2 Peter 2 (Let's get into it)

[Grace777x70]

Galatians 2:16 - nevertheless knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the Law but through faith in Christ Jesus, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, so that we may be justified by faith inChrist and not by the works of the Law; since by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified. (NASB)

Galatians 2:20 - I have been crucified with Christ; and it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself up for me.

Galatians 3:22 - But the Scripture has shut up everyone under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.

Galatians 3:26 - For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus.

Philippians 3:9 - and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith.

Is this a KJV only thing?

No, it's not a KJV only thing. All the manuscripts have the faith "of" Christ in them for Gal. 2:20. It all depends on how the translators translated the word. It is definitely in the "genitive case" which is the case of "possession". It is the faith of Christ.

The way I view it is - Jesus lived as a man ( and He was God in the flesh too ) and He committed His spirit into the hands of His Father at the cross. Jesus lived by the Father within Him while on this earth - completely dependent on Him - the same we too live by Christ now on this earth. Without Him we can do nothing.

It was the faith of Jesus in the Father's capability to raise Him from the dead. We too have faith in Jesus and what He has done which He had accomplished through His own faith in the Father. The gospel is from faith to faith. ( from Christ's faith to our faith in Him - it also can mean we grow in our faith as we see more of Christ's work of grace and love for us )

So, it is in my mind - both - we live by the faith of what Jesus accomplished by His faith in the Father and we too live by our faith in what Christ has already done.

It's a matter of seeing the work of Christ from His viewpoint and His reliance ( faith ) on the Father which in the hearing of Him - we too receive faith.

Romans 10:17 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.

It's just a different perspective of the origin of faith - Christ had it first and lived by it and now we too live off that faith which He had in the Father. From faith to faith.

It all boils down to - we must have faith in Christ Himself and His finished work on the cross for salvation and the receiving of life.

 

[mailmandan]

No, it's not a KJV only thing. All the manuscripts have the faith "of" Christ in them for Gal. 2:20. It all depends on how the translators translated the word. It is definitely in the "genitive case" which is the case of "possession". It is the faith of Christ.

The way I view it is - Jesus lived as a man ( and He was God in the flesh too ) and He committed His spirit into the hands of His Father at the cross. Jesus lived by the Father within Him while on this earth - completely dependent on Him - the same we too live by Christ now on this earth. Without Him we can do nothing.

It was the faith of Jesus in the Father's capability to raise Him from the dead. We too have faith in Jesus and what He has done which He had accomplished through His own faith in the Father. The gospel is from faith to faith. ( from Christ's faith to our faith in Him - it also can mean we grow in our faith as we see more of Christ's work of grace and love for us )

So, it is in my mind - both - we live by the faith of what Jesus accomplished by His faith in the Father and we too live by our faith in what Christ has already done.

It's a matter of seeing the work of Christ from His viewpoint and His reliance ( faith ) on the Father which in the hearing of Him - we too receive faith.

Romans 10:17 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] So faith comes from hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.

I see what you're saying now. It sounded like garee was trying to imply that we don't exercise faith in Christ at all and Christ exercises all the faith for us. I wasn't sure if this conversation was heading for a KJV only debate or a 5 point Calvinism debate.

 

[Grace777x70]

I see what you're saying now. It sounded like garee was trying to imply that we don't exercise faith in Christ at all and Christ exercises all the faith for us. I wasn't sure if this conversation was heading for a KJV only debate or a 5 point Calvinism debate.

I thought garee was talking about our faith originates from the faith of Christ when He trusted Himself with the Father. It was Jesus faith in the Father that accomplished all things. That's the way I took it anyway. Of course I may have viewed it through the lens of how I see the faith of Christ too.

We definitely choose to exercise faith in the message of Christ when we hear of Him. Actually this principle applies for all the truths from the Holy Spirit as He reveals new aspects of the love and grace of our Father and Lord to us.

 

[preacher4truth]

When Scripture says we live by the faith of the Son of God it is referencing that is where our faith came from, from whom that faith was granted. Don't be fooled by the one preaching genitive case, he doesn't know what he's speaking of and his conclusions are false. Saying one possesses faith does not mean that that faith is the same faith that Christ "possesses."

That is clearly incorrect.

I live by the faith of the Son of God; meaning, not that faith which Christ, as man, had, but that of which he is the author and object, by which the just man lives; not upon it, for the believer does not live upon any of his graces, no, not upon faith, but by faith on Christ, the object; looking to him for pardon, righteousness, peace, joy, comfort, every supply of grace, and eternal salvation: which object is described as "the Son of God"; who is truly God, equal with his Father; so that he did not live upon a creature, or forsake the fountain of living waters, but upon the only begotten Son of God, who is full of grace and truth: of whom he further says, - Gill

There are many other sources, but taking the of out of context as someone is doing in this thread is to arrive at false conclusions. It should rather be rendered faith in the Son of God.

 

[Grace777x70]

There is a completely different Greek word for "in". There is no Greek word for "of" it is supplied by the genitive case.

Anyway - people can believe what they want as it all boils down to - we must have faith in Christ for salvation and life.

I believe that the faith of Jesus living as man for the Father to raise Him from the dead produced a living faith that we can have "in" Christ and in all that He has done in His work on the cross and resurrection.

God raised Jesus from the dead by Jesus' own blood of the New Covenant. Jesus had faith that the Father would do this when He put His spirit into His hands.

One day - we too will get a new body that is immortal like our Lord's but for now our spirit is one with the Lord. Thank you Jesus!

Hebrews 13:20 (NASB)
[SUP]20 [/SUP] Now the God of peace, who brought up from the dead the great Shepherd of the sheep through the blood of the eternal covenant, even Jesus our Lord,

 

[garee]

James is not using the word "justified" to mean "accounted as righteous" but is "shown to be righteous." James is discussing the proof of faith (says-claims to have faith but has no works/I will show you my faith by my works - James 2:14-18), not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God (Romans 4:2-3).

Hope you are enjoying your vacation..

Yes a imputed righteousness the righteousness of Christ not of his own self . It is as you offered below

Hebrews 12:2 says that Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith, not His faith.
Again this is not of our owm selves.This is according to His faith as His belief. He who began the good work of His faith in us (not of us) will finish it.

Abraham does not get accredited for the work of Holy Spirit moving Abraham to do the will of God. It was not the will of Abraham .If it was the will of God and Abraham performed it if we would accredit that work to Abraham clearly blasphemy is in the picture.

Again we do not accredit the faith of Christ to Abraham or any believer. In that parable it was Christ working in Abraham to both will (Take now thy son get thee into the land) and perform it. Abraham does not get accredited for hearing God and being moved to work it out

And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of. And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and saddled his ass, and took two of his young men with him, and Isaac his son, and clave the wood for the burnt offering, and rose up, and went unto the place of which God had told him. Gen 22:2

God gets credit for both. Doing the will of God is the free will we exercise. If we would refuse to do His will it would not make the faith of God to no effect to those who do move according to the good pleasure of it. It is what expected of new creatures it is not a bonus that removes the wage of sin

Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.: Phi 2:12

The companion verse is below.

Jam 2:23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God

 

[Grace777x70]

Hope you are enjoying your vacation..

Yes a imputed righteousness the righteousness of Christ not of his own self . It is as you offered below

Hebrews 12:2 says that Jesus is the author and finisher of our faith, not His faith.
Again this is not of our owm selves.This is according to His faith as His belief. He who began the good work of His faith in us (not of us) will finish it.

Abraham does not get accredited for the work of Holy Spirit moving Abraham to do the will of God. It was not the will of Abraham .If it was the will of God and Abraham performed it if we would accredit that work to Abraham clearly blasphemy is in the picture.

Again we do not accredit the faith of Christ to Abraham or any believer. In that parable it was Christ working in Abraham to both will (Take now thy son get thee into the land) and perform it. Abraham does not get accredited for hearing God and being moved to work it out

And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of. And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and saddled his ass, and took two of his young men with him, and Isaac his son, and clave the wood for the burnt offering, and rose up, and went unto the place of which God had told him. Gen 22:2

God gets credit for both. Doing the will of God is the free will we exercise. If we would refuse to do His will it would not make the faith of God to no effect to those who do move according to the good pleasure of it. It is what expected of new creatures it is not a bonus that removes the wage of sin

Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.: Phi 2:12

The companion verse is below.

Jam 2:23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God

I can see that truth. Everything originates with God and comes from God Himself including the faith "to will and to do" of His good pleasure.

It is the whole - He is the Vine - we are the branch thing. We have no life apart from our union with Him.

Colossians 1:18 (KJV)
[SUP]18 [/SUP] And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

 

[Chris1975]

A practicing homosexual may believe "mental assent" in the existence and historical facts about Jesus, yet if they have not repented, they do not believe/entrust their spiritual well being to Christ. The unrighteous (including homosexuals) will not inherit the kingdom of God (1 Corinthians 6:9). Those who practice such things (Galatians 5:21). To "practice" such sins listed in 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 and Galatians 5:19-21 equates to a willful, habitual lifestyle. No repentance, just bring it on. That is not the fruit of a genuine believer. That's how I would bring them into the correct way and of course, I would share the gospel with them.

*1 Corinthians 6:11 - Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

^^^ good response.

- So from the above we can conclude then that openly gay churches have not repented; they are thus not in the faith; and therefore unless they repent they will be treated just like the unbelievers, and have their portion in the lake of fire. We can agree on this.

- this is the same for any church condoning any other sins (to answer Grace777's question to me yesterday). The same principle applies as to the above.- we can see the evidence of this in 1 Corinthians 5 church, which overlooked the sins of the man who had his fathers wife. Instead of dealing with this, they tolerated it, bringing sharp rebuke by Paul. This one was handed over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his soul would be saved on the day of judgement.

-mailmandan, by your own admission above in scriptures 1Cor6v9 and Gal 5v19-21 the ones who commit these sins (both the homosexual example and the example of the man who had his fathers wife in Corinth) will receive as their portion eternal torment. Therefore the only way the 1 Corinthians 5 church member could have his soul saved on the day of judgment would be for this same believer to repent before he breathes his last. That was what the destruction of the flesh judgement was - that he would have a change of heart. He would continue to die physically, but in hope that this process leads to a repentance in his soul.

- Therefore by conclusion, the only way into a restoration of relationship with the Lord would be a repentance on behalf of the believer.

 

[Chris1975]

^^^ good response.

- So from the above we can conclude then that openly gay churches have not repented; they are thus not in the faith; and therefore unless they repent they will be treated just like the unbelievers, and have their portion in the lake of fire. We can agree on this.

- this is the same for any church condoning any other sins (to answer Grace777's question to me yesterday). The same principle applies as to the above.- we can see the evidence of this in 1 Corinthians 5 church, which overlooked the sins of the man who had his fathers wife. Instead of dealing with this, they tolerated it, bringing sharp rebuke by Paul. This one was handed over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his soul would be saved on the day of judgement.

-mailmandan, by your own admission above in scriptures 1Cor6v9 and Gal 5v19-21 the ones who commit these sins (both the homosexual example and the example of the man who had his fathers wife in Corinth) will receive as their portion eternal torment. Therefore the only way the 1 Corinthians 5 church member could have his soul saved on the day of judgment would be for this same believer to repent before he breathes his last. That was what the destruction of the flesh judgement was - that he would have a change of heart. He would continue to die physically, but in hope that this process leads to a repentance in his soul.

- Therefore by conclusion, the only way into a restoration of relationship with the Lord would be a repentance on behalf of the believer.

And by implication, no repentance means that condemnation will remain on such a person.

 

[Grace777x70]

Chris1975 -

I am interested in seeing how your theory about sin and the Christian looks like in real life.

It's a legitimate question that will reveal what "walking after the flesh" means as far as sinning and going to heaven to be with the Lord.

So, if you would answer the question truthfully it will reveal what is really believed. Here is the question for you.

Can someone that wilfully sins for the last 3 months of their life by having malice and slander or envy or that causes strife during that time ( which are all works of the flesh ) and not repenting of them go to heaven if they died tonight?

I want to know about this "living after the flesh" idea.

I believe this question will reveal some things. It is a legitimate question about "real life" situations and living after the flesh.

Answer the question below so that we understand what "living after the flesh" looks like in real life:

Let's look at this sin business for a bit. Envy is just as much a sin as any sexual sinning is. ( Gal. 5 )

So, let's say someone has been envious of other people for years. All of a sudden they die...does this one that was envying people now not go to heaven in your religion?

...in some people's thinking they would go to hell because they have been "living after the flesh"?

Or what about gluttony ( which is a form of lasciviousness - "without restraint" ) which is a sin - what if someone has a battle with overeating all the time and they die ?

Do they go to hell now when they die because they were not able to overcome this over-eating as this is "living after the flesh" too?

These 2 scenarios above would be people "living in the flesh" and as you call being a servant to sin ( even though they are free in Christ but don't know it yet and haven't gown up in the Lord enough spiritually to overcome them ).

These 2 groups of people in some people's theology would not be children of God and thus go to hell.....Is that right?

Is this true in your religion?

Thanks for answering as I like to take people's religion for test runs to see how this works in real life.

( Let me say that I am vehemently against any form of sinning from living a homosexual lifestyle to being envious of others, to causing strife and divisions....all the works of the flesh will bring destruction of some sort to all of us while in this earth )

I believe the proper teaching of the love and grace of God in Christ will supply the believer the proper nutrients in order to live godly lives in this present world.

 

[willybob]

And by implication, no repentance means that condemnation will remain on such a person.

very true, for scriptures says that the wrath of God remains upon the children of disobedience.....

 

[garee]

I see what you're saying now. It sounded like garee was trying to imply that we don't exercise faith in Christ at all and Christ exercises all the faith for us. I wasn't sure if this conversation was heading for a KJV only debate or a 5 point Calvinism debate.

That is not what I was trying to apply.We exercise(work) the faith that comes from him as a free gift.We are not saved apart from His faith, by having it in him .He must do the first works giving us His faith from him, towards us. Ag Christ unles he first gives us the faith to make it ssible .It is the work of God that we can beleive Him, not seen. Again we cannot have faith in unless we are first given the faith of Chrsit as the work that works in us to both will and do his good pleasure

The commandment is not to have the faith of Christ, the Lord in respect to the things of men. It is there the father of lies gets his foot in the door and can cause a oeson to commit blashempy(atributing the work of one to another.)of the Holy Spirit the unforgivable sin .

Verse one sets the context for the whole chapter, miss it by blaspheming His Holy name by which we are called heavenward might as well forget the remaining.


am 2:1 My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons.

The conclusion below

m 2:7 Do not they blaspheme that worthy name by the which ye are called?

 

[J7]

When Scripture says we live by the faith of the Son of God it is referencing that is where our faith came from, from whom that faith was granted. Don't be fooled by the one preaching genitive case, he doesn't know what he's speaking of and his conclusions are false. Saying one possesses faith does not mean that that faith is the same faith that Christ "possesses."

That is clearly incorrect.

I live by the faith of the Son of God; meaning, not that faith which Christ, as man, had, but that of which he is the author and object, by which the just man lives; not upon it, for the believer does not live upon any of his graces, no, not upon faith, but by faith on Christ, the object; looking to him for pardon, righteousness, peace, joy, comfort, every supply of grace, and eternal salvation: which object is described as "the Son of God"; who is truly God, equal with his Father; so that he did not live upon a creature, or forsake the fountain of living waters, but upon the only begotten Son of God, who is full of grace and truth: of whom he further says, - Gill

There are many other sources, but taking the of out of context as someone is doing in this thread is to arrive at false conclusions. It should rather be rendered faith in the Son of God.

You imply that Grace777 is actively attempting to deceive people. I think that is reprehensible actually.

 

[Grace777x70]

very true, for scriptures says that the wrath of God remains upon the children of disobedience.....

The children of dis-obedience are those that have not received Christ and the message of Him.

Ephesians 2:2 (NASB)
[SUP]2 [/SUP] in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience.

The wrath of God "remains" on these because of their refusal to receive Christ's sacrifice for their sins.

Here is what those who have received Christ have.

1 Thessalonians 5:9 (KJV)
[SUP]9 [/SUP] For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

 

[willybob]

God lives and moves through time (everlasting through the measurement of time) and knows all that can be known, and sees all things as reality. Possibilities are not certainties and that is reality, lest one perceives God doesn't see things as reality...

 

[mailmandan]

And by implication, no repentance means that condemnation will remain on such a person.

In the case of those who practice homosexuality (willful, habitual lifestyle, no repentance, just bring it on) they are not in the faith. We can agree on that. According to 1 Corinthians 6:9 and Galatians 5:19-21, these people are described as "unrighteous" who "practice" such sins. They are not believers who lost their salvation, but unbelievers who never received it. *Also see 1 John 3:7-10.

In regards to the case of the man who had his father's wife in 1 Corinthians 5:1-5, this man truly stumbled and was in need of repentance in regards to this matter. How long did he stumble? We don't know for sure, yet Paul did not say the man lost his salvation and needed to get saved all over again. He was to receive discipline (delivered to Satan for the destruction of the flesh) yet (that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus). How long did this man stumble? We don't know for sure, yet some may argue that he did repent in 2 Corinthians chapter 2. Temporarily stumbling in the present does not necessarily mean continuous action in the future.

In 1 Corinthians 3:1-3, Paul addresses the Corinthian believers who were behaving as men of the flesh/carnal. There was envy, strife and divisions among them and they were still on milk and not ready for solid food. That would not be considered practicing sin and nothing is mentioned about them losing their salvation either and needing to repent of their envy, strife and divisions in order to get saved all over again. Instead, Paul refers to them as "babes in Christ." They needed to mature.

 

[willybob]

Obedience is not considered an optional extra for believers that we are not expected to do, yet obedience is also not mandatory in the sense that it is forced or legalistic for believers either.

very pleasing to the flesh I would suppose....

 

[willybob]

those that walk after the flesh desperately seek to change the 10 commandments (law of the Spirit) to the 10 suggestions for better living....

 

[Grace777x70]

In the case of those who practice homosexuality (willful, habitual lifestyle, no repentance, just bring it on) they are not in the faith. We can agree on that. According to 1 Corinthians 6:9 and Galatians 5:19-21, these people are described as "unrighteous" who "practice" such sins. They are not believers who lost their salvation, but unbelievers who never received it. *Also see 1 John 3:7-10.

In regards to the case of the man who had his father's wife in 1 Corinthians 5:1-5, this man truly stumbled and was in need of repentance in regards to this matter. How long did he stumble? We don't know for sure, yet Paul did not say the man lost his salvation and needed to get saved all over again. He was to receive discipline (delivered to Satan for the destruction of the flesh) yet (that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus). How long did this man stumble? We don't know for sure, yet some may argue that he did repent in 2 Corinthians chapter 2. Temporarily stumbling in the present does not necessarily mean continuous action in the future.

In 1 Corinthians 3:1-3, Paul addresses the Corinthian believers who were behaving as men of the flesh/carnal. There was envy, strife and divisions among them and they were still on milk and not ready for solid food. That would not be considered practicing sin and nothing is mentioned about them losing their salvation either and needing to repent of their envy, strife and divisions in order to get saved all over again. Instead, Paul refers to them as "babes in Christ." They needed to mature.

In brown above is where the "lose your salvation belief system" stumbles at. Envy, strife and divisions are just as much a work of the flesh as sexual sinning is.

We Christians love to categorize sins by the one that "we or our group" don't do.

That's why we need to be preaching the love and grace of God in Christ so that believers can grow up in Him.

There is a place for church discipline in order to stop others from influencing the others but that is a different story from what Christ has done in the new creation which is the new man of the heart created in righteousness and holiness.

 

[Chris1975]

In Red below

Chris1975 -

I am interested in seeing how your theory about sin and the Christian looks like in real life.

It's a legitimate question that will reveal what "walking after the flesh" means as far as sinning and going to heaven to be with the Lord.

So, if you would answer the question truthfully it will reveal what is really believed. Here is the question for you.

Can someone that wilfully sins for the last 3 months of their life by having malice and slander or envy or that causes strife during that time ( which are all works of the flesh ) and not repenting of them go to heaven if they died tonight?

What does the bible say?
Galatians 5 v19-21
[SUP]19 [/SUP]Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery,[SUP][c][/SUP] fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, [SUP]20 [/SUP]idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, [SUP]21 [/SUP]envy, murders,[SUP][d][/SUP] drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.


My interpretation
The bible is true.

Is the Lord fair?
[SUP]9 [/SUP]The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us,[SUP][b][/SUP] not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance. <this is written to the Church>.

Would they go to heaven or hell?
- if they went to heaven, how could it be fair on all those others who went to hell for the same transgressions?



I want to know about this "living after the flesh" idea.

I believe this question will reveal some things. It is a legitimate question about "real life" situations and living after the flesh.

Answer the question below so that we understand what "living after the flesh" looks like in real life:

Let's look at this sin business for a bit. Envy is just as much a sin as any sexual sinning is. ( Gal. 5 ) <agreed>

So, let's say someone has been envious of other people for years. All of a sudden they die...does this one that was envying people now not go to heaven in your religion? <see above. Why weren't they living in faith? Why weren't they living in love? Why were they not yielding to the leading of the Holy Spirit? Do you believe that the Holy Spirit wasn't prompting them about this issue? Do you think God likes to spring surprises on His loved ones? They would have had the opportunity to repent but chose not to.>

...in some people's thinking they would go to hell because they have been "living after the flesh"?

Or what about gluttony ( which is a form of lasciviousness - "without restraint" ) which is a sin - what if someone has a battle with overeating all the time and they die ? <who was their master? was sin still their master? or did they have a new master? If they truly had a new master, the power of sin over them would have been broken. They would have been able to, by the power of the Spirit, put to death the misdeeds of the flesh. But they chose gluttony. When you come to the Lord, you are a new creation, and tremendous power is available to those who repent to live in victory>.

Do they go to hell now when they die because they were not able to overcome this over-eating as this is "living after the flesh" too? <as above>

These 2 scenarios above would be people "living in the flesh" and as you call being a servant to sin ( even though they are free in Christ but don't know it yet and haven't gown up in the Lord enough spiritually to overcome them ). Read this thread (http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/153004-standard-sinless-perfection.html) and Paul's response in Philippians 3v9-21

These 2 groups of people in some people's theology would not be children of God and thus go to hell.....Is that right?

If we despite the chastening of the Lord, we are considered illegitimate children - Hebrews 12v8. The believer decides whether to repent or not.Is this true in your religion?

Thanks for answering as I like to take people's religion for test runs to see how this works in real life.

( Let me say that I am vehemently against any form of sinning from living a homosexual lifestyle to being envious of others, to causing strife and divisions....all the works of the flesh will bring destruction of some sort to all of us while in this earth )

I believe the proper teaching of the love and grace of God in Christ will supply the believer the proper nutrients in order to live godly lives in this present world.