What does Occupy Wall Street protests, going on all over world, mean to you ?

[GreenNnice]

Your duty as a Christian is to obey Jesus. Jesus has the words of eternal life. He is the way,truth, and the life.

This is man's way and man's truth and a man's life, not that of Jesus.

It is good to care for poor and sick and widows, this is good. But the gospel of Jesus is the only power unto salvation. Not these protests.

May Jesus bless you

---
Ram, God's plan is carried out in many ways, all ways, now, that said , there are good ways to do things and bad. We should not judge people in protests or anything else.

What should we do?

Good question, I think everyone agrees...

The Lord leads , the Lord allows, the Lord provides, all things to ALL people, sinners, non-sinners, Muslims, Christians, Catholics, Mormons, ALL. Now, people accepting what the Lord gives is another thing. Now, people accepting what the Lord allows (hint: think God allowing Satan to attack Job) is another thing entirely Now, people following the Lord is not a given. People have been given free choice, true dat since the beg. of time.

Now then, how will you help forward God's plan for humankind?

THAT , Ram, is completely and only , ultimately, between God and any given individual (His eye is on all of us, 'sparrow') , it is a PERSONAL relationship between you and God.

OWS is a movement of many issues , reasons, wants, and, perhaps, in future, these things will become 'demands' and IF enough people think the same way and things do not change, then, the Lord leads but the obvious thing to happen next would be like the 1968 French's response to government failure and economic gross unfairness...

Revolution.
---
Liam, you say you are a poor college student in college NOW .

...Saying 'that' means you can be in sympathy with those of OWS, but not empathy because you are not experiencing what these RECENT COLLEGE GRADS are experiencing. There are NO jobs, the country lost 8 million jobs in last 5 years and got back now , thru October 2011, 2.75 million of those 8 million jobs LOST back...

Ok, green, so that's good, as Darwinian economics is at work , the 'bests' and 'betters' are getting the jobs, the ones not qualified are not. Survival of the fittest, works for me. Equal opportunity, not equal outcome, my ideology completely.

Ok, liam, fair enough, and, in some ways, true enough, but....what IF you boil the #s down to averages and the FACT that of the 100,000 jobs added in August 2011 50,000 of them were McDonalds employment, in other words, MOSTLY minimum wage jobs.

These people on the streets are NOT college kids , as you say, liam, they are graduates of college with good education and the MAJORITY of the 2.75 million jobs created in last couple years are 'mcdonslds' jobs and now comes the Christmas season and the jobs #s will continue to be skewed from Macy's, Sears, PART-TIME jobs that mostly pay...minimum wage.

So these OWS folks are largely, I think, college GRADS , with 40,000 in loans to pay off and NO way to pay then off. And, sure, the Mcdonalds jobs are out there but minimum wage jobs give you POVERTY income.

 

[TheGrungeDiva]

---
So these OWS folks are largely, I think, college GRADS , with 40,000 in loans to pay off and NO way to pay then off. And, sure, the Mcdonalds jobs are out there but minimum wage jobs give you POVERTY income.

To my knowledge, no survey has been done to find out who, exactly, makes up the people on the streets, what percentages have jobs, etc. In my personal estimation (which is by no means scientific), I would say some of them are college students, but very few. Most of them are college grads, some of them recent, some of them graduated 10, 20, 30, 40 years ago. Some of them are unemployed, some of them are under-employed (i.e. working part time and looking for full-time work, or working below their 'pay-grade' as it were), some have jobs they hate, some have jobs they love, some are self-employed, some are stay-at-home moms or dads. Some have enough money to support their families, but barely, some don't. Some are what most of us would consider "wealthy." I don't think anyone from the 1% is among the protesters, but it wouldn't surprise me if a 5% or at least a 10% were. Warren Buffet is one of the 1%, and he supports them. (Not enough to sleep in a tent and get tear-gassed, though.)

In other words, they're representative of Americans of all walks of life.

As opposed to the Tea Party, who says Government is Evil, they say Corporations are Evil. Obviously, this is an over-simplification on both sides. There is overlap. My husband and I, for example, both believe that both government and corporations are evil; he tends to think corporations are the lesser evil of the two, while I see government as slightly less evil, or at least easier to vote corruption out of (you can't vote the CEO out of a corp unless you're on its board). I know people who stood with the signs at Tea Party rallies, and are standing with signs at Occupy {insert local city here} now. I know people who criticize Tea Party and also criticize OWS. With good reason, on both sides.

Just as there were plenty of loonies at Tea Party rallies who had signs that were misspelled, or who were saying neo-nazi slogans, or even leaders among them who didn't even know basic American history (thanks, Sarah Palin, for the laughs), those fringe elements did not represent the whole. It was MONTHS before the group became cohesive under a platform. And when it did, some of the people who had initially rallied with them became frustrated. Some thought they didn't go far enough, some thought they went too far. Many tea party leaders have now been elected into congress. For better or for worse, they are doing their best to get the things for which their movement stands accomplished. Though I disagree with a lot of those things, I respect them for sticking to their promises.

In a few months, or maybe a year or two, we will have some official, or semi-official statements, of what OWS really stands for. A lot of people who have been rallying will be frustrated, some will say it's too much of a compromise, some will say it's not what they wanted, but it will be a step. I cannot predict what direction that step will take. If it is one which I support, and more importantly, which supports the Gospel, I will jump in the ring, put my money and my mouth behind it, pray for its success.

Until then, I pray for those who are on the line, being beaten by the police for exercising their right to assemble peaceably.

 

[phil36]

What can singles do to support this movement that is out there for the betterment of society. Or, is it betterment. More and more, the class distinction of rich and poor is changing. There are more millionaires than ever before, and, consequently, more poverty than ever before.

OWS wants things like :

Living conditions good for all.

Work opportunities fair for all.

Forgiveness of student, personal and, home mortgage debts /loans

Minimum wage of $20 an hour .

Healthcare for all
--------

Let's not focus on the politics, like what we think is best way for America to get jobless rate below 9%, etc., but let us focus as singles on what WE WOULD DO / CAN DO NOW to help this movement BECOME like God would want it to be .

Maybe it already is what God wants, as YOU are on the front lines now, you ARE a someone in one of the 250 USA cities protesting or, in Sydney, London, Paris, Rome, and other world cities.

Please, by all means, explain this '99%' movement.

In other words, let's set up our own Christian OWS .

Sounds like the welfare state in the Scotland, only the minimum wage is around £6 per hr. ($10 I think).

 

[Pheonix]

min wage in Canada just got to $10.25 last year I think. Before that it was $8.25 I think.

 

[Ramon]

---
Ram, God's plan is carried out in many ways, all ways, now, that said , there are good ways to do things and bad. We should not judge people in protests or anything else.

What should we do?

Good question, I think everyone agrees...

The Lord leads , the Lord allows, the Lord provides, all things to ALL people, sinners, non-sinners, Muslims, Christians, Catholics, Mormons, ALL. Now, people accepting what the Lord gives is another thing. Now, people accepting what the Lord allows (hint: think God allowing Satan to attack Job) is another thing entirely Now, people following the Lord is not a given. People have been given free choice, true dat since the beg. of time.

Now then, how will you help forward God's plan for humankind?

THAT , Ram, is completely and only , ultimately, between God and any given individual (His eye is on all of us, 'sparrow') , it is a PERSONAL relationship between you and God.

OWS is a movement of many issues , reasons, wants, and, perhaps, in future, these things will become 'demands' and IF enough people think the same way and things do not change, then, the Lord leads but the obvious thing to happen next would be like the 1968 French's response to government failure and economic gross unfairness...

Revolution.
---
Liam, you say you are a poor college student in college NOW .

...Saying 'that' means you can be in sympathy with those of OWS, but not empathy because you are not experiencing what these RECENT COLLEGE GRADS are experiencing. There are NO jobs, the country lost 8 million jobs in last 5 years and got back now , thru October 2011, 2.75 million of those 8 million jobs LOST back...

Ok, green, so that's good, as Darwinian economics is at work , the 'bests' and 'betters' are getting the jobs, the ones not qualified are not. Survival of the fittest, works for me. Equal opportunity, not equal outcome, my ideology completely.

Ok, liam, fair enough, and, in some ways, true enough, but....what IF you boil the #s down to averages and the FACT that of the 100,000 jobs added in August 2011 50,000 of them were McDonalds employment, in other words, MOSTLY minimum wage jobs.

These people on the streets are NOT college kids , as you say, liam, they are graduates of college with good education and the MAJORITY of the 2.75 million jobs created in last couple years are 'mcdonslds' jobs and now comes the Christmas season and the jobs #s will continue to be skewed from Macy's, Sears, PART-TIME jobs that mostly pay...minimum wage.

So these OWS folks are largely, I think, college GRADS , with 40,000 in loans to pay off and NO way to pay then off. And, sure, the Mcdonalds jobs are out there but minimum wage jobs give you POVERTY income.

Indeed true, that God caries out his will. And despite these protest, his will is being fulfilled. No matter what people do, Jesus Christ has judged the world.

I know it sounds like a judgement from me, but it is his judgement.

We are to be separated from the world and separated unto God. Focused on the gospel of Jesus, and not on politics. Politics don't stop the plan of God. No matter who rules, even if it be a dictator, God rules over the kingdoms of men and their establishments.

There are too many Christians that are swayed by politics and religions of men. Hard to follow Jesus when you follow what the media spits out.

There have been protests ever since the beginning, and men have ended up judged ultimately by God. None of these things ever do any real good, because the only real good that can be done is by the gospel of Jesus Christ.

All of these movements and campaigns, and protests, and ideals, and vain things are of the world, and of people of the world.

Not those who follow men are the children of God, but those who are lead by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

May Jesus bless you.

 

[GreenNnice]

To my knowledge, no survey has been done to find out who, exactly, makes up the people on the streets, what percentages have jobs, etc. In my personal estimation (which is by no means scientific), I would say some of them are college students, but very few. Most of them are college grads, some of them recent, some of them graduated 10, 20, 30, 40 years ago. Some of them are unemployed, some of them are under-employed (i.e. working part time and looking for full-time work, or working below their 'pay-grade' as it were), some have jobs they hate, some have jobs they love, some are self-employed, some are stay-at-home moms or dads. Some have enough money to support their families, but barely, some don't. Some are what most of us would consider "wealthy." I don't think anyone from the 1% is among the protesters, but it wouldn't surprise me if a 5% or at least a 10% were. Warren Buffet is one of the 1%, and he supports them. (Not enough to sleep in a tent and get tear-gassed, though.)

In other words, they're representative of Americans of all walks of life.

As opposed to the Tea Party, who says Government is Evil, they say Corporations are Evil. Obviously, this is an over-simplification on both sides. There is overlap. My husband and I, for example, both believe that both government and corporations are evil; he tends to think corporations are the lesser evil of the two, while I see government as slightly less evil, or at least easier to vote corruption out of (you can't vote the CEO out of a corp unless you're on its board). I know people who stood with the signs at Tea Party rallies, and are standing with signs at Occupy {insert local city here} now. I know people who criticize Tea Party and also criticize OWS. With good reason, on both sides.

Just as there were plenty of loonies at Tea Party rallies who had signs that were misspelled, or who were saying neo-nazi slogans, or even leaders among them who didn't even know basic American history (thanks, Sarah Palin, for the laughs), those fringe elements did not represent the whole. It was MONTHS before the group became cohesive under a platform. And when it did, some of the people who had initially rallied with them became frustrated. Some thought they didn't go far enough, some thought they went too far. Many tea party leaders have now been elected into congress. For better or for worse, they are doing their best to get the things for which their movement stands accomplished. Though I disagree with a lot of those things, I respect them for sticking to their promises.

In a few months, or maybe a year or two, we will have some official, or semi-official statements, of what OWS really stands for. A lot of people who have been rallying will be frustrated, some will say it's too much of a compromise, some will say it's not what they wanted, but it will be a step. I cannot predict what direction that step will take. If it is one which I support, and more importantly, which supports the Gospel, I will jump in the ring, put my money and my mouth behind it, pray for its success.

Until then, I pray for those who are on the line, being beaten by the police for exercising their right to assemble peaceably.

----+------
True, PearlDiva, the composition of OWS is not truly known, and, you're right, unless maybe Buffet or Gates maybe attended OWS, the 1% haven't shown up. Buffet in agreement means big whoop to me too. It's like Ruth Madoff sorry her husband, Bernie, ripped people off bybthe droves of their fortunes but perfectly fine accepting a 2.5 million settlement sum to live on.

I think that we can agree that economic unfairness is a key point of OWS . And, jobs is direct corrolation to that unfairness. Now, all the ideas and stands and wants outside of a 'jobs' key theme include living conditions good for all, working oppotunities fair for all, a suitable minimum wage, healthcare for all, forgiveness (to some extent) of student, mortgage, credit card loans, and, corporation accountability, étc.

---Ram, true God's plans will be carried out, but it is untrue to think that human intervention cannot alter God's plans. In fact, God calls Christian people directly into movements and protests, yes, He does.

This movement is not going away any time soon looks like so I won't be surprised one bit IF Christians called to this particularl movement get used by God in a great way to bring on a transformation of society.
The Lord leads.

 

[Ramon]

----+------
True, PearlDiva, the composition of OWS is not truly known, and, you're right, unless maybe Buffet or Gates maybe attended OWS, the 1% haven't shown up. Buffet in agreement means big whoop to me too. It's like Ruth Madoff sorry her husband, Bernie, ripped people off bybthe droves of their fortunes but perfectly fine accepting a 2.5 million settlement sum to live on.

I think that we can agree that economic unfairness is a key point of OWS . And, jobs is direct corrolation to that unfairness. Now, all the ideas and stands and wants outside of a 'jobs' key theme include living conditions good for all, working oppotunities fair for all, a suitable minimum wage, healthcare for all, forgiveness (to some extent) of student, mortgage, credit card loans, and, corporation accountability, étc.

---Ram, true God's plans will be carried out, but it is untrue to think that human intervention cannot alter God's plans. In fact, God calls Christian people directly into movements and protests, yes, He does.

This movement is not going away any time soon looks like so I won't be surprised one bit IF Christians called to this particularl movement get used by God in a great way to bring on a transformation of society.
The Lord leads.

No human can alter God's plans. He has set his plans up before you were born, even before Hitler was born. Satan cannot even altar God's plans. No matter what happens, God has already carried out his plan since the beginning. And Even though Jesus died and rose over 2,000 years ago, he has already accomplished what he needed to accomplish for the salvation of those who will be saved.

If this is hard to understand, it was revealed to me in a chess game, (I like chess, so he used it to show me).

I saw a game in which it was down to a few pieces, and the white made a move and, HIS QUEEN WAS CAPTURED!! OH NO!!! lol.

The queen is a very powerful piece. But this was a part of his plan. The black took the piece and everyone just knew the game was over. But actually the queen sacrifice won the game for him, it just wasn't until several moves later until black realized it. CHECKMATE! WHITE WINS!!! GAME OVER!!

Now, when did white win? Was it when he made the final move, checkmating black? Or was it when he made that queen sacrifice?

Black had no choice really, he had to take the queen.

It is the same way with Jesus. Jesus had to die for the battle to be won. It was a crucial and strategic move. That is why Jesus said, ''It is accomplished!!''

He did not say, ''it will be accomplished.'' He said IT IS!!

And that is why he said, ''If I be lifted up from the earth I will draw all men unto me.''

Not everyone will be saved, some will, some won't. Not everyone will repent. Some will some won't. But the question is, will you?

It is a choice you must make.

May Jesus bless you.

 

[GreenNnice]

No human can alter God's plans. He has set his plans up before you were born, even before Hitler was born. Satan cannot even altar God's plans. No matter what happens, God has already carried out his plan since the beginning. And Even though Jesus died and rose over 2,000 years ago, he has already accomplished what he needed to accomplish for the salvation of those who will be saved.

If this is hard to understand, it was revealed to me in a chess game, (I like chess, so he used it to show me).

I saw a game in which it was down to a few pieces, and the white made a move and, HIS QUEEN WAS CAPTURED!! OH NO!!! lol.

The queen is a very powerful piece. But this was a part of his plan. The black took the piece and everyone just knew the game was over. But actually the queen sacrifice won the game for him, it just wasn't until several moves later until black realized it. CHECKMATE! WHITE WINS!!! GAME OVER!!

Now, when did white win? Was it when he made the final move, checkmating black? Or was it when he made that queen sacrifice?

Black had no choice really, he had to take the queen.
I
It is the same way with Jesus. Jesus had to die for the battle to be won. It was a crucial and strategic move. That is why Jesus said, ''It is accomplished!!''

He did not say, ''it will be accomplished.'' He said IT IS!!

And that is why he said, ''If I be lifted up from the earth I will draw all men unto me.''

Not everyone will be saved, some will, some won't. Not everyone will repent. Some will some won't. But the question is, will you?

It is a choice you must make.

May Jesus bless you.

---
Ram, God does know our plans before we are born , read Psalms 139. But God gives US free will to use our plans within His grand plan that one day through all the prophecies that have spot-on already come true, proving scripture, through prophecies presently coming true and through prophecies yet to be fulfilled, including the greatest one to come, Jesus' coming again.

Jeremiah 29:11 is a well known verse too that speaks of God's omniscience of our plans, but that DOES NOT MEAN that our actions/free will choices fail to alter those plans-good or bad. God does not just move us like chess pieces on a board in a computer vs computer game that the outcomevof every single move is known down to checkmate.
---
God does know how the OWS movement will ultimately turn out-GOOD, because God is good and He will, like 911, make it work out for His glory. But people can make free will choices in the content of the book, so to speak, possibly even... changing the ending.

The Lord leads, people can choose to follow or not.

 

[Ramon]

---
Ram, God does know our plans before we are born , read Psalms 139. But God gives US free will to use our plans within His grand plan that one day through all the prophecies that have spot-on already come true, proving scripture, through prophecies presently coming true and through prophecies yet to be fulfilled, including the greatest one to come, Jesus' coming again.

Jeremiah 29:11 is a well known verse too that speaks of God's omniscience of our plans, but that DOES NOT MEAN that our actions/free will choices fail to alter those plans-good or bad. God does not just move us like chess pieces on a board in a computer vs computer game that the outcomevof every single move is known down to checkmate.

God said that he knows the plans he has for you. Of course people choose their own plans.

I know that this is an uncommon thing to hear about, but it is true. Paul also spoke of this when he said that the potter has the clay in his hands. And he went on to say that some will say, ''then why does God find fault?''

As I did say, it IS a choice one must make, to choose life or choose death.

God has already won. He saw the winning move in the beginning. He saw his son die on the cross in the beginning. He saw him resurrected to life in the beginning. Although, we had not seen it.

God is the beginning and the end, and he knows who are his own, and he knew them from the beginning. He is waiting simply for the manifestation of the sons of God.

A wise man once said that what already has been will be, and what will be has already been. He spoke this by the Spirit, understanding the wisdom of God, which is to fear God and keep his commandments. Everything else is vanity.

We cannot altar his plans, although many have tried to no avail. Satan tries, and will try, but his head was already crushed in the garden. From the garden to the garden. From Adam to Jesus Christ, it was accomplished already in Jesus.

Yet, you have a choice. Choose life!

May Jesus bless you.

 

[Jullianna]

LUKE 10

25 On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. “Teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?”
26 “What is written in the Law?” he replied. “How do you read it?”
27 He answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’; and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’”
28 “You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied. “Do this and you will live.”
29 But he wanted to justify himself, so he asked Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?”
30 In reply Jesus said: “A man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho, when he was attacked by robbers. They stripped him of his clothes, beat him and went away, leaving him half dead. 31 A priest happened to be going down the same road, and when he saw the man, he passed by on the other side. 32 So too, a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side. 33 But a Samaritan, as he traveled, came where the man was; and when he saw him, he took pity on him. 34 He went to him and bandaged his wounds, pouring on oil and wine. Then he put the man on his own donkey, brought him to an inn and took care of him. 35 The next day he took out two denarii and gave them to the innkeeper. ‘Look after him,’ he said, ‘and when I return, I will reimburse you for any extra expense you may have.’
36 “Which of these three do you think was a neighbor to the man who fell into the hands of robbers?”
37 The expert in the law replied, “The one who had mercy on him.”
Jesus told him, “Go and do likewise.”


Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees. A little leaven affects the whole loaf.

 

[tribesman]

Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees. A little leaven affects the whole loaf.

And what is the leaven of the pharisees? Hypocrisy.

Luke12

[1] ...Beware ye of the leaven of the Pharisees, which is hypocrisy.

 

[Jullianna]

And what is the leaven of the pharisees? Hypocrisy.

Amen, Sir

 

[Ramon]

An attachment to an earlier post of mine on the chess pieces.

The response is that God does not move us around like chess pieces. But that is sort of like the pieces saying to the player that they don't need his help to win the game, when they could not even move if it were not for the hand of the player.

People of God are moved by God, by his Holy Spirit. They do what he commands. They are in this battle, which is the Lords. Jesus Christ was moved by the Spirit of God.

If we see the two sides of the table we see this:

There are those that are moved by God

And there are those who are moved by Satan

Anyone that is not moved by God is moved by Satan. Even idle people are moved by Satan, to not move.

I love this game of chess though. There are Major Pieces, and there are pawns, and there is the king. The major pieces are much like those who go out to prepare the ground for the victory. Like the prophets, or the apostles. They end up being the main ones who end up dying for the victory. These pieces almost always end up being sacrificed for an advantage.

But the most powerful piece is the queen in this game. If she is sacrificed, that means a big loss to some. But in this game, it meant a great victory. This victory, I equate with the victory Jesus won on the cross.

He won it at the sacrifice, not at the end of the game. Right now, we are just waiting for it to play out, but in the end, it will be clear who the victor is. JESUS CHRIST! Because he did defeat death on that cross, and he rose from the dead to prove the righteousness of God.

I love tribesman's post:

Psalm 3:3 - But Thou, O Lord, art a shield around me. You're my glory and the lifter of my head

Yes, my Head was lifted up to draw all men to Himself.

May Jesus bless you.

 

[Ramon]

This will be my last post on this thread, but I have to write this while it is fresh.

Concerning that chess game, what will people remember most about it? Will they remember the victory, or will they remember the queen sacrifice that won the victory?

THAT SACRIFICE!!

And that is the gospel we preach. That is what we protest. The victory of the sacrifice. I boast in the victory of the sacrifice. Because THAT is what won it for us.

The victory was on the cross, and then he rose from the dead taking captivity captive, and he gave gifts to men.

Yes, when we look back or even forward, we look to that sacrifice. That was the most important move ever. If it had not been for that, we would all be lost in our sins.

AMEN!! We would loose!

May Jesus bless you.

 

[ada]

This will be my last post on this thread, but I have to write this while it is fresh.

Concerning that chess game, what will people remember most about it? Will they remember the victory, or will they remember the queen sacrifice that won the victory?

THAT SACRIFICE!!

And that is the gospel we preach. That is what we protest. The victory of the sacrifice. I boast in the victory of the sacrifice. Because THAT is what won it for us.

The victory was on the cross, and then he rose from the dead taking captivity captive, and he gave gifts to men.

Yes, when we look back or even forward, we look to that sacrifice. That was the most important move ever. If it had not been for that, we would all be lost in our sins.

AMEN!! We would loose!

May Jesus bless you.

Please do confuse the people with you own interpretations!
As for me you put to much of yourself in your message without any reference.
Please stay on scripture or give some kind of references what you mean.
And please explain what you mean with the queen and sacrifice...?
Thank you!°
If you have the the same complain on me i will be thankful that you remind me.

 

[Jullianna]

I suppose there are times when it becomes unkind to point out the obvious, but it sure explains a lot, huh? Bless his heart...

 

[GreenNnice]

This will be my last post on this thread, but I have to write this while it is fresh.

Concerning that chess game, what will people remember most about it? Will they remember the victory, or will they remember the queen sacrifice that won the victory?

THAT SACRIFICE!!

And that is the gospel we preach. That is what we protest. The victory of the sacrifice. I boast in the victory of the sacrifice. Because THAT is what won it for us.

The victory was on the cross, and then he rose from the dead taking captivity captive, and he gave gifts to men.

Yes, when we look back or even forward, we look to that sacrifice. That was the most important move ever. If it had not been for that, we would all be lost in our sins.

AMEN!! We would loose!

May Jesus bless you.

---
Ram, yes, God does move us to act, but we still must move to act, and, when we move we must choose to move (follow) toward Him.
--
A lot of what you say, Ram, is brilliantly said but I don't think 'all' is said right. And, not so coincidentally, how I say our movement shouid go is the part that is small in words but great in meaning, for in this mustard seed meaning, so to speak, is seen that human actions are only in vain IF they are not in step with letting the Lord lead their life, hence, following Him.

I know both of us are following God, Ram, and, debate of free will of man or God, even salvation, is much debated.

You would be a great peace for OWS, i think.

 

[Ramon]

---
Ram, yes, God does move us to act, but we still must move to act, and, when we move we must choose to move (follow) toward Him.
--
A lot of what you say, Ram, is brilliantly said but I don't think 'all' is said right. And, not so coincidentally, how I say our movement shouid go is the part that is small in words but great in meaning, for in this mustard seed meaning, so to speak, is seen that human actions are only in vain IF they are not in step with letting the Lord lead their life, hence, following Him.

I know both of us are following God, Ram, and, debate of free will of man or God, even salvation, is much debated.

You would be a great peace for OWS, i think.

I did say I would not post here again, but I will retract that.

How much better would it be if we sought to understand one another, with humility and the peace of God, without bitterness or strife. Then we would let the Holy Spirit work, and his glory would be displayed. That is why I am answering you.

Amen GreenNice.

If I was being a little too confusing, I will try to be a little less confusing.

I cannot say it is an interpretation what I have said, it isn't. It is indeed the truth, but whether you understand this or not, that is up to God to reveal it to whoever can receive it.

This should in no way cause strife. Not at all. So maybe I can explain it, though I would rather leave it at that. But this is for anyone who might be confused at what I mean, if they TRULY want to know what I mean.

Yes, as you say, it is often debated concerning the free will of man and God. One thing that cannot be debated however is salvation. I mean, you can debate it with men all day long, but int he end, Jesus has the final words. And he has spoken what he will speak about salvation.

There are some things we cannot interpret. Two things we cannot interpret is what is good and what is bad. God is the only one who can judge that. Now, God has judged that, and he has given his judgments to us. We read them in the ten commandments, in fact, we read them in the beginning when the Lord said to Adam, ''Do not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.''

But Jesus came with many judgments. And his judgments are good.

Maybe I have offended some people because I spoke of something he has shown me, that others have not been shown. But why did I? Because I see the end of that way. So it was to prevent people from going that way, and going THE WAY, Jesus Christ.

That road isn't just broad for nothing. And that other way is not just narrow for nothing.

May Jesus bless you.

 

[GreenNnice]

I did say I would not post here again, but I will retract that.

How much better would it be if we sought to understand one another, with humility and the peace of God, without bitterness or strife. Then we would let the Holy Spirit work, and his glory would be displayed. That is why I am answering you.

Amen GreenNice.

If I was being a little too confusing, I will try to be a little less confusing.

I cannot say it is an interpretation what I have said, it isn't. It is indeed the truth, but whether you understand this or not, that is up to God to reveal it to whoever can receive it.

This should in no way cause strife. Not at all. So maybe I can explain it, though I would rather leave it at that. But this is for anyone who might be confused at what I mean, if they TRULY want to know what I mean.

Yes, as you say, it is often debated concerning the free will of man and God. One thing that cannot be debated however is salvation. I mean, you can debate it with men all day long, but int he end, Jesus has the final words. And he has spoken what he will speak about salvation.

There are some things we cannot interpret. Two things we cannot interpret is what is good and what is bad. God is the only one who can judge that. Now, God has judged that, and he has given his judgments to us. We read them in the ten commandments, in fact, we read them in the beginning when the Lord said to Adam, ''Do not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.''

But Jesus came with many judgments. And his judgments are good.

Maybe I have offended some people because I spoke of something he has shown me, that others have not been shown. But why did I? Because I see the end of that way. So it was to prevent people from going that way, and going THE WAY, Jesus Christ.

That road isn't just broad for nothing. And that other way is not just narrow for nothing.

May Jesus bless you.

----
Amen, Ram, the Lord leads, your words are beautifully put, I think we agree on most points and that's good for communication among men of God, which I believe you are , and, believing God is the Saviour of your world here and now and to come is all that, ultimately, matters.

I think OWS needs the love of God and hope at OWS, the world is something God says we are to act in while being , per scripture, not of this world (hey, that sounds like a Petra song).
So....I just , through this entire thread have been wanting to find out what people would do IF God called them to OWS, and, at first, you would've needed to plane ride to New York, but I bet now, chances are, IF you are in the USA, or, London, Sydney, Paris, Rome, and, other world location OWS movements, you don't have to go very far to answer that worldly call. Remember, too, Jesus' great words that He spoke during a time to a gathering...'For I did not come to call the righteous but sinners to repentance.' (Matt. 9:13)
And, another great verse that calls us to to into the world to fulfill God's plan for us...'Do not think that I came to bring peace on Earth (and tidings of great joy, as Charlie Brown would be that one ) , I did not come to bring peace but a sword.'

Now, I am not suggesting that God says to bring violence to OWS. IN fact, just the opposite

Peace to you, my good c.c. chat friend, RAM, many blessings over to you for adamantly writing others the good words of Christ.

Notes: You must see 'A Charlie Brown Christmas.' In it, at the end, Charlie Brown, I think (maybe it's Linus) tells the story of Baby Jesus. also, I was a chess champion at my school's college, the 'queen sacrifice, otherwise known I believe as 'Queen's Gambit' most popularly but I've not played chess in years. Great game. Awesome dream !

 

[Ramon]

----
Amen, Ram, the Lord leads, your words are beautifully put, I think we agree on most points and that's good for communication among men of God, which I believe you are , and, believing God is the Saviour of your world here and now and to come is all that, ultimately, matters.

I think OWS needs the love of God and hope at OWS, the world is something God says we are to act in while being , per scripture, not of this world (hey, that sounds like a Petra song).
So....I just , through this entire thread have been wanting to find out what people would do IF God called them to OWS, and, at first, you would've needed to plane ride to New York, but I bet now, chances are, IF you are in the USA, or, London, Sydney, Paris, Rome, and, other world location OWS movements, you don't have to go very far to answer that worldly call. Remember, too, Jesus' great words that He spoke during a time to a gathering...'For I did not come to call the righteous but sinners to repentance.' (Matt. 9:13)
And, another great verse that calls us to to into the world to fulfill God's plan for us...'Do not think that I came to bring peace on Earth (and tidings of great joy, as Charlie Brown would be that one ) , I did come to bring peace but a sword.'

Now, I am not suggesting that God says to bring violence to OWS. IN fact, just the opposite

Peace to you, my good c.c. chat friend, RAM, many blessings over to you for adamantly writing others the good words of Christ.

Notes: You must see 'A Charlie Brown Christmas.' In it, at the end, Charlie Brown, I think (maybe it's Linus) tells the story of Baby Jesus. also, I was a chess champion at my school's college, the 'queen sacrifice, otherwise known I believe as 'Queen's Gambit' most popularly but I've not played chess in years. Great game. Awesome dream !

Well isn't that just amazing. lol.

Chess champion huh? Maybe you can give me a few pointers, I can't beat this computer on my ipod on the halfway setting. lol.

May Jesus bless you.