The Ten Commandments are the Covenant, did you know?

[TMS]

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The same angel who explained the vision of Daniel 8 to Daniel returned in chapter 9 to explain the time element that he had been left unexplained (Daniel 8:16-17, 26; 9:21-23). In other words, the angel came back to further expand, in Daniel 9, the explanation he had interrupted in Daniel 8. Thus these two chapters are linked by the selfsame angel, Gabriel! Furthermore, it is of more than passing interest that the unexplained time element of Daniel 8 began his explanation in chapter 9 with a time prophecy! That is to say, the unexplained time element of Daniel 8 was explained with another time prophecy in chapter 9 and that time prophecy was the first part of the 2300 days.
Gabriel told Daniel about the time element of the prophecy in Daniel 9: ‘Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city.’ (Daniel 9:24, KJV).
The word ‘determined’ in the Hebrew is chathak. It can mean ‘to cut, to decide, to decree, to ordain, to appoint.’ The New English Bible translates it ‘marked out.’ The word appears only this time in the Hebrew Bible but in Mishnaic Hebrew it is frequently used in a literal sense to describe the act of cutting off parts of animals for the sacrificial service, the cutting off of the foreskin in circumcision, the cutting off of a lampwick and a miner cutting out ore from a mountain. Figuratively, the word is also used to describe the act of cutting or dividing a Bible verse into two parts for study. The root meaning of this word, then, appears to be ‘cut off.’ Now, when something is cut off, it must be cut off from something else! For instance, if
you to cut a branch off a tree there must be a tree to cut it off from! This being
the case, we must ask: ‘From what are the seventy weeks cut off?’ The answer is not hard to find. It must have been cut off from the larger prophecy of the 2300 days/years in the previous chapter.


A starting point for this 70 week period is given: "Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks," sixty-nine weeks, or four hundred and eighty-three years. Daniel 9:25. The commandment to restore and build Jerusalem, as completed by the decree of Artaxerxes Longimanus (see Ezra 6:14; 7:1, 9), went into effect in the autumn of B.C. 457. From this time four hundred and eighty-three years extend to the autumn of A.D. 27. According to the prophecy, this period was to reach to the Messiah, the Anointed One. In A. D. 27, Jesus at His baptism received the anointing of the Holy Spirit, and soon afterward began His ministry. Then the message was proclaimed. ‘The time is fulfilled.’

457 bc. Is the starting point .

Plus 2300 years
= 1844.

There was no zero year between bc and ad.

To sum it up (i wanted to say heaps more) .... there is no earthly sanctuary to cleanse and if the day of atonement was a schoolmaster for the future ministry of Christ. A type of the antitype. Heb 9:24, The earthly sanctuary was a figure and shadow of the true tabernacle in heaven, containing two distinct apartments: the Holy Place and the Most Holy Place. Heb 8:2. It helps to study the process in the old testament. Lev 16.

Christ moved into the most holy place in 1844 to cleanse the sanctuary from sin.

The sanctuary in heaven not earth. Jesus is judging each case to blot out their sin and place it on the scapegoat.


Investigative judgement.. which began in 1844..

 

[SabbathBlessing]

You said it yourself. You judge those who are born again as if they were unbelievers. According to the false prophet EG White, my prayers are not answered by God because I am not deceived by SDA false doctrine. I won't go on. I could rip your false prophet to shreds and destroy your arguments, but there is no point. The plain truth is not enough for you.

I never said anything about my judgment, Only God knows our heart, I point out the way God said He judges us in Scripture. Once He comes, all of our decisions are sealed Rev22:11 Why I try to point people back to doing what He asks if we love Him. Exo20:6 John14:15

This is what God says, I think we should not lightly pass over it.


Pro 28:9 One who turns away his ear from hearing the law, Even his prayer is an abomination.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Gentiles were never under the law and Acts 15 proves that.

Gentiles were never in covenant to obey Exodus 20.

You have your wires crossed but so do the larger traditional churches, unfortunately.

I think you have a misunderstanding of what under the law means, it doesn't mean not keeping it.

Gal 5:18But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law

19Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness
20idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies
21envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God

There are only two groups in the end

The group we want to be in

Rev 14:12Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus

Or this group, we don't want to be in. Our decision decides which one we are in and who we serve and obey Rom6:16KJV

Mat7:’23;And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

Its a deception to think that God's commandments, is only for Jews when He said it is for those who love Him Exo20:6 John14:15 1John5:3

Without love - we don't have anything and love is not a feeling, God defined how we are to love Him- He even personally wrote it out. Deut4:13 Exo31:18

 

[Just_A__Follower]

The Investigative Judgement

We all stand before the Judgement seat of Christ.
2Co 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

Mat 12:36 But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.

On the day of judgment we will all give account.

Paul talked of future judgement
Judgement to come..

Act 24:25 And as he reasoned of righteousness, temperance, and judgment to come, Felix trembled, and answered, ...

Ecc 12:13-14
13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. 14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.

God will bring every work....

3 phases ...

Phase 1.
Dan 7:9-11
9 I beheld till the thrones were cast down, and the Ancient of days did sit, whose garment was white as snow, and the hair of his head like the pure wool: his throne was like the fiery flame, and his wheels as burning fire. 10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened. 11 I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till the beast was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning flame.

Jesus is set to Judge and the books are opened at the time.
This is future from Paul's day but before the second coming.

Rev 22:12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

So Jesus judges every case before He returns. (The time I'll come back to).

Phase 2
After Jesus returns .... Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

The saved will judge the unsaved for the 1000 year reign with Christ. Even the unsaved angels.

1Co 6:2-3
2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? 3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

Phase 3
At the end of the millenium ...
Rev 20:11-12
11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

If your not found in the book of life....
Rev 20:14-15
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

The final judgment is given to those that are not saved. Justice is served and sin will not rise again.

Phase 1 is the most important because it is when Jesus decides who is lost and who is saved.
We He comes, He knows who is saved, who He is going to resurrect and who are save that are living.

Phase 1 is the Investigative Judgement..
Look at Daniel 7:9,10.
Also Rev 14:6,7
The Judgment Transpires before the Second Coming
“Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth--to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people—
saying with a loud voice, "Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His
judgment has come [while the gospel is being preached]; and worship Him who
made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water."”
Jesus gives the Reward when He comes
If Jesus brings the reward when He comes again then he must have determined the reward before He comes. This means people do not receive the reward when they die but rather when Jesus comes.
Matthew 16:27
“For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works.”
Revelation 22:12
"And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one
according to his work.”

I'll start a new post about the phase 1 of the judgement .....

So since Miller’s prophecy failed, Ellen took it and turned it into a courtroom drama to save face as if the God that knows our hearts and every hair on our head needs to sit down and comb through evidence to see if I ever lost my temper in traffic or ate a piece of bacon. He said “it is is finished”. 2 Tim 2:19 He already knows who are His. He is not a slow reader that’s been sitting for the last 180 years studying our records. HE IS OMNISCIENT. investigative judgment is made up nonsense to cover a false prophecy with another false prophecy.

Please quit wasting your time try to prove nonsense.

 

[JimiSurvivor]

What did God place in our hearts? God’s laws Heb8:10 which Jesus used interchangeable with the Word of God Mat15:3-14 Mark7:7-13 that always included the 4th commandment Exo20:6 Exo20:1-17

Let us look at Hebrews 8:10 to see if it tells us the way to salvation can be found through a "gospel" of REPENTANCE and FAITH PLUS the righteous merit we obtain by KEEPING SHABBAT (i.e., the 4th commandment)

…9 It [i.e., the New Covenant] will not be like the covenant I made with their fathers when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, because they did not abide by My covenant, and I disregarded them, declares the Lord.
10 For this is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord. I will put My laws in their minds and inscribe them on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they will be My people. (Hebrews 8:10)

Under the prior covenant people, mainly the Jews, attempted to follow the law as best as they could. The New Covenant works because the Holy Spirit transforms and enables us from within. This verse says very clearly that the New Covenant WOULD NOT BE LIKE the prior one yet you seem to think the NC is essentially the same. You STILL believe mankind can keep the laws. Do you not see that if this had been possible, God would never have allowed His precious Son to be crucified. You believe we can do it by our own effort because you do not understand the depth of the Law (which Jesus revealed) or our own depravity. You are like a patient diagnosed with rabies who thinks he can overcome it with exercise and a healthy diet.

No one is saved without faith

Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.

We are saved by grace though faith. Faith is a big word, not a small one. Faith does not void the law but establishes the law Rom3:31

Nor does grace give us a pass to break the law of God and sin 1John3:4 James2:10-12.

Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? 2Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it?

These statements show that you assume anyone who rejects your Judaizing doctrines are antinomian. That is not true. Yes Christians, if they are "born again" should evidence moral/spiritual change but many "good" moral people will never enter the kingdom. Apparently, whether or not even believers ultimately enter into eternal life depends on whether or not they keep Shabbat. Thus "continuing in sin" is the same as NOT keeping Shabbat.

why we see the Sabbath being kept according to the commandment immediately after the death of the Cross Luke23:56
the Sabbath was kept generation after generation in every City Acts 15:21 kept by the apostles every Sabbath 30+ years after the Cross with both Jews and Gentiles alike Acts 13:42 Acts 13:44 Acts 16:13 Acts 17:2 Acts 18:4

As usual you think by simply posting a number of scriptures proves your point. However, when we examine these references individually and in context your interpretations disappear like mirages.
For instance, Luke 23:55-56 says…55 The women who had come with Jesus from Galilee followed, and they saw the tomb and how His body was placed. 56 Then they went home and prepared spices and ointments to anoint his body. But by the time they were finished the Sabbath had begun, so they rested as required by the law.
They did not have enough time to finish preparing the burial spices because Shabbat had begun so they discontinued their work. They did this because they were obedient to the covenant they were living under. This adds nothing to our discussion. You seem to be utterly unable to see that God's plan of redemption unfolds in time in a sequential order of events according to the covenants God makes with man. Prior covenants God made with previous generations can be either altered or abolished by the formation of a New Covenant that overrides it.
.

Just as Jesus indicated Isa56:6-7 Mat24:20 and will be kept for those who are saved for all eternity Isa66:22-23 so from the beginning of time Exo20:11 to the very end Isa66:22-23 and everywhere in between, because this is according to the will of God. He could not be more plain on this. Eze 20:20 hallow My Sabbaths, and they will be a sign between Me and you, that you may know that I am the Lord your God.’
Don’t let anyone cheat us of this Blessing God is trying to give man by following what the world does and not what is according to Christ Col2:8

What God blesses is forever 1 Chron 17:27 and man can't take it away Num23:20 God blessed the Sabbath day Exo20:11 and blesses the man that keeps the Sabbath Isa56:2 man cannot take away God's Blessing, they can only forfeit their own which I do not advise Psa37:22

1 Chron 17:27 was speaking about God blessing the Temple of Solomon and the Davidic dynasty
Isaiah 56:6 was speaking of the laws concerning Gentiles living among the Jews who wanted to convert to Judaism.
Matthew 24:20 is speaking about events that will happen at the return of the Son of man.
In order to get the Bible to mean what you want them to mean, you take bits and pieces of scriptures, blend them into a word salad until they have no resemblace to the text and them proclaim them as truth.

The plan of salvation is God saving His people from their sins Mat1:21, not in their sins which leads people on the wrong path Heb10:26-28. He will say I do not know you depart from Me Mat7:23

So essentially, since you believe NOT KEEPING SHABBAT, IS a sin then even those who have believed in Jesus and that His gospel is true the gospel will ultimately hear God say to them: 41...., ‘Depart from Me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels (Matthew 25:41)

 

[JimiSurvivor]

No you haven’t

If all God's commands are eternal and inalterable then the requirement of circumcising all male descendants of Abraham as a condition of being in their covenants would still be in effect. However, those original disciples of Jesus who knew Him had heard Him speak met together and decided circumcision of all new converts was not necessary before they could be saved. When a NEW covenant is made it often comes with changes in the laws that govern it.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Let us look at Hebrews 8:10 to see if it tells us the way to salvation can be found through a "gospel" of REPENTANCE and FAITH PLUS the righteous merit we obtain by KEEPING SHABBAT (i.e., the 4th commandment)

…9 It [i.e., the New Covenant] will not be like the covenant I made with their fathers when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, because they did not abide by My covenant, and I disregarded them, declares the Lord.
10 For this is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord. I will put My laws in their minds and inscribe them on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they will be My people. (Hebrews 8:10)

This verse has the law of God written on the hearts and minds of His New Covenant believer. Who determines the law of God- God or us? Its sad this even has to be a debate. Yes, if we are in a covenant relationship where His laws are written in our minds to do them and written in our hearts because we want to do them by love- in this covenant He remembers our sins no more because we are no longer doing so, we are submitting to the Holy Spirit and though our love for Him- we are keeping the covenant God gave us and obeying His commandments through the power of the Holy Spirit.

God cannot write His laws on stony hearts with a harden heart Heb3:7-19 that will not subject themselves to the law of God Rom8:7-8 and sadly has not entered into this covenant by faith.

Under the prior covenant people, mainly the Jews, attempted to follow the law as best as they could. The New Covenant works because the Holy Spirit transforms and enables us from within. This verse says very clearly that the New Covenant WOULD NOT BE LIKE the prior one yet you seem to think the NC is essentially the same. You STILL believe mankind can keep the laws. Do you not see that if this had been possible, God would never have allowed His precious Son to be crucified. You believe we can do it by our own effort because you do not understand the depth of the Law (which Jesus revealed) or our own depravity. You are like a patient diagnosed with rabies who thinks he can overcome it with exercise and a healthy diet.

Yes, we have been through this many times. The old covenant was external- the law written on stone Exo34:28 Deut4:13 this one is internal the law of God written in the heart and minds if one cooperates with God. Same law, better promises Heb8:6, better location Heb8:10 God keeping His promise not a jot or tittle shall pass Mat5:18-19 God doesn;t make mistakes Psa19:7 Rom7:12 we do.

These statements show that you assume anyone who rejects your Judaizing doctrines are antinomian. That is not true. Yes Christians, if they are "born again" should evidence moral/spiritual change but many "good" moral people will never enter the kingdom. Apparently, whether or not even believers ultimately enter into eternal life depends on whether or not they keep Shabbat. Thus "continuing in sin" is the same as NOT keeping Shabbat.

The issue is assuming that keeping God's 4th commandment and wanting to join ourselves to the LORD and be His servant was just for Jews when Jesus plainly said everyone Isa56:6. Its not that He was not clear, its a matter of believing what He says.

As usual you think by simply posting a number of scriptures proves your point. However, when we examine these references individually and in context your interpretations disappear like mirages.
For instance, Luke 23:55-56 says…55 The women who had come with Jesus from Galilee followed, and they saw the tomb and how His body was placed. 56 Then they went home and prepared spices and ointments to anoint his body. But by the time they were finished the Sabbath had begun, so they rested as required by the law.
They did not have enough time to finish preparing the burial spices because Shabbat had begun so they discontinued their work. They did this because they were obedient to the covenant they were living under.

This was after the death of Christ, the covenant ratified at His death and the Sabbath was kept not by some random people as you are suggesting but Mary who followed Jesus everywhere and was a faithful disciple. If Jesus was going to change one of His commandments He would have told them or someone. He already promised He would not which is why Sabbath keeping was faithfully kept by the people of God decades and decades after the Cross and will forever according to the LORD Isa66:22-23

 

[SabbathBlessing]

This adds nothing to our discussion. You seem to be utterly unable to see that God's plan of redemption unfolds in time in a sequential order of events according to the covenants God makes with man. Prior covenants God made with previous generations can be either altered or abolished by the formation of a New Covenant that overrides it.

I think the issue is understanding the difference between the law of God that belongs to God Exo20:6 and an agreement made between God and His people. All of God's people keep God's commandments Rev14:12 because they live by His every word as we are told Mat4:4

.

1 Chron 17:27 was speaking about God blessing the Temple of Solomon and the Davidic dynasty

Its the principle who is above God to take away His Blessing? Who gives anyone authority to do so? We can't we can only forfeit our own. Psa 37:22

Isaiah 56:6 was speaking of the laws concerning Gentiles living among the Jews who wanted to convert to Judaism.

I would suggest not adding what is not there to what God said plainly. That is no where to be found in the Text.

Matthew 24:20 is speaking about events that will happen at the return of the Son of man.
In order to get the Bible to mean what you want them to mean, you take bits and pieces of scriptures, blend them into a word salad until they have no resemblace to the text and them proclaim them as truth.

It means exactly what Jesus said it means the Sabbath will be kept until the Son of Man returns at His Second Coming otherwise no need to pray for us to flee when the sign comes of the abomination of desolation that those with faith have to flee on Sabbath day.

So essentially, since you believe NOT KEEPING SHABBAT, IS a sin then even those who have believed in Jesus and that His gospel is true the gospel will ultimately hear God say to them: 41...., ‘Depart from Me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels (Matthew 25:41)

You keep isolating this one commandment when God did not. Its part of the Ten Commandments that are all under God's mercy seat unedited in heaven Exo25:21 Rev 11:18-19 because this is God's standard of righteousness and judgement. Removing one of the commandments doesn;t remove the law, it just covers it where when He returns does not put us in a good spot Pro28:13 Heb10:26-30 instead of allowing God to be God and He define what are His commandments Exo20:16 Exo20:1-17 Deut4:13 Exo31:18 and what is sin 1John3:4 and what is doing righteousness Psa119:172 Isa56:1-2 what is His Truth Psa 119:151 instead of us telling God. I guess God will sort this all out in His time.

 

[JimiSurvivor]

Why do you think faith in God means disobedience to God? Where in the Bible does it say we can disobey God and be saved? This was the very first lie in the garden that we can disobey God and live the exact opposite of what God said. Sadly this deception is still working.

This is a straw man argument. which means refuting an argument different from the one actually under discussion, while not recognizing or acknowledging the distinction. You see I believe that faith and obedience are inseparable. However, I do not believe EVERYTHING God required of the Jews under the covenant of Moses He requires of believers who are under the New Covenant. Take circumcision. God required every male who wanted to be a part of the covenants of Abraham and Moses to be circumcised. If you REALLY BELIEVED God cannot alter or abolish any of His decrees he makes your SDA group would require it of every prospective member.

God still requires mankind to obey the UNIVERSAL MORAL LAW which God planted in the consciences of all mankind. The idea that we can walk with God while we are living in sin is called ANTINOMIANISM. I do not believe that that so please don't ever accuse me of believing it. In my understanding, faith and obedience are inseparable. I just do not believe God requires of NC believes what He did of those who lived under Israel's covenant that was made at Sinai. Our relationship with God was established under the terms of the New Covenant. Had the Apostles, who Messiah charged with the mission of proclaiming the "gospel of salvation" thought that keeping Shabbat was essential to salvation they would have said so explicitly. However, they did not.

 

[ATG]

The sabbath commandment given in Exodus 20 is codified law.

If the sabbath commandment was given in Genesis then, it was not codified law.

There is no record of a sabbath law in Genesis.

The sabbath commandment was not given to the forefathers but only to Israel.

Codified law carries penalties and is written law and that appears in Exodus.

Simple enough. God is not 'vague' about law and transgression. If it's law, He writes it as commanded law.

The only change is from law of Moses to that of Christ by His apostles.

If Jesus commands any law to His churches, He's given it to His apostles to command us. There is no more commanded sabbath keeping by law after the death, burial, and resurrection of the God of Israel Jesus Christ.

 

[JimiSurvivor]

I think the issue is understanding the difference between the law of God that belongs to God Exo20:6 and an agreement made between God and His people. All of God's people keep God's commandments Rev14:12 because they live by His every word as we are told Mat4:4

I spoke about human covenants (such as marriage) in order to show how God views covenants. He used the principle of covenant unity as a the basis for marriage. Whenever He wanted to bring mankind closer and realize His plans for us, He also used the language of covenant.
This is why Revelation connects our final redemption to the slain Lamb.
9And they sang a new song: “Worthy are You to take the scroll and open its seals, because You were slain, and by Your blood You purchased for God those from every tribe and tongue and people and nation.
(Revelation 5:9)
It seems you would prefer speaking about God's statutes and regulations

All of God's people keep God's commandments Rev14:12 because they live by His every word as we are told Mat4:4

Do they? I doubt that. Only those who lack the inner witness of the Holy Spirit assume they can by their own effort and dedication keep the Law.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

I spoke about human covenants (such as marriage) in order to show how God views covenants. He used the principle of covenant unity as a the basis for marriage. Whenever He wanted to bring mankind closer and realize His plans for us, He also used the language of covenant.
This is why Revelation connects our final redemption to the slain Lamb.
9And they sang a new song: “Worthy are You to take the scroll and open its seals, because You were slain, and by Your blood You purchased for God those from every tribe and tongue and people and nation.
(Revelation 5:9)
It seems you would prefer speaking about God's statutes and regulations



Do they? I doubt that. Only those who lack the inner witness of the Holy Spirit assume they can by their own effort and dedication keep the Law.

A covenant is an agreement. The law of God is just that God's Law. And He determines this, not us Exo20:6 Exo20:1-17 because its His and He is God.

According to Scripture God has a people who keeps it.

Rev 14:12 Here is a call for the endurance of the saints, those who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

This is a straw man argument. which means refuting an argument different from the one actually under discussion, while not recognizing or acknowledging the distinction. You see I believe that faith and obedience are inseparable. However, I do not believe EVERYTHING God required of the Jews under the covenant of Moses He requires of believers who are under the New Covenant. Take circumcision. God required every male who wanted to be a part of the covenants of Abraham and Moses to be circumcised. If you REALLY BELIEVED God cannot alter or abolish any of His decrees he makes your SDA group would require it of every prospective member.

God still requires mankind to obey the UNIVERSAL MORAL LAW which God planted in the consciences of all mankind. The idea that we can walk with God while we are living in sin is called ANTINOMIANISM. I do not believe that that so please don't ever accuse me of believing it. In my understanding, faith and obedience are inseparable. I just do not believe God requires of NC believes what He did of those who lived under Israel's covenant that was made at Sinai. Our relationship with God was established under the terms of the New Covenant. Had the Apostles, who Messiah charged with the mission of proclaiming the "gospel of salvation" thought that keeping Shabbat was essential to salvation they would have said so explicitly. However, they did not.

God's Universal moral Law is the Ten Commandments- the where God personally wrote out them Himself Exo31:18 where He tell us how to love Him and love our neighbor. They were never the Ten recommendations or the Ten suggestions of if we don't like one of them we can just forget it.

Its why all Ten Commandments are under His mercy seat Exo25:21 in the ark of His covenant Exo25:16 Exo40:20 shown in His Heavenly Temple at the last trumpet before Judgement James2:11-12 Rev 11:18-19 because this is His standard of righteousness Psa119:172 Isa56:1-1 that is from everlasting to everlasting Psa119:142 the foundation of His Throne Psa89:14

 

[Inquisitor]

A covenant is an agreement. The law of God is just that God's Law. And He determines this, not us Exo20:6 Exo20:1-17 because its His and He is God.

According to Scripture God has a people who keeps it.

Rev 14:12 Here is a call for the endurance of the saints, those who keep the commandments of God and their faith in Jesus.

A covenant is an agreement by both parties and sealed in blood.

The Exodus 24, covenant was between which two parties?

Which people were in covenant to obey that covenant?

In Revelation 14:12, which commandments are you referring to?

 

[Inquisitor]

God's Universal moral Law is the Ten Commandments

Who made that claim?

 

[SabbathBlessing]

Who made that claim?

God. Exo20:6 Mat5:18-19 Psa89:34 Exo31:18 Mat5:19-30 Mat15:3-14 Mark7:7-13 Mark 12:29-31

The entire Bible is about the testimony of God through His prophets and apostles John5:39 who has a greater Testimony than God Himself Exo31:18 as far as I am concerned no one, others might have a different view and I guess God will sort it all out soon enough.

 

[SabbathBlessing]

This is a straw man argument. which means refuting an argument different from the one actually under discussion, while not recognizing or acknowledging the distinction. You see I believe that faith and obedience are inseparable. However, I do not believe EVERYTHING God required of the Jews under the covenant of Moses He requires of believers who are under the New Covenant. Take circumcision. God required every male who wanted to be a part of the covenants of Abraham and Moses to be circumcised. If you REALLY BELIEVED God cannot alter or abolish any of His decrees he makes your SDA group would require it of every prospective member.

God still requires mankind to obey the UNIVERSAL MORAL LAW which God planted in the consciences of all mankind. The idea that we can walk with God while we are living in sin is called ANTINOMIANISM. I do not believe that that so please don't ever accuse me of believing it. In my understanding, faith and obedience are inseparable. I just do not believe God requires of NC believes what He did of those who lived under Israel's covenant that was made at Sinai. Our relationship with God was established under the terms of the New Covenant. Had the Apostles, who Messiah charged with the mission of proclaiming the "gospel of salvation" thought that keeping Shabbat was essential to salvation they would have said so explicitly. However, they did not.

Regarding circumcision that was given to Abraham for Jews only until the Seed- this gained access to the cure for sin at the earthy temple until Jesus.

Acts 14:24 Since we have heard that some who went out from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your souls, saying, “You must be circumcised and keep the law”—to whom we gave no such commandment—

The Sabbath started at Creation Exo20:11 before sin, before the need for animal sacrifices it was always part of God's perfect plan, the Sabbath was given to mankind Mat2:27-28 everyone who love the LORD and wants to serve and join themselves to Him Isa56:6 why the Sabbath continues on according to the LORD Isa66:22-23 because God will never want to stop spending sacred time with His children

Why Paul contrasted the commandments of God with circumcision and what matters is keeping the comamndment of God.

1 Cor7: 19 Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.

The Sabbath is a commandment of given given directly by God Himself along with the commandment to only worship Him and not steal from our neighbor. Exo20:1-17

 

[vassal]

The God of Israel who said remember the Sabbath in the OT, before He was crucified, buried, and resurrected from the dead. Since then in His NT, He has never said remember the Sabbath. Though it's still good to do so.

Of course, Remembering the Sabbath of old is not commanding a sabbath.

And so, that's why your congregation, like any other, only remembers the old Sabbath, but does not command it. All Christians are free to also keep a sabbath day or rest for themselves by choice, if possible. If not, none the worse nor better.

And so, all this talk was just about exhorting remembrance of the OT Sabbath, and extolling the benefits today, if possible to keep one?

For some reason, I thought this was another hypocritical group commanding to keep a sabbath, that their own congregation does not themselves keep as by law.

Oh well. I certainly do remember the Sabbaths of old Israel, as well as the other things written of them in Scripture. And though I don't work on Sundays anymore, since I retired from the military, I just count it a church day. I rest daily when I'm not working, sleeping, and praying in Christ Jesus.

Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

 

[vassal]

It sounds like you believe that when Jesus said "keep MY commands" it was just another way of saying keep MOSES' commands (by keeping Shabbat and all the other laws of that covenant). Had He said that I doubt if any of the rabbis would have objected, not even those who ultimately crucified Him. After all, had not the rabbis ALWAYS told the Jewish people to keep the commandments of God as well as all the "traditions of the elders" that had been passed down to them?

However that was not the Messianic Message that had been prophesied by Isaiah:
6 Therefore My people will know My name; they will know on that day that I [the Messiah] am He who speaks.
Here I am!” 7 How beautiful on the mountains are the feet of those who bring GOOD NEWS, who proclaim PEACE, who bring good tidings,who PROCLAIM SALVATION who say to Zion, “YOUR GOD REIGNS!”
(Isaiah 52:6-7)
The Kingdom of Heaven would come near in the person of the Messiah who would call people to repentance and salvation if they believed. This is the gospel, the good news of salvation which had never been heard before Jesus. Just telling people to obey the Law more perfectly would not save them because their problem was more fundamental - they lacked spiritual life. However, the Son possessed the life of the Father and He was granted the "authority to give it to us" (John 17:2-3, 1 John 5:12-13, )

The Ten Commandments is the commandments of God or what God calls “My commandments”. Exo20:6 You can find them in Exo20:1-17. It’s also called the law of God and the Testimony Exo31:18 of God and Jesus used it interchangeably with the Word of God Mat15:3-14 Mar7:7-13

Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.”

There are several laws in Scripture, the commandments of God, the Ten Commandments is the only law that God Himself wrote Deut4:13 Exo31:18 and placed inside the ark of His covenant. Exo25:16 Exo40:20

Moses wrote another law in a book, which was places outside the ark Deut41:24-26 that contained everything but the Ten Commandments including circumcision and the handwritten ordinances 2Chron 33:8 that Paul often speaks of.

This would contradict Jesus who plainly said He did not come to destroy/abolish the law and He fulfilled what He promised to do to magnify His law Isa8-:21 which means greater, not smaller why He plainly taught not to break or teach others to break the least of these commandments Mat5:19-30 which is the complete opposite of that the law is abolished.

It’s in our Bibles that in is the transgression of the law 1John3:4 and continuing in that path of sinning and breaking the law of God leads us down the wrong path John2:4 Heb10:26-30 Mat7:21-23

Let’s look at the law its speaking about…

Eph 2:11Therefore remember that you, once Gentiles in the flesh—who are called Uncircumcision by what is called the Circumcision made in the flesh by hands— 12that at that time you were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. 14For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, 15& having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, 16and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity. 17And He came and preached peace to you who were afar off and to those who were near. 18;For through Him we both have access by one Spirit to the Father.

This is not saying at the Cross we can now worship other gods and start stealing from our neighbor. It’s speaking of circumcision- because it was a requirement to get the cure for our sins in the OT by taking an animal sacrifice to an earthy temple for the forgiveness of sins. Jesus took away than enmity and wall of separation of circumcision. Both Jews and Gentiles and anyone can gain access to forgiveness of sins through the death of Jesus Christ through repentance, which means a sorry heart, a change of mind and direction.

Does this mean we can continue breaking the law of God?

Do we want this response at Christ’s Second Coming?

May 7:23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’ (Those without law).

Because Jesus very plainly taught not to break or teach others to break the least of these commandments quoting directly from the Ten Commandments. Mat5:19-30


If we belong to Christ we are not going to be sinning and committing adultery or coveting or breaking the least of God’s commandments Mat5:19-30

Yes, the people broke the old covenant so it voided it out so God made a New Covenant on better promises Heb8:6 and now writes His laws in the hearts and minds of His New Covenant believers. Sadly not everyone accepts the law of God Rom8:7-8 and have not entered this covenant by faith,

This is sad but true, faith establishes the law, so we abandon the law we are abandoning faith in Christ those who do not subject themselves to the law of God cannot please God Rom8:7-8. Did Jesus go around stealing, or profaning the LORD’s name or breaking the LORDS Sabbath, or coveting His neighbor. We need to have the same faith as Jesus, not just in Jesus but of Jesus.

Rev 14:12Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus

Your judgment noted but only God can righteously judge 24million people that you have never met. How we judge others is how God will judge us.

Romans 7:1–7 teaches that believers are “released from the law” in the sense that, through Christ’s death, they have died to their old relationship with it—just like a person is freed from a marriage covenant when a spouse dies. This doesn’t mean the law is abolished or sinful; Paul clearly says it reveals what sin is (v.7). Rather, we are no longer under the condemnation of the law. Instead, we now belong to Christ and serve God in “newness of the Spirit,” meaning obedience flows from a transformed heart rather than external obligation. The law is holy, just and good Rom7:12, the law was never the issue, its always been the hardened heart of man not subjecting themselves to the law of God Rom8:7-8

Mat 19:16 And behold, one came to him and said, Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?

Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why askest thou me concerning that which is good? One there is who is good: but if thou wouldest enter into life, keep the commandments.

Mat 19:18 He saith unto him, Which? And Jesus said, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,

Mat 19:19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.


JESUS LISTS THE TEN COMMANDMENTS!! The Covenant

 

[vassal]

The God of Israel who said remember the Sabbath in the OT, before He was crucified, buried, and resurrected from the dead. Since then in His NT, He has never said remember the Sabbath. Though it's still good to do so.

Of course, Remembering the Sabbath of old is not commanding a sabbath.

And so, that's why your congregation, like any other, only remembers the old Sabbath, but does not command it. All Christians are free to also keep a sabbath day or rest for themselves by choice, if possible. If not, none the worse nor better.

And so, all this talk was just about exhorting remembrance of the OT Sabbath, and extolling the benefits today, if possible to keep one?

For some reason, I thought this was another hypocritical group commanding to keep a sabbath, that their own congregation does not themselves keep as by law.

Oh well. I certainly do remember the Sabbaths of old Israel, as well as the other things written of them in Scripture. And though I don't work on Sundays anymore, since I retired from the military, I just count it a church day. I rest daily when I'm not working, sleeping, and praying in Christ Jesus.

why not just do it on the day God asked, if it made no difference God would have said it differently, God tests us on that day to see if we obey and do His will read Exodus 16 about the manna.