Sabbath Obligation?

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Truth7t7

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Just gonna add a simple idea. Jesus said he fulfilled the law. If you follow Jesus' 2 commands all the ten laws are automatically falling under them. Love God, love others. Thats what the ten commandments were about. The sabbath rest was a forrunner to how our redeemed lives should be-- every day focusing on God, resting in Him, in constant communication with our Father in heaven. The old testament israelites did not have that fellowship with God. Every law, rule, feast and festival, were symbolic of our future relationship with the risen Savior, and our Father. Anything else is legalistic.
Jesus Christ Upheld The 10 Commandments

Matthew 19:16-17KJV

16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
 

acts5_29

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Apr 17, 2020
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Some obligations we take onto ourselves voluntarily. Sabbath being one.
 
S

Scribe

Guest
I'm a sinner saved by God's grace, thank you Lord Jesus!

Nobody is telling you how to live your life,
Your distraction of (Holiness) dosent delete the factual truth of scripture, the 7th day sabbath applies to all Creation, some just aren't aware of this fact.

No place in the Holy Bible has God retracted his Sanctifying or Hallowing of the 7th day Sabbath, and Man's command to follow it, and I'm not a 7th Day Adventist nor do I follow Ellen G. Whites teachings, or any offshoot thereof.

Genesis 2:2-3KJV
2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Exodus 20:8-11KJV
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
Keep My Commandments :)

Jesus Christ Is The Great (I Am) That Delivered The 10 Commandments To Moses.

John 14:12-21KJV
12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.
13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.
15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.
16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.
20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.
21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

Jesus Christ Upheld The 10 Commandments, Just One Example Below.

Matthew 15:4-9KJV
4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.
5 But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me;
6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.
7 Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,
8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.
9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Not going to get in a 'right fight' over the sabbath. That has already been done and Jesus won. :)
 

Dino246

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Jun 30, 2015
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Isa 56:1 Thus saith the LORD, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.
Isa 56:2 Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.
Isa 56:3 Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the LORD, speak, saying, The LORD hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree.
Isa 56:4 For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;
Isa 56:5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.
Isa 56:6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;
Isa 56:7 Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people.
Isa 56:8 The Lord GOD which gathereth the outcasts of Israel saith, Yet will I gather others to him, beside those that are gathered unto him.

Joh 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

What texts were you reading?
My apologies; I missed the "-8" in the Isaiah reference. There certainly is no reference in John 10:16.
 

Dino246

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You would be in error.

Num_9:3 In the fourteenth day of this month, at even, ye shall keep it in his appointed season: according to all the rites of it, and according to all the ceremonies thereof, shall ye keep it.

The "ceremonies" (which are carnal) are not the "spiritual" Law of God's Ten Commandments.
The NASB has "statutes and ordinances"; ceremonies aren't mentioned.

Ceremonies ordained by God are not "carnal".
 

Dino246

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Your verses quoted in Collosians 2:16-17 seen below, was speaking to the believers that were following the New Moons And Sabbath Days, that were being judged by others.

As clearly seen below in Isaiah 66:22-23 below, the New Moons And Sabbath Days Are (ETERNAL) and will be observed in the (ETERNAL) New Heavens and Earth.

Collosians 2:16-17KJV
16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
Verse 17 makes clear that they are fulfilled in Christ. There is nothing remaining for us to do with them.
 

Dino246

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Just ask for the objective factual evidence to be provided for such a bizarre and erroneous statement. The terms "ceremonial" & "moral", &c., are even replete throughout most commentaries modern and ancient.
There is no passage in Scripture that identifies which is which. There are passages that identify a few as ceremonial, but these are far from exhaustive. There are 613 specific ordinances. Does Scripture tell us which is in which category? No. Does Scripture even identify the categories? No.

Next....
 

Nehemiah6

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Jul 18, 2017
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When you are able to show where our Savior rescinded the Seventh Day as the Sabbath of the Lord...
When Christ -- in His resurrection -- became "the First Fruits of them that slept" (on the morrow after the Sabbath -- the 8th day), He superseded the 7th day, and made the 8th day the Christian Sabbath. It is not the day but the principles of the Sabbath that God is concerned with: (1) rest, (2) worship, and (3) good works. The apostolic churches met for worship and the Breaking of Bread on the first day of the week. This was spiritually significant.
 

JaumeJ

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Jul 2, 2011
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When Christ -- in His resurrection -- became "the First Fruits of them that slept" (on the morrow after the Sabbath -- the 8th day), He superseded the 7th day, and made the 8th day the Christian Sabbath. It is not the day but the principles of the Sabbath that God is concerned with: (1) rest, (2) worship, and (3) good works. The apostolic churches met for worship and the Breaking of Bread on the first day of the week. This was spiritually significant.
Your knowledge seems to of those things never written. Where does it say the Seventh Day is now the first day of the week. Where does it say our rest will begin on the first day of creation? Why are so many hell-bent on changing what the Father taught us, that is the Everlasting Father, Jesus.
 

WithinReason

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Feb 21, 2020
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There are 613 specific ordinances.
Judaism 101: A List of the 613 Mitzvot (Commandments)

Ok. I know how some like ordered lists, so hear goes:

[1.] To begin with, there is not a single place in all the TaNaKh, neither the portion thereof, the Torah (Gen-Deut) where God, Moses, Joshua, or any person of heaven above, or on this earth below, state on biblical record that there are exactly '613' 'mitzvot'. For the New Testament minded (Matt-Rev), the same applies also. Again, absent. Jesus, as a final example (for the New Testament minded), did not once enumerate the 'mitzvot' of the Torah for us in such fashion, to '613' or any other such number.

[2.] The enumeration of '613' is a Rabbincal, yea even after a Talmudical, fashioning or calculation or enumeration. No one has to take my word for this, it is said as much on the very site so kindly provided to us (it has been provided so many times, I lost count):

"... Below is a list of the 613 mitzvot (commandments). It is based primarily on the list compiled by Rambam in the Mishneh Torah, but I have consulted other sources as well. As I said in the page on halakhah, Rambam's list is probably the most widely accepted list, but it is not the only one. The order is my own, as are the explanations of how some rules are derived from some biblical passages. ..." - http://www.jewfaq.org/613.htm
As a side note:

The RaMBaM (whom I have read on numerous occasions, with others, such as RaMBaN, Pirke, etc) is actually, Ra(bbi) M(oses) Ba(ni) M(aimon), aka Maimonides, of the 12th cent Morocco & Egypt (during the Almoravid (Muslim) empire, and died under the Ayyubid sultanate) - Link

[3.] RaMBaM's listing isn't the only one. There are other listings, by other Rabbis, all several thousand years removed from Moses or Joshua, and the website provided demonstrates the accuracy of this point.

[4.] RaMBaM's order of listing isn't the only one. There are other orderings, by other Rabbis and persons non-Rabbi (scholars, etc), and again, the very website provided, demonstrates this by stating it out as matters of fact, and in personal ordered listing preferred instead to RaMBaM's (example 2 orders at least on the face of it).

[5.] RaMBaM's explanation for the listing and ordering thereof is not the only one. There are explanations, just as there are other listings and orderings by other Rabbis, etc. (generally, not exclusively, following after RaMBaM, (thus post 12th cent), possible just more easily accessible)

[6.] The '613' number is for some calculated on Gematraic principles, with differing reasons or starting points by differing Rabbis, and for this reason, some disagree that it should be said number, for instance:

"... I disagree there are 613 Mitzvot because the explanation for the number is based on gematria, however the gematria of the Torah is not Standard ( https://www.academia.edu/39659743/Long_preview_of_The_Genesis_Wheel_and_other_hermeneutical_essays ). Instead of the letters Shin and Tav having the value of 300 and 400, they are valued at 3 and 4, and using this most secret gematria the number of Mitzvot would be 217 (31 × 7). However 613 is discovered with this gematria in the opening verses of Genesis so it is still a very significant gematria number.

We first get the idea of 613 mitzvot from Rabbi Simlai:

From Makkot 24a:
"דרש רבי שמלאי שש מאות ושלש עשרה מצות נאמרו לו למשה שלש מאות וששים וחמש לאוין כמנין ימות החמה ומאתים וארבעים ושמונה עשה כנגד איבריו של אדם אמר רב המנונא מאי קרא (דברים לג, ד) תורה צוה לנו משה מורשה תורה בגימטריא שית מאה וחד סרי הוי אנכי ולא יהיה לך מפי הגבורה שמענום

§ Rabbi Simlai taught: There were 613 mitzvot stated to Moses in the Torah, consisting of 365 prohibitions corresponding to the number of days in the solar year, and 248 positive mitzvot corresponding to the number of a person’s limbs. Rav Hamnuna said: What is the verse that alludes to this? It is written: “Moses commanded to us the Torah, an inheritance of the congregation of Jacob” (Deuteronomy 34:4). The word Torah, in terms of its numerical value [gimatriyya], is 611, the number of mitzvot that were received and taught by Moses our teacher. In addition, there are two mitzvot: “I am the Lord your God” and: “You shall have no other gods” (Exodus 20:2, 3), the first two of the Ten Commandments, that we heard from the mouth of the Almighty, for a total of 613."[1]

However the word תורה is valued at 215; Tav:4 + Vav:6 + Resh:200 + Heh:5 = 215. So if we add the two for the first two commandments the people heard at Sinai: 215 + 2 = 217.

Regarding the number of צִיצִית which is supposed to equal the number of Mitzvot:

Rashi "וזכרתם את כל מצות ה'. שֶׁמִּנְיַן גִּימַטְרִיָּא שֶׁל צִיצִית שֵׁשׁ מֵאוֹת, וּשְׁמוֹנָה חוּטִין וַחֲמִשָּׁה קְשָׁרִים הֲרֵי תרי"ג (תנחומא): You will remember all of Adonoy’s commandments. As the numerical value of צִיצִית is 600, and the eight threads and five knots equal 613."[2]

צִיצִית = 204

plus 8 threads and 5 knots = 217.

You can check the sums on this gematria calculator which uses the correct gematria of the Torah; https://shematria.pythonanywhere.com/
Vilna Gaon in Orot Hagra also disagreed that 613 was the correct number, saying;

It definitely cannot be said that only 613, and no more, come under the category of mitzvot. For if so, there are only three mitzvot from Berei**** until Bo, and many portions of the Torah contain no mitzvot. That is not plausible… The mitzvot are thus multitudinous beyond enumeration… ..." - https://www.reddit.com/r/Gematria/comments/d0jzef
 

WithinReason

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Feb 21, 2020
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There are 613 specific ordinances.
[7.] Moses specifically said by inspiration of God, that what God spoke and wrote at Mt. Sinai with His own voice and finger from Heaven were "the ten commandments". God came down upon Mt. Sinai in awesome majesty, with the whole mountain covered in the fire of the presence of the Holy Angels of God, so that none but those whom God called up were able to come near.

Exo_34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.

Deu_4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.

Deu_10:4 And he wrote on the tables, according to the first writing, the ten commandments, which the LORD spake unto you in the mount out of the midst of the fire in the day of the assembly: and the LORD gave them unto me.

In each place the Hebrew word "[1697] dabar" is used, as the Ten Commandments are not merely laws or commands, but individual promises of God each that He would perform in those who would walk in His covenant. More on that later as needful.

[8.] The "ten commandments" that God spake in Person to all the people without the mediator Moses, were a complete Law, nothing further being added unto them, except later as to be written in a scroll/book through a mediator (Moses):

Deu_5:22 These words the LORD spake unto all your assembly in the mount out of the midst of the fire, of the cloud, and of the thick darkness, with a great voice: and he added no more. And he wrote them in two tables of stone, and delivered them unto me.

[9.] The "ten commandments" were written by God's own finger originally on sapphire stone and which second set was placed into the "pattern" Ark of the Covenant in the earthly tabernacle (Exodus 25:16,21).

[10.] The other precepts, statutes, laws, commands, ordinances, etc were all given by God through the mediator Moses, to be written by Moses' hand, and placed not inside of the Ark, but to be placed in the side of the Ark:

Deu_31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

So, while important, God makes distinction, by several means. The many other things which God gave fall under the umbrella of the Ten Commandments:

Psa_119:96 I have seen an end of all perfection: but thy commandment is exceeding broad.

and as such '613' probably wouldn't even come close to the depth of God's Ten Commandments, which are the expansion of His perfect character of Love, which itself is expressed in the greatest (Deuteronomy 6:5) and second greatest commandments (Leviticus 19:17-18) (both of whose contexts are the Ten Commandments, see Deut. 5, etc).

[11.] The '613' enumeration only considers material within the texts of the Torah (Gen-Deut), and not any other material from the Nevi'im or Ketuvim, as if God somehow stopped talking and giving commands through men, priests or prophets or kings, see Isaiah 8:20 (Law and Testimony)

[12.] Even from a basic search of scripture, the Torah itself makes differences between words:

Gen 26:5 KJB Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

Gen 26:5 KJB Str. BecauseH6118 thatH834 AbrahamH85 obeyedH8085 my voice,H6963 and keptH8104 my charge,H4931 my commandments,H4687 my statutes,H2708 and my laws.H8451

Gen 26:5 HOT עקב אשׁר־שׁמע אברהם בקלי וישׁמר משׁמרתי מצותי חקותי ותורתי׃

Gen 26:5 HOT Str. עקבH6118 אשׁרH834 שׁמעH8085 אברהםH85 בקליH6963 וישׁמרH8104 משׁמרתיH4931 מצותיH4687 חקותיH2708 ותורתי׃H8451 (apologies for how this posts, not much can be done about that, I used highligher to mark the beginning and ending, so while the sentence reads left to right, each individual word correctly reads right to left)

Gen 26:5 HOT Translit. ëqev ásher-shäma av'rähäm B'qoliy waYish'mor mish'mar'Tiy mitz'wotay chuQôtay w'tôrotäy

Notice the distinction made between H4687 (mitzvot) and H8451 (torah), which is again found in Exodus 16:28,

Exo 16:28 And the LORD said unto Moses, How long refuse ye to keep my commandments and my laws?

This should suffice for now.
 

Truth7t7

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May 19, 2020
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When Christ -- in His resurrection -- became "the First Fruits of them that slept" (on the morrow after the Sabbath -- the 8th day), He superseded the 7th day, and made the 8th day the Christian Sabbath. It is not the day but the principles of the Sabbath that God is concerned with: (1) rest, (2) worship, and (3) good works. The apostolic churches met for worship and the Breaking of Bread on the first day of the week. This was spiritually significant.
The 7th day Sabbath is superceded, and the 8th day is the Christian Sabbath, what you been smoking, big smiles!

Once upon a time in the land of fairy tales and make believe :giggle:

No place in the Holy Bible has God retracted his Sanctifying or Hallowing of the 7th day Sabbath, Nor his command for man to follow it.

Genesis 2:2-3KJV
2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Exodus 20:8-11KJV
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
 
F

Fundamental

Guest
But His most important commandment is often forgotten.
“Love one and another like He loved us.” Sabbath is between God and the person. If one can’t hold the Sabbath due to specific reasons that’s ok. Jesus could not be more clear in Matthew 12.

We must also read the Holy Bible through His Spirit and not by letters alone like pharisees used to do.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
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But His most important commandment is often forgotten.
“Love one and another like He loved us.” Sabbath is between God and the person. If one can’t hold the Sabbath due to specific reasons that’s ok. Jesus could not be more clear in Matthew 12.

We must also read the Holy Bible through His Spirit and not by letters alone like pharisees used to do.
The simple truth is, the reverence that is given to (Sunday) observation should be given to the 7th day (Sabbath)

Church service, business closures, etc

The Pagan ways of man has entered the church a fact, as many sit blind in ignorance to God's truth.

Easter: Pagan fertility rites, surrounding the Verbal Equinox

Christmas: Pagan Worship in the rebirth of the sun, winter solstice.

Sunday: Pagan day of the Sun worshippers, established by pagan Roman Emperor Constantine in 321AD
 
F

Fundamental

Guest
The simple truth is, the reverence that is given to (Sunday) observation should be given to the 7th day (Sabbath)

Church service, business closures, etc

The Pagan ways of man has entered the church a fact, as many sit blind in ignorance to God's truth.

Easter: Pagan fertility rites, surrounding the Verbal Equinox

Christmas: Pagan Worship in the rebirth of the sun, winter solstice.

Sunday: Pagan day of the Sun worshippers, established by pagan Roman Emperor Constantine in 321AD
To be honest. I never understood why European churches went from saturday to sunday. But looking at it from the moon and sun perspective, it makes sense. Jesus Christ brought the light so sunday makes perfect sense. I just don’t know the exact history behind it.
 

JaumeJ

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Jul 2, 2011
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I confess I have quoted others stating 611 and 613. Why? Possibly because the number really does not seem important in being obedient to our Father, it is the heart, soul and mind. Yes, many of the written laws are to be obeyed, but this can only be under the explanations given byb Yeshua. So, I may quote the 611 in the future but only as a general idea of the number since the number is reduced drastically by the fulfillment of Yeshua, and the continuing fulfillment by His Body Members. To understand this, one must learn of Yeshua, and not of flesh.
 

Dino246

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Jun 30, 2015
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[7.] Moses specifically said by inspiration of God, that what God spoke and wrote at Mt. Sinai with His own voice and finger from Heaven were "the ten commandments". God came down upon Mt. Sinai in awesome majesty, with the whole mountain covered in the fire of the presence of the Holy Angels of God, so that none but those whom God called up were able to come near.

Exo_34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.

Deu_4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.

Deu_10:4 And he wrote on the tables, according to the first writing, the ten commandments, which the LORD spake unto you in the mount out of the midst of the fire in the day of the assembly: and the LORD gave them unto me.

In each place the Hebrew word "[1697] dabar" is used, as the Ten Commandments are not merely laws or commands, but individual promises of God each that He would perform in those who would walk in His covenant. More on that later as needful.

[8.] The "ten commandments" that God spake in Person to all the people without the mediator Moses, were a complete Law, nothing further being added unto them, except later as to be written in a scroll/book through a mediator (Moses):

Deu_5:22 These words the LORD spake unto all your assembly in the mount out of the midst of the fire, of the cloud, and of the thick darkness, with a great voice: and he added no more. And he wrote them in two tables of stone, and delivered them unto me.

[9.] The "ten commandments" were written by God's own finger originally on sapphire stone and which second set was placed into the "pattern" Ark of the Covenant in the earthly tabernacle (Exodus 25:16,21).

[10.] The other precepts, statutes, laws, commands, ordinances, etc were all given by God through the mediator Moses, to be written by Moses' hand, and placed not inside of the Ark, but to be placed in the side of the Ark:

Deu_31:26 Take this book of the law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there for a witness against thee.

So, while important, God makes distinction, by several means. The many other things which God gave fall under the umbrella of the Ten Commandments:

Psa_119:96 I have seen an end of all perfection: but thy commandment is exceeding broad.

and as such '613' probably wouldn't even come close to the depth of God's Ten Commandments, which are the expansion of His perfect character of Love, which itself is expressed in the greatest (Deuteronomy 6:5) and second greatest commandments (Leviticus 19:17-18) (both of whose contexts are the Ten Commandments, see Deut. 5, etc).

[11.] The '613' enumeration only considers material within the texts of the Torah (Gen-Deut), and not any other material from the Nevi'im or Ketuvim, as if God somehow stopped talking and giving commands through men, priests or prophets or kings, see Isaiah 8:20 (Law and Testimony)

[12.] Even from a basic search of scripture, the Torah itself makes differences between words:

Gen 26:5 KJB Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

Gen 26:5 KJB Str. BecauseH6118 thatH834 AbrahamH85 obeyedH8085 my voice,H6963 and keptH8104 my charge,H4931 my commandments,H4687 my statutes,H2708 and my laws.H8451

Gen 26:5 HOT עקב אשׁר־שׁמע אברהם בקלי וישׁמר משׁמרתי מצותי חקותי ותורתי׃

Gen 26:5 HOT Str. עקבH6118 אשׁרH834 שׁמעH8085 אברהםH85 בקליH6963 וישׁמרH8104 משׁמרתיH4931 מצותיH4687 חקותיH2708 ותורתי׃H8451 (apologies for how this posts, not much can be done about that, I used highligher to mark the beginning and ending, so while the sentence reads left to right, each individual word correctly reads right to left)

Gen 26:5 HOT Translit. ëqev ásher-shäma av'rähäm B'qoliy waYish'mor mish'mar'Tiy mitz'wotay chuQôtay w'tôrotäy

Notice the distinction made between H4687 (mitzvot) and H8451 (torah), which is again found in Exodus 16:28,

Exo 16:28 And the LORD said unto Moses, How long refuse ye to keep my commandments and my laws?

This should suffice for now.
Tl; dr.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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Sunday: Pagan day of the Sun worshippers, established by pagan Roman Emperor Constantine in 321AD
It has already been established in this very thread, and you yourself have read it, that hundreds of years before Constantine, the Church was meeting for worship on the day after sabbath, calling it the 8th day, which is the day on which Christ rose.

Please don't keep knowingly spreading misinformation.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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Not to mention that Constantine was a converted believer, not a pagan, when he made the longstanding tradition of the church a formal part of the Roman empire.

There is no doubt that Christians were actively distancing themselves from Judaism for the first 1,700 years after the resurrection. But there is abundant historical and also Biblical evidence showing that they have from the beginning met on the day of the week upon which Christ arose - and that doesn't happen to be the weekly sabbath, which the Jews only made every Saturday after they abandoned the lunar calendar God had instituted.

It's my opinion that the weekly sabbath according to scripture is counted from the beginning of the month, which is itself marked by the appearance of the new moon. That means it is not the also-pagan-named Julian calendar 'Saturn-day' but it is the 7th day after the new moon, from moon to moon.

IOW y'all lying about the origin of worship on the 8th day and y'all got the wrong day anyhow; you're not using the right calendar.
 

Truth7t7

Well-known member
May 19, 2020
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To be honest. I never understood why European churches went from saturday to sunday. But looking at it from the moon and sun perspective, it makes sense. Jesus Christ brought the light so sunday makes perfect sense. I just don’t know the exact history behind it.
Jesus is the light, so disregard the commandment to observe the 7th Day Sabbath, and replace it with the pagan sun worshippers (Sunday) that was established by pagan Roman Emperor Constantine in 321AD?

Real Big Smiles! :giggle: