The Absurdity of ‘Born a Sinner’

[tribesman]

And here's what this PS says on the Godhead (modalist heresy):

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/35080-jesus-not-god-36.html#post878775 <- link

Maybe also explains why so few things get straight there.

 

[mark54]

And here's what this PS says on the Godhead (modalist heresy):

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/35080-jesus-not-god-36.html#post878775 <- link

Maybe also explains why so few things get straight there.

I can vouch for the fact PS does believe Jesus is God

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I ask God's forgiveness everyday. If I have offended anyone it does not mean I am not saved but I do have this habit of opening my mouth and thinking later and the last thing I want to do is hurt someone's feelings. Mind you it may not be a sin? But I do try to be as much like Christ as I can be, although I do feel it would be a sin not to tell the truth, especially where the word of God is concerned, and if the truth hurts, well so be it.

so what happens to the poor soul who has not repented of a sin after salvation? has he forfeited his right to be saved?

 

[tribesman]

I can vouch for the fact PS does believe Jesus is God

And? Many heresies and cults will say that "Jesus is God", it doesn't mean that they are teaching the truth about the Godhead and it doesn't justify their heresies.

Modalism/monarchianism/sabellianism or any other idea that says that the Father and the Son are the same person is heresy. The apostles and the church fathers did not teach this. Beware of such heresies!

1John.2

[22] Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
[23] Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.
[24] Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye also shall continue in the Son, and in the Father.

 

[zone]

And here's what this PS says on the Godhead (modalist heresy):

http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/35080-jesus-not-god-36.html#post878775 <- link

Maybe also explains why so few things get straight there.

aye.
enter: Kenyon, Hagin and Copeland et al.

 

[PS]

what is the plain word of God?
what has the power to salvation of the soul?
your threatenings?

why is it some folks have wretched sinners soley reliant on the Cross...then the redeemed sinner fighting for his eternal soul according to the Law?

oh right...because they think the Gospel IS the LAW.

Galatians 3
By Faith, or by Works of the Law?
1O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? It was before your eyes that Jesus Christ was publicly portrayed as crucified. 2Let me ask you only this: Did you receive the Spirit by works of the law or by hearing with faith? 3Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected bya the flesh? 4Did you sufferb so many things in vain&#8212;if indeed it was in vain? 5Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith&#8212; 6just as Abraham &#8220;believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness&#8221;?

7Know then that it is those of faith who are the sons of Abraham. 8And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justifyc the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, &#8220;In you shall all the nations be blessed.&#8221; 9So then, those who are of faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith.

The Righteous Shall Live by Faith
10For all who rely on works of the law are under a curse; for it is written, &#8220;Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them.&#8221; 11Now it is evident that no one is justified before God by the law, for &#8220;The righteous shall live by faith.&#8221;d 12But the law is not of faith, rather &#8220;The one who does them shall live by them.&#8221; 13Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us&#8212;for it is written, &#8220;Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree&#8221;&#8212; 14so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirite through faith.


calm your show PS.


Romans 8
God&#8217;s Everlasting Love
31What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can beh against us? 32He who did not spare his own Son but gave him up for us all, how will he not also with him graciously give us all things? 33Who shall bring any charge against God&#8217;s elect? It is God who justifies. 34Who is to condemn? Christ Jesus is the one who died&#8212;more than that, who was raised&#8212;who is at the right hand of God, who indeed is interceding for us.i 35Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or danger, or sword? 36As it is written,

&#8220;For your sake we are being killed all the day long;
we are regarded as sheep to be slaughtered.&#8221;

37No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. 38For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, 39nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Paul is writing to the redeemed who are already saved but initially, like those converts, Paul repented of his sin and believed in Jesus the same as everyone who wants to follow Christ has to do.

Somehow I do not see Calvinists doing that.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Paul is writing to the redeemed who are already saved but initially, like those converts, Paul repented of his sin and believed in Jesus the same as everyone who wants to follow Christ has to do.

Somehow I do not see Calvinists doing that.

and arminians, and all those that teach we can lose salvation are?

I think you have Calvinist mixed up with those that teach a licentious gospel of mere belief only. No Calvinist I know teaches this false easy believing gospel.

the sad thing. those that believe in this easy believism are in just as much danger as you are. neither of you have yet repented. you have to much pride to admit you have no hope and completely trust God.

 

[PS]

so what happens to the poor soul who has not repented of a sin after salvation? has he forfeited his right to be saved?

As you said our salvation is eternal, provided we never ever reject the Lord otherwise we are crucifying Him all over again.

Hebrews 6:4 “It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.”

 

[PS]

and arminians, and all those that teach we can lose salvation are?

I think you have Calvinist mixed up with those that teach a licentious gospel of mere belief only. No Calvinist I know teaches this false easy believing gospel.

the sad thing. those that believe in this easy believism are in just as much danger as you are. neither of you have yet repented. you have to much pride to admit you have no hope and completely trust God.

So how does one receive eternal life according to Calvin? His actual words would be helpful. Although why you just cannot quote the Bible or Jesus is beyond me.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

As you said our salvation is eternal, provided we never ever reject the Lord otherwise we are crucifying Him all over again.

you just contradicted yourself. You said it is eternal. but then again, it might not be. which is it?

Hebrews 6:4 “It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.”

heb 6 is speaking to jews trying to return to law. stating we can taste the gift of God and then fall away ant hus have to use the law to be resaved again. The author is making it clear. if we can fall away, we can not be resaved by law. we are lost forever. because whever sin caused us to fall away was not paid for by Christ on the cross.

Thus he stated a truth, if we can fall away, Christ would have to return to redeem the sin he forgot to redeem the first time. See the danger, saying one can fall away puts christ to open shame


so why are you shaming Christ?

 

[zone]

Paul is writing to the redeemed who are already saved but initially, like those converts, Paul repented of his sin and believed in Jesus the same as everyone who wants to follow Christ has to do.

Somehow I do not see Calvinists doing that.

it's funny because i'm not a calvinist.
but everytime the calvin-haters fire-up....well.....look what happens:


Acts 9
The Conversion of Saul
1But Saul, still breathing threats and murder against the disciples of the Lord, went to the high priest 2and asked him for letters to the synagogues at Damascus, so that if he found any belonging to the Way, men or women, he might bring them bound to Jerusalem. 3Now as he went on his way, he approached Damascus, and suddenly a light from heaven flashed around him. 4And falling to the ground he heard a voice saying to him, &#8220;Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting me?&#8221; 5And he said, &#8220;Who are you, Lord?&#8221; And he said, &#8220;I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting. 6But rise and enter the city, and you will be told what you are to do.&#8221; 7The men who were traveling with him stood speechless, hearing the voice but seeing no one. 8Saul rose from the ground, and although his eyes were opened, he saw nothing. So they led him by the hand and brought him into Damascus. 9And for three days he was without sight, and neither ate nor drank.

Galatians 1
Paul Called by God
11For I would have you know, brothers, that the gospel that was preached by me is not man&#8217;s gospel.c 12For I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it, but I received it through a revelation of Jesus Christ. 13For you have heard of my former life in Judaism, how I persecuted the church of God violently and tried to destroy it. 14And I was advancing in Judaism beyond many of my own age among my people, so extremely zealous was I for the traditions of my fathers. 15But when he who had set me apart before I was born,d and who called me by his grace, 16was pleased to reveal his Son toe me, in order that I might preach him among the Gentiles, I did not immediately consult with anyone;f 17nor did I go up to Jerusalem to those who were apostles before me, but I went away into Arabia, and returned again to Damascus.

18Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to visit Cephas and remained with him fifteen days. 19But I saw none of the other apostles except James the Lord&#8217;s brother. 20(In what I am writing to you, before God, I do not lie!) 21Then I went into the regions of Syria and Cilicia. 22And I was still unknown in person to the churches of Judea that are in Christ. 23They only were hearing it said, &#8220;He who used to persecute us is now preaching the faith he once tried to destroy.&#8221; 24And they glorified God because of me.

 

[PS]

and arminians, and all those that teach we can lose salvation are?

I think you have Calvinist mixed up with those that teach a licentious gospel of mere belief only. No Calvinist I know teaches this false easy believing gospel.

the sad thing. those that believe in this easy believism are in just as much danger as you are. neither of you have yet repented. you have to much pride to admit you have no hope and completely trust God.

A child can understand salvation and be saved.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

As you said our salvation is eternal, provided we never ever reject the Lord otherwise we are crucifying Him all over again.

Hebrews 6:4 “It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, because to their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.”

ps. Who is one who reject the Lord? is not he one who denies Christ, and thus would become an antiChrist?

18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the[c] Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.
20 But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you know all things.[d] 21 I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth.
22 Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.


Notice the major theme here?


1. These people have left the church
2. These people now deny Christ (they have as you say rejected him)
3. Unlike us, who have the anointing of God. they never did
4. They were never truly a part of us (never saved)
5. if they had been truly of us, they NEVER WOULD HAVE LEFT!


so why do you continue to say one can be saved, then leave the church and reject christ, when John here makes it clear. they were never saved, for it=f they were truly saved, they never would have left? Do i trust you or John?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

A child can understand salvation and be saved.

true, I was saved as a child. But that was no my question. would you like to answer my question?

Who is more saved. the calvanist who trusts god completely. or the one who states God will not keep his promise and we can lose salvation?

 

[PS]

you just contradicted yourself. You said it is eternal. but then again, it might not be. which is it?



heb 6 is speaking to jews trying to return to law. stating we can taste the gift of God and then fall away ant hus have to use the law to be resaved again. The author is making it clear. if we can fall away, we can not be resaved by law. we are lost forever. because whever sin caused us to fall away was not paid for by Christ on the cross.

Thus he stated a truth, if we can fall away, Christ would have to return to redeem the sin he forgot to redeem the first time. See the danger, saying one can fall away puts christ to open shame


so why are you shaming Christ?

So you admit we can fall away.

 

[PS]

true, I was saved as a child. But that was no my question. would you like to answer my question?

Who is more saved. the calvanist who trusts god completely. or the one who states God will not keep his promise and we can lose salvation?

There are probably Calvinists and OSAS who have lost their faith and rejected God. Paul says we have to run the race to the end.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

So you admit we can fall away.

No, why would I admit this. This is not what the passage states. it states IF we fall away, we can never be renewed. The author was fighting the law gospel. which states we can fall away. The context is not about rejecting God. it is about falling away due to sin.

 

[PS]

No, why would I admit this. This is not what the passage states. it states IF we fall away, we can never be renewed. The author was fighting the law gospel. which states we can fall away. The context is not about rejecting God. it is about falling away due to sin.

Is the end not the same?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

There are probably Calvinists and OSAS who have lost their faith and rejected God.

well there might be. But according to John, they may claim to be calvanists, and believe in OSAS. but they were never saved. that is why they left to prove they were never saved.

Are you going to reject what John said?

The gospel is not about what calvin said, or what anyone else said, it is about the good news of Jesus Christ.

Paul says we have to run the race to the end.

so now your back under law? Paul did not have salvation in mind when he said this. He had in mind striving to be more like christ, and never assuming he ever made it to the super spiritually mature christian where he could sit still and not do anymore.. Which is a mistake many Christians make.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Is the end not the same?

why would it be the same? it was the jews who were teaching we could fall away due to sin. Not the gospel of christ.

Are we under law?? your contradicting yourself here.. and you don't even see it. Dies sin cause us to lose salvation, and have to do some religious act to be re-saved again. this is what the author of hebrews was speaking against. why can't you see this?