Some thoughts on the Sabbath...

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Romans 2:28-29​

28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

If man calls you a Jew.....
 
BBerean said:
Hebrews ch 8 , 9, 10,11 an excellent read !
A few verses that stand out to me ch 8 v 10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days , Saith the Lord , I will put my laws into their mind , and write them in their hearts ; and I will be to them a God , and they shall be to me a people.

Hebrews ch 10 v 16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days , Saith the Lord , I will put my laws into their minds will I write them ; ( read the whole chapters for better understanding. But here you can see The Lord deepened his laws more so than the letter of the law into the lives of his people,therefore very much more alive ! Amen . )
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God’s Word enters His people’s hearts when they repent of sins including legalism and accept Jesus as Messiah and Lord incarnate. He indwells believers as the Holy Spirit.

God could have chosen anyone other than Abraham to be the father of believers, and/or God could have chosen Ishmael instead of Isaac, or He could have chosen Reuben instead of Judah, etcetera. IOW, Jesus could have been an aborigine instead of a Jew, so let us not fixate on the physical.
 
memberofthebride said:
I have read it for 60 years and I have found the natural mind of men can never understand God's Word, which is why there are 45,000 varieties of churches today, when Christ instituted only ONE!
And I expect by year end there will be 46,000 or more

you are missing the fact the 10 Commandments reveal to man how to love God, the first 4, and how to love man, the last 6.
I read Christ rested only on the 7th Day and made only the 7th Day Holy time.

15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

151 Thou [art] near, O LORD; and all thy commandments [are] truth.

172 My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments [are] righteousness.

I believe God's WORD, men's never.
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one thing I have learned on this blog
there is no end to the ways people can and have come up with to prove, logically, biblically obeying God is no longer required.
And I know who else will never obey God --- Satan.
 
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memberofthebride said:
I have read it for 60 years and I have found the natural mind of men can never understand God's Word, which is why there are 45,000 varieties of churches today, when Christ instituted only ONE!
And I expect by year end there will be 46,000 or more

you are missing the fact the 10 Commandments reveal to man how to love God, the first 4, and how to love man, the last 6.
I read Christ rested only on the 7th Day and made only the 7th Day Holy time.

15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

151 Thou [art] near, O LORD; and all thy commandments [are] truth.

172 My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments [are] righteousness.

I believe God's WORD, men's never.
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When a man’s words are inspired by God, we should believe both.
 
memberofthebride said:
only the men of God recorded in the Word of God, not even one from the 45,000 churches
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All believers are people of God who should witness for Christ—parents by loving and teaching their children.

What we teach and inspired insights should agree with the GW, especially the Gospel.
 
TMS said:
Spiritualy we inherit the promised land and spiritual we inherit many other promises. We should not say we are not Israelites. By adoption we are Israelites in Christ
All one in Christ...

So the Gentile argument used to say the 10 commandments are not for us, does not apply.
As spiritual Jews we should obey the law.
Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:

Inwardly and spiritually it applies to us.
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Nowhere does it say We Are Spiritual Jews that is ridiculous because in Christ there is no Jew or Gentile we are grafted into the spiritual blessing which translates to the spiritual Promised Land i e heaven or to be with God all this other fluff is just that it's made up your imagining it in the text we don't become Israel
 
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memberofthebride said:
I have read it for 60 years and I have found the natural mind of men can never understand God's Word, which is why there are 45,000 varieties of churches today, when Christ instituted only ONE!
And I expect by year end there will be 46,000 or more

you are missing the fact the 10 Commandments reveal to man how to love God, the first 4, and how to love man, the last 6.
I read Christ rested only on the 7th Day and made only the 7th Day Holy time.

15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

151 Thou [art] near, O LORD; and all thy commandments [are] truth.

172 My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments [are] righteousness.

I believe God's WORD, men's never.
Click to expand...
All right first of all we have to mix all of your Old Testament statements because what we're talking about is what Jesus commanded and second the words Commandments in those passages are ambiguous as to what they mean and require context and understanding of the overarching theology that is being taught in a new testament.

which is not the Ten Commandments Nine of the 10 are imported into Christianity, the Sabbath is not neither is the entirety of the Mosaic law because the very best commandment the greatest commandment which is to love God and love thy neighbor the fulfills the law
 
BBerean said:
Start by doing all the 10 commandments then I agree . Not just the ones we prefer that fit our doctrine.
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It not my doctrine, it Protestant Christianity. Before you launch yourself into all of these arguments you need to understand the premise of protestant Christianity I didn't just one day and wake up and come to this conclusion I know what it means to be a Protestant Christian and how I got where I'm at.

I also hear from God and know that I am on the right path. In addition and probably more important to you is that I understand what the Bible is telling me because when you're honest and you take away all the presuppositions.

Christianity is incredibly simple Jesus Christ did it all and all we have to do is believe that he is who he says he is through that he gives us through Grace.

Nothing that we do merits us anything love God and love thy neighbor fulfills the whole of the law which includes the Ten Commandments therefore the Ten Commandments are irrelevant since I am doing them anyway my loving God and loving my neighbor

I take my Sabbath rest whenever I feel like it in Jesus because he is our Sabbath rest this is 101 Protestant Christianity if you disagree with this fine take your argument up with God not with me or others who are Protestant Christians as Works related actions are never called for and considered heretical to Protestant Christianity
 
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Seeker47 said:
There is a passage in Psalm 95 that says if we do not know God’s ways, we will not enter His rest. I have been studying the sabbath and trying to understand what God really says. For your amusement and consideration, I submit the following thoughts.

Genesis 2:3
God then blessed the seventh day and set it apart because he had finished creation

The first thing God did on the seventh day, after creation was completed, was to make the day “Holy.” The entire day, not just part. He set one full day aside from all others for His use and pleasure. That use and pleasure was for our benefit; an opportunity to refresh.

Exodus 20:8-11
The first commandment concerning the Sabbath is to remember it forever…

Next God commanded His people to remember His special set-apart day forever. (Not sure we have done so well with that.) The sabbath is a reminder of His everlasting covenant. An acknowledgement that following a short period of struggles and difficulties, He will bring us all into an everlasting sabbath with Him.

Exodus 20:10
…but the seventh day is a sabbath to the Lord your God. On it you shall not do any work,

He then commanded His people to do no work. This has been abused and miss-understood for centuries, but His intent is clear. We are to rely on Him. (Picking up sticks does not necessarily violate the sabbath, but More on this later) We can trust God for our provision or we can rely on our own effort, but we cannot do both. For one full day out of seven, God asks our reliance be totally on Him, not on ourselves. The Bible says God will provide for the sabbath, all we need do is make the preparations.

So, what do we do? Yeshua showed us! Prayer, doing good works, reading scripture, hearing, and preaching the word, singing, fasting, healing, making oaths and vows to God, offering thanksgivings, yet always glorifying His Holy Name. There is tremendous power in the sabbath.

One problem I did encounter in my study; the stony execution of a man for collecting sticks on the sabbath. (Numbers 15:32-36) This appeared cruel and set me back.

After a little more study the context then became clear, the execution had absolutely nothing to do with breaking sabbath rules. The context is a discussion of unintentional and intentional sin. The issue is blasphemy; the deliberate, insulting, contemptuous and willful lack of reverence for God. This man stood at the foot of the mountain and heard God’s own voice proclaiming his commandments. In his arrogance he then proceeded to publicly challenged God. Not a good idea.

There is no judgement here on how or when anyone chooses to keep sabbath, only the encouragement for thoughts and prayers on the subject.
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Thanks Seeker47, for considering the sabbath. I like that you mention Numbers 15 and the man who picked up sticks on the sabbath. People often use this scripture to say that God commanded bad things or that the Bible advocates murder. They try to discredit what is written because they don't understand the picture that is being painted. But what the scripture is actually painting is a warning about trying to save others by our own strength. The sabbath is all about how Jesus, through the cross and resurrection, does all of the work of saving his own persons, whilst the persons only rest in that regard. They could not save themselves because they are not sinless. Only sinless Jesus could satisfy the demands of the law by taking their sins upon himself. That is the picture painted by the sabbath. Yet the man in Numbers 15 was not resting in Christ's work, so to speak. He was trying to pick up sticks (picture of someone's trying to save others by his own sinful strength). The scripture shows that the end result of someone trying to save by their own perfection and by their own work, without God's work on the cross, ends in death. Rather than being a picture of how God is a killer, it is a picture of how God is warning us that it is only through him, through his work at the cross, that anyone will have life. Thanks God, for letting us know that it is only through Christ's work on the cross and having a part in his victory resurrection, that we are able to be saved. Not by our own works.
The Bible is written in parable form (Psalm 78:1-2, Mark 4:34) but people think it is not written that way. We are told that the sabbath is a shadow of the real thing, but that it is not the real thing. It is simply painting a picture so that hopefully we can understand the real thing. If a person is saved by trusting in Christ, they are already keeping the real thing. They are are forever keeping the sabbath in that sense. Forever - yes. Because they are forever saved. So, Christ has forever done the work of saving them, whilst they only rest in that regard.
In like manner, Leviticus tells us to take two birds and kill one under running water to cleanse a leper. Does that mean that God wants us to go out and find two birds and then find an actual leper and perform a ceremony to cleanse him or her? No, the bird killed under running water is a picture painted of Christ at the cross who was killed for the sake of the unsaved according to the word. The leper is a picture of an unsaved person who is cleansed by Christ and becomes saved. You don't have to do the ceremony. The ceremony is a picture painted of the read thing. The real thing is simply someone being saved.
 
NightTwister said:
I'm not Jewish.
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I don't think there are many literal Jews left in the world. I do not like what the Talmud teaches, and I could not be a literal Jew.

But to be part of God's family we are referred to as the Children of Abraham.

Not by blood line or literally but by our inward choice.

Rom 2:28-29
28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: 29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Rom 9:7-8
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. 8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

The Children of Promise are counted for the seed..

Gal 3:6-8
6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness. 7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. 8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

They which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.

Gal 3:14-16
14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Christ is what it was all about...

Gal 3:26-29
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

We are heirs according to the Promise.
By Christ we are the seed of Abraham.

Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:


make with the house of Israel

Will make with the house of Israel

The Israel of God.
Gal 6:15-16
15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature. 16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.

It is not possible to have 144000 literal Jews of pure blood line today. Even if the number is symbolic.. God has His Israelites today and they are not people that do not believe in Jesus.

But Spiritual Jews .... yes.
 
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TMS said:
I don't think there are many literal Jews left in the world. I do not like what the Talmud teaches, and I could not be a literal Jew.

But to be part of God's family we are referred to as the Children of Abraham.

Not by blood line or literally but by our inward choice.

Rom 2:28-29
28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: 29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Rom 9:7-8
7 Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. 8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

The Children of Promise are counted for the seed..

Gal 3:6-8
6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness. 7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. 8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

They which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.

Gal 3:14-16
14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Christ is what it was all about...

Gal 3:26-29
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

We are heirs according to the Promise.
By Christ we are the seed of Abraham.

Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:


make with the house of Israel

Will make with the house of Israel

The Israel of God.
Gal 6:15-16
15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature. 16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.

It is not possible to have 144000 literal Jews of pure blood line today. Even if the number is symbolic.. God has His Israelites today and they are not people that do not believe in Jesus.

But Spiritual Jews .... yes.
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None of that changes my premise and earlier statement that we are not Israel as Gentile Christians. In fact pretty much every verse you quoted supports exactly what I'm saying

we are grafted into Israels promise but we are not Israel

Your reference to Jeremiah 31:31 (HEB 8:10) is out of context this did happen when Jesus appeared on the scene and went through his whole Passion Play however the Jews did not accept it and as prophecy salvation was given to the Gentiles to make Israel jealous.

Only at this point did the Jews begin to see Jesus for who he was

Salvation came to the Jews first as suggested by the verse in Jeremiah 31, and elsewhere, however they rejected Jesus and the salvation he provided was then given to the Gentile Nations.
 
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