When are we saved ?

I don't need to put my beliefs in boxes either. As long as they align with Scripture, I'm good

Yes. I think we should be able to discuss the Bible without people putting labels on us. Just because I believe in election, that does not make me a Calvinist and just because I believe in the effects of the fall doesn’t put me in a box either.

The Bible teaches election and the Bible teaches depravity of man. Don’t need the institutes of Calvin or the works of Arminius to know that.

Not you, but some people here have a bad habit of labeling people. That is counterproductive.

It’s interesting that the word “pistis” can be translated faith or faithfulness. With Christ, I think it’s His faithfulness that saves us, and our faith merely rests on His Faithfulness in what He has done, what He is doing, and what He will do.

Mormons can demonstrate scripture with scripture from the bible also ?

The point is HOW they became children of God? By faith IN Jesus christ . You can't keep trying the ' It only refers to the 'elect' switch- a -roo with every verse

I gave a link

Molinism affirms that God grants salvation, but a person has the choice to freely accept it or reject it.

When we repent, and receive Him as our Lord and Saviour, giving and surrendering our lives and hearts to Him, trusting in Him to help us. Loving Him, selflessly, with all our hearts!!! He is everything!!! We are so blessed, He helps establish us, little by little, bit by bit...faith to faith.

Then that would mean we could not recieve Jesus , recieve the Holy Spirit , recieve Christ's righteousness and be justified until we ' surrendered ' our lives . What ever that means? surely surrendering our lives takes a while ?

God does not "grant" eternal deliverance, he does, however grand deliverances (salvations) to his elect, as they sojourn here in this world, and the elect has the choice to accept it or reject it, which has nothing to do with risking their eternal inheritance.

You are right, but these actions come from the regenerate, and not from the unregenerate.

Little by little, bit by bit...faith to faith.

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I prefer these actions come with God, not without God. Everything is about Him and His work. I just want to keep my eyes on Him!!

Er no the bible says we recieve all of those things the moment we believe. Its not a instalment scheme.

Er no the bible says we recieve all of those things the moment we believe. Its not a instalment scheme.

Neither do we boast beyond our limits in the labors of others. But we hope that as your faith increases, our area of influence among you will greatly increase as well, 2 Corinthians 10:15 affirms that faith grows over time. Also 2 Peter 3:18affirms growth ~ But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To Him be the glory both now and to the day of eternity. Amen.

Um, that is what I said: Molinism affirms that God grants salvation, and man has a choice to either accept or reject.

You seem to feel you have a need to correct me on things I do not even say.

I wonder why that is

I am sorry, if I misread your statement. that you were making reference to the views of the Molinism, and not your personal views.

I don't need to put my beliefs in boxes either. As long as they align with Scripture, I'm good

That's just it! people do not become children of God, by faith in Christ.

I have explained this to you time and time again that the natural man only has faith in mankind, and what he accomplishes, which is not spiritual faith. To repeat myself; Spiritual faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit, and only comes with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in the new birth. The new birth is given by God's sovereign grace, without any participation of mankind.

Your agenda is to get the natural man to have the ability to believe in the things of the spirit, which contradicts scripture. I know that you do not like me mentioning harmonizing the scriptures, but you will not be able to understand the doctrine that Jesus taught if you have contradicting scriptures.