Pre-Trib Rapture=Mark of the beast (for some), Naiveness=Sleep and unpreparedness

[moment_of_faith]

I think people get confused. The name "tribulation period" concerning the 7 years was given by man. The scriptural names given are daniels 70th week, The time of jacobs trouble. The time of Gods testing etc etc.

eternally-gratefull --
Now you may not believe like me and I think that is what he is saying, but I believe the rider on the red horse doesn't go out until 3 1/2 years into the 7 years and you are correct it is the last 7 years that was left on the clock from Daniels 7 X 70 -- 7 weeks or 49 years to rebuild the city - 62 weeks or 434 years until Jesus was crucified for a total of 69 weeks or 483 years leaving 1 week / 7 years still left on the clock. These 7 years are known as Jacob Trouble / Tribulation Period
Now I don't believe the 2nd seal the rider on the red horse goes out until 3 1/2 years in for 2 reasons. First you can't have peace " The Rider in the White Horse " the False Christ " Anti- Christ " and the rider on the red horse to take peace from earth at the same time. So what starts the 2nd half of the tribulation period? The last 3 1/2 year is when the rider on the red horse goes out to take PEACE that the anti-christ had established.

 

[Tommy4Christ]

Look no further than what is going on in the Church system today,most think thier pastors are preaching truth, when they are dispensing the mark, by telling the masses they can get saved IN thier vile sins, and make it into heaven! The deception is here and now, This article has opened my eyes and mind to other possibilities as to the mark of the beast, the condition most churches are in today, who are preaching the lie!​

Compliments standingthegap.org​

The Mark of the Beast!​

He causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their foreheads,and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. Rev13:16-17
What you need to understand clearly is that the Present day church System is already under the control of the Beast. But the Beast is NOT some Worldly dictator as everyone is suspecting. Actually the Beast John was shown in Rev13 is the Church System gone fully apostate. It’s not merely the Catholic System as many have identified over the years, but the ENTIRE professing Christian religious establishment, all preaching the Message of the Beast!

John was also shown an IMAGE created by the Beast that lives and breaths and causes everyone (in the System) to bow down to it in Worship and ‘Receive’ a Mark on the Right hand or Forehead. This IMAGE has the appearance of a Lamb but speaks the language of the Dragon through an Army of false teachers convinced that the IMAGE they have created is really Jesus Christ! This False Jesus is the focal point of Present day professing Christianity. What He represents to them is the Fallacy of Reformed theology.

According to this IMAGE the people can be ‘Saved in their sins’, Receive a Magic Moral Transfer of Christ’s Righteousness and Obedience, have their sins forgiven in advance and be made eternally secure in their vile and sinful condition. As the Rev13 passage says: ‘He CAUSES them to Receive a mark’, this Army of False teachers are dispensing this Mark as a GIFT on all who will receive it! The expression John is using is a Metaphor, (look it up!) Meaning: a figure of speech in which a term or phrase is applied to something to which it is not literally applicable in order to suggest a resemblance, as in “A mighty fortress is our God.”

The common Message today is ‘Receive Jesus as your personal Savior’ by repeating a series of words repeated after the Pastor or someone supposedly leading you to the Lord. But what they are actually receiving is the IMAGE of Jesus created by the Dragon who has appeared to professing Christianity as the LAMB! (or a wolf in sheep’s clothing, Matt7:15) This is the Strong Delusion spoken of in 2Thess2:10.
How does the Mark of the Beast play into this? That’s the part FEW (if any) can understand.

The Mark is dispensed either on the Forehead or Right hand and no one is forced to take it. They freely receive it as a gift form the great Beast Image they bow down to. Everyone is expecting some kind of Physical Mark in the form of modern technology. (a chip or implant of some sort) So everyone is looking in the WRONG place for this to come to pass. The Real Mark is ‘Spiritual’ in nature and consists of a false Gospel Message that you can be ‘saved in your sins’.

Where is the Mark Dispensed?
On the ‘Forehead’ or ‘Right Hand’ To Understand this notes the following Translation:
Forehead (used only in the Book of Revelation) Is two Greek Words:
Meta: Meaning, ‘With’
Ops: Meaning, ‘An Eye’ “Literally: ‘With an Eye.’ Or ‘Within the Eye of the Mind!’
Jesus said in Matt5:27-30:
You have heard that it was said to those of old‘You shall not commit adultery.But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.If your right eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.
The extreme importance of Crucifying the flesh with its passions and desires is expressed throughout Scripture. It is the VERY essence of real Repentance. Without it NO ONE can be truly Saved. The body of sin MUST be done away with in repentance, die with Christ, once and for all to the old man and be raised to the Newness of life in the Spirit. (Rom6:4-6, Gal5:24)

However the IMAGE that has taken full control of professing Christianity has removed this essential step from the Salvation process and replaced with the MARK. What is the Mark? Simply: the ‘evil eye’ of the flesh, fixed on the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes and the pride of life! (1John2:15-17) Bowing to the IMAGE is the refusal to Cut off the evil eye or hand and cast it from you. Instead you retain the evil within and call it your ‘sin nature’.
The lamp of the body is the eye. If therefore your eye is good, your whole body will be full of light.But if your eye is bad, your whole body will be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in you is darkness, how great is that darkness! Matt6:22-23
Again Christ points to this Mark of the flesh: “What comes out of a man that defiles a man. For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness. All these evil things come from within and defile a man.” Mk7:20-23

Sin enters into the Mind through the Eyes (2Pet2:14) You take possession of it when the desire (lust) united with the will. (James1:14-16, you latch on to it and perform the act!) This is why the Double-minded cannot enter into the Kingdom. (Js1:8) But under the IMAGE this has been reversed! The Mark, (your own evil eye of the flesh) is retained and you ‘receive’ it as a Gift of eternal life. Herein is how the professing Church world is deceived into exchanging the Truth of God for a lie. (Rom1:25)

The Name written on the Forehead of the Saints is the revived spirit that takes place through repentance and faith proven by deeds. (Acts3:19) The Mind is fixed on things above not on things of the earth. (Col3:1-3) It is the SINGLE Eye Jesus spoke of in Matt6:22, grounded in a good and honest heart.
You have to understand that the Book of Revelation (John’s vision) is written to the Church, not the world at large. Out of the Seven Churches addressed in Chapters 2-3, only two remained faithful and did not deny His Name. Therefore John’s vision has everything to do with the Corruption of the Gospel Message under an apostate System gone haywire.

I contend that these Churches addressed by the Spirit represent the condition of professing Christianity down through the ages. Although every generation, including the early Saints, thought the time was near and that they were experiencing the final days before Christ’s return. But that’s part of the overall deception to keep the mind in a state of confusion concerning these things. Such is the nature of the so-called Rapture theory. First developed by a Dispensational teacher named John Nelson Darby in the early 1800’s, who supposedly received a vision from a self-proclaimed Prophetess named Margaret McDonald in Glasgow. She claimed to had received a vision from God about a ‘secret’ Rapture of the church that was about to take place so that they would escape the Great Tribulation coming on the earth.

The teaching spread quickly among the early Charismatic’s and at a Prophecy Conference in Dublin Ireland in 1830, Darby officially introduced the Doctrine of Dispensationalism. His contention was that the Return of Christ would happen in two stages separated by a Seven year Tribulation period. During this time the Anti-Christ would appear on the scene, deceive the entire world and unite the political and religious powers of the earth under a New World Order. God would then Judge this vile System by pouring out His Wrath in the form of the Trumpets, Seals and Bowls. Christ would return at the end, bind Satan in the bottomless pit and reign on the earth for a thousand years of Peace.

Since the formation of these fallacies many have cashed in on the hype by writing books and making further predictions and in modern times producing full length motion pictures. Nothing has come to pass of course because NONE of them has any Spiritual understanding into the Mark they have received under the false Gospel Message dispensed by the IMAGE. To this day the fallen apostate Church is waiting for some kind of tangible sign to indicate the Rapture is near and Christ is about to return. They debate timetables and cannot completely agree on a Pre-Mid or Post Trib Rapture or whether or not Jesus will actually reign on earth in physical form for a thousand years.

But they ALL Preach the Message of the Dragon! The Woman on the Scarlet Beast is the present day Church! Your own Pastors, teachers, Bible Scholars, Sunday school teachers and leaders are working the Mystery of lawlessness (2Thess2:7) directly under the noses of the people! And they are completely blind-sided by the subterfuge. No one suspects their own church to be part of a wide ranging satanic deception. A virtual Army of false teachers is actively dispensing the Mark to millions of unsuspecting souls who receive it with gladness and joy. Those who oppose this false message and will not receive it as truth are forbidden to ‘buy and sell’ inside the System. Therefore the real message of Repentance and faith proven by deeds, is heresy to the church.

I also contend that the Number of his name, Rev13:17, is the Number of Man himself! You can accept this or reject it, your choice. But the Word used in Rev13 for man does not indicate a ‘Certain man’ but is: .Anthropos or Mankind (both male and female) Unknown to the early Saints the Atomic Number of Carbon is 666, consisting of Six Neutrons, Six Electrons and Six Protons. Man is made out of Dust (Gen3:19) which is Carbon, the bases of organic life. So the Number of his name, in my opinion, is the Number of Man, who Receives his own Mark by refusal to Pluck out or Cut off the offending portions of his lustful desires.

Many of the early Saints wrongly identified the Latin System (Catholic Church) as the Beast because the number weight of their name according to their ancient numerical system equaled 666. The Latin Kingdom for example, spelled then as ‘lateinov’ translated from the Greek numerical system into this number. But it didn’t mean that the Pope or even Rome was the expected Anti-Christ! It meant that MANY names of man would also equal 666, because it is his number. Thus all the false predictions throughout history to this day trying to identify the Anit-Christ.

How can this apply to all of mankind when most of the World does not adhere to Christianity? The Passage in Rev13 is universal; ALL of mankind receives this Mark. Explain to me how Islam, Buddhism and Hinduism are going to receive this mark. It would NEVER happen they are mortal enemies of Christianity. But applying the Mark to Mankind solves the problem because anyone who is in bondage to the Lust of the eye and flesh already has it! The Bible teaches that you are a ‘Salve to who you obey, sin to death or obedience to Righteousness’ Rom6:16. The Mark can also be defined as a sign placed on the Branded Slave, showing ownership. Thus the Mark has much significance as to WHO a person is serving. (The flesh or the Spirit)

By necessity the professing Church System of today is making their so-called converts Servants of sin. They are told they are Born in sin, Can never stop sinning and are Saved in sin. The Deception is complete. The ‘evil eye’ remains and they all bow to the IMAGE.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Look no further than what is going on in the Church system today,most think thier pastors are preaching truth, when they are dispensing the mark, by telling the masses they can get saved IN thier vile sins, and make it into heaven! The deception is here and now, This article has opened my eyes and mind to other possibilities as to the mark of the beast, the condition most churches are in today, who are preaching the lie!​

Compliments standingthegap.org​

The Mark of the Beast!​

He causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their foreheads,and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. Rev13:16-17
What you need to understand clearly is that the Present day church System is already under the control of the Beast. But the Beast is NOT some Worldly dictator as everyone is suspecting. Actually the Beast John was shown in Rev13 is the Church System gone fully apostate. It’s not merely the Catholic System as many have identified over the years, but the ENTIRE professing Christian religious establishment, all preaching the Message of the Beast!

John was also shown an IMAGE created by the Beast that lives and breaths and causes everyone (in the System) to bow down to it in Worship and ‘Receive’ a Mark on the Right hand or Forehead. This IMAGE has the appearance of a Lamb but speaks the language of the Dragon through an Army of false teachers convinced that the IMAGE they have created is really Jesus Christ! This False Jesus is the focal point of Present day professing Christianity. What He represents to them is the Fallacy of Reformed theology.

According to this IMAGE the people can be ‘Saved in their sins’, Receive a Magic Moral Transfer of Christ’s Righteousness and Obedience, have their sins forgiven in advance and be made eternally secure in their vile and sinful condition. As the Rev13 passage says: ‘He CAUSES them to Receive a mark’, this Army of False teachers are dispensing this Mark as a GIFT on all who will receive it! The expression John is using is a Metaphor, (look it up!) Meaning: a figure of speech in which a term or phrase is applied to something to which it is not literally applicable in order to suggest a resemblance, as in “A mighty fortress is our God.”

The common Message today is ‘Receive Jesus as your personal Savior’ by repeating a series of words repeated after the Pastor or someone supposedly leading you to the Lord. But what they are actually receiving is the IMAGE of Jesus created by the Dragon who has appeared to professing Christianity as the LAMB! (or a wolf in sheep’s clothing, Matt7:15) This is the Strong Delusion spoken of in 2Thess2:10.
How does the Mark of the Beast play into this? That’s the part FEW (if any) can understand.

The Mark is dispensed either on the Forehead or Right hand and no one is forced to take it. They freely receive it as a gift form the great Beast Image they bow down to. Everyone is expecting some kind of Physical Mark in the form of modern technology. (a chip or implant of some sort) So everyone is looking in the WRONG place for this to come to pass. The Real Mark is ‘Spiritual’ in nature and consists of a false Gospel Message that you can be ‘saved in your sins’.

Where is the Mark Dispensed?
On the ‘Forehead’ or ‘Right Hand’ To Understand this notes the following Translation:
Forehead (used only in the Book of Revelation) Is two Greek Words:
Meta: Meaning, ‘With’
Ops: Meaning, ‘An Eye’ “Literally: ‘With an Eye.’ Or ‘Within the Eye of the Mind!’
Jesus said in Matt5:27-30:
You have heard that it was said to those of old‘You shall not commit adultery.But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.If your right eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.
The extreme importance of Crucifying the flesh with its passions and desires is expressed throughout Scripture. It is the VERY essence of real Repentance. Without it NO ONE can be truly Saved. The body of sin MUST be done away with in repentance, die with Christ, once and for all to the old man and be raised to the Newness of life in the Spirit. (Rom6:4-6, Gal5:24)

However the IMAGE that has taken full control of professing Christianity has removed this essential step from the Salvation process and replaced with the MARK. What is the Mark? Simply: the ‘evil eye’ of the flesh, fixed on the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes and the pride of life! (1John2:15-17) Bowing to the IMAGE is the refusal to Cut off the evil eye or hand and cast it from you. Instead you retain the evil within and call it your ‘sin nature’.
The lamp of the body is the eye. If therefore your eye is good, your whole body will be full of light.But if your eye is bad, your whole body will be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in you is darkness, how great is that darkness! Matt6:22-23
Again Christ points to this Mark of the flesh: “What comes out of a man that defiles a man. For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness. All these evil things come from within and defile a man.” Mk7:20-23

Sin enters into the Mind through the Eyes (2Pet2:14) You take possession of it when the desire (lust) united with the will. (James1:14-16, you latch on to it and perform the act!) This is why the Double-minded cannot enter into the Kingdom. (Js1:8) But under the IMAGE this has been reversed! The Mark, (your own evil eye of the flesh) is retained and you ‘receive’ it as a Gift of eternal life. Herein is how the professing Church world is deceived into exchanging the Truth of God for a lie. (Rom1:25)

The Name written on the Forehead of the Saints is the revived spirit that takes place through repentance and faith proven by deeds. (Acts3:19) The Mind is fixed on things above not on things of the earth. (Col3:1-3) It is the SINGLE Eye Jesus spoke of in Matt6:22, grounded in a good and honest heart.
You have to understand that the Book of Revelation (John’s vision) is written to the Church, not the world at large. Out of the Seven Churches addressed in Chapters 2-3, only two remained faithful and did not deny His Name. Therefore John’s vision has everything to do with the Corruption of the Gospel Message under an apostate System gone haywire.

I contend that these Churches addressed by the Spirit represent the condition of professing Christianity down through the ages. Although every generation, including the early Saints, thought the time was near and that they were experiencing the final days before Christ’s return. But that’s part of the overall deception to keep the mind in a state of confusion concerning these things. Such is the nature of the so-called Rapture theory. First developed by a Dispensational teacher named John Nelson Darby in the early 1800’s, who supposedly received a vision from a self-proclaimed Prophetess named Margaret McDonald in Glasgow. She claimed to had received a vision from God about a ‘secret’ Rapture of the church that was about to take place so that they would escape the Great Tribulation coming on the earth.

The teaching spread quickly among the early Charismatic’s and at a Prophecy Conference in Dublin Ireland in 1830, Darby officially introduced the Doctrine of Dispensationalism. His contention was that the Return of Christ would happen in two stages separated by a Seven year Tribulation period. During this time the Anti-Christ would appear on the scene, deceive the entire world and unite the political and religious powers of the earth under a New World Order. God would then Judge this vile System by pouring out His Wrath in the form of the Trumpets, Seals and Bowls. Christ would return at the end, bind Satan in the bottomless pit and reign on the earth for a thousand years of Peace.

Since the formation of these fallacies many have cashed in on the hype by writing books and making further predictions and in modern times producing full length motion pictures. Nothing has come to pass of course because NONE of them has any Spiritual understanding into the Mark they have received under the false Gospel Message dispensed by the IMAGE. To this day the fallen apostate Church is waiting for some kind of tangible sign to indicate the Rapture is near and Christ is about to return. They debate timetables and cannot completely agree on a Pre-Mid or Post Trib Rapture or whether or not Jesus will actually reign on earth in physical form for a thousand years.

But they ALL Preach the Message of the Dragon! The Woman on the Scarlet Beast is the present day Church! Your own Pastors, teachers, Bible Scholars, Sunday school teachers and leaders are working the Mystery of lawlessness (2Thess2:7) directly under the noses of the people! And they are completely blind-sided by the subterfuge. No one suspects their own church to be part of a wide ranging satanic deception. A virtual Army of false teachers is actively dispensing the Mark to millions of unsuspecting souls who receive it with gladness and joy. Those who oppose this false message and will not receive it as truth are forbidden to ‘buy and sell’ inside the System. Therefore the real message of Repentance and faith proven by deeds, is heresy to the church.

I also contend that the Number of his name, Rev13:17, is the Number of Man himself! You can accept this or reject it, your choice. But the Word used in Rev13 for man does not indicate a ‘Certain man’ but is: .Anthropos or Mankind (both male and female) Unknown to the early Saints the Atomic Number of Carbon is 666, consisting of Six Neutrons, Six Electrons and Six Protons. Man is made out of Dust (Gen3:19) which is Carbon, the bases of organic life. So the Number of his name, in my opinion, is the Number of Man, who Receives his own Mark by refusal to Pluck out or Cut off the offending portions of his lustful desires.

Many of the early Saints wrongly identified the Latin System (Catholic Church) as the Beast because the number weight of their name according to their ancient numerical system equaled 666. The Latin Kingdom for example, spelled then as ‘lateinov’ translated from the Greek numerical system into this number. But it didn’t mean that the Pope or even Rome was the expected Anti-Christ! It meant that MANY names of man would also equal 666, because it is his number. Thus all the false predictions throughout history to this day trying to identify the Anit-Christ.

How can this apply to all of mankind when most of the World does not adhere to Christianity? The Passage in Rev13 is universal; ALL of mankind receives this Mark. Explain to me how Islam, Buddhism and Hinduism are going to receive this mark. It would NEVER happen they are mortal enemies of Christianity. But applying the Mark to Mankind solves the problem because anyone who is in bondage to the Lust of the eye and flesh already has it! The Bible teaches that you are a ‘Salve to who you obey, sin to death or obedience to Righteousness’ Rom6:16. The Mark can also be defined as a sign placed on the Branded Slave, showing ownership. Thus the Mark has much significance as to WHO a person is serving. (The flesh or the Spirit)

By necessity the professing Church System of today is making their so-called converts Servants of sin. They are told they are Born in sin, Can never stop sinning and are Saved in sin. The Deception is complete. The ‘evil eye’ remains and they all bow to the IMAGE.

the man of sin is called the "son of perdition" Judas was called the "son of perdition" in both instances, satan entered a person and controlled him.

the beast is not the false church, the false church is babylon, or the harlot, the beast destroys the false church, so no one can go against him, because even the false church would understand he is not from God.

you need to study more my friend. and stop listening to people.

 

[peterT]

why do you continue to twist what I say? Instead of being closed minded why don;t you try to understand what it is I am saying.

Paul said that Isreal is loved because of the fathers. But hated because of the gospel. Are these "hated" children of Isreal a part of the body of Christ? If you think they are. you would be wrong. If you think I think they are. you would also be wrong. So either way, your wrong.

And why you refuse to see these natural children of Isreal are still beloved because of the fathers are loved Because God still has a plan for them, even thought they have been in unbelief since the day paul wrote those words even until today (hundreds of years and many generations) is beyond me.

Twisting your words I don’t think so.

What are there two fountains of living water, one for the Jewish christens and another for the non-Jewish Christians or do we are drink from the same spirit.

If James was only speaking to the Jewish Christians that would be respected of persons.

James2:9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.

And as for God finishing with the Jews I never said or thought such a thing, you are just making that up.

God has not finished with the Jews by far; hopefully he will keep putting the pressure on them until they repent.

I am not sure but I think as a people they will not repent until they see Jesus coming in the clouds and the dead rising at the last trumpet.

Rv11:13And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.

you are wrong about this, too mush segregation and respected of persons in your doctrine for me to listen to you on this

 

[onoma]

Does the THOUSAND YEAR MILLENNIUM take place after Jesus returns or before? Rev. 20:1-3. And what KINGDOM is Matt. 13:43 referring to.?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Twisting your words I don’t think so.

What are there two fountains of living water, one for the Jewish christens and another for the non-Jewish Christians or do we are drink from the same spirit.

Your still twisting my words. If you understand what it is I was saying, You would not continue to make comments like this. If you wish to continue twisting everything I say and try to make me look stupid, then why bother to continue?

If you look at my posts in this thread and the "other thread" you would see I am not claiming this at all. How can I when I make comments like "in this age there is no Jew or gentile, we are all one under Christ".

If James was only speaking to the Jewish Christians that would be respected of persons.

James2:9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.

1. Well lets see what James has to say on the matter,

James 1: 1:
1 James, a bond-servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, To the twelve tribes who are dispersed abroad: Greetings.


I think I will take james word over yours. he is writting to the natural children of Isreal (12 Tribes) who are scattered because of the sins of the nation.



2. where you may be right, he did not write JUST to jews. You are wrong as thinking this was directed to gentile believers, although we CAN and should learn from his writings.

And as for God finishing with the Jews I never said or thought such a thing, you are just making that up.

God has not finished with the Jews by far; hopefully he will keep putting the pressure on them until they repent.

I am not sure but I think as a people they will not repent until they see Jesus coming in the clouds and the dead rising at the last trumpet.

Rv11:13And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.

you are wrong about this, too mush segregation and respected of persons in your doctrine for me to listen to you on this

no segragation period/

there are two promises.

1. In YOU all the nations of the world will be blessed - in this promise, there is no gentile or isreal, we are all one under Christ through abraham and Gods covenant with him.

2. And I give you this land as an ETERNAL inheritance to you and your generations ofter you forever., he then reconfirmed this covenant with Issac, and again with Jacob. It was THIS covenant paul spoke of in romans 11 (hated for the gospel, but loved because of the fathers)

Paul segregated them. not me. God segregated them, not me. Your the one trying to make two different aspects of a covenant into one. Not me

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Does the THOUSAND YEAR MILLENNIUM take place after Jesus returns or before? Rev. 20:1-3. And what KINGDOM is Matt. 13:43 referring to.?

according to scripture it happens.

1. After great tribulation
2. After Gods wrath is poured out on evil during this tribulation
3. After satan and the false prophet are bound
4. After the return of Christ.

 

[AgapeSpiritEyes]

I pray that you will be richly blessed in what the Lord gave me in March 1986,
the Lord has revealed to me His awesome plan and I have waited on Him to tell me
to share it I feel it is very close to the time.
The Lord revealed to me two years that the vision is coming to reality in 2012-2013.


Here Is the Vision the Lord Gave Me 26 years ago:
The statement that the Catching up of The Church, The Body of Jesus Christ is
the next imminent event on God’s Calendar is lacking one Major event that will
precede the Catching up of the faithful Christians who are willing to give up
everything to work in The Latter Rain Ministry prophesied by the prophets
speaking God’s foreseeable further. This Latter Rain has been perceived in the
Holy Spirit but was not called and seen vividly yet in the church age
the prophets spoke God’s word describing it; some have thought it was for
the Jews in the Millennial Rule of the LITTERAL PRESENCE OF JESUS at
His walking and talking presence on this planet earth, but because of this
revelation and mentioning of the Latter Rain by James to the Church and the
revelation God gave to Paul in the Letter to the Ephesians Church a glorious church
without spot or wrinkle or any such thing! A complete church a perfect church perfected y Jesus.
This explains the parable of the reference to the 10 virgins and why 5 were foolish how escaping wrath is the Lord’s desire and plan for His bride. How he literally expressed His heart to rescue and provide a way of escape even for the Jews from Egypt he even excluded them from 7 plagues before they left.
We can be confident that the Latter Rain must come to The Church and by the revelation
of this Prophesy it’s foretelling by God to the Church by Jesus Christ is
the following revealed in detail vividly but not completely in the following:

 

[AgapeSpiritEyes]

When lying down to sleep, in this dream, and afterwards waking and recalling
the dream I realized completely I WILL live in the vision, so the dream is as follows:
(The Latter Rain Vision. The Vision the revelation given by the Lord Jesus Christ
and verified from the text written in the book of Joel 2:23-32/ Zach. 10:1
Hosea 6:1-3/10:12, James 5:1-8 and Ephesians 5:25-32 I Thess 5:1-11).
The first scene in the dream started by looking far in distance from
the earth, Very far from the earth in outer space looking down on the earth.
All the details of the earth were in detailed view of all the Nations, Continents,
Islands every race every kindred every language came into full view. From the
East and the West the North to the South all nations became visible and were
recognized it was so awesome the feeling was holy awe completely with holy
fear at the sight. It was overwhelming. This sight of the whole earth at this outer
space perspective. While looking up further in outer space lighting flashed and thunder
rumbled like a storm that was coming to the earth from outer space. The lighting
was brilliant and heavy thunder moving closer and closer to the earth.
The flashing lighting went toward the earth. Looking down upon the earth from
a view from the north was a huge great gigantic thing upon the earth. While
starring at this gigantic object, it was overwhelming because it was very big gigantic
even like a giant covering the whole earth, its feet were pointed toward the
North Pole its head reached the South Pole, its arms stretched reaching the
Pacific and Atlantic oceans, it was hard to understand this figure whether it
was a person or a mountain. While looking at this figure further it could clearly
be seen that it was a giant person. He was struggling for his very life just to stay
alive. His body was covered with filth, debris covered from head to his feet.
Sometimes this giant would move its body and make motions that it wanted to rise
and stand up on its feet. When it did move to try to stand it made small movements
and when it did thousands of little creatures ran away from this giant body,
they were underneath its body and they ran away from it. These little creatures
were grotesque, hideous looking. When the giant would start to rise they would
run away from underneath of the giant when the giant became calm these ugly
demons would start to sink back and go underneath the giant. Here is this giant
that stretches over the whole face of the earth and these little dirty filthy demons
creatures living underneath this enormous giant. All of a sudden while watching this
giant it lifted up its hand toward heaven. Then it lifted up its other hand toward
heaven. When it did these little filthy dirty demon spirit creatures by the thousands
fled away from this giant and again they went into the darkness and into night places
on the earth to where they could not be seen anymore. Slowly this great giant began
to rise upright and as it did its head and its hands went way up into the clouds.
As it was rising to its feet, it seemed to become cleansed from all the filth of those
filthy demon creatures that covered him. As it raised his hands into the heavens
as though it was surrendering to praising The Lord and as it raised its hands they both cleared the sky up into the clouds because the giant was so big enormous in size.
Then suddenly the clouds became silver, the most beautiful silver ever seen.
While watching these phenomena it was so great it was so awesome so stirring.
It was hard to understand the meaning. It was difficult to understand what it all meant.
While gazing on this vision the cry in my heart rose and I cried O LORD O LORD
WHAT IS THE MEANING OF ALL THIS? I MUST KNOW. All these events that came
about deep in outer space above the earth in the Spirit and He was surrounding
me in the presence of the FATHER GOD. Looking back on this scene these beautiful silver clouds suddenly poured drops of liquid light raining down upon the giant. Slowly the giant began to melt and to slowly sink as it where into the very earth itself. This giant was melting; its whole form seemed to have melted upon the whole face of the earth. This great rain began to come down stronger and stronger. Raining down drops of liquid light and it grew so strong it was flooding the earth itself. Watching this giant that seemed to melt suddenly it was being transformed from where it was being liquefied into millions of people and these people flowed over the whole face of the earth. Continuing to watch this sight People began to stand up all over the world, all nations and races, kindred and languages and now they were lifting their hands toward heaven and praising God and at that very moment a great thunder roared in the heavens. It was a deafening roar throughout the heavens. Looking throughout the atmospheres over earth and the outer space above the earth there appeared a figure. This figure was brilliant and glistened glimmering shimmering dazzling white. The most beautiful person you have ever seen in all your life. The face was not distinguished in details but the Holy Spirit gave me intuitive revelation that it was The Lord Jesus Christ. The Lord Jesus Christ Stretched forth his hand and as He did He stretched forth his hand to one person and another and then another and as He stretched forth His hand on the people and even upon nations of the world. They could be seen, the men and women that He pointed toward. When He pointed toward them this liquid light flowed from His hand into the person He pointed to and therefore a mighty anointing of God's Holy Spirit Fire came upon that person. Now those people began to go forth in the Name of Jesus Christ and to speak and change the people in the world. It seemed that time lapsed while watching it seemed to be days, weeks, and even months. Beholding the Lord Jesus He continued to stretch forth His hands and impart this Liquid Light to those who were surrounded in tragedies. Jesus would reach His hand toward them. Then to astonishing sorrow, Jesus stretched forth his hand to impart this Holy Spirit liquid light and fire to some but they refused to receive. They said, "No, No." We don't want
this, both men and women popular, famous ministers widely known in churches.
Some you would surely thought would want this rain, former and latter rain, anointing
in their lives. As Jesus reached forth His hands toward them, they bowed their heads
backed away and when they did, they went into a spiritual darkness and a spiritual
blackness. Such a bewildering scene watching all of this, Jesus Christ in all His glory
had anointed hundreds even thousands all over the world in all Nations. The clothing
of His love and power was upon these people they went out in The Name of The Lord
both men and women male and female young and old. As they left their jobs some had
been ditch diggers others woman who hand washed clothes some had been wealthy
and others had been poor. People who were bound with paralysis, sickness, disease,
blindness and deafness. Now when the Lord stretched forth His hand to give them
this Holy liquid fire anointing they were instantaneously healed and then they went throughout the whole world. This is the amazing spectacular miracle of all the vision of the end time Liquid Glory Latter Rain Anointing the liquid glory and fire of The Lord Jesus Christ. These people when they received this liquid light and fire they too would proceed to minister to others and when they did they too would stretch their hands as the Lord did and as they did the same liquid fire came out of their hands just as it did from The LORD'S hand.
They were stretching forth their hand and they would say “according to the word of
God be made whole" these people continued in this mighty ministry of the End Time.
Deep in my spirit a cry came up welling up out of my spirit to know what the meaning of all these events was. Then The Lord Spoke and said, "This is it, in the last days I will restore all the canker worm, palmerworm, caterpillar and locust have destroyed. I will restore all that these have destroyed. My people in the End Time shall Go forth as a mighty army and they shall sweep over the whole face of the earth, After this, while looking up again from above the earth down on to the earth these people clothed with this liquid fire where going to and from here and there over the whole face of the earth. Suddenly I was looking at a man in Africa and instantaneously in a split second he was transported in the Holy Spirit to Russia and then to China and then to the United States by the Holy Spirit.
These people came through victoriously through all adversities through fires, pestilence,
Or famine, fire or persecution seemed to stop them as they went angry crowds
assemble coming at them with knives, swords, clubs and guns coming at them as they did to Jesus Christ in the garden but just as Jesus did those people also they passed right through them. They could not find them when they went to hunt them down because they went forth in the Name of the Lord Jesus going out stretching forth their hand, they blessed people, and there was never any one church
denomination was mentioned. These people who were all going in the Name of the Lord of
Host Jehovah El Sabboath as they marched forward everything they did in the Name of
The Lord Jesus as they ministered the end time message. They ministered to mass multitudes: 10,000's of thousands, even millions seemed to come to the Lord Jesus and every nation upon the face of the earth because they preached it was the Last Hour it was simply glorious. Gradually there were people who accumulated and gathered in mobs and were violently rebelling and attacking the workers but God had given them this message and nothing by any means would stop them. God is going to give the
Whole world a demonstration in the Last Hour of the Great power of God. Men and
Women of all walks of life and degrees will mean nothing. God will choose who so ever will. There will be no hindrance or any obstacles too big no depths to low no valley to deep but they will reach into there and they will see God Bless and they will all work together in harmony. Jesus Christ and he alone will be the theme of the whole mission as they go forth and they continued it seemed lasted for day's weeks would go by. They would
cry out in laughter as they went forth bringing the Last time message of victory and blessing. Watching from outer space above the earth there were times when Glorious floods of Liquid Light would fall upon Great Congregations. That congregation would lift up their hands and praise God for hours even days and the Holy Spirit fell on all flesh in these meetings. To every person in these meetings received this power and anointing the miracles of God would reside and remain on and impart onto others. After these events came a sudden loud clasp of thunder. This thunder was heard resounding through the whole world. All heard it at the same time. The voice of The Lord was heard, He said, "Now this is my people, this is my beloved bride". Then the earth, lakes and graves began to open all over the entire earth, saints bodies came up out of their
Graves, collectively from all the ages of man came out of their graves. Suddenly, from every direction they began to gather in the air forming this gigantic body just as seen at the beginning, as the dead in Jesus Christ began to rise. It was hard to comprehend the whole sight it was so marvelous far exceeding anything ever seen. This giant body had at first been full of filth and immoral debris suddenly was a mighty giant arrayed in the most beautiful white garments spotless smooth unwrinkled.
Saints of all ages seemed to be gathered around this body slowly it began to form as it did it moved farther up into the universe. Suddenly outer space opened The Lord Jesus in His fullness appeared then another clasp of thunder and a voice said, "This is my beloved bride in whom I have waited. She shall come forth and be tried by fire. This is she that I have loved from the beginning. "Continuing to watch this from outer space upon the earth from the north, the beginning of, massive destruction, men and women in anguish crying out, buildings in destruction. Then a voice spoke and said, "Now my wrath is being poured out upon the face of the earth. The wrath of God was poured out in such a terrible way it was so terrifying I shook and trembled. Again, while looking at these horrible awful sight whole cities, whole nations went down into destruction. There was weeping and wailing and crying all over the whole earth. People would cry out going into caves and sides of mountains. They jumped into lakes and rivers to drown themselves but could not die. Continuing to look back on the glorious sight in the heavens and seeing the End Time ministry it was simply "The Last Hour. “
God is going to send this: rain, former rain and Latter Rain This Glorious Liquid Light with fire and it will spread like wild Holy fire over the whole face of the earth and preserve and save millions.
It is going to clean up the church. All the filthy demon spirit’s profligacy's that have been spewed upon the churches will be cleansed by the Latter Rain of the Glorious Liquid Light of the Lord Jesus Christ and his power. ALL THE FILTH IN THE CHURCHES PUT UPON THEM BY THE DEMONS OF satan are going to be removed cleanse washed away. All, who will, will be clothed with power and anointing from God. No more critics or hecklers no more media mania for money and prestige.
No more lusts of the flesh or of the eyes or the pride of life in the Church.
The Glory of Jesus Christ will be seen through and on the Church each individual worker in the Last Hour through all who are willing!
Maranatha Come Lord Jesus to us in the Rain the former and the Latter Rain

 

[peterT]

Your still twisting my words. If you understand what it is I was saying, You would not continue to make comments like this. If you wish to continue twisting everything I say and try to make me look stupid, then why bother to continue?

If you look at my posts in this thread and the "other thread" you would see I am not claiming this at all. How can I when I make comments like "in this age there is no Jew or gentile, we are all one under Christ".

1. Well lets see what James has to say on the matter,

James 1: 1:
1 James, a bond-servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, To the twelve tribes who are dispersed abroad: Greetings.


I think I will take james word over yours. he is writting to the natural children of Isreal (12 Tribes) who are scattered because of the sins of the nation.



2. where you may be right, he did not write JUST to jews. You are wrong as thinking this was directed to gentile believers, although we CAN and should learn from his writings.

no segragation period/

there are two promises.

1. In YOU all the nations of the world will be blessed - in this promise, there is no gentile or isreal, we are all one under Christ through abraham and Gods covenant with him.

2. And I give you this land as an ETERNAL inheritance to you and your generations ofter you forever., he then reconfirmed this covenant with Issac, and again with Jacob. It was THIS covenant paul spoke of in romans 11 (hated for the gospel, but loved because of the fathers)

Paul segregated them. not me. God segregated them, not me. Your the one trying to make two different aspects of a covenant into one. Not me

Let me try and draw a simple picture for you about the Jews. You can’t go too far wrong if you follow Jesus and what he said and did and thought.

Jesus said to Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews: Ye must be born again

The Jews must be born again. And that is the message Jesus gave to the Jews.

He also said if you believe in Moses you would believe in me for he wrote of me

46For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.

They didn’t even believe Moses.

He also said The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy.

9Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage.10So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests.

As many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests.

And that makes us all one nation one blood one body the church

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Let me try and draw a simple picture for you about the Jews. You can’t go too far wrong if you follow Jesus and what he said and did and thought.

Jesus said to Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews: Ye must be born again

The Jews must be born again. And that is the message Jesus gave to the Jews.

He also said if you believe in Moses you would believe in me for he wrote of me

46For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.

They didn’t even believe Moses.

He also said The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy.

9Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage.10So those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests.

As many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was furnished with guests.

And that makes us all one nation one blood one body the church

Thanks for telling me something I already knew. And have known since I was first saved 30 years ago.

Now would you like to talk about what we were talking about? or stick with this one subject we both agree on?

 

[Elizabeth619]

ohhhhhhh, this link is interesting....

The Premillennial Deception

 

[eternally-gratefull]

ohhhhhhh, this link is interesting....

The Premillennial Deception

Nice link, however a few flaws.

Literal interpretation.

Any and ALL prophesy when it concerns time which has been fulfilled has been fulfilled literally. Since ALL have been fulfilled literally. Why should we not interpret future prophesy literally. It is called if it happened in the past, it should happen in the future

Prophesy concerning messiah. Christ fulfilled MANY of these OT prophesies literally.
1. He came at the exact time he was said to come (daniel 9) to the year.
2. he came the way they said he would come (on a donkey).
3. He died the way they said he would die (on a tree, and notice this prophesy was given long before Crucifiction was even invented)
4. He was resurrected as was prophesied.
5. He did what was prophesied (removed the sin of the world)

All these prophesies came literally true, why should not the rest of the things concerning messiah also come true? why would we take half literally, and the other half (which we can not explain) spiritually?
1. He would bring Isreal together again as one nation
2. He would remove their sin, and cause them to repent and come to him
3. He will restore them to their land
4. He will DESTROY all evil in the world, and those who were against him
5. He will not only restore them to their rightfully ownled land (given to their fathers) but he will personally be their king and rule them AND THE WHOLE WORLD

why would we spiritualise these prophesies, when every other prophesy came literally true?

As far is using symbolic terms, I agree with the writter of that article. Yet God used symbolic terms to represent LITERAL things all the time.. The 4 gentile nations were called beasts, yet the 4 nations have been literally fulfilled just as God said they would, up until rome, which is still in its prophetic age.

So we should expect God to use figurative things to represent literal events.

and finally, concerning John. John saw things he probably could not comnprehend. He wrote down what he saw. in the language he knew. so it is not off hand or illogical to try to explain what it was john saw in todays language, Especially if what John saw was today.

 

[Elizabeth619]

Nice link, however a few flaws.

Literal interpretation.

Any and ALL prophesy when it concerns time which has been fulfilled has been fulfilled literally. Since ALL have been fulfilled literally. Why should we not interpret future prophesy literally. It is called if it happened in the past, it should happen in the future

Prophesy concerning messiah. Christ fulfilled MANY of these OT prophesies literally.
1. He came at the exact time he was said to come (daniel 9) to the year.
2. he came the way they said he would come (on a donkey).
3. He died the way they said he would die (on a tree, and notice this prophesy was given long before Crucifiction was even invented)
4. He was resurrected as was prophesied.
5. He did what was prophesied (removed the sin of the world)

All these prophesies came literally true, why should not the rest of the things concerning messiah also come true? why would we take half literally, and the other half (which we can not explain) spiritually?
1. He would bring Isreal together again as one nation
2. He would remove their sin, and cause them to repent and come to him
3. He will restore them to their land
4. He will DESTROY all evil in the world, and those who were against him
5. He will not only restore them to their rightfully ownled land (given to their fathers) but he will personally be their king and rule them AND THE WHOLE WORLD

why would we spiritualise these prophesies, when every other prophesy came literally true?

As far is using symbolic terms, I agree with the writter of that article. Yet God used symbolic terms to represent LITERAL things all the time.. The 4 gentile nations were called beasts, yet the 4 nations have been literally fulfilled just as God said they would, up until rome, which is still in its prophetic age.

So we should expect God to use figurative things to represent literal events.

and finally, concerning John. John saw things he probably could not comnprehend. He wrote down what he saw. in the language he knew. so it is not off hand or illogical to try to explain what it was john saw in todays language, Especially if what John saw was today.

How can we scriptually confirm these visions were for "today"?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

How can we scriptually confirm these visions were for "today"?

for all we know, they might not happen for another 1000 years, What we can scripturally confirm is that they have not happened yet.

 

[Elizabeth619]

for all we know, they might not happen for another 1000 years, What we can scripturally confirm is that they have not happened yet.

Now you know good and well that I do not agree with that. You just wanna rile me up dontcha?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Now you know good and well that I do not agree with that. You just wanna rile me up dontcha?

lol, No sis, I am just stating what I believe

Take Matt 24 for example. Jesus claimed that unless he returned no flesh would survive. Now this was not possible until the advent of Nuclear weapons. So this is one example of something which can be scripturally proven to not have happened yet, In my mind

 

[moment_of_faith]

It all hinges on Israel ..

 

[peterT]

Thanks for telling me something I already knew. And have known since I was first saved 30 years ago.

Now would you like to talk about what we were talking about? or stick with this one subject we both agree on?

Let me try and draw a simple picture for you from a different angle.

Matt21:43Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

We are not grafted into the Jews, the Jews are not the vine, we are grafted into Jesus and they can be grafted into Jesus too.

We are his people and the sheep of his pasture “CRISTIANS” whether we are Jewish Christians and non-Jewish Christians we are all one in Christ, one people one nation one blood one body the church


We get everything and they get nothing until they come to Jesus. And they even lose what they think they have.

Luke8:18 Take heed therefore how ye hear: for whosoever hath, to him shall be given; and whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he seemeth to have.

As for segregation for Jewish Christians and non-Jewish Christians there is no segregation for we are all one.

The only segregation that there is, is light and darkness, truth and the lie, unrighteousness and righteousness, belief and unbelief, Christ with Belial.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Let me try and draw a simple picture for you from a different angle.

Matt21:43Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

We are not grafted into the Jews, the Jews are not the vine, we are grafted into Jesus and they can be grafted into Jesus too.

We are his people and the sheep of his pasture “CRISTIANS” whether we are Jewish Christians and non-Jewish Christians we are all one in Christ, one people one nation one blood one body the church


We get everything and they get nothing until they come to Jesus. And they even lose what they think they have.

Luke8:18 Take heed therefore how ye hear: for whosoever hath, to him shall be given; and whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he seemeth to have.

As for segregation for Jewish Christians and non-Jewish Christians there is no segregation for we are all one.

The only segregation that there is, is light and darkness, truth and the lie, unrighteousness and righteousness, belief and unbelief, Christ with Belial.

Your not helping at all. Your not telling me anything I do not know either. all your doing is repeating the same ole stuff which I have known since I was a kid.

we are not talking about salvation, how someone is saved, or who is saved.

Let me see if I can help you.

1. The OT prophesied that it would be taken from the jews and given to the gentiles. (which is exactly what you just showed me)
2. The OT also prophesied, as did Paul, that just as the jews fell away, so would th egentiles.
3. The OT as well as paul also prophesied that at this time (the falling away) wihich will occur about the same time the "times of the gentile" is complete, Isreal will repent and be restored (as per lev 26)

we not talking about salvation here. being a jew never got anyone an automatic in, even in their age. we are talking about Gods covenant to his people here on earth.

You must separate the two. they are not interchangable.