Calvinist Kitchen...stirring the pot

boggles the mind it does

if, as tulip states, one cannot be saved unless first regenerated, then why do you now state a person can think for themself if presented with the option of God granted or worldy repentance

I don't suppose you saw that you did that though. The truth still manages to escape through the well groomed tulip gardens

Interesting eh? ... I guess a bit of a need to back peddle a bit on the harshness of the dogma.

I thought that the edge might have been off due to all those memes being posted with no actual dogma needing to be advertised

out of practice, yah know?

Notice how we are never able to understand, comprehend, and are unlearned....

?? Did not Paul say the opposite the n romans 1 bro?

I did not make a great decision. I just did as the tax collector did and became bancrupcy and cried out for mercy

Notice how we are never able to understand, comprehend, and are unlearned....

fruit grows on trees or even bushes, but you would have fruit suspended in nothingness

the word 'fruit' is a metaphor for the work of the Holy Spirit in our lives, to produce the character of Christ in us

the Holy Spirit does not work in a non believers life in that manner. you will not find such a thing as you state anywhere in the Bible

Jesus draws people as He states if He is lifted up He will DRAW (all men unto him..women too) . if you think that the faith a person has is caused by the Holy Spirit BEFORE they are saved, then WHAT ABOUT THE REST OF THE FRUIT?

HUH? WHERE'S IT AT?

here is Galatians 5 containing the description of the fruit of the Spirit

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.

Note that faith is actually translated faithfulness here, which is in keeping with the rest of the descriptions, rather than faith. The faithfulness is to God, to Christ....it is not the faith that saves, it is the faith that keeps a person IN Christ

But I digress, if a tulip person thinks they are regenerated BEFORE salvation, then where is the rest of the fruit?

I would tend to think they do not need salvation if they are already on board and loving, joyous, patient etc, little calvins running around such as the fine examples in this thread

It is God's will and desire that none shall perish but all have everlasting life. He is fully capable of accomplishing this.

“But the objection is not yet resolved, that if all things are done by the will of God, and men contrive nothing except by His will and ordination, then God is the author of all evils.”
John Calvin

God's sovereignty is not properly understood within the Calvinist dogma... rather than correctly understand how God works in the affairs of men... and brings His to pass without direct control Calvin makes God responsible for all evil.... Calvin has issues with his own will, and the will of others as did Augustine.

There is some irony in that Calvin who preached the "bondage of the will" had no problem putting other people's will under his bondage.

God in the end did give us "a will" and the ability to choose and this is evidenced throughout scripture.

The ability to choose what?

You can't choose something you don't believe in. Its an impossibility.

You can only choose what you do believe in.


And then we ask the simple question "where did that belief come from to begin with"?

And then we ask the simple question "where did that belief come from to begin with"?

the Spirit would know best what it means. the Spirit and the writers of the Scriptures.


it is good to keep a somewhat open mind on things so to Allow the Spirit to speak.


for the Spirit knows more than we do. but We can learn more and more if we keep our minds open.

I would be the last one to say that God couldn't do something.

We don't know Gods whole plan. No matter how some people claim the opposite.

“But the objection is not yet resolved, that if all things are done by the will of God, and men contrive nothing except by His will and ordination, then God is the author of all evils.”
John Calvin

Perhaps it is best to not read Calvin because he sounds like an absolute whack job regarding spiritual concerns.

That's usually the response I get when I tell people who worship their own will that they in fact do worship their own will.

They get upset. They get mad.

What is so special about your will anyway? Isn't trading it for Gods Will a much better trade?

This is part of the free will’ers problem, they truly believe man is autonomous: self governing or without outside governance, acting without ANY outside influence or limitation. This is an unbiblical, pagan view of the will of man. One only needs to read the Bible to see the will of man is fallen after Adam and Eve, like a disease that plagues all mankind. His will, his reason and his logic, his heart mind and soul, is evil continuously in need of cleansing. Cleansing offered only by God the Spirit who comes to whom he wills, when he wills and why he wills, for his own glory that no man may boast.
Sorry free will’ers, you’re not autonomous, you’re not gods who resurrect yourselves from the dead, who remove your own hearts of stone and replace it with a heart of flesh, who summon God the Spirit and command Him to dwell within...