Do protestants have a reasonable non-Roman-Catholic explanation for John 20:22-23?

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TruthDefender said:
Only ONE, His church (those local congregations who follow His pattern from Scripture).
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beechan said:
Then what exactly which church?
The JW? Church of Later Day Saints? the Baptist? Methdist? Lutheren Church? Church of Presbyterian?
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A Holy Spirit inspired, understanding of biblical / scriptural / Holy Spirit inspired commentary, (by the apostles of Christ) = God's Word = Jesus ...
It is the ONLY criteria, The ONLY Standard, by which we can determine "What the Church of Christ is" "Who the Church body is..." and IF we are a part of the Body of Christ = His Church.

If you are looking to join the TRUE Body of Christ's Church, then compare these different 40,000+ congregations, with the "standard" from The Word, Jesus ... as outline above, using scriptural references ... Pray for the Holy Spirit's Guidance ( discernment ) and compare these different groups "fundamental doctrines" with the Word of God... If they don't match up... then find one that does ... (This is what I did 30 odd years ago...)
The first standard that I look to, to "quickly" evaluate whether a person, our a group of people, believe and follow Jesus, is # 4 & # 8 ABOVE.

If people are not keeping God's commandments, particular #4, the Sabbath ... then they are following and believing the other spirit in the world, being Satan ( the lord of this world, 2 Cor 4:4) and his Antichrist spirit, ( in this world) the Papacy, ( James 4:4 )

The Papacy ~~> Dan 7:25 He shall speak pompous words against the Most High, Shall persecute the saints of the Most High, And shall intend to change times and law. Then the saints shall be given into his hand For a time and times and half a time."

(change times and law) => changed the solemnity of God's 7th Day Sabbath to Sunday AND changed God's Law, (eg. the taking out of => );
Exo. 20: 3 You shall have no other gods before me. 4 You shall not make to you any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. 5 You shall not bow down yourself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; 6 And showing mercy to thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

I KNOW this is a hard pill to swallow, but it IS the Truth, according to Holy Spirit inspired scripture, The Word.
SO !! We each are REQUIRED BY GOD, as to "Who shall you follow ?"

Joel 24:15 "... But as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.”
~~Happy Sabbath Folks~~
 
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Follower777 said:
A Holy Spirit inspired, understanding of biblical / scriptural / Holy Spirit inspired commentary, (by the apostles of Christ) = God's Word = Jesus ...
It is the ONLY criteria, The ONLY Standard, by which we can determine "What the Church of Christ is" "Who the Church body is..." and IF we are a part of the Body of Christ = His Church.

If you are looking to join the TRUE Body of Christ's Church, then compare these different 40,000+ congregations, with the "standard" from The Word, Jesus ... as outline above, using scriptural references ... Pray for the Holy Spirit's Guidance ( discernment ) and compare these different groups "fundamental doctrines" with the Word of God... If they don't match up... then find one that does ... (This is what I did 30 odd years ago...)
The first standard that I look to, to "quickly" evaluate whether a person, our a group of people, believe and follow Jesus, is # 4 & # 8 ABOVE.

If people are not keeping God's commandments, particular #4, the Sabbath ... then they are following and believing the other spirit in the world, being Satan ( the lord of this world, 2 Cor 4:4) and his Antichrist spirit, ( in this world) the Papacy, ( James 4:4 )

The Papacy ~~> Dan 7:25 He shall speak pompous words against the Most High, Shall persecute the saints of the Most High, And shall intend to change times and law. Then the saints shall be given into his hand For a time and times and half a time."

(change times and law) => changed the solemnity of God's 7th Day Sabbath to Sunday AND changed God's Law, (eg. taking out);
Exo. 20: 3 You shall have no other gods before me. 4 You shall not make to you any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. 5 You shall not bow down yourself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; 6 And showing mercy to thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

I KNOW this is a hard pill to swallow, but it IS the Truth, according to Holy Spirit inspired scripture, The Word.
SO !! We each are REQUIRED BY GOD, as to "Who shall you follow ?"

Joel 24:15 "... But as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.”
~~Happy Sabbath Folks~~
Click to expand...
So which church are you referring to ?You put up a few hundred words,yet my question is not answered.
 
Follower777 said:
A Holy Spirit inspired, understanding of biblical / scriptural / Holy Spirit inspired commentary, (by the apostles of Christ) = God's Word = Jesus ...
It is the ONLY criteria, The ONLY Standard, by which we can determine "What the Church of Christ is" "Who the Church body is..." and IF we are a part of the Body of Christ = His Church.

If you are looking to join the TRUE Body of Christ's Church, then compare these different 40,000+ congregations, with the "standard" from The Word, Jesus ... as outline above, using scriptural references ... Pray for the Holy Spirit's Guidance ( discernment ) and compare these different groups "fundamental doctrines" with the Word of God... If they don't match up... then find one that does ... (This is what I did 30 odd years ago...)
The first standard that I look to, to "quickly" evaluate whether a person, our a group of people, believe and follow Jesus, is # 4 & # 8 ABOVE.

If people are not keeping God's commandments, particular #4, the Sabbath ... then they are following and believing the other spirit in the world, being Satan ( the lord of this world, 2 Cor 4:4) and his Antichrist spirit, ( in this world) the Papacy, ( James 4:4 )

The Papacy ~~> Dan 7:25 He shall speak pompous words against the Most High, Shall persecute the saints of the Most High, And shall intend to change times and law. Then the saints shall be given into his hand For a time and times and half a time."

(change times and law) => changed the solemnity of God's 7th Day Sabbath to Sunday AND changed God's Law, (eg. the taking out of => );
Exo. 20: 3 You shall have no other gods before me. 4 You shall not make to you any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. 5 You shall not bow down yourself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; 6 And showing mercy to thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

I KNOW this is a hard pill to swallow, but it IS the Truth, according to Holy Spirit inspired scripture, The Word.
SO !! We each are REQUIRED BY GOD, as to "Who shall you follow ?"

Joel 24:15 "... But as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.”
~~Happy Sabbath Folks~~
Click to expand...

9b16c9308dfc99d94587a259cd002cf6

I put up an anology here.
Like you find a lost kid in the mall, crying to look for her mother.
You keep on telling the girl : you mother is a woman, your mother loves you, your mother cooks your meals.....(just rubbish!)
The girl needs you to tell her where to find her mother!
 
beechan said:
So which church are you referring to ?You put up a few hundred words,yet my question is not answered.
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It is up to ONLY you, by your PRAYING & being inspired by the Holy Spirit to answer your question of "Which of the 40,000+ denominations," is believing and following Jesus, to His Standards, the Bible, to be His Church. ....
All I did is to give you the outline of what the Character of Christ and His Righteousness, looks like, scripturally ...

It is up to each one of individually, BY FAITH, to either conform to the Character of Christ & His Righteousness, or not. This the bottom line salvational question. Do you believe and follow Jesus ? John 3:16

Romans 1:17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Hebrews 10:38 Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

Gal 3:11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

Having the Faith OF Jesus; Gal 2:20 "...I live by the faith OF the Son of God..." KJV, not the NIV

1. Faith that Trusts in Christ’s Finished Work
Hebrews 12:2 “Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of God.”

The “faith of Jesus” is a complete reliance on the Father’s promise, not on our own strength. When we look to Christ as the “author and finisher,” we adopt that same unwavering trust.

2. Faith That Overcomes Temptation
Matthew 4:1‑11 “Then was Jesus led up… tempted… Yet He answered, ‘Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.’ … He rebuked Satan and left Him.”

Having the faith of Jesus means standing firm against temptation, relying on Scripture and the Spirit rather than personal desire.

3. Faith That Seeks the Will of the Father
John 6:38 “For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.”

The “faith of Jesus” is self‑denying obedience—a willingness to align our actions with God’s will.

4. Faith That Believes in the Power of the Cross
1 Corinthians 15:58 “Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye steadfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.”

When we possess the same faith, we remain steadfast because we trust that the Cross has already secured victory over sin.

5. Faith That Looks Forward to Eternal Glory
Philippians 3:20‑21 “For our citizenship is in heaven; and from whence we also eagerly wait for the Saviour, Jesus Christ, who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body…”

The “faith of Jesus” includes a confident expectation of the heavenly destiny ( salvation ) that fuels perseverance now. TODAY
 
Follower777 said:
It is up to ONLY you, by your PRAYING & being inspired by the Holy Spirit to answer your question of "Which of the 40,000+ denominations," is believing and following Jesus, to His Standards, the Bible, to be His Church. ....
All I did is to give you the outline of what the Character of Christ and His Righteousness, looks like, scripturally ...
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OK, everyone chooses his own HOLY SPIRIT. Simple enough.
Isn't it FREEWILL?
Like going to buffet, one chooses his own favourite food.
shutterstock_234903775-qmm5sp2lpvln5cb32m70qrrgitwquzp3h0505dcnt4.jpg
 
beechan said:
OK, everyone chooses his own HOLY SPIRIT. Simple enough.
Isn't it FREEWILL?
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Sorry ! There is only one Holy Spirit, as there is one "other spirit" Antichrist spirit, in the world. James 4:4 Just Two spirits ..

You have a free will, choice to make ... Which Spirit, during your probationary life here, on Earth ... you will follow ! Choose wisely, according to the Word of God, your eternal life depends on it.
 
Follower777 said:
Sorry ! There is only one Holy Spirit, as there is one "other spirit" Antichrist spirit, in the world. James 4:4 Just Two spirits ..
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That's what I am asking you to ponder:
Which of the 40,000+ denominations holds the 'only one HOLY SPIRIT'?
 
Follower777 said:
Sorry ! There is only one Holy Spirit, as there is one "other spirit" Antichrist spirit, in the world. James 4:4 Just Two spirits ..

You have a free will, choice to make ... Which Spirit, during your probationary life here, on Earth ... you will follow ! Choose wisely, according to the Word of God, your eternal life depends on it.
Click to expand...
You must have heard this joke about denominations:


Once I saw a man on a bridge about to jump

I said, "Don't do it!" He said, "Nobody loves me." I said, "God loves you. Do you believe in God?"

He said, "Yes." I said, "Are you a Christian or a Jew?" He said, "A Christian." I said, "Me, too! Protestant or Catholic?" He said, "Protestant." I said, "Me, too! What denomination?" He said, "Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Baptist or Southern Baptist?" He said, "Northern Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist or Northern Liberal Baptist?"

He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region, or Northern Conservative Baptist Eastern Region?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region." I said, "Me, too!"

Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1879, or Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912." I said, "Die, heretic!" And I pushed him over.
 
beechan said:
That's what I am asking you to ponder:
Which of the 40,000+ denominations holds the 'only one HOLY SPIRIT'?
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Will you drop the “40,000 denominations” foolishness already? Your question is senseless.
 
Dino246 said:
Will you drop the “40,000 denominations” foolishness already? Your question is senseless.
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I see the '40000 deniminations' is the strong argument against your claim that your faith is led by 'the only HOLY SPIRIT', it must be truth. so I am not going to drop this point.
 
beechan said:
Are you too shy to say that it is your church which houses the 'only one HOLY SPIRIT'??
Show me which church? I'll come over!!
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There are many local churches who follow the pattern in the NT. No one is truly perfect, but we try very hard to follow the first century church. It should never change with the times, as they say; just like the word never changes.
 
TruthDefender said:
There are many local churches who follow the pattern in the NT. No one is truly perfect, but we try very hard to follow the first century church. It should never change with the times, as they say; just like the word never changes.
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The first century church was made up of poor and illiterate believers. They did not have gospels yet and a copy of OT scripture was expensive. Even they had one they were unable to read. They could only listen to what elders (the church authority) taught. So there was no Sola Scriptura thing back then.
In that case, any church which teaches you Sola Scriptura is not following NT pattern of the First Century Church.
 
beechan said:
All scripture is inspired by God
We know that God's truth stands the test of time and all subsequent Scripture must be inspired by God as well. But, the important thing to keep in mind is that this verse does not say that Scripture is the only thing inspired by God.

All scripture...is useful for teaching, for refutation, for correction...(and the list goes on).
I emphasized the word "useful" for a reason. Notice how it says "useful" and not something like "the only thing" or "the only means". In other words, scripture is helpful, it is a resource, an aid (add your own synonym here). This verse, nor the word "useful", nor its synonyms imply that it is the only rule of faith. It says that it is something useful for one's faith.
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2 Timothy 3:16 says plainly that ‘all Scripture is inspired by God’ - theopneustos, literally ‘God-breathed,’ a unique word in the New Testament and ancient Greek, thus seemingly chosen for this special purpose. It highlights Scripture’s divine origin and authority. The verse says nothing about anything outside Scripture, and silence does not give anyone license to declare other writings inspired or not. Those are simply human claims, not textual facts.

While ōphelimos can mean ‘useful,’ ‘profitable,’ ‘advantageous,’ or ‘beneficial,’ the surrounding context - Paul reminding Timothy of the sacred writings he has known from youth 2Tim3:14-15 and warning against false teachers - combined with the purpose clause in 2 Tim3:17 makes clear that Scripture itself is fully sufficient, not merely one aid among many. Any reading, such as in Catholic interpretations, that reduces it to a ‘helpful resource’ alongside other purported authorities ignores the fuller Text and diminishes the Scripture.
 
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