. Why people insist on giving Moses credit for God’s law when God’s name is in each of the first 4 commandments, not Moses, Moses is a human-being, God is divine And did not leave His divine law to be written by man.

 

[ChristRoseFromTheDead]

The Ten Commandments were written by God Himself and placed inside the ark of the covenant, not besides like the book of the law.

God wrote the Ten Commandments and it was inside His ark, not besides the ark like the Book of the law.

Exo 31:18 And when He had made an end of speaking with him on Mount Sinai, He gave Moses two tablets of the Testimony, tablets of stone, written with the finger of God.

Exo 25:21 You shall put the mercy seat on top of the ark, and in the ark you shall put the Testimony that I will give you

Deut 40:20 He took the Testimony and put it into the ark, inserted the poles through the rings of the ark, and put the mercy seat on top of the ark.

Deut 31:24 So it was, when Moses had completed writing the words of this law in a book, when they were finished, 25 that Moses commanded the Levites, who bore the ark of the covenant of the Lord, saying: 26 “Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there as a witness against you

You can believe as you wish, but the clear Scripture says something else. The law of God was not written by Moses, was not placed besides the ark, it was written by God and placed inside His ark of the covenant. This is why there is so much confusion in God’s Word. We just will not allow God to define His own Law that He wrote. Even Moses refused to take credit for it Exo32:16

It doesn't matter; it was all one law, and it all had to be obeyed. God pronounced a curse on everyone who didn't do all things written in the law. You're just playing games picking and choosing which parts you like and throwing out the parts you don't like. If you follow the law you are liable for every bit of it.

 

[Mem]

The Ten Commandments were written by God Himself and placed inside the ark of the covenant, not besides like the book of the law.

God wrote the Ten Commandments and it was inside His ark, not besides the ark like the Book of the law.

Exo 31:18 And when He had made an end of speaking with him on Mount Sinai, He gave Moses two tablets of the Testimony, tablets of stone, written with the finger of God.

Exo 25:21 You shall put the mercy seat on top of the ark, and in the ark you shall put the Testimony that I will give you

Deut 40:20 He took the Testimony and put it into the ark, inserted the poles through the rings of the ark, and put the mercy seat on top of the ark.

Deut 31:24 So it was, when Moses had completed writing the words of this law in a book, when they were finished, 25 that Moses commanded the Levites, who bore the ark of the covenant of the Lord, saying: 26 “Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there as a witness against you

You can believe as you wish, but the clear Scripture says something else. The law of God was not written by Moses, was not placed besides the ark, it was written by God and placed inside His ark of the covenant. This is why there is so much confusion in God’s Word. We just will not allow God to define His own Law that He wrote. Even Moses refused to take credit for it Exo32:16

Only the Ten Commandments is under the mercy seat of God, no more was added to the Ten Commandments Deut5:22 Deut4:13 its the law of God that God Himself wrote and claimed as His. Why people insist on giving Moses credit for God’s law when God’s name is in each of the first 4 commandments, not Moses, Moses is a human-being, God is divine And did not leave His divine law to be written by man.

Do I sense an underlying nontrinitarian assumption present in this? As this would do much to explain the divergence of perspectives.
As I view it, Jesus fulfilled Moses law and honored it to the jot, satisfying every tittle of its requirement even to the sentence of death, which was beyond the requirement toward His responsibility to it. He suffered that part for our sake, and His Father accepted this as sufficient to satisfy His justice, as much it also met with His mercy, and kissed. Then He raised Him to His inheritance of the Kingdom of God, to rule even, just as He did before, as God with power to do all His will. "The Lord said the My Lord..."

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Do I sense an underlying nontrinitarian assumption present in this? As this would do much to explain the divergence of perspectives.
As I view it, Jesus fulfilled Moses law and honored it to the jot, satisfying every tittle of its requirement even to the sentence of death, which was beyond the requirement toward His responsibility to it. He suffered that part for our sake, and His Father accepted this as sufficient to satisfy His justice, as much it also met with His mercy, and kissed. Then He raised Him to His inheritance of the Kingdom of God, to rule even, just as He did before, as God with power to do all His will. "The Lord said the My Lord..."

How one can read this and come away that the law of God that He wrote with His own finger Exo31:18 , that He called as His Exo20:6 Deut 4:13 that has His name on each of the first four commandments Exo20:1-11 that He placed inside His ark Exo40:20 that is in heaven Rev 11:19 Rev 15:5 under His mercy seat Exo25:21, the law of Moses. Moses wrote another law. One is man, one is God. It’s the reason why there is so much confusion to the NT because one will not allow the “He who said “ which is God James 2:11 to define His own law, man thinks they know better.

Justice and mercy has not kissed yet because Judgement is the last day and we are judged on His words John 12:48 James 2:11

 

[Mem]

How one can read this and come away that the law of God that He wrote with His own finger, that He called as His that has His name on each of the first four commandments that He placed inside His ark that is in heaven under His mercy seat, the law of Moses. Moses wrote another law. One is man, one is God. It’s the reason why there is so much confusion to the NT because they will not allow the He who said which is God James 2:11 but define His own law, man thinks they know better.

Of course, God wrote it, why would anyone think that God would agree to die for anything less? But Jesus spoke of His law, which He Himself claimed had better promises. The Law of Christ.

 

[memberofthebride]

strawman.

at issue is not whether believers go about willfully sinning.

at issue is whether we are under the Law or whether our works effect our salvation.

Scripture is super clear about this: we are saved by belief, and are not under the Law. no one is justified by their works.

comment

those that have repented, been baptized and received the Holy Spirit are no longer "under penalty of death" but are still subject to the law.

The death of Christ did not eliminate the law, only the penalty that each of us are UNDER because of our sins against God. sin is the transgression of the Torah.

Many love to interpret Paul as saying we no longer have to keep the law, that line of thinking is illogical

If Christ eliminated the Torah then repentance and baptism would not be needed, how can you repent from sin that does not exist? Actually if the Torah were abolished, the death of Christ would be unnecessary.

Why would Christ abolish the Law that put Him to death, that makes no sense. If he abolished it first , He would not have to die.

The 40,000 favors are illogical.

 

[Mem]

If Christ eliminated the Torah then repentance and baptism would not be needed, how can you repent from sin that does not exist? Actually if the Torah were abolished, the death of Christ would be unnecessary.

The use of the term Torah has become synonymous of the Law even though it is more indicative of 'teaching' which is the employment of a 'schoolmaster. In this case one that brings us to Christ, the Principle. Except no one should compare His character with that of any of those that they might remember from their school years. You say, "if the Torah were abolished, the death of Christ would be unnecessary." Yet, because of Christ's death, we live! Something to that logic isn't jelling. The Torah wasn't abolished, it was fulfilled. Done. It served the intended purpose to bring you to Christ if, indeed, you have come to Christ.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Of course, God wrote it, why would anyone think that God would agree to die for anything less? But Jesus spoke of His law, which He Himself claimed had better promises. The Law of Christ.

Jesus is God made flesh, so it’s the same laws. Jesus came to magnify His laws Isa 42:21 not to destroy Mat5:17-30

Jesus taught keeping the same law that He called the commandment of God. Mark15:3-14 Mark7:7-13 Mat 5:19-30 Mark-:17-19

What God does is forever, He makes no mistakes, we do.

Ecc 3:14 I know that whatever God does,
It shall be forever.
Nothing can be added to it,
And nothing taken from it.
God does it, that men should fear before Him.

His saints still keep them until the end of time

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.


Revelation 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers (Breaking commandment #1 Exodus 20:3) and sexually immoral (breaking commandment #7 Exodus 20:14) and murderers (breaking commandment #6 Exodus 20:13) and idolaters (breaking commandment #2 Exodus 20:4-6), and whoever loves and practices a lie (breaking # 9 Exodus 20:16 or any of the commandments 1 John 2:4) Breaking one we break them all James 2:11-12 Exo 20:1-17 .

 

[Mem]

His saints still keep them until the end of time

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

You can't separate the commandments of God from an (unchanged) law, even though we are told that the law has changed.