Islam

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vashweb2

Active member
May 30, 2018
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152
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#1
I think one of the main ideas that should be taken under consideration is what life attest to. The most important thing in life for atheists, Christians, and Muslims is the connections we have with our families and friends, or in one word love. If we examine the Muslims version of God versus the Christian's we see a huge difference. Jesus Christ is so personal and relational in that He comes in to our problems in being a man and saves us from them as God. The entire old testament is centered around the theme of sacrifice an unblemished animal for sins and the coming Messiah as liberator. Muslims believe in the Torah then I hope they will look all the foreshadowing that occurs in the bible pointing to Jesus Christ as God and savoir. I hate to say this but the bible warns about this very happening in Gal 1:8 "But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be under a divine curse," and 2 cor 11:14 "And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light." This is almost a prophecy of what happened to Muhammad. An angel my have spoken to him, but if one did, it was not from heaven. I love and respect all Muslims and hope that even with our disagreements we can still joke around, be friends, yet hold to the truth without question.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
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#2
It is hard to be friends with a group that hates you and is intent of destroying you. Mahammad was a fraud.
 

vashweb2

Active member
May 30, 2018
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152
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#3
Not all of them are like that. I have meant many nice Muslim people who are really sweet and kind. I know that they do not have the truth but they are still kind. The Media portrays Islam and Christianity as hateful as possible. Go read your newspaper today. I read an article about a homosexual boy at a Catholic school who wasn't allowed to give a speech at the school for some reason. The Media was all over it. We can't believe what the media says about Christianity or Islam the same. Talk to a Muslim. Show them who Christ is rather than assuming they hateful toward you; because they are very loving people too. Share who Christ is with Love and Truth and watch the change.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
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#4
I had a good Muslim friend too years ago, very sweet woman who came from India. The ones that hate us are the ones that blindly adhere to the teachings of Islam. Id don't consider these to be potential friends but rather should be treated as a threat. I don't go by what the media's interpretation of Islam but rather what it truly is, and that is, totally contrary to the Word of God.

By the way, glad to have you as part of our community. Welcome to CC.
 

vashweb2

Active member
May 30, 2018
39
152
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#5
Atheism and agnostics are all around. Everything they believe is contrary to the word, yet we work with them and are friends with them. Please forgive me for saying this but I feel that I mean it: if I had a choice to chose between living next to a Muslim or an atheist, I would chose a Muslim. Muslims believe in Jesus Christ and the teachings of the gospel although they are terribly mistaken about its interpretation. Quran chapter 5 verse 46 states this "And We sent, following in their footsteps, Jesus, the son of Mary, confirming that which came before him in the Torah; and We gave him the Gospel, in which was guidance and light and confirming that which preceded it of the Torah as guidance and instruction for the righteous." They do believe in a false interpretation in their Quran, but they cannot reject what the bible says about Jesus, their book tells them that right here.
 

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
68,342
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#6
Muslims believe in Allah and Mohammed. Allah is NOT the God of the bible..
 

vashweb2

Active member
May 30, 2018
39
152
33
#7
Allah is the word for God in Arabic. Without the word Allah, you would not be able to say God in Arabic. Muslims of course have some serious differences from Christianity. I am no way at all trying to say they are same, at least to Christians. But Muslims believe in the Gospels and the Torah, we do not believe in the Quran. As I have already shown in the verse I posted from the Quran, Muslims cannot deny most of the message we Christians believe in. This is a huge evangelism tool for helping a Muslim see the truth. They will of course say that the Gospels have been corrupted to support their denial of the deity of Christ. But then we could easily show them (because they were never given this information) the biblical manuscripts we have. We have all the Gospels within the 100 years of their writing. Which affirms their validity more than the historical Quran. The Quran's history has some serious issues and so does Muhammad. But telling Muslims that their belief is wrong, flat out, will quickly turn them away. Just imagine yourself in their situation; as soon as someone says anything against Christainity we immediately do not even care what that person is saying because we know we have the Truth. And if someone were to keep repeating their words against our faith, even if they have some truth to them, do we even care? Mat 7:12 says to do on to others as you want done to you. I think their is an opportunity for telling them the truth, but it should not be forced upon them. If God wanted to force Christianity upon people He certainly has the power to do it. Mat 5:16 says let your light shine before others, that they may see your good deeds and glorify your Father in heaven. I believe through the fruits of the spirit will show which the truth.
 
#8
What part of "Caliphate" (global domination), or "sharia law", do you not understand? Christianity has been playing "whack-a-mo" with islam, and muslims, since muhammid! These manuscripts you spoke of ARE available to muslims to teach. Yet, the "oppressive" sharia law, will not allow it!
 

Attachments

vashweb2

Active member
May 30, 2018
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#9
I am aware of some sects of Islams belief: Taliban, ISIS, and other Terrorist groups. Put to equate those groups, and label those groups, with all Islam would be like equating Jim Jones's group, or the Crusades, or Mormons, or other groups that we Christians would not equate with Christianity, as Christians. I am aware of you talking about with Sharia Law and how some Muslims countries have some laws of apostasy. The thing is that there are so many sects of Islam to you can throw in as great worry for Americans without considering the ones that are peaceful. Generalizing all Muslims isn't going to show them the truth, it will only push them away even more. Our truth is the real truth, and our love is the real love, no one here doubts that. I am around Muslims all day long and never see any of them act in the way certain sects of Islam act in other countries. I did a group study not that long ago with a young Muslim and he was very kind to me and very honest about his faith. Developing relationships is the best way we can reflect the truth that they have never heard. Muslims occupy around 1.6 billion (according to the last Us.gov numbers) out of 7 billion people. That is a large number we would be ignoring. Mat 5:43-45 says "You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous," and Matt 28:19 "Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit." It seems if they cannot come here then we will have to go there; it is one or the other.
 
#10
I am quite sure, you are the first and only convert to Christ that has ever witnessed the Gospel message to the muslim/islamic world in the past 2,000 years. And for this? I applaud your efforts! And, I shall disregard world history, or interpret that history as.....Well?.....That was then, and this is now. :)
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
7,250
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#11
I am aware of some sects of Islams belief: Taliban, ISIS, and other Terrorist groups. Put to equate those groups, and label those groups, with all Islam would be like equating Jim Jones's group, or the Crusades, or Mormons, or other groups that we Christians would not equate with Christianity, as Christians. I am aware of you talking about with Sharia Law and how some Muslims countries have some laws of apostasy. The thing is that there are so many sects of Islam to you can throw in as great worry for Americans without considering the ones that are peaceful. Generalizing all Muslims isn't going to show them the truth, it will only push them away even more. Our truth is the real truth, and our love is the real love, no one here doubts that. I am around Muslims all day long and never see any of them act in the way certain sects of Islam act in other countries. I did a group study not that long ago with a young Muslim and he was very kind to me and very honest about his faith. Developing relationships is the best way we can reflect the truth that they have never heard. Muslims occupy around 1.6 billion (according to the last Us.gov numbers) out of 7 billion people. That is a large number we would be ignoring. Mat 5:43-45 says "You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous," and Matt 28:19 "Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit." It seems if they cannot come here then we will have to go there; it is one or the other.
Of course we are to love all people. Muslims included. However you are gravely mistaken about your views that the MAJORITY Muslims don't hold to radical, anti American, anti freedom ideas of how society should operate. Here is a short video by non Christians, including muslims, explaining the extreme danger Islam itself presents to the World at large and Christians in particular.

 

Yeraza_Bats

Senior Member
Dec 11, 2014
3,632
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#12
Allah is the word for God in Arabic. Without the word Allah, you would not be able to say God in Arabic. Muslims of course have some serious differences from Christianity. I am no way at all trying to say they are same, at least to Christians. But Muslims believe in the Gospels and the Torah, we do not believe in the Quran. As I have already shown in the verse I posted from the Quran, Muslims cannot deny most of the message we Christians believe in. This is a huge evangelism tool for helping a Muslim see the truth. They will of course say that the Gospels have been corrupted to support their denial of the deity of Christ. But then we could easily show them (because they were never given this information) the biblical manuscripts we have. We have all the Gospels within the 100 years of their writing. Which affirms their validity more than the historical Quran. The Quran's history has some serious issues and so does Muhammad. But telling Muslims that their belief is wrong, flat out, will quickly turn them away. Just imagine yourself in their situation; as soon as someone says anything against Christainity we immediately do not even care what that person is saying because we know we have the Truth. And if someone were to keep repeating their words against our faith, even if they have some truth to them, do we even care? Mat 7:12 says to do on to others as you want done to you. I think their is an opportunity for telling them the truth, but it should not be forced upon them. If God wanted to force Christianity upon people He certainly has the power to do it. Mat 5:16 says let your light shine before others, that they may see your good deeds and glorify your Father in heaven. I believe through the fruits of the spirit will show which the truth.
I like most of what you say here, but I gotta correct you on one thing. Allah is not araboc for God, and its easily provable. Do you know the islamic creed, "there is no god but allah"? Even in arabic, the title of God is not the same as the name of allah.

Screenshot_2018-05-15-20-32-08.png

Allah is in fact a name and not a title, the islamic god has its own name, just like all of satans made up gods.

Also, islam does indeed deny both that Christ is the Son of God and that He gave His life for our sins and was ressureccted.

But you are right, there are many loving and kind muslims out there. Too many people have come to believe that criticizing muslims = racism, even in the Christian community somehow.

Muslims are people just like you and I, but Islam is evil. Not only does it deny Christ and calls Him " nothing more than a messenger of allah", but it also calls for violencr and subjagation of nonbelievers. But we should strive to love muslims and befriend them (Id say only if they know how to answer islamic criticisms), definitely.
 

Yeraza_Bats

Senior Member
Dec 11, 2014
3,632
160
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#13
I am aware of some sects of Islams belief: Taliban, ISIS, and other Terrorist groups. Put to equate those groups, and label those groups, with all Islam would be like equating Jim Jones's group, or the Crusades, or Mormons, or other groups that we Christians would not equate with Christianity, as Christians. I am aware of you talking about with Sharia Law and how some Muslims countries have some laws of apostasy. The thing is that there are so many sects of Islam to you can throw in as great worry for Americans without considering the ones that are peaceful. Generalizing all Muslims isn't going to show them the truth, it will only push them away even more. Our truth is the real truth, and our love is the real love, no one here doubts that. I am around Muslims all day long and never see any of them act in the way certain sects of Islam act in other countries. I did a group study not that long ago with a young Muslim and he was very kind to me and very honest about his faith. Developing relationships is the best way we can reflect the truth that they have never heard. Muslims occupy around 1.6 billion (according to the last Us.gov numbers) out of 7 billion people. That is a large number we would be ignoring. Mat 5:43-45 says "You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous," and Matt 28:19 "Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit." It seems if they cannot come here then we will have to go there; it is one or the other.
To be fair, the Christian crusades were a response to islamic conquest, and not just a campaign to kill muslims just cuz.

Some crusaders did awful things to Jewish people, yeah. But the crusades themselves were a reaponse to the violence of islam

Also, its 100% right to point out that islam IS violent. The different sects dont matter, because we can easily read what is written in the quran and hadiths

Screenshot_2018-05-07-23-40-47.png

But you are right that we shouldnt judge muslims soley on their religion.

We should love the muslims. We should love them enough to feel driven to reacue them from their false prophet. And we should treat them, as individuals, with love and respect.
 

Yeraza_Bats

Senior Member
Dec 11, 2014
3,632
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#14
I like most of what you say here, but I gotta correct you on one thing. Allah is not araboc for God, and its easily provable. Do you know the islamic creed, "there is no god but allah"? Even in arabic, the title of God is not the same as the name of allah.

View attachment 183152

Allah is in fact a name and not a title, the islamic god has its own name, just like all of satans made up gods.

Also, islam does indeed deny both that Christ is the Son of God and that He gave His life for our sins and was ressureccted.

But you are right, there are many loving and kind muslims out there. Too many people have come to believe that criticizing muslims = racism, even in the Christian community somehow.

Muslims are people just like you and I, but Islam is evil. Not only does it deny Christ and calls Him " nothing more than a messenger of allah", but it also calls for violencr and subjagation of nonbelievers. But we should strive to love muslims and befriend them (Id say only if they know how to answer islamic criticisms), definitely.

Oooof, just saw a mistake here, wrote "criticising muslims", meant to say " criticising islam"

Wish this site would let you edit your posts.
 

vashweb2

Active member
May 30, 2018
39
152
33
#15
I have talked to Muslims and study Islam by former Muslims, so I am pretty sure Allah is the term we can use if we were to say it in Arabic. Here's a link that will help with that:
. As I said before, the Violent string is something you do not want to pull lest all of Christian history come out and you have to defend Christian Crusades, The Many Witch trials, The Indian invasions, etc. The Muslims you will encounter in the United States will mostly be the nice loving ones. If you watch the link you will hear the testimony of a Muslim and what he was brought up to believe when he was a Muslim. And as I said before, if they don't come to us we will have to go to them. If you read the history of the Christian, especially in the book of Acts, you will find out that Christianity has had to deal with much pain in order to propagate the truth. If Christians persecute Muslims in America, Christianity won't be Christianity anymore. Its not the Christian way to avoid the potential to share the gospel for the sake of safety. Matthew 10:33 "But whoever denies Me before men, I will also deny him before My Father in heaven." Matthew 16:25 "For whoever wants to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for My sake will find it." Matthew 5:44 "But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you." Matthew 28:19 "therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit." Christians in the last couple hundred years have grown very comfortable due to technology and prosperity within their nations that they have forgotten what the bible and history teaches about the church. When the time comes, I will pray to God myself and go to Pakistan, Iran, Iraq, the United Arab Emirates, and other Muslim countries and preach the gospel. These people mean everything to our Jesus Christ who died for them. There is so much work to be done, so much work that we cannot be stagnant in our preaching. We should not be afraid of Muslims or have any hatred toward them. They only already believe in God, we just need to point out what we have in common rather than the differences so that we can get along. The scripture I posted makes that clear. If you don't know any Muslims I suggest you make friends with one and learn how the behave rather than putting your complete faith in the Media's version. The Media is always attacking Christians from all directions and we know that there opinions are simply for self-serving purposes. If you want to know what Muslims believe talk to them. The Muslims I am talking about are the one's we experience here in the United States. They don't come to a country of free speech for no reason. They don't come to country that allows women to dress so disgustingly to teach their children that. And again you cannot equate the Muslims you are going to experience, the ones in which I am referring to, to the whole. The majority of Christians are Catholics if you were to look up the statistics. Would we accept that as reflecting our ideals and beliefs? Let us encounter and love and share the Gospel. Jesus Christ died on the Cross for the Sins of all humanity. Quran 5:46, 47 "And We sent, following in their footsteps, Jesus, the son of Mary, confirming that which came before him in the Torah; and We gave him the Gospel, in which was guidance and light and confirming that which preceded it of the Torah as guidance and instruction for the righteous," "And let the People of the Gospel judge by what Allah has revealed therein. And whoever does not judge by what Allah has revealed - then it is those who are the defiantly disobedient." So please brothers and sisters, let us focus on what we agree on with Muslims to teach them the Truth. Their texts says right here that they have to listen to the Gospels and the Torah. Again, they will say it is flawed but they still cannot reject the totality of it. It helps if you look at Muslim as you would any other person, except for the fact that they already people in Jesus and God, they just need to combine the two;). s-l1600.jpg
 

Yeraza_Bats

Senior Member
Dec 11, 2014
3,632
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#16
I was only pointing out that allah is not really arabic for God.

As for pointing out history, its not history Im tatalking about. Im talking about Islam itself. Islam is the teachings of muhammad, and not what every muslim does.
Muhammad command violence against unbelievers, all it takes is reading what he said and did in the quran and hadiths. He even himself is recorded as saying that his finances were paid forcing others to pay a life tax-

Screenshot_2018-05-29-12-33-24.png

As for people pointing out violence done by Christians, let them. We are told that we should defend our faith. Its good to know how to answer criticisms.
 

Demi777

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2014
6,515
1,446
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Germany
#17
Thing is that Allah comes from the arabic pagan deity ""Allat"" which is female. Mohammed changed it to an male name "allah" and after the years and years it was also taken into the normal wording.
It wasnt always allah.
so in the end yea its one name for just god BUT its not the original. Most muslims or people from arab countries dont even know the history of it lol.
 

tanakh

Senior Member
Dec 1, 2015
4,038
655
113
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#18
I think one of the main ideas that should be taken under consideration is what life attest to. The most important thing in life for atheists, Christians, and Muslims is the connections we have with our families and friends, or in one word love. If we examine the Muslims version of God versus the Christian's we see a huge difference. Jesus Christ is so personal and relational in that He comes in to our problems in being a man and saves us from them as God. The entire old testament is centered around the theme of sacrifice an unblemished animal for sins and the coming Messiah as liberator. Muslims believe in the Torah then I hope they will look all the foreshadowing that occurs in the bible pointing to Jesus Christ as God and savoir. I hate to say this but the bible warns about this very happening in Gal 1:8 "But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be under a divine curse," and 2 cor 11:14 "And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light." This is almost a prophecy of what happened to Muhammad. An angel my have spoken to him, but if one did, it was not from heaven. I love and respect all Muslims and hope that even with our disagreements we can still joke around, be friends, yet hold to the truth without question.
Like yourself I pray that Muslims will come to Christ through reading the Bible but how many actually read and understand it?
Some years ago I fell into a conversation with a young Muslim who said he didnt need sixty six books to know God just the one
meaning the Koran. As I see it the problem is not just a matter of belief its in cultural,political and historic barriers that have
developed over centuries of animosity on both sides of the divide. The same can be said for Jewish attitudes towards Christians
and the New Testament. I believe a work of the Holy Spirit in individual lives is the only way anyone can come to Christ. Its how I
came to him and how it is with us all.

I do think people in western society are fairly ignorant regarding the Islamic beliefs and history myself included which doesnt help
to encourage people to consider Christ and Christianity to be the truth. I am trying to educate myself a little more so at least I know what I'm talking about!. On the subject of educating myself I came across a Poet and teacher called Rumi recently who had a great influence on many people including Christians and Jews in the middle ages. I believe he was the founder of the Sufi branch of Islam
do you know much about him and to what extent his influence plays a part today?
about
 

mcubed

Senior Member
Dec 20, 2013
1,449
211
63
#19
I think one of the main ideas that should be taken under consideration is what life attest to. The most important thing in life for atheists, Christians, and Muslims is the connections we have with our families and friends, or in one word love. If we examine the Muslims version of God versus the Christian's we see a huge difference. Jesus Christ is so personal and relational in that He comes in to our problems in being a man and saves us from them as God. The entire old testament is centered around the theme of sacrifice an unblemished animal for sins and the coming Messiah as liberator. Muslims believe in the Torah then I hope they will look all the foreshadowing that occurs in the bible pointing to Jesus Christ as God and savoir. I hate to say this but the bible warns about this very happening in Gal 1:8 "But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be under a divine curse," and 2 cor 11:14 "And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light." This is almost a prophecy of what happened to Muhammad. An angel my have spoken to him, but if one did, it was not from heaven. I love and respect all Muslims and hope that even with our disagreements we can still joke around, be friends, yet hold to the truth without question.
Muslims believe in Torah.... Who is the chosen son... Isaac or Ishmael?
 

Yeraza_Bats

Senior Member
Dec 11, 2014
3,632
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#20
Muslims believe in Torah.... Who is the chosen son... Isaac or Ishmael?
According to muhammad, both the torah and gospel are from allah. And yet the quran completely contradicts the gospel.

If allah cant preserve the gospel, why should we care wheter or not muslims claim the torah?