RAPTURE, PRE OR POST?

[Grandpa]

Where have you people found this teaching, is it from that book you quoted in another post?

Who cares if you are sick of it, Almighty Yahweh is long suffering and he does things his way not yours or mine.

When i read revelation, i see the end result of mans wicked ways, and how salvation is through Yeshua son Almighty Yahweh God.

He is within you yes in spirit, but he also will return for all those with the spirit within them.....

How these people twist scripture to lead people away is sickening..

I've never read a book, apart from the bible, that says the things I have been saying.

Almighty Yahweh is long suffering and he does things his way not yours or mine. Does what I am describing sound like my way? How does it make any sense? How can we be walking around with flesh bodies and yet have some other body somewhere else?

It doesn't make any sense does it? Absolutely can't get your mind around it. Why would I try to describe something that no one can understand and no one will agree with and claim it as "my way".

If I wanted to convince you of something you could understand I would go with pre-trib or post-trib. That's something you could really understand.

Let me ask just one question. Those others were just rhetorical... How were the apostles able to describe the process of the resurrection? They were still alive. They spoke with Authority.

 

[2knowhim]

Maybe we are talking about a different person?

I am of Almighty Yahweh God and Yeshua is my saviour.
And I am born of the Holy spirit, and he will return.

Maybe that is where we differ...

Free will must be observed so, peace be with you and may your find the truth.

Again, How free is your will, if we were born dead in sins and trespasses, you were a salve to sin.

You didn't choose that, it was what it was, but when we are born again how free are you?

Now we are slaves to Righteousness, are we not?

If............there is any such thing as free will, and I say IF..........Then that can only be IN HIM.


Sin lead me before, now Righteousness leads me.

 

[peacefulbeliever]

I've never read a book, apart from the bible, that says the things I have been saying.

Almighty Yahweh is long suffering and he does things his way not yours or mine. Does what I am describing sound like my way? How does it make any sense? How can we be walking around with flesh bodies and yet have some other body somewhere else?

It doesn't make any sense does it? Absolutely can't get your mind around it. Why would I try to describe something that no one can understand and no one will agree with and claim it as "my way".

If I wanted to convince you of something you could understand I would go with pre-trib or post-trib. That's something you could really understand.

Let me ask just one question. Those others were just rhetorical... How were the apostles able to describe the process of the resurrection? They were still alive. They spoke with Authority.

I am not understanding any this at all so bear with me and let me ask a couple of questions:

If the tribulation and resurrection have past - Where is the new heaven and new earth wherein dwelleth righteousness? (2 Peter 2:13)

If the tribulation and resurrection have past - When shall God wipe away all tears? Why is there still death, sorrow, crying, and pain when these things should be passed away? (Rev. 21:4)

The apostles were able to describe these things because they wrote as God inspired them.

In Christ. . . . .

 

[enochson]

I am not understanding any this at all so bear with me and let me ask a couple of questions:

If the tribulation and resurrection have past - Where is the new heaven and new earth wherein dwelleth righteousness? (2 Peter 2:13)

If the tribulation and resurrection have past - When shall God wipe away all tears? Why is there still death, sorrow, crying, and pain when these things should be passed away? (Rev. 21:4)

The apostles were able to describe these things because they wrote as God inspired them.

In Christ. . . . .

Heb. 12 ;22 say's "You have come" you can't come to something that hasn't come. It's a matter of sight which is only by faith which is a gift from god to see and not of man Heb. 12;1-2 heb. 11 has nothing to do with the new creation and is a fasle teching of the events that have taken place. see Heb. 11;40 which is christ faith.

 

[enochson]

Again, How free is your will, if we were born dead in sins and trespasses, you were a salve to sin.

You didn't choose that, it was what it was, but when we are born again how free are you?

Now we are slaves to Righteousness, are we not?

If............there is any such thing as free will, and I say IF..........Then that can only be IN HIM.


Sin lead me before, now Righteousness leads me.

Amen I bow down and give thanks to the most High God.

 

[Grandpa]

I am not understanding any this at all so bear with me and let me ask a couple of questions:

If the tribulation and resurrection have past - Where is the new heaven and new earth wherein dwelleth righteousness? (2 Peter 2:13)

If the tribulation and resurrection have past - When shall God wipe away all tears? Why is there still death, sorrow, crying, and pain when these things should be passed away? (Rev. 21:4)

The apostles were able to describe these things because they wrote as God inspired them.

In Christ. . . . .

The tribulation and resurrection have not passed.

They are right now. In your midst.

The apostles witnessed and experienced it, probably to a greater degree than anyone since.

 

[peterT]

Matthew 24:37-39
37But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

38For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, 39And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

.

It’s funny how you use the story of Noah from Matt24.

Because the whole chapter is about the tribulation and immediately after the tribulation.

It’s a exampol that jesus used to strengthen his story about his coming to gather together his elect from the four winds, Immediately after the tribulation.

The story goes like this.

Immediately after the tribulation, then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven, And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds. And it will be like the days of Noah.

God kept Noah through the fool NOT from the food.

The story of Noah in Matt24 is a post-trib example, from a post-tribulation story that Jesus told himself.

And yet somehow you take that story of Noah and turn it into a pre-trib rapture.

And even though I just exposed your doctrine as twisted, you will continue to use it.

And why. Because the devil has a strong hold over you, with the spirit of delusion.


Matt24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Matt24:37 But as the days of Noe [were], so shall also the coming of the Son of man be

 

[shroom2]

The tribulation and resurrection have not passed.

They are right now. In your midst.

The apostles witnessed and experienced it, probably to a greater degree than anyone since.

Nope.

The tribulation and resurrections are still future.

 

[2knowhim]

PeterT,

How do you explain these vs.?


Mat 23:36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.


Mat 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

 

[peterT]

To lay your life down you can't count your life dear to yourself and that includes any contrived intellectual self knowledge of the scriptures you might have that puffs up through a spirit of pride. To lay your life down in the love of God you have to leave it in that humble position of being laid down and wait for God to raise it up so that the flesh is not involved and God gets the glory. Self knowledge is a contrived attempt to get understanding and reveal the knowledge of God that can only be acquired in Christ through the humility of faith.

The plan and will of God for the church is contained in the mystery of Christ and the church. The Spirit reveals the word and knowledge of that mystery to the heart of the believer that has been hid in God. When we were placed in Christ at salvation we were hid with Christ in God, and in that hiding place we receive the things of God that pertain to Christ and the church. Now if you want the verses for this I can give them to you but they will just go right over your head because they must be spiritually discerned through grace and knowledge of Christ and not through the self-knowledge of contrived intellectualism that has nothing to do with the mind of Christ.

What are you saying? that you would not give your life instead of your own family?

That you wouldn’t give your life to save some of your brethren.

That you wouldn’t give your life if your children lives depended on it.

And that you’re not interested in the example of Jesus, and how he laid down his life for us.

John10:13 The hireling fleeth, because he is an hireling, and careth not for the sheep.

And you talk about being puffs up through a spirit of pride.

 

[Grandpa]

It’s funny how you use the story of Noah from Matt24.

Because the whole chapter is about the tribulation and immediately after the tribulation.

It’s a exampol that jesus used to strengthen his story about his coming to gather together his elect from the four winds, Immediately after the tribulation.

The story goes like this.

Immediately after the tribulation, then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven, And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds. And it will be like the days of Noah.

God kept Noah through the fool NOT from the food.

The story of Noah in Matt24 is a post-trib example, from a post-tribulation story that Jesus told himself.

And yet somehow you take that story of Noah and turn it into a pre-trib rapture.

And even though I just exposed your doctrine as twisted, you will continue to use it.

And why. Because the devil has a strong hold over you, with the spirit of delusion.


Matt24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Matt24:37 But as the days of Noe [were], so shall also the coming of the Son of man be

You can say pre-trib or post-trib and use whatever other key words you want. They will cause other people with just as little understanding as you to start arguing amongst yourselves.

You have 18 pages proving how wise you are in your own eyes.

This isn't head knowledge or theory for me. I've already seen what happens. I've seen the explanation that the bible uses. I'm just trying to explain it the same way the Lord Jesus did and the Apostles did. If you don't understand or don't agree with it, what does that mean? It doesn't mean I am wrong, it means you have a lack of understanding. Pray to the Lord for Wisdom and Knowledge.

 

[2knowhim]

It’s funny how you use the story of Noah from Matt24.

Because the whole chapter is about the tribulation and immediately after the tribulation.(of those days)

It’s a exampol that jesus used to strengthen his story about his coming to gather together his elect from the four winds, Immediately after the tribulation.(of those days)

The story goes like this.

Immediately after the tribulation,(of those days) then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven, And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds. And it will be like the days of Noah.

God kept Noah through the fool NOT from the food.

The story of Noah in Matt24 is a post-trib example, from a post-tribulation story that Jesus told himself.

And yet somehow you take that story of Noah and turn it into a pre-trib rapture.

And even though I just exposed your doctrine as twisted, you will continue to use it.

And why. Because the devil has a strong hold over you, with the spirit of delusion.


Matt24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Matt24:37 But as the days of Noe [were], so shall also the coming of the Son of man be

PeterT,

How do you explain these vs.?


Mat 23:36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.


Mat 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

 

[peacefulbeliever]

Nope.

The tribulation and resurrections are still future.

I agree with you but I just wanted to see where they got this - I don't think people understand that there are different administrations and all administrations are not applicable to the church, the body of Christ.

 

[Grandpa]

I agree with you but I just wanted to see where they got this - I don't think people understand that there are different administrations and all administrations are not applicable to the church, the body of Christ.

Bust God out of the tiny box you are putting Him in.

He's really much bigger than that.

I don't think people understand that God doesn't play by our rules.

 

[2knowhim]

I just want to know why shroom, or Peter won't answer my posts.

Why won't they Grandpa, why?


Blessings

 

[peterT]

You can say pre-trib or post-trib and use whatever other key words you want. They will cause other people with just as little understanding as you to start arguing amongst yourselves.

Matt 24 is a tribulation and post tribulation chapter NOT a pre-tribulation chapter, know were dose it talk about a pre-tribulation coming.

And that also shows the devil has a strong hold over you, with the spirit of delusion.

They will cause other people with just as little understanding as you to start arguing amongst yourselves.

What are you doing here?
Are you arguing amongst yourselves?. For me this is the spirit of debate, debating Gods word, rooting out and pulling down and destroying false doctrine, then build and to plant.. but you might into arguing amongst yourselves?.

Jeremiah 1;10 See, I have this day set thee over the nations and over the kingdoms, to root out, and to pull down, and to destroy, and to throw down, to build, and to plant.

Sorry I thought it was a war in the spirit, but you can call it arguing if you like.

.You have 18 pages proving how wise you are in your own eyes.

What 18 pages, what are you talking about?

.I've already seen what happens.

No you haven’t seen what happens, your just making it up, the pre-trib is not in the bible so how could you have seen it already

 

[peterT]

PeterT,

How do you explain these vs.?


Mat 23:36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.


Mat 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.

Jesus is prophesying Like the rest of the chapter.

I just want to know why shroom, or Peter won't answer my posts.

Why won't they Grandpa, why?


Blessings

There you go, question answered

 

[Grandpa]

Matt 24 is a tribulation and post tribulation chapter NOT a pre-tribulation chapter, know were dose it talk about a pre-tribulation coming.

And that also shows the devil has a strong hold over you, with the spirit of delusion.





What are you doing here?
Are you arguing amongst yourselves?. For me this is the spirit of debate, debating Gods word, rooting out and pulling down and destroying false doctrine, then build and to plant.. but you might into arguing amongst yourselves?.

Jeremiah 1;10 See, I have this day set thee over the nations and over the kingdoms, to root out, and to pull down, and to destroy, and to throw down, to build, and to plant.

Sorry I thought it was a war in the spirit, but you can call it arguing if you like.

[quote=Grandpa;644456].

You have 18 pages proving how wise you are in your own eyes.

What 18 pages, what are you talking about?



No you haven’t seen what happens, your just making it up, the pre-trib is not in the bible so how could you have seen it already[/quote]

Who has said anything about pre-trib other than you? Like I've already said that is just silly key words that you use amongst yourselves to prove to each other how wise you are in your own eyes.

I am talking about what is real. Right Now.

 

[enochson]

70 ad done deal

 

[2knowhim]

70 ad done deal

Yes, Amen , Amen