Sabbath

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Studyman

Senior Member
Oct 11, 2017
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and what did Christ say ? whosoever believes in Me shall be saved?

your response to a young lady doing that very thing was to mock it.

keep up all the lecturing and deconstructing and reconstructing of Scripture you want, you displayed your true colors by you words.

I do not care to interact with you after that shameful display of disregard of salvation by faith in Christ alone, but I will point it out so others can know what you really think of the Cross and the Blood. you throw it away to go worship on the alter of the Sabbath, your idol.
I was agreeing with the wonderful post she wrote. Sorry if that offended you.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
7,085
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I was agreeing with the wonderful post she wrote. Sorry if that offended you.
no, you did not offend me. I know you do not know what you are talking about. posthuman has gave you an 18 wheeler trailer full of good, sound theology, you have rejected it all. shows what you know. or don't.
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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how do you know he did? and, dawn means dawn. sunup. not sundown.
-
so, produce a translation that defines the word dawn as dusk, and I go with what you say.
till them, I will go with what the word means over your judeaizing opinion.
Here is one bible verse alone, that refutes your view of a sunrise service.
"The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark.."

Seems it was still dark, and Christ was already not there.
-

We read clearly that Mary Magdalene came to anoint Christ on “the first day
of the week … at the rising of the sun” (verse 2).

She found that the stone of His sepulcher was rolled away (verse 4). Verse 9 confirms that He
had already been resurrected: “Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week .…”

Notice carefully though: It doesn’t say He “did rise” or “rose on the first day.” It says He was
risen. He had done so, as the Scriptures so clearly show, on late Saturday afternoon.

That expression—was risen—is the sole basis for the idea that Christ was resurrected on Sunday
morning—yet it says nothing of the sort! Instead, it simply confirms that Christ had
already been resurrected and emerged from the tomb by the time Mary arrived.

As for Easter and its traditional Sunday “sunrise service,” there is no biblical basis for its ob-
servance. The Catholic Encyclopedia frankly admits that “the apostolic fathers do not mention it” .
-

“In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week,
came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre”

If you study the Greek text, you learn that the word for sabbath is
actually plural! “After the sabbaths,” it should read.

Jesus crucified on a Wednesday afternoon and buried later that evening,
before sunset. The next day, Thursday, was an annual sabbath. The day
after that, was preparation day for the regular weekly Sabbath.


The reason Matthew refers to sabbaths, plural, is because there were
two sabbaths that week! When Matthew says Mary came early Sunday morning,
before dawn, after one of the sabbaths, he is referring to the weekly Sabbath.

-

Mark 16:1 says Mary Magdalene and her companions bought spices
“when the sabbath was past.” They were planning to prepare these
ointments and spices so that they might anoint the body of Jesus.


Yet Luke 23:56 says they prepared these spices and then rested on
the weekly Sabbath day. Compare these two texts carefully.


Those who hold to the Good Friday-Easter belief must conclude that these
verses are a glaring contradiction. They are not! They complement each
other perfectly, if you understand that there were two sabbaths that week.
-

encyclopedias point out, the Easter tradition for Christians began with “the words
of the ancient Nicene Creed”—not with the Bible. The tradition actually has its roots
in paganism, following customs that began long before Christ ever lived.

Antiquity of the Roman Mass
It is still redolent of that liturgy, of the days when Caesar ruled the world
and thought he could stamp out the faith of Christ, when our fathers
met together before dawn and sang a hymn to Christ as to a God.


"We also send you the good news of the settlement concerning the holy pasch, namely
that in answer to your prayers this question also has been resolved. All the brethren
in the East who have hitherto followed the Jewish practice will henceforth observe
the custom of the Romans and of yourselves and of all of us (who from ancient times)
have kept Easter together with you.[13]


A custom of the Romans, not from the bible, and not given to Jesus church.
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
8,441
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Nobody witnessed the resurrection. When Christ met Mary the act was already done. Why can't you get that into your head. :):cool:

oh the irony

if no one witnessed it as you say (and in fact that is true) then YOU cannot equivocably stand behind your Sabbath ideals either

so maybe pull your head of wherever you have misplaced it also

 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
8,441
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I already posted it, it is in scripture. How do you know He didn't?

the wall must have a big dent where you keep banging your head into it

stubborn is one thing, but not acknowledging your failure to comprehend you are actually saying to yourself what you think you are saying to someone else is.......DENSE

I am done here. :cool:
right. well let's hope it's well done and here's a fork

 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
8,441
3,623
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"prove-all, post: 3676775, member: 196569"]Here is one bible verse alone, that refutes your view of a sunrise service.
"The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark.."

Seems it was still dark, and Christ was already not there.
-

so let's see...according to you, the days have evolved into a cycle of light and night

so at 6 am where I live it is still dark, it is still the day before until the sun rises

so tomorrow, it will not be the 6th of August until about 6:30 when it is getting light

that's what you are saying....it was yet dark but not the Sabbath

figure it out if you can.
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
5,977
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John 20:1 (KJV)
The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark,
unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.

so let's see...according to you, the days have evolved into a cycle of light and night
according to the bible:

"And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night.

so at 6 am where I live it is still dark, it is still the day before until the sun rises
Not true, even if you go by a man made clock, midnight starts a new day, not morning.

If you went by how God defines a day according to the bible,
it is the evening[night time] then morning[daytime]that makes a 24 hr period

"And the evening and the morning were the first day.
And the evening and the morning were the second day.
And the evening and the morning were the third day.

that's what you are saying....it was yet dark but not the Sabbath
It was still dark "not light outside" when Mary saw Christ was gone already.
So before sunrise , while it was still dark outside. Sunrise only marks the start of
the daylight portion of the day, the day had started at nightfall the previous evening,
after the Sabbath had pasted.

It was not a sunrise resurrection like people suggest.

figure it out if you can.
I am still suprised people can not figure how long 3 days and 3 nights last. The only
sign given by Christ disproves the tradation of good friday to sunday sunrise.

And the evening and the morning were the first day.
And the evening and the morning were the second day.
And the evening and the morning were the third day.
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
2,782
331
83
oh the irony

if no one witnessed it as you say (and in fact that is true) then YOU cannot equivocably stand behind your Sabbath ideals either

so maybe pull your head of wherever you have misplaced it also

Proof of a Sabbath Resurrection is Scriptural...nothing to do with human witnessess 1Cor 15v3,4. The Word of God speaks Truth, not you or me except we speak HIS WORDS. No need to argue !
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
5,977
400
83
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the question I have is whether sabbath is like all the other appointed days
in scripture - determined by the the moon?
There is No need to determine when the Sabbath is by the the moon.

Once the 7th day was made at creation, making a 7 day week,
no need to try and figure when the Sabbath day starts except to
just know how to count to seven.


For 40 years they knew if it was a Sabbath day or not.
Jesus keep the same 7th day Sabbath as in the wilderness.
We today are certain we can keep the same 7th day Sabbath.

There has been no change in our calendar in past centuries
that has affected in any way the cycle of the week.
The origin of the 7th day Sabbath, at creation week was from God.

There is no question about which day the seventh day of the week is.
This is assured by the God given Oracles, given to us.
-

This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel
which spake to him in [the mount Sina], and with our fathers:
who received the lively oracles [ to give unto us ] Acts 7:38

What advantage then hath the Jew? or what profit is there of circumcision?
Much every way:chiefly, because that unto them
were committed [the oracles of God]. Romans 3:2

For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need
that one teach you again which be the first principles of

[the oracles of God]; and are become such as have
need of milk, and not of strong meat. Hebrews 5:12

If any man speak, let him speak as [the oracles of God];
if any man minister, let him do it as of the ability which God giveth:

that God in all things may be glorified through Jesus Christ,
to whom be praise and dominion for ever and ever. Amen. 1 Peter 4:11

-
New covenent
But He answered and said, “It is written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone,
but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.’ ”
-

I would not dismiss the Astronomy observance.
They could even tell you what day passover was, say in 31 ad.
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
5,977
400
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There is NO natural weekly cycle in nature that man can follow, or from the stars.
It is from creation week, when God placed his presence in it making it holy and known.

Below is a list of languages that indicate a seven day weekly cycle
with the seventh day as the Sabbath / Rest.

Shemitic
Hebrew Bible Yom Ha Shabbath or Day of the Sabbath
Hebrew (ancient and modern) Shabbath or Sabbath
Targum of Onkelos (Hebrew literature) Yom Shviaa or Day Seventh AND Sabbath or Sabbath
Kurdistan Jews (Targum dialect) Yoymet Shabbat Kodesh or Holy Sabbath Day
Ancient Syriac Shabbatho or Sabbath
Chaldee Syriac (Kurdistan; Urumia, Persia) Shapta or Sabbath
Samaritan (Nablas, Palestine) (use old Hebrew letters) Yoma Hasheviah
or Day the Seventh AND Shabbath or Sabbath
Babylonian (Euphrates and Tigris Valleys, Mesopotamia) Sabatu or Sabbath
Assyrian (Euphrates & Tigris Valleys, Mesopotamia) Sabatu or Sabbath
Arabic (very old names) Shiyar or Chief or Rejoicing Day
Arabic (ancient and modern; W. Asia, E, W & N Africa) Assabt or The Sabbath
Maltese (Malta) Issibt or Sabbath
Tigre (Abyssinia) Sanbat or Sabbath
Amharic (Abyssinia) Sanbat or Sabbath
Falasha (Jews of Abyssinia) Yini Sanbat or The Sabbat

Hamitic
Coptic (Egypt; a dead language for 300 years) Pi Sabbaton or The Sabbath
Orma or Galla (south of Abyssinia) Zambada or Sabbath
Tamashek or Towarek (ancient Libyan or Numidian) Ahal Essabt or The Sabbath Day
Kabyle or Berber (Ancient Numidian; N Africa) Ghas or Sabbath Day
Hausa (Central Africa) Aseebatu or The Sabbath

Japhetic
Sanscrit (India) Shanivar or Saturn-day
Hindi (India) Shumiwar or Saturn-day
Pali (India) Sanivaro or Saturn-day
Urdu or Hindustani (Islamic and Hindu, India) Shamba or Sabbath; And Sanichar or Saturn
Pashto or Afghan (Afghanistan) Khali or Unemployed day; And Shamba or Holiday, Sabbath
Pahlavi or Pahlavi-Pazand (Ancient Persian) Kevan or Saturn; And Shambid or Fragrance - The pleasantest day of the week; And Dies Sabbati or Sabbath
Persian (Persia; Modern Iran) Shambih or Holiday, Sabbath
Armenian (Armenia) Shapat or Sabbath
Kurdish (Kurdistan) Shamba or Sabbath
Brahuiky (Beluchistan) Awalihafta or First or Chief of the Seven; And Shambe or Sabbath

Tartaric
Mongolian (Sharra-Mongolian; Eastern Mongolia) Sanitear and Bemba or The Son of the Sun, Saturn
Kalmuk (Western Mongolia) Bembe Graku or Saturn Planet
Turkish (Osmanlian; Turkey) Yomessabt or Day the Sabbath
Lazen (Pashelik of Trebisond) Ssabatun or Sabbath

Monosyllabic
Chinese (Roman Catholic; earlier) Chanlitsi or Worship-day Seven
Mohammadan Chinese Saibitai or Sabbath
Annamite (Annam) Ngaythubay or Day in order Seven
Ancient Peguan (Pegu-Burma) T'pauh or (Day) Seven
Khassi (Cossyah Hills, East of Bengal) Ka sngi sait-jain or A day to wash clothes; Purification-day
Tibetan (Tibet) Za-pen pa or (Planet Seven)
Boutan (Little Tibet) Pen-pa or Eye of God=Saturn; AND Odsardunpa or Seventh Brilliant Star
Georgian (Caucasus) Shabati or Sabbath
Suanian (Caucasus)Ingouish (Caucasus) Sammtyn or Sabbath
Aware or Avar (Daghistan; Cis-Caucasus) Samat qo or Sabbath Day

Polynesian
Malayan (Sumatra) hari Sabtu or Day Sabbath
Javanese (Java) Saptoe (saptu) or Sabbath
Sunda (West Java) Saptu or Sabbath
Dayak (Borneo) Sabtu or Sabbath
Makssar (Southern Celebes and Salayer Islands) Sattu or Sabbath
Bugis (Celebes) Sattu or Sabbath
Malagassay (Madagascar) Alsabotsy or The Sabbath
Nuforian (NW New Guinea) Ras Fiek or Day Seven

African
Swahili (East Africa) Assabu or The Sabbath
Congo (West Africa) Satade or Saturday; AND Kiaosabulu or Sabbado: Sabbath
Isolated Languages?
Wolof (Sengambia, W Africa) Alere-asser or Last Day - Sabbath
Fulah (W Africa) Essibt or The Sabbath
Mandingo (South of Senegal, W Africa) Sibiti or Sabbath
Teda (Central Africa) Essebdu or The Sabbath
Bornu or Kanuri (Central Africa) Sibda or Sabbath
Fulfulde (Central Africa) Assebdu or Sabbath
Sonyal (Central Africa) Assebdu or Sabbath
Logone (Central Africa) Se-sibde or Sabbath
Wandals (Central Africa) Sidba or Sabbath
Bagrimma (Central Africa) Sibbedi or Sabbath
Maba (Central Africa) Sab. or Sabbath

Miscellaneous
Norman French (10th and 11th centuries) Seabedi, Samaday, Semadi or Sabbath Day
Ancient French (12 and 13th centuries) Samedi or Sabbath Day
D?oc. France (ancient and modern) Dissata, Dissate or Day Sabbath
Ecclesiastical Roman Sabatum
Parliamentary (British) Dies Sabbati
Basque (Spain and France) Larumbat or One Quarter (moon)
Finnish (Finland) Lauvantai or Corruptions of Icelandic Laugardagur
Estonian (Estonia) Lau-paaw or Bathday
Livonian (Baltic Russia) Puol-paava or Half Day
Lap (Laplanders, Norway) Lavardak or Corruption of Ice. Lang.
Morduin (Russia) Subbota, Suota or Sabbath
Tsheremissian (Russia) Kuks-keca or Dry-day (day without work)
Permian (Russia) Subota or Sabbath
Votiak (Russia)
Hungarian (Hungary) Szombat or Sabbath
Ostiac (Russia) Chotmetchatl or Sixth-day; AND Juolynchatl or Hinder end-day
Greek (Greece) (Sabbath)
Modern Greek (Greece) (Sabbath)
Latin (Italy) Sabbatum or Sabbath; AND Dies Saturni or Day of Saturn
Italian (Italy) Sabato or Sabbath
Spanish (Spain) Sabado or Sabbath
Portuguese (Portugal) Sabado or Sabbath
French (France) Samedi or Sabbath-day
Roman (Spain, Catalonia) Dissapte or Day-Sabbath
Wallachian (Romania or Wallachia) Sambata or Sabbath
Old High German (South Germany) Sambaztag or Sabbath's day
High German (Germany) Samstag or Sabbath's day
Icelandic (Iceland) Laugardagur or (of bath-day)
Swedish (Sweden) Lordag or Corruption of Icelandic Laugardagur
Danish (Denmark) Laverdag or Corruption of Icelandic Laugardagur
Old Slave (Bulgaria) Subbota or Sabbath
Russian (Russia) Subbota or Sabbath
Illyrian (Dalmatia, Serbia) Subota or Sabbath
New Slovenian (Illyrie in Austria) Sobota or Sabbath
Bulgarian (Bulgaria) Subbota or Sabbath
Polish (Poland) Sobota or Sabbath
Bohemian (Bohemia) Sobota or Sabbath
Lusatian (Saxony) Sobota or Sabbath
Polabic (borders of the Elbe) Subuta or Sabbath
Lithuanian (Lithuania) fubata or Sabbath
Prussian (Prussia; Germany) Sabatico or Sabbath
English Bible (England) The Seventh Day, The Sabbath

This could not have happened if there was no flood and no tower of Babel.
this should prove the Sabbath day was known back then to mankind.
-

How did Noah know how to record months and years when the flood happened,
if he did not know Gods calender to record time.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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There is No need to determine when the Sabbath is by the the moon.

Once the 7th day was made at creation, making a 7 day week,
no need to try and figure when the Sabbath day starts except to
just know how to count to seven.
ok, but this is just you stating it. proof by 'because you say so'
every other appointed day in the Law is counted by the lunar cycle. why would one appointed day be different?
why does Exodus 16:1 tell us exactly which day of which month it is, the first time a sabbath is ever recorded as being commanded or observed by any man?
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
2,782
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ok, but this is just you stating it. proof by 'because you say so'
every other appointed day in the Law is counted by the lunar cycle. why would one appointed day be different?
why does Exodus 16:1 tell us exactly which day of which month it is, the first time a sabbath is ever recorded as being commanded or observed by any man?
As I understand GOD started the 'count for the Sabbath. There is no scripture telling us WE have to do this every week by any other means ....but just count to 7 from rhe day GOD established it ! This is helping us to look foreward to a spiritual future and eternal life with GOD when every day will be holy in HIS holy presence...rather than harking back to the physical creation which SPIRIT does not depend on. Can you see that PH ?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
25,004
6,536
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As I understand GOD started the 'count for the Sabbath. There is no scripture telling us WE have to do this every week by any other means ....but just count to 7 from rhe day GOD established it ! This is helping us to look foreward to a spiritual future and eternal life with GOD when every day will be holy in HIS holy presence...rather than harking back to the physical creation which SPIRIT does not depend on. Can you see that PH ?
He started the count for every other appointed day of the Law by the new moon. how do I decide one day is not like these other sabbaths? knowing that the first time He commands it He gives the exact day and month ((both of which are counted from the new moon)), and it happens to be aligned with all the feast sabbaths ((Exodus 16)) is of interest.

just because a human says so isn't really weight enough. it was unbelieving Jews who decided to call it every saturday in the 4th century when they abandoned their old way of keeping time in favor of adopting the Julian calendar. should we be suspicious of that?

that's what I'm asking.

and the Spirit says, Christ is the substance, the observation of a day is a shadow. it's written.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
7,085
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He started the count for every other appointed day of the Law by the new moon. how do I decide one day is not like these other sabbaths? knowing that the first time He commands it He gives the exact day and month ((both of which are counted from the new moon)), and it happens to be aligned with all the feast sabbaths ((Exodus 16)) is of interest.

just because a human says so isn't really weight enough. it was unbelieving Jews who decided to call it every saturday in the 4th century when they abandoned their old way of keeping time in favor of adopting the Julian calendar. should we be suspicious of that?

that's what I'm asking.

and the Spirit says, Christ is the substance, the observation of a day is a shadow. it's written.
they seem to have the thought that repeating the same things over and over will make them true.
 

Studyman

Senior Member
Oct 11, 2017
3,570
515
113
no, you did not offend me. I know you do not know what you are talking about. posthuman has gave you an 18 wheeler trailer full of good, sound theology, you have rejected it all. shows what you know. or don't.
Yes, the world is full of "good" sound theology. Wesley, the Pope, Calvin, Luther. Even the serpent gave Eve a reasonable argument against honoring God with respect and obedience. And yes, by the Grace of God I have escaped their "Theology". I'm not interested in your, or some other religious man's "Philosophy". I am interested in getting my information from the Christ, and there is only one of Him. And though preachers come and go, His Word's Last forever.

I don't expect you to understand.
 

Studyman

Senior Member
Oct 11, 2017
3,570
515
113
John 20:1 (KJV)
The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark,
unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.



according to the bible:

"And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night.



Not true, even if you go by a man made clock, midnight starts a new day, not morning.

If you went by how God defines a day according to the bible,
it is the evening[night time] then morning[daytime]that makes a 24 hr period

"And the evening and the morning were the first day.
And the evening and the morning were the second day.
And the evening and the morning were the third day.



It was still dark "not light outside" when Mary saw Christ was gone already.
So before sunrise , while it was still dark outside. Sunrise only marks the start of
the daylight portion of the day, the day had started at nightfall the previous evening,
after the Sabbath had pasted.

It was not a sunrise resurrection like people suggest.



I am still suprised people can not figure how long 3 days and 3 nights last. The only
sign given by Christ disproves the tradation of good friday to sunday sunrise.

And the evening and the morning were the first day.
And the evening and the morning were the second day.
And the evening and the morning were the third day.
Religious traditions of man are more important than what the Word of God says to most folks. The Mainstream Preachers of Christ's time chose their man made doctrines and traditions over the Word's of the same God they claimed to serve, even after this same God showed them.

Rather than except what those who understood the Word showed them , like Stephen, and repent, they chose to preserve their traditions and doctrines of man and place him on permanent ignore.

This is a circle that has been repeated over and over since the serpent convinced Eve, using parts of God's Word, to trust her own vision over the instruction of God.

Very good post PA :)
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
8,441
3,623
113
Proof of a Sabbath Resurrection is Scriptural...nothing to do with human witnessess 1Cor 15v3,4. The Word of God speaks Truth, not you or me except we speak HIS WORDS. No need to argue !

sorry

you use scripture to provide 'proof' of your opinions

that is not how scripture works

your entire premise of Sabbath or else is false

you can worship any day you want and every day

your biggest fault lies in condemning and heaping condemnation which the Bible EXPLICITLY says do not do ...do not judge other believers by their observance or lack of observance of days and what they eat

however, you do the complete opposite

and you have been provided with these scripture references many many times and dismiss it

so, you know, that is YOUR problem
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
8,441
3,623
113
John 20:1 (KJV)
The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark,
unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.



according to the bible:

"And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night.



Not true, even if you go by a man made clock, midnight starts a new day, not morning.

If you went by how God defines a day according to the bible,
it is the evening[night time] then morning[daytime]that makes a 24 hr period

"And the evening and the morning were the first day.
And the evening and the morning were the second day.
And the evening and the morning were the third day.



It was still dark "not light outside" when Mary saw Christ was gone already.
So before sunrise , while it was still dark outside. Sunrise only marks the start of
the daylight portion of the day, the day had started at nightfall the previous evening,
after the Sabbath had pasted.

It was not a sunrise resurrection like people suggest.



I am still suprised people can not figure how long 3 days and 3 nights last. The only
sign given by Christ disproves the tradation of good friday to sunday sunrise.

And the evening and the morning were the first day.
And the evening and the morning were the second day.
And the evening and the morning were the third day.
sorry

you use scripture to provide 'proof' of your opinions

that is not how scripture works

your entire premise of Sabbath or else is false

you can worship any day you want and every day

your biggest fault lies in condemning and heaping condemnation which the Bible EXPLICITLY says do not do ...do not judge other believers by their observance or lack of observance of days and what they eat

however, you do the complete opposite

and you have been provided with these scripture references many many times and dismiss it

so, you know, that is YOUR problem
 

7seasrekeyed

Senior Member
Aug 27, 2017
8,441
3,623
113
they seem to have the thought that repeating the same things over and over will make them true.

most people call that brainwashing

it's a technique used to make people believe lies

thankfully, we know better