Why I Believe Judas Iscariot is Saved Pt 1
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There are NO false apostles of Christ. Christ doesn't call false Christ's into the body of Christ? But I know from Scripture that every true apostle called of Christ is a saved person because to be an apostle called of Christ means you are in the body of Christ (Ep. 4:11-12).
You quote in 2 Corinthians does not say false apostles of Christ, It says they "turn THEMSELVES into false apostles of Christ," but they are not called of Christ, so get your thinking in compliance with Scripture and say the same thing as God. When you add to the Bible you end up with heresy.
You quote in 2 Corinthians does not say false apostles of Christ, It says they "turn THEMSELVES into false apostles of Christ," but they are not called of Christ, so get your thinking in compliance with Scripture and say the same thing as God. When you add to the Bible you end up with heresy.
B
He was an apostle and a sinner like the other 11. Didn't Jesus tell Peter that he would deny Him thrice? Didn't Jesus tell the apostles that one of them would betray Him? The apostles were picked to serve a purpose in Jesus' crucifixion through free will : good or bad. All of the apostles who went out and preached the gospel were martyred except for John who wrote the Book of Revelation. Judas committed suicide by hanging.
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G
I am new comer. A Friendly Reminder...Let us not put ourselves on God's position. At the end of the day we will only know what God wants us to know. I am open to learn from everyone and please be open minded in reading replies. Nice threads though.
The Bible may not use the word "free will" but its concept is used several times in the bible. When people in the bible chooses to decide and do things on their own way - thats their own will right?
I am not in the position to JUDGE whether JUDAS is saved or not. It is between Judas and Jesus Christ. But it is clear in the Scripture that the "fruit" of Judas while he's with Jesus is not fruit of the holy Spirit (Galataians 5:22-23). Jesus also clearly stated in Matthew 12:33 that "a tree is recognized by its fruit". I can only judge Judas by his fruit and i will say He does not have the Holy spirit in him.
In Romans 10:5-15, clearly explains that salvation is for everyone (including Judas), unfortunately, during that time Judas does not comprehend who Jesus is and follow his selfishness rather that Jesus Christ.
At the end, God has planned all those things out for He's greater purpose and for the reason that He love us so much that He want us to be reconcile with Him.
I am sorry if i have mistakes in my reply. I pray and hope that I have extended my love and concern to everyone. God Bless
The Bible may not use the word "free will" but its concept is used several times in the bible. When people in the bible chooses to decide and do things on their own way - thats their own will right?
I am not in the position to JUDGE whether JUDAS is saved or not. It is between Judas and Jesus Christ. But it is clear in the Scripture that the "fruit" of Judas while he's with Jesus is not fruit of the holy Spirit (Galataians 5:22-23). Jesus also clearly stated in Matthew 12:33 that "a tree is recognized by its fruit". I can only judge Judas by his fruit and i will say He does not have the Holy spirit in him.
In Romans 10:5-15, clearly explains that salvation is for everyone (including Judas), unfortunately, during that time Judas does not comprehend who Jesus is and follow his selfishness rather that Jesus Christ.
At the end, God has planned all those things out for He's greater purpose and for the reason that He love us so much that He want us to be reconcile with Him.
I am sorry if i have mistakes in my reply. I pray and hope that I have extended my love and concern to everyone. God Bless
O
[h=3]Jeremiah 1:5[/h]New King James Version (NKJV)
[SUP]5 [/SUP]“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you; Before you were born I sanctified you; I ordained you a prophet to the nations.”
so Jeremiah 1:5, what is your game, satan's best friend? Please forgive, but the tactics I see here are of him and from him, He is known for taken the written Word of God and twisting it just enough that one takes it for the real thing but it is counterfeit, not the really thing, but at least I can claim this fact, it is not of the Spirit, and what is not of the Spirit is against God, One is either for God or against God, and one day we all will stand before Him that has fire in His eyes and we will be reviewed and we will have to give a review of what we did and how we did it, in what Spirit did we do it and did it edify the Body of Christ and or His church? It sounds as if we have Judas Iscariot among us? But listen, I may be a little hard on you but I do love you, the question is this: What would Jesus say to you, or how would He answer you? Be blessed no matter what, I have a masters in Theology, and I have a real problem following you and I ask myself, why?
[SUP]5 [/SUP]“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you; Before you were born I sanctified you; I ordained you a prophet to the nations.”
so Jeremiah 1:5, what is your game, satan's best friend? Please forgive, but the tactics I see here are of him and from him, He is known for taken the written Word of God and twisting it just enough that one takes it for the real thing but it is counterfeit, not the really thing, but at least I can claim this fact, it is not of the Spirit, and what is not of the Spirit is against God, One is either for God or against God, and one day we all will stand before Him that has fire in His eyes and we will be reviewed and we will have to give a review of what we did and how we did it, in what Spirit did we do it and did it edify the Body of Christ and or His church? It sounds as if we have Judas Iscariot among us? But listen, I may be a little hard on you but I do love you, the question is this: What would Jesus say to you, or how would He answer you? Be blessed no matter what, I have a masters in Theology, and I have a real problem following you and I ask myself, why?
The Bible does not use the term "free will" and there is no such concept to be found anywhere in same. Own will and free will are worlds apart. Not to be confused. Man has no free will in spiritual matters.
The mistake is that you think there is a "free will" in matters where there are none. You do not think so because of scripture reading, but because of philosophical concepts that you picked up elsewhere.
The mistake is that you think there is a "free will" in matters where there are none. You do not think so because of scripture reading, but because of philosophical concepts that you picked up elsewhere.
"not putting ourselves in God's position" is exactly the right attitude we ought to have!
it's God's position to judge the soul of a person, and not wrong for us to judge
whether a person's actions are good or not.
one old preacher said "i'm not a judge, but i am a fruit inspector"
the point jeremiah1:5 was trying to get across here i think was that it's so common for us all to 'judge' Judas because of his betrayal,
and forget that he was one of the chosen, called by name, and sent out with the Lord's authority.
so the Lord's elect can fall! we also know this from Peter, who denied Him, and was also rebuked for having his mind set on earthly things when he tried to dissuade Jesus from taking up the cross.
but before any of the apostles, it was written:
for the righteous falls seven times and rises again,
but the wicked stumble in times of calamity.
(Proverbs 24:16)
and
The Lord makes firm the steps
of the one who delights in him;
though he may stumble, he will not fall,
for the Lord upholds him with his hand.
(Psalm 37:23-24)
so we know the righteous can fall.
don't we also fall? can any single one of us say we never denied Jesus? that we never turned Him over to His enemies?
the thing i think the OP wanted us to think about is (1) what does the apostleship of Judas imply in and of itself, and (2) given his apostleship what does his betrayal imply? (3) given his apostelship and his betrayal, what do his actions afterwards imply?
so i'm thinking -- how does that relate to us, who are also called to be His children, and who also stumble and sin? do we judge Judas in the same way we would have ourselves judged? do we judge ourselves with the same measure? should we be judging this at all in the first place?
we ought to love mercy -- can we have mercy for this man? which of us is more deserving than him, honestly?
it's God's position to judge the soul of a person, and not wrong for us to judge
whether a person's actions are good or not.
one old preacher said "i'm not a judge, but i am a fruit inspector"
the point jeremiah1:5 was trying to get across here i think was that it's so common for us all to 'judge' Judas because of his betrayal,
and forget that he was one of the chosen, called by name, and sent out with the Lord's authority.
so the Lord's elect can fall! we also know this from Peter, who denied Him, and was also rebuked for having his mind set on earthly things when he tried to dissuade Jesus from taking up the cross.
but before any of the apostles, it was written:
for the righteous falls seven times and rises again,
but the wicked stumble in times of calamity.
(Proverbs 24:16)
and
The Lord makes firm the steps
of the one who delights in him;
though he may stumble, he will not fall,
for the Lord upholds him with his hand.
(Psalm 37:23-24)
so we know the righteous can fall.
don't we also fall? can any single one of us say we never denied Jesus? that we never turned Him over to His enemies?
the thing i think the OP wanted us to think about is (1) what does the apostleship of Judas imply in and of itself, and (2) given his apostleship what does his betrayal imply? (3) given his apostelship and his betrayal, what do his actions afterwards imply?
so i'm thinking -- how does that relate to us, who are also called to be His children, and who also stumble and sin? do we judge Judas in the same way we would have ourselves judged? do we judge ourselves with the same measure? should we be judging this at all in the first place?
we ought to love mercy -- can we have mercy for this man? which of us is more deserving than him, honestly?
Was Judas called? Sure he was...
"For many are called, but few are chosen"
-Matthew22:14
Were the twelve really 'people like us'? Sure they were. The 12 were not super-humans any more than the Jews were a super-race. The calling is not based on personal merit, but upon God's mercy and grace through Jesus, even in the time the Apostles were chosen.
Judas was an Apostle according to Webster's definition. It's only when we twist the definition to mean "somebody who went to heaven" that we run into troubles.
Was Judas the "son of perdition" referred to in John 17:12? Sure, it's clear from the context that it was one of the 12. Which of the other's do you think fits the bill?
Keep the discussion limited to just one passage? Of course not. No one verse or passage is meant to be dissected in a void. The context of any passage is the rest of God's Word. It is synthesis, not dissection, which will lead us unto true doctrine and true facts.
The idea that, simply because something is prophesied makes it ok, is simply non-sequitur. It's like the devil saying he doesn't have to go to Hell because it was prophesied that he would have to go to hell. This sympathy-for-the-devil stuff just doesn't float.
I'm afraid that Judas' present and future looks grim indeed.
"For many are called, but few are chosen"
-Matthew22:14
Were the twelve really 'people like us'? Sure they were. The 12 were not super-humans any more than the Jews were a super-race. The calling is not based on personal merit, but upon God's mercy and grace through Jesus, even in the time the Apostles were chosen.
Judas was an Apostle according to Webster's definition. It's only when we twist the definition to mean "somebody who went to heaven" that we run into troubles.
Was Judas the "son of perdition" referred to in John 17:12? Sure, it's clear from the context that it was one of the 12. Which of the other's do you think fits the bill?
Keep the discussion limited to just one passage? Of course not. No one verse or passage is meant to be dissected in a void. The context of any passage is the rest of God's Word. It is synthesis, not dissection, which will lead us unto true doctrine and true facts.
The idea that, simply because something is prophesied makes it ok, is simply non-sequitur. It's like the devil saying he doesn't have to go to Hell because it was prophesied that he would have to go to hell. This sympathy-for-the-devil stuff just doesn't float.
I'm afraid that Judas' present and future looks grim indeed.