Martin Luther - the founder of Protestantism: Anti-Semitic?
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T
Are the claims being made in this thread about Martin Luther true?
One of them is. Martin Luther did hate Jews for not recognising the Messiah had already come.
If the claims are true, then what are the implications for today?
Just because I believe Luther was a great man of God, doesn't me he did everything right. There's a reason we should only follow the sinless man/God, Jesus, not the heroes of the faith. Share God's Truth with Jewish people. Love them and try to help them recognise that the Messiah has already come.
One of them is. Martin Luther did hate Jews for not recognising the Messiah had already come.
If the claims are true, then what are the implications for today?
Just because I believe Luther was a great man of God, doesn't me he did everything right. There's a reason we should only follow the sinless man/God, Jesus, not the heroes of the faith. Share God's Truth with Jewish people. Love them and try to help them recognise that the Messiah has already come.
What he failed to see was that all came to pass for the world to be Blessed with the Saviour.
What we must remember is through the rejection did Salvation come to us all.
It is difficult to receive and many have used it to give way that they can be saved in disbelief which is not so.
Others have used it to hate them....
The Messiah said to love our enemies.
What we must remember is through the rejection did Salvation come to us all.
It is difficult to receive and many have used it to give way that they can be saved in disbelief which is not so.
Others have used it to hate them....
The Messiah said to love our enemies.
They're true, obviously. And they're not "claims" by anyone in this thread, but rather the words of Martin Luther himself.
Some people here justify and make excuses for the disgusting words and beliefs of this wretched man in order to justify themselves, which is inexcusable.
There is only one thing to do, really.
Some people here justify and make excuses for the disgusting words and beliefs of this wretched man in order to justify themselves, which is inexcusable.
There is only one thing to do, really.
A
"But the Jews are so hardened that they listen to nothing; though overcome by testimonies they yield not an inch. It is a pernicious race, oppressing all men by their usery and rapine. If they give a prince or magistrate a thousand florins, they extort twenty thousand from the subjects in payment. We must ever keep on guard against them."Martin Luther.
If quotes were given from the first century to this day, by famous world leaders. Id think youd see Martin was no exception,
to the basic problem. Usery.
If quotes were given from the first century to this day, by famous world leaders. Id think youd see Martin was no exception,
to the basic problem. Usery.
We must remember that there were other types of people that were of the same kind.
I was took back when i read about the women eating their own children!
What type of people do that?
All the evil spirit worshiping and having their children pass through the fire, i'd be naive to think things do not take place still in this world.
I was took back when i read about the women eating their own children!
What type of people do that?
All the evil spirit worshiping and having their children pass through the fire, i'd be naive to think things do not take place still in this world.
"What shall we Christians do with this rejected and condemned people, the Jews?
First, to set fire to their synagogues or schools and to bury and cover with dirt whatever will not burn, so that no man will ever again see a stone or cinder of them. This is to be done in honor of our Lord and of Christendom, so that God might see that we are Christians...
Second, I advise that their houses also be razed and destroyed. For they pursue in them the same aims as in their synagogues. Instead they might be lodged under a roof or in a barn, like the gypsies. This will bring home to them the fact that they are not masters in our country...
Third, I advise that all their prayer books and Talmudic writings, in which such idolatry, lies, cursing, and blasphemy are taught, be taken from them...
Fourth, I advise that their rabbis be forbidden to teach henceforth on pain of loss of life and limb.
Fifth, I advise that safe-conduct on the highways be abolished completely for the Jews. For they have no business in the countryside...
Sixth, I advise that usury be prohibited to them, and that all cash and treasure of silver and gold be taken from them...
Seventh, I recommend putting a flail, an ax, a hoe, a spade, a distaff, or a spindle into the hands of young, strong Jews and Jewesses and letting them earn their bread in the sweat of their brow... For it is not fitting that they should let us accursed Goyim toil in the sweat of our faces while they, the holy people, idle away their time behind the stove, feasting and farting.
Especially you pastors who have Jews living in your midst, persist in reminding your lords and rulers to be mindful of their office and of their obligation before God to force the Jews to work, to forbid usury, and to check their blasphemy and cursing."
Martin Luther
On the Jews and their Lies - 1543
Yes, wretched. CLEARLY wretched. Are you blind, tintin? Evidently so. You follow this man and defend him in spite of the truth. I suggest that you "grow up" and finally adopt an ability to reason logically and exercise some rational thought concerning the foundations of your faith.
T
Maynard, no, I'm not blind. Also, you're the one who didn't read my post. I know that Martin Luther was wrong in hating Jews but I said that despite that, he was a great man of God and that I didn't have to agree with him on everything. And what do you post? Luther's writings about hating Jews? There's a lack of communication here.
A
I perceive you dont have a clue what your talking about or even reading.
Id bet if i talked to you about US politics, banking, and foreign affairs youd
see your hypocracy. Unless of coarse your a pacifist. Which few people really are deep down.
This is not a Catholic/reformation issue if your talking about Jews. And if thats the
case i can provide many many catholic quotes as damning to jews as anything Martin said.
And in fact i agree with them all. Not against jews in general but the evil industry they tended
and the implications of it.
Id bet if i talked to you about US politics, banking, and foreign affairs youd
see your hypocracy. Unless of coarse your a pacifist. Which few people really are deep down.
This is not a Catholic/reformation issue if your talking about Jews. And if thats the
case i can provide many many catholic quotes as damning to jews as anything Martin said.
And in fact i agree with them all. Not against jews in general but the evil industry they tended
and the implications of it.
7
HAHAHAHAHA That was funny, brother. Really, I like it lol.
But if you're talking about Luther being brutally honest, I think the issue is more that he spoke a lot without thinking, which is why his opinions changed so much. And for a man who changed his opinions so much, makes you wonder what faith he really had when he started this reformation. I get the feeling that he did a lot of things in spite out of pride. Just going on all the quotes and stuff I have read here. But i'll certainly be doing a bit more research on this. Its fascinating.
Hey, Happy Easter!! God bless!
But if you're talking about Luther being brutally honest, I think the issue is more that he spoke a lot without thinking, which is why his opinions changed so much. And for a man who changed his opinions so much, makes you wonder what faith he really had when he started this reformation. I get the feeling that he did a lot of things in spite out of pride. Just going on all the quotes and stuff I have read here. But i'll certainly be doing a bit more research on this. Its fascinating.
Hey, Happy Easter!! God bless!
7
Actually, that wasn't true at first. He agreed that the Holy Catholic Church was the Church for all Christians to be a part of. Like you said earlier(i think it was you anyway), he didn't want to leave the Catholic Church, which brings me to conclude that everything he taught about the Pope being the anti-christ was taught in spite, letting his pride get in the way of his faith. You know, being upset over the whole ex-communication thing.
Yeh, look, about that indulgences thing, that was done by a few corrupt priests and actually went against Catholic Doctrine, which says these things shall not be done within the Catholic Church. It had nothing to do with the teachings of the Catholic Church about faith. I don't deny that there's been corruption in the Catholic Church. There has been in EVERY Church.
Luther didn't teach that Scripture was our ultimate authority over counsels popes or traditions until long afterwards. He kept changing the story by the looks of things. This is going to be very interesting to research.
Yeh, look, about that indulgences thing, that was done by a few corrupt priests and actually went against Catholic Doctrine, which says these things shall not be done within the Catholic Church. It had nothing to do with the teachings of the Catholic Church about faith. I don't deny that there's been corruption in the Catholic Church. There has been in EVERY Church.
Luther didn't teach that Scripture was our ultimate authority over counsels popes or traditions until long afterwards. He kept changing the story by the looks of things. This is going to be very interesting to research.