Sabbath

You completely MISunderstood my meaning and I am not going to argur with you. Difference in understanding is bound to happen when we speak from different sides. Have a nice day !

I don't understand the resistance to this when there isn't any to not coveting, for example.

you get the exact same thing when people start judging one another over eating bacon. not resistance to a healthy diet, but resistance to being judged over consuming delicious bacon. the Bible says not to allow anyone to judge you over bacon ((Colossians 2:16-17)) so of course people are like, hey, what gives?!
on the other side, people start talking about the Sinai covenant Law, pointing out how bacon is a pork product and therefore not kosher. they try to frame the whole discussion as though by gratefully receiving and enjoying tasty bacon strips people are willfully sinning. they compare the bacon bits to the mark of the beast and go on and on about how pigs were created whole and it wasn't until man came along and invented ways to thinly slice and fry them. they quote Exodus and Leviticus and completely disregard what Christ has done, removing the written requirements of the Law and setting us free, having died to what condemned us and no longer found under it through immersion into Him and His cross. they gloss over all the new testament epistles and say things like, 'Jesus didn't eat bacon'
all that stuff sounds really convincing and it certainly has them hoodwinked, but it's ultimately an impossibly failed argument because it contradicts what we read in the Bible. we are not under meat and drink laws. we are saved by belief, and serve by the new way of the Spirit and not the old way of the written code. we are able to eat sizzling and scrumptious bacon slices with thanksgiving to God and we're not condemned for doing so - and we're not under commandment to be juicing and eating only raw organic soya products. all the while, if your conscious condemns you when you eat bacon, it's sin for you, but you must not judge the brother who freely chews and swallows bacon without guilt. the Kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, and His true worshippers worship in spirit & truth, not on this mountain or some other. try not to make the weaker brother stumble, but don't impose your own lack of faith on everyone else. act with sincere love, being thankful always to Him who set you free and made you alive while you were dead in sin and ignorance.

so you don't think regretting what you're doing is a negative thing? not even willing to discuss it because you've written me off as evil therefore not worthy of your wisdom on the matter? because i keep the command of God, "do not let anyone act as your judge with regard to a sabbath"

bizarre.


some of the people i meet here just don't make any sense at all =\
well, the human brain starts deteriorating almost immediately at birth. so what should we expect from each other?
lol, we should 100% expect brain damage.

Where do you get most of your Christian teachings, we have Calvinist, Lutherans and many more that broke off from the Catholic Church just after the middle ages when people started becoming literate.

The RCC hijacked Christianity just about the time they formed after the Nicene Council in 325 AD. The pagan Emperor Constantine, that called the Council, steered Christianity for the rest of his life.

When these "Protestants" broke off, they did so with many complaints about church doctrine. These complaints (or protests) are what they derive their name from.

Trouble is, they carried enough of that false doctrine to make themselves daughters of the great whore (see Rev. 17:5). You don't even realize you are honoring the Catholics by keeping their teachings about the Sabbath. They even admit, in their ibid, they changed the Sabbath and that all of Christianity is following them.

It all boils down to the fact that there are people who do not like grace and the fact that grace is being taught in the Bible.
The New Testament teaches grace.
It’s not a disputable matter.
No amount of posting scripture out of context changes that fact.

People can believe whatever they want. One should be honest about their agenda.
If you don't believe Christ came to bring us grace then you don’t believe the NT. There is no hi jacking of the scripture or misinterpreted words.
The NT says what it say very clearly. Jesus brought us grace.
If the Bible as it is written offends
Some people they may need to find a new book to start studying.
A book they don’t need to ignore half of just to make their agenda
Work.

It all boils down to the fact that there are people who do not like grace and the fact that grace is being taught in the Bible.
The New Testament teaches grace.
It’s not a disputable matter.
No amount of posting scripture out of context changes that fact.

People can believe whatever they want. One should be honest about their agenda.
If you believe Christ came to bring us grace then you don’t believe the NT. There is no hi jacking of the scripture or misinterpreted words.
The NT says what it say very clearly.
If the Bible as it is written offends
Some people they may need to find a new book to start studying.
A book they don’t need to ignore half of just to make their agenda
Work.

If you believe Christ came to bring us grace then you don’t believe the NT.

yes, " in this sign conquer " was the other event.

but, since, you seem not to know. i'll help you out-

the council of Nicaea was called to settle a dispute between Constantine and arius of Alexandria , the dispute being was Jesus born a man , then became divine, or was he born divine.

so, hate to break it you conspiracy theorists, the council was not called to worship the sun God, or make Christanity pagan.

and, their is plenty of N.T. Scripture that Christ followers meet on the first day of the week.

I know you all think Christ rose on the Sabbath, but sorry, wrong , " at dawn on the first day of the week."

the greek word dawn means- dawn. sunup.

sorry to burst your bubble with truth, but you will probably dismiss this as a catholic conspiracy to ruin Christianty, as your group does with everything that proves your Sabbath hoax to be hoax.

I already answered why the Council was called. You missed the other point that was to be settled "Easter." See below.


You are right there was no official council to establish Sunday, it was just done. The Council at Laodicea (AD 365) did outlaw the true Sabbath. See below.



Christ was already risen unseen by the time He greeted Mary. If He was buried just before sundown, He resurrected just before sundown. Jesus said three days and three nights (72 hours).



From post #112

The council Nicea did not address the Sabbath, that is correct.

But at this time, there were many different doctrines among Christians. So Constantine called upon a conclave of bishops from all over Rome, to settle these differences. This happened at the Council of Nicea in 325, which was convened to solve two main differences: The first was the divinity of Christ. Arius, a priest of Alexandria, was teaching that Christ was created and not eternal and divine like the Father. The Council denied him and his doctrines; and condemned his followers, the Arian teachers, although this Arian wing continued strong in some areas. When the Germanic and Gothic invaders were converted to Christianity, it was usually to the Arian form. The other major difference, facing the Council was the date on which to celebrate Passover. At this time, in Asia Minor, many Christians still commemorated Jesus’ death on the day the Jewish Passover lambs were slain. But Rome and the Western churches chose to honor the resurrection instead. They celebrated the Passover always on a Sunday. The Council ruled in favor of the west and Rome. It ruled that the Passover, commemorating the death of Jesus, no longer be kept—anyone keeping the old way would be put to death. This new Passover was celebrated on the first Sunday after the full moon following the vernal equinox. It was later called “Easter” by the Germanic Christian converts.

Here is the event that changed the Sabbath:

The Roman Catholic Church grew out of this “hijacking” of Christianity by Constantine. I might note here: as a result of this hijacking—and his Sunday sabbath—the later Council of Laodicea (AD 365) outlawed the true seventh-day sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday).

here is the actual statement-

" Christians must not Judeaize by resting on the Sabbath, but must work that day, rather honor the Lord's Day, and, if they can, resting as Christians. but, if any found to be judeaizers , let them be anathema from Christ."

I got no big problems with statement.

you and your group do not honor the Lord's Day. you think that means Sabbath, when it clearly does not.

and the lie that Christ rose on the Sabbath , man I am tired of debunking that.

the Sabbath ends at sun down. sat. the women did not go to the tomb till the next mourning, " at dawn on the first day of the week"

dawn means dawn. in the greek.

so, i'll tell you the same thing I told your fearless ( clueless) leader studyman- the catholic church did not write the greek language.

so, produce a translation that defines the word dawn as dusk, and I go with what you say. till them, I will go with what the word means over your judeaizing opinion.

Nobody witnessed the resurrection. When Christ met Mary the act was already done. Why can't you get that into your head.

Christ was already risen unseen by the time He greeted Mary. If He was buried just before sundown, He resurrected just before sundown. Jesus said three days and three nights (72 hours).

Thanks posthuman. This is such an interesting conversation!

I wont too much because it is quite late here, where I am and I have to go out early in the morning!

I think I can see what you are saying by your analogy to dietary laws. By your analogy, is not eating bacon the same thing as saying we are saved by doing that necessarily? Where does the analogy differ from the reality of the two things being compared?

Are the dietary laws to be viewed in exactly the same way as the Ten Commandments Law?

Which commandments does Colossians 2 refer to?

Also, Jesus said that He did not come to destroy the law but to fulfil (Matthew 5:17) than what is the difference between destroy and fulfil as it seems many interpretations of "fulfil" are in the effect that it is said to have for us tantamount to "destroy". If it is the case that Jesus' "fulfilment" of the law meant that He does not need to manifest the law in our lives and hearts, why, in reality, do most Christians not murder, commit adultery etc but only mention that fulfilment = doing away with when it comes to the Sabbath alone whereas they would agree to upholding the other commandments?

I already posted it, it is in scripture. How do you know He didn't?

how do you know he did? and, dawn means dawn. sunup. not sundown.

Thanks posthuman. This is such an interesting conversation! I wont too much because it is quite late here, where I am and I have to go out early in the morning! I think I can see what you are saying by your analogy to dietary laws. By your analogy, is not eating bacon the same thing as saying we are saved by doing that necessarily? Where does the analogy differ from the reality of the two things being compared? Are the dietary laws to be viewed in exactly the same way as the Ten Commandments Law? Which commandments does Colossians 2 refer to? Also, Jesus said that He did not come to destroy the law but to fulfil (Matthew 5:17) than what is the difference between destroy and fulfil as it seems many interpretations of "fulfil" are in the effect that it is said to have for us tantamount to "destroy". If it is the case that Jesus' "fulfilment" of the law meant that He does not need to manifest the law in our lives and hearts, why, in reality, do most Christians not murder, commit adultery etc but only mention that fulfilment = doing away with when it comes to the Sabbath alone whereas they would agree to upholding the other commandments?

Because Christ said so. You are not even reading my replies, you just keep parroting the same thing. I am done here.

Yes, it is pretty clear that God chose to include God's Holy Sabbath in His Ten Commandments.

From the very beginning the serpent has worked to convince folks to reject God's instructions. Jesus, as the Word, showed us in the beginning how it does this. It uses parts of God's Words and then attaches a very reasonable sounding voice to convince Eve that God didn't have her best interest at heart. It's a Fascinating example Jesus created for us.

Gen. 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

Very cleaver to use God's Word in it's deception.

4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: (You are Saved)
5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, (reject God's instructions) then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

Jesus placed this example there so we could know how it deceives folks.

Paul warns of the same thing in Col. 2.

Col. 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

Who is the Christ? Is He not the Word which became Flesh? Was not "ALL THINGS" Created by Him? So fish on Friday is a tradition of man, Lent, Halloween, Christmas, these are all religious traditions of man. Not condemning, just pointing out Biblical Truth.

But the creation of Clean and unclean animals, Holy and Unholy, this is a creation of the Christ.

Lev. 11:
44 For I am the LORD your God: (Word which became Flesh) ye shall therefore sanctify yourselves, and ye shall be holy; for I am holy: neither shall ye defile yourselves with any manner of creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
45 For I am the LORD that bringeth you up out of the land of Egypt, to be your God: ye shall therefore be holy, for I am holy.
46 This is the law of the beasts, and of the fowl, and of every living creature that moveth in the waters, and of every creature that creepeth upon the earth:
47 To make a difference between the unclean and the clean, and between the beast that may be eaten and the beast that may not be eaten.

So unlike many of the man made religious traditions that are accepted in the religions of the world today, the creating of clean and unclean, Holy and Unholy are from the Christ, the Word which became Flesh.

We know the serpent uses cleverness and parts of God's Word to deceive. Paul is warning not to be fooled by the religious traditions of men, but to listen to the Christ.

Many, who come in Christ's name, preach that the Christ's instructions are not for man, that they are vain deceit, and Rudiments of the World, and "tradition of man". The serpent convinced Eve of the same thing.

Gen. 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.

Not only did the serpent deceive Eve, but Eve then spread this same deceit to other members of God's Family. We have examples of this same deception through out the Bible. It is a strong deception and actually convinced the Mainstream Preachers of Christ's time as a human, to kill Him, their own Messiah, thinking they were serving Him.

This deception is nothing to mess with.

Paul is warning about such a deception in Col. 2. He knew that the Mainstream God of Abraham Preachers of his time were deceiving people. He knew they didn't believe in the Law and Prophets, and actually persecuted anyone who did, including him after his conversion.

Acts 24:.14 But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

This is why Paul honored God's Sabbaths including "Feast of Unleavened Bread".

1 cor. 5:
7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

This is why Paul said not to let anyone judge you in your obedience to the Great Christ.

Col. 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

These instructions come directly from the Word which became Flesh and are not man made doctrines or tradition.

20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,
21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;
22 Which all are to perish with the using after the commandments and doctrines of men?

The Jews, who had rejected God's instructions and created their own, were working to deceive the Gentiles, Galatians, and Colossians. Paul is telling us to "Beware" that they, through cleaver philosophy and vain deceit, "Spoil us" or make us rotten.

There are those who preach that this is telling folks to reject God's instructions. That the Word's of the Word which became flesh are "Vain deceit" and "Rudiments of the World". I don't think the Bible supports this teaching.

It seems you have a healthy grasp of the scriptures M, good for you.

I'm sure you know what Jesus said about what defiles us.

Matt. 15:16 And Jesus said, Are ye also yet without understanding?
17 Do not ye yet understand, that whatsoever entereth in at the mouth goeth into the belly, and is cast out into the draught?
18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.
19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:
20 These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.

Rebellion, disobedience, dishonor, these things come from within and defile a man.

These things are vain deceit, tradition of men, rudiments of the World. But the Word's of the Word which became Flesh lasts forever.

Is. 66:
16 For by fire and by his sword will the LORD plead with all flesh: and the slain of the LORD shall be many.
17 They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one tree in the midst, eating swine's flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, saith the LORD.

Great Post M

it was a command for the nation of Israel only. it was never commanded for gentiles. we are to take a day of rest, as God the father instituted in the Creation, but non-jews were never under the Sabbath command.

I hear this often, that God is a God of the Hebrews, not for us who are somehow different in God's eyes. Yet, over and over those Hebrews you say that God spoke to exclusively were told to include all men who wanted to join with them, that what God said was for them also.

What is your scripture backup for your idea that God doesn't include us in His care and instructions?