the Sabbath

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

SabbathBlessing

Well-known member
Dec 13, 2023
1,346
224
63
The law grants you the knowledge of your unrighteousness.

I establish the law because it condemns people like yourself.

Sin is transgression of the law. No one is righteous, no one is holy, the law is telling you this.

Romans 3:19
Now we know that whatever the Law says, it speaks to those who are under the Law, so that every mouth may be closed and all the world may become accountable to God.

Your self-condemned. Even worse, your under a delusion that your obeying the law.

You are contradicting what Paul said. Paul told you that you are condemned already, your flesh is dead. Yet, you stand there proclaiming that you can obey the law. Something is fatally wrong in what you teach.

Correct me if I am wrong. You believe that you can obey the law and the rest of humanity failed?
We are all under the law as none of us is righteous or without sin.

It’s not like some can bypass it and other’s can’t.

All the law does is point out our sin like the next verse says from Paul

Romans 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.”

All the Ten Commandments do is point our sin, so we don’t depend on our righteousness, but God’s Psa 119:172 and points us to Jesus who has the power to cleanse and sanctify. 1 John 1:9

If we cover our sins, we can’t prosper by going to Jesus for His forgiveness, mercy grace and sanctification Pro 28:13 1 John 1:9 and thats a dangerous place to be. Heb 10:26-30

We can gain victory over sin, Jesus doesn’t make us do it alone but it requires a humble and willing heart John 14:15-18

Jesus is more powerful to keep us from sin than the devil is to keep us in sin, God’s law just gives us something to measure ourselves with as it is what we will all be judged by James 2:10-12 Mat 5:18-30 Rev 22:14-15 regardless if one accepts or not.

The only one who can condemn is Jesus, so best to leave the judging to Him and we are told we have two paths….

Romans 6:16 Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one’s slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness?

It’s up to us who we want to follow, the more popular teachings we don’t need to keep God’s Ten Commandments or the teachings of Jesus who taught to keep the commandments warned not to break the least of these commandments Mat 15:3-14, Mark 7:7-13 Mat 5:18-30 Mat 19:17-19 and was lived out in His life John 15:10 and is our example to follow. 1 John 2:6 1 Peter 2:22-23
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
25,484
13,785
113
We are all under the law as none of us is righteous or without sin.
All of us who are Christians were condemned by the Law. However, Christians have been transferred from death to life and are under Christ's blood. We are no longer under the Law.

Incomplete theology, in this case, is wrong theology.
 

SabbathBlessing

Well-known member
Dec 13, 2023
1,346
224
63
All of us who are Christians were condemned by the Law. However, Christians have been transferred from death to life and are under Christ's blood. We are no longer under the Law.

Incomplete theology, in this case, is wrong theology.
I believe you are misunderstanding Paul.

We are not under the condemnation of the law, if one is keeping the law.

Paul clearly teaches if we are in Christ one is not hostile to God's law and if we are hostile to it, that's not a good sign. Because those walking in the flesh (sin- breaking God's law) can't please Him


Romans 8: 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh (sin) set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh (sin) cannot please God.

Jesus in His own Words rejects this teaching we are without law.

Mat 5:19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Mat 7:21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’ (without law)

Paul never contradicted Jesus- just many misunderstand Paul and why his teachings comes with a warning 2 Peter 3:16
 

dlj57

Active member
Jan 11, 2024
189
53
28
All of us who are Christians were condemned by the Law. However, Christians have been transferred from death to life and are under Christ's blood. We are no longer under the Law.

Incomplete theology, in this case, is wrong theology.
You keep saying we are not under the Law, show me scripture supporting your view.
Question remains; Why are the Ten Commandments repeated throughout the NT and the Sabbath mentioned and observed 60 times in the NT? If they have been done away with, they shouldn't be there.
 

dlj57

Active member
Jan 11, 2024
189
53
28
Some of what you wrote is correct.

The argument now reduces to which set of commandments. The commandments in the law of Moses or the commandments that Christ gave us. I will not exclude the commands in Acts 15 either.

Just one Q: Why are the Ten Commandments repeated throughout the NT and the Sabbath mentioned and observed 60 times in the NT? If they have been done away with, they shouldn't be there.
 

dlj57

Active member
Jan 11, 2024
189
53
28
Some of what you wrote is correct.

The argument now reduces to which set of commandments. The commandments in the law of Moses or the commandments that Christ gave us. I will not exclude the commands in Acts 15 either.

Three Laws
(1) The moral Laws is written in the hearts and minds; the moral Laws are embedded in our very souls. Adam and Eve knew they sinned and felt guilty and ashamed, God didn't have to tell them just like He doesn't have to tell us today.
(2) The Law of Moses, the old Mosaic Law are 600+ commandments, regulations etc... from the 2nd through the fifth books of the Torah.
We are no longer under this Law through the blood of Christ.
(3) The 10 Commandments have been with us from Creation, then God gave them to Moses in writing, they are with us now evident in that they are repeated throughout the NT, and the Sabbath being mentioned and observed 60 times throughout the NT. They will be with us on the New Earth, God says all flesh will come to worship him from one Sabbath to another.
 

SabbathBlessing

Well-known member
Dec 13, 2023
1,346
224
63
Then we all are under a curse.. and if this curse is not removed. we will suffer the death we deserve..
Jesus took the penalty of that curse for us because breaking the Ten Commandments comes with a death sentence. Romans 6:23 If the law could have been removed without the blood of Christ- He wouldn't had to of died. But scripture tells us we too much die of self (sin) 1 Corinthians 15:31 and be reborn in Christ through faith Romans 6:3-4 Ga 3:26-28 and if we stumble along the way instead of sacrificing animals for sin- we can go directly to Jesus who is our High Priest in the New Covenant when we confess and repent, which means a change in direction. He can cleanse us of all sin and unrighteousness, but when He heals- He says- go and sin no more. Living under grace means living a righteous and obedient life to Christ.

We are either a slave to sin or a slave to Christ. Romans 6:16 Two paths- two different directions. Jesus wants to free us of the bondage of sin, which is why the Ten Commandments is called the law of liberty James 2:10-12 overcoming sin in Christ John 14:15-18 free to walk with Him in His righteousness Psa 119:172

In Christ there is no rebellion to Him

Isa 48:18 Oh, that you had heeded My commandments!
Then your peace would have been like a river,
And your righteousness like the waves of the sea.
 

dlj57

Active member
Jan 11, 2024
189
53
28
Some of what you wrote is correct.

The argument now reduces to which set of commandments. The commandments in the law of Moses or the commandments that Christ gave us. I will not exclude the commands in Acts 15 either.
That should be the Commandments that God gave us. There's no argument, the moral Laws are embedded in us, we know right from wrong, you don't need written laws or for someone to tell us. The law of Moses, 600+ commandments and regulations from the Torah, a lot of them which had to do with annual Sabbaths, sacrifices, and food and meat. The Ten Commandments have been with us from creation, then God gave them to Moses, they are with us now and will be with us on the New Earth.
 

CS1

Well-known member
May 23, 2012
13,059
4,346
113
The Ten Commandments have been with God from Creation and will be with us on the New Earth "... and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship me, saith the Lord." (Isaiah 66:23) Moses did not write the ten Commandments; they were given to him by God. The Ten Commandments are not part of the Law of Moses or any part of the old Mosaic Law. "Do not think that I come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them" (Matt 5:17) The Sabbath is mentioned 60 times in the NT alone and all have to do with the 7th day Sabbath but on which refences an annual Sabbath. God made the Sabbath for all mankind (Mark 2:27). Jesus kept it (Luke 4:16), Paul kept it (Acts 17:2), and Gentiles kept it (Acts 13:42-44; 16:13) Several of the Ten Commandments are mentioned throughout the New Testament. God only set one day apart from the rest and blessed it, sanctified it and blessed it and that would be the 7th day of the week not the first.
I have a question Did Abraham keep the Sabbath?
 

Cameron143

Well-known member
Mar 1, 2022
19,233
6,611
113
62
Jesus took the penalty of that curse for us because breaking the Ten Commandments comes with a death sentence. Romans 6:23 If the law could have been removed without the blood of Christ- He wouldn't had to of died. But scripture tells us we too much die of self (sin) 1 Corinthians 15:31 and be reborn in Christ through faith Romans 6:3-4 Ga 3:26-28 and if we stumble along the way instead of sacrificing animals for sin- we can go directly to Jesus who is our High Priest in the New Covenant when we confess and repent, which means a change in direction. He can cleanse us of all sin and unrighteousness, but when He heals- He says- go and sin no more. Living under grace means living a righteous and obedient life to Christ.

We are either a slave to sin or a slave to Christ. Romans 6:16 Two paths- two different directions. Jesus wants to free us of the bondage of sin, which is why the Ten Commandments is called the law of liberty James 2:10-12 overcoming sin in Christ John 14:15-18 free to walk with Him in His righteousness Psa 119:172

In Christ there is no rebellion to Him

Isa 48:18 Oh, that you had heeded My commandments!
Then your peace would have been like a river,
And your righteousness like the waves of the sea.
In the Spirit in Christ there is no sin. In Christ there is no condemnation, but no one is sinless.
 

Everlasting-Grace

Well-known member
Dec 18, 2021
5,947
1,872
113
Jesus took the penalty of that curse for us because breaking the Ten Commandments comes with a death sentence. Romans 6:23 If the law could have been removed without the blood of Christ- He wouldn't had to of died.
there are many many more commands God has given us in the word, in the old and new testament.

God gave us ten commands. and said you can not even keep these ten. And he has proven we could not.

He died so we could be freed from the penalty of sin (which is death)
But scripture tells us we too much die of self (sin) 1 Corinthians 15:31 and be reborn in Christ through faith Romans 6:3-4 Ga 3:26-28 and if we stumble along the way instead of sacrificing animals for sin- we can go directly to Jesus who is our High Priest in the New Covenant when we confess and repent, which means a change in direction. He can cleanse us of all sin and unrighteousness, but when He heals- He says- go and sin no more. Living under grace means living a righteous and obedient life to Christ.

We are either a slave to sin or a slave to Christ. Romans 6:16 Two paths- two different directions. Jesus wants to free us of the bondage of sin, which is why the Ten Commandments is called the law of liberty James 2:10-12 overcoming sin in Christ John 14:15-18 free to walk with Him in His righteousness Psa 119:172

In Christ there is no rebellion to Him

Isa 48:18 Oh, that you had heeded My commandments!
Then your peace would have been like a river,
And your righteousness like the waves of the sea.
The law says you must be perfect.. Thats why we are no longer under law but under grace.

When you realise. You will be freed from your bondage
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
60,195
29,500
113
I have a question Did Abraham keep the Sabbath?
He claims Abraham kept the ten commandments... hundreds of years before they were given.

And though he and another say they get no answer as to what has changed regarding the law, rather than high-
fiving each other over their imagined victory, they should be using their hands to untie the blindfolds they wear.



Romans 13:10
:)
 

SabbathBlessing

Well-known member
Dec 13, 2023
1,346
224
63
there are many many more commands God has given us in the word, in the old and new testament.

God gave us ten commands. and said you can not even keep these ten. And he has proven we could not.

He died so we could be freed from the penalty of sin (which is death)

The law says you must be perfect.. Thats why we are no longer under law but under grace.

When you realise. You will be freed from your bondage
Can you use scripture please because I believe you are using a lot of scripture out of context. If you can post the scripture references.

The commandments of God are not meant to be burdensome 1 John 5:3

The bondage is sin Romans 6, not God's law which is holy, just and good Romans 7:12

Jesus would not ask us to keep something if it was impossible to keep. Its the "other spirit" who wants to keep us in sin, our salvation is from sin. Mat 1:21
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
60,195
29,500
113
The commandments of God are not meant to be burdensome 1 John 5:3
Now then, why do you test God by placing on the necks of the disciples a
yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? Acts 15:10



From Acts 15:20 plus 28
:)
 

SabbathBlessing

Well-known member
Dec 13, 2023
1,346
224
63
He claims Abraham kept the ten commandments... hundreds of years before they were given.

And though he and another say they get no answer as to what has changed regarding the law, rather than high-
fiving each other over their imagined victory, they should be using their hands to untie the blindfolds they wear.



Romans 13:10
:)
Sin is the transgression of God's law 1 John 3:4
The Ten Commandments Romans 7:7 Mat 5:19-30
Without law there is no transgression Romans 4:15

Therefore Adam and Eve broke the commandments because they sinned- sin is the transgression of God's law.

Cain knew it was "sin" that he killed Abel, because he was given God's law to thou shalt not murder.

Abraham kept the commandments of God Gen 26:5 and the Sabbath is a commandment of God Exo 20:8-11 that started right in the Garden Exo 20:11 Gen 2:1-3

God wrote and spoke the Ten Commandments formally in Sinai, but they existed prior to that. The earthy temple was a replica of God's Heavenly Temple Heb 8:1-5 which is revealed to have God's ark of the covenant Rev 11:19
 

SabbathBlessing

Well-known member
Dec 13, 2023
1,346
224
63
In the Spirit in Christ there is no sin. In Christ there is no condemnation, but no one is sinless.
Are you claiming we can be in Christ and be sinning?

Not according to Paul, he made that clear Romans 8:4-8