Are WOMEN Pastors Biblical??

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notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
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The "authorized version" is the KJV and was authorized by King James himself. His 'authorization' was nothing because he wasn't even a christian.
The translation was done by men who knew the Lord and their integrity was above reproach. King James did not translate the original texts.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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The translation was done by men who knew the Lord and their integrity was above reproach. King James did not translate the original texts.
Neither did the translators. They worked from mass-printed Greek editions, not manuscripts.
 
Nov 11, 2018
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I believe we are a "helper" to man. We have a job. As some have said, behind every good man is a good woman. For what man can fight strife with strife.... if his woman is of strife? Can we not be content to be a helper? I have a man and work to help him often. So my glory to the word of God... is to help bring my man to glory to ... glorify His name. If this is my only job, then so be it... I feel that God will reward me for doing my job. Must I be the King... to be the King's helper? No. But let women work toward a good... and a loving husband... but mostly a loving God.... sustain us... throughout our works. I think, no matter what our job, if we are working for God, It's hard to imagine a failed job. Work for God, wait for God's guidance, live for God, and God will reward us.!
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
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I have hesitated to answer thinking I am wasting my time. I will assume that you are not aware of certain things. It is a Godly character to seek the authorial intent (both the human author and the Holy Spirit) of any particular scripture in question.

There are organizations (many) that exist to allow scholars to present their hermeneutics to contribute to the collective body of knowledge that we have on interpreting scriptures with that goal in mind. Other scholars (experts in original languages and textual manuscripts for example) examine and respond to these presentations either agreeing with their hermeneutics or pointing out where they have made mistakes. These kinds of "Theological Academic Circles" are a great contribution to the body of Christ worldwide. You can find out about them by asking someone who is pursuing a doctorates in theology.
I’m certainly not aware of everything , I’m going to venture a guess and say you also aren’t aware of everything

my point , and brother there’s no need to hesitate to answer I’m not attempting to argue and am not going to take unintended offense

I’m actually wondering is there any biblical roots for worldly instititions to determine how believers should interpret scripture ?

my point brother is sure a study group is a great thing anyone who is hungry for Gods word should seek him as they think best .

But the thing is there’s no roots in the Bible for institutions where a bunch of teachers are gathered together and decide to turn away from the gospel of the kingdom and christs doctrine , except for the one i quoted to you

so can I ask you what was that warning from Paul there ? He foretold 1900 years ago that in time people would not want true doctrine and would father themselves these many teachers , would get together and turn doctrine into fables because they didn’t want to hear the truth

so can I ask you what institution of teachers that were going to all come together and distort truth into false doctrine other than seminary which is widely accepted as the authority in the worldly church ehstd this about if it’s not a reference to a tethering of intellectual teachers who decide it’s not about believing the truth ?

What or where does this apply since I don’t understand and you do ?

“For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine;

but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.”
‭‭2 Timothy‬ ‭4:3-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

My point was is there anything other than this that would describe the gathering of many teachers who turn ears away from truth ?

and doesn’t it make you consider at the least where the roots of worldly institutions actually came from if they aren’t rooted in scripture ?

again it’s a good thing for folks to get together and study scripture , I don’t think there is such a thing as an elite group of teachers who have the decisions on understanding scripture

I think a simple Minded believer who asks the lord about his word and seeks him will understand far more then ten intellectuals who get together and agree .

but you are correct there’s a lot I don’t know , where do you think Paul’s warning about the many teachers who’d get together and distort things fits in ?

The group that doesn’t attend seminary maybe huh ?
 

Edify

Active member
Jan 27, 2021
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The translation was done by men who knew the Lord and their integrity was above reproach. King James did not translate the original texts.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Are you into King James onlyism?
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
17,845
9,818
113
I believe we are a "helper" to man. We have a job. As some have said, behind every good man is a good woman. For what man can fight strife with strife.... if his woman is of strife? Can we not be content to be a helper? I have a man and work to help him often. So my glory to the word of God... is to help bring my man to glory to ... glorify His name. If this is my only job, then so be it... I feel that God will reward me for doing my job. Must I be the King... to be the King's helper? No. But let women work toward a good... and a loving husband... but mostly a loving God.... sustain us... throughout our works. I think, no matter what our job, if we are working for God, It's hard to imagine a failed job. Work for God, wait for God's guidance, live for God, and God will reward us.!
Thanks for your refreshing comments. :)

In general, your comments are equally applicable to any Christian; our role is to glorify God and to help others do so. I need not be the senior pastor (or even a staff member) to help the church fulfill its role in the Kingdom and the community.

I would encourage you to do some research on the word "helper" as it is used in Genesis 2:18. "Subordinate assistant" is not the right sense. ;)
 
Nov 11, 2018
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Thanks for your refreshing comments. :)

In general, your comments are equally applicable to any Christian; our role is to glorify God and to help others do so. I need not be the senior pastor (or even a staff member) to help the church fulfill its role in the Kingdom and the community.

I would encourage you to do some research on the word "helper" as it is used in Genesis 2:18. "Subordinate assistant" is not the right sense. ;)
ok, i do see that in Gen:2:18, but is there an additional word that u have? I would love to listen... and thank you SO much for your attention.... i love to hug necks... so virtually huggin ur neck, lol
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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ok, i do see that in Gen:2:18, but is there an additional word that u have? I would love to listen... and thank you SO much for your attention.... i love to hug necks... so virtually huggin ur neck, lol
The term in Hebrew is ezer kenegdo, which is used elsewhere in the OT of God Himself in relation to Israel. The sense of corresponding equality is implicit. The KJV's "helpmeet" is an unfortunate choice which has influenced generations of Christians toward a subordinate view not only of wives, but of women in general.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
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Neither did the translators. They worked from mass-printed Greek editions, not manuscripts.
Mass printed Greek editions in the 1600's? Did they buy them in the local Greek book store?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
Nov 11, 2018
113
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The term in Hebrew is ezer kenegdo, which is used elsewhere in the OT of God Himself in relation to Israel. The sense of corresponding equality is implicit. The KJV's "helpmeet" is an unfortunate choice which has influenced generations of Christians toward a subordinate view not only of wives, but of women in general.
Well, I actually try to stay away from the male/female issues for the most part... bcuz unfortunately, the Good Lord seems to have cursed me with a smart mouth. I would say graced me.... but my mouth sometimes seems to be bigger than my whole head. I say that to say this, If God had meant for man to have a stupid counterpart, I feel He would have made that clear. Alas, He said that man should cling to his wife and leave parents. Now if a man is leaving 2 smart people(parents), for one woman, you'd think the Good Lord would give some wisdom in even that she=male. Yes, I use weird words, lol, but they say behind every good man is a good woman... possibly cuz the bad women are driving many men crazy. But I think a daughter of God, is only here to help guide others to God... as a good man... should be doing the same. Thus, if we take a moment to reflect, one might think, why should a man compete w/ a Godsend? Why should any Son of God compete with anyone really? For God will give you all the words and a wife to support a man. And as I love the birds I feed, or the bunnies I raise and love, why would a person take any loving creature and try to hurt it? So maybe we should just love all things around us... and watch the beauty that comes from it... and make a home of it. I feel that so many average people have opportunity to build this loving world around them... but sadly... so few people find that light. I look out my backyard, as I buy seed for birds, and food for bunnies, and daily, i see cardinals (in my backyard as I speak), and juncos and often mourning doves, and collared doves, and blue jays (which most ppl hate, but God made them for a purpose too), and robins, and crows, and flycatchers, and woodpeckers, and in trying to be environmental, we have gained this world of loveliness!... when others are just building treasures on earth... I'm seeking treasures in nature... and hopefully in God's world. We just have to do the best we can as we go... in accordance with scripture. :)
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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Mass printed Greek editions in the 1600's? Did they buy them in the local Greek book store?
The 1500's actually. Erasmus before 1530, Stephanus around 1560, and Beza around 1590. Instead of making ignorant quips, do your homework.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
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The 1500's actually. Erasmus before 1530, Stephanus around 1560, and Beza around 1590. Instead of making ignorant quips, do your homework.
How many editions constitute a "mass"?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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How many editions constitute a "mass"?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
I said "mass-printed", as on a printing press, to distinguish them from manuscripts copied by hand.
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
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I said "mass-printed", as on a printing press, to distinguish them from manuscripts copied by hand.
So how many "mass printed" copies existed at the time? How many complete manuscripts did they have to work from?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 

Dino246

Senior Member
Jun 30, 2015
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So how many "mass printed" copies existed at the time? How many complete manuscripts did they have to work from?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
I don't know how many copies were made of the various printings. I do know that for the New Testament, the KJV translators had Erasmus' five editions, Stephanus, and Beza (all Greek), Luther's (German), the various previous English editions, Stephanus, and perhaps a handful of other-language printings. To my knowledge they had no "complete" manuscripts, if any at all.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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Acts 18:26 does not show a woman teaching a man. it shows a man and a woman
(husband and wife) explaining things to him in their home, not in the assembly.
First you say the church assembled in homes, then you say a teaching in a home is not an assembly.

"Church" is the body of Christ regardless of where it meets.

Jesus said where two or more are gathered in His Name... ;)
 

notuptome

Senior Member
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,521
113
I don't know how many copies were made of the various printings. I do know that for the New Testament, the KJV translators had Erasmus' five editions, Stephanus, and Beza (all Greek), Luther's (German), the various previous English editions, Stephanus, and perhaps a handful of other-language printings. To my knowledge they had no "complete" manuscripts, if any at all.
Suffice it to say that they did not have the number of copies of the scriptures we have today. Last I heard there were like hundreds of copies. The Dead Sea scrolls among the recent copies. Despite having the printing press copies of the scriptures were not widely available and not easily affordable.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
S

Scribe

Guest
I’m certainly not aware of everything , I’m going to venture a guess and say you also aren’t aware of everything

my point , and brother there’s no need to hesitate to answer I’m not attempting to argue and am not going to take unintended offense

I’m actually wondering is there any biblical roots for worldly instititions to determine how believers should interpret scripture ?

my point brother is sure a study group is a great thing anyone who is hungry for Gods word should seek him as they think best .

But the thing is there’s no roots in the Bible for institutions where a bunch of teachers are gathered together and decide to turn away from the gospel of the kingdom and christs doctrine , except for the one i quoted to you

so can I ask you what was that warning from Paul there ? He foretold 1900 years ago that in time people would not want true doctrine and would father themselves these many teachers , would get together and turn doctrine into fables because they didn’t want to hear the truth

so can I ask you what institution of teachers that were going to all come together and distort truth into false doctrine other than seminary which is widely accepted as the authority in the worldly church ehstd this about if it’s not a reference to a tethering of intellectual teachers who decide it’s not about believing the truth ?

What or where does this apply since I don’t understand and you do ?

“For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine;

but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.”
‭‭2 Timothy‬ ‭4:3-4‬ ‭KJV‬‬

My point was is there anything other than this that would describe the gathering of many teachers who turn ears away from truth ?

and doesn’t it make you consider at the least where the roots of worldly institutions actually came from if they aren’t rooted in scripture ?

again it’s a good thing for folks to get together and study scripture , I don’t think there is such a thing as an elite group of teachers who have the decisions on understanding scripture

I think a simple Minded believer who asks the lord about his word and seeks him will understand far more then ten intellectuals who get together and agree .

but you are correct there’s a lot I don’t know , where do you think Paul’s warning about the many teachers who’d get together and distort things fits in ?

The group that doesn’t attend seminary maybe huh ?
People in CC who have no bible school training distort the scriptures daily.

I really cannot give you even one example of bible college student on CC who is distorting scripture. So I don't agree with your premise at all.

The turning away from sound doctrine most often comes from people with NO bible school training.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
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People in CC who have no bible school training distort the scriptures daily.

I really cannot give you even one example of bible college student on CC who is distorting scripture. So I don't agree with your premise at all.

The turning away from sound doctrine most often comes from people with NO bible school training.
ah well I expected you would reject the question on its face, and I would have to disagree on this with you and say I don’t know who has been “ trained “ and authorized by whatever seminary they attended . I don’t know who has done what

but those who have said they have been trained and authorized I don’t think I’ve ever heard many of them speaking anything about the kingdom of God and ministry of Christ

mostly of not exclusively any interaction I’ve had with someone who says they have been trained , is the experience like your sort of framing there

that if you haven’t been trained and authorized your just twisting scripture , sort of as of a place of arrogance and self anointing of authority in my own view and experience

most seem to be great if you fully agree with whatever they are explaining , but if you bring scripture into the conversation that would help them understand something better , then you all the sudden need to not twist scripture and need to submit to their authority over you because again the institution whichever it might be who shaped thoer understanding of scripture , authorized them for a few grand and gave them a certificate

I sort of reject that process myself , but again it’s only because it is not biblical but is shaped just like the world does things “ create a group of scholars and let them all come to a consensus of things them accept only that “

whether evolution , morality , law , or religion man always tries to altar what God was clear in saying and worldly institutions just for my own dime aren’t what scripture supports or suggests

what it actually does teach the church to do is to share the word of Christ among ourselves in love , not judging others with it but sharing it in hope among our groups . It does say God will choose people from among the believers to do each different service pastor teacher prophets ect

it says he will do that by imparting spiritual godts on them according to his own will and not that of man . That the ailitjorization of service in his kingdom is his choosing of a person

I have issues when a consensus isn’t what is taught in scripture. I was honestly wondering if there were biblical roots I’m going to assume there simply isn’t

but listen I think disagreement is okay , and of people benefit from theological conclusions and consensus it’s thier right to seek the lord anyway they choose as smoother Christians who take belief of what’s written as the right understanding

so again this is only my own view about it and I believe that everyone has the right to thier belief

I do know there is a strong delusion in the world that some will believe and be led astray , and that there came a time many teachers were gathered together
And they changed doctrine away from the truth

but that shouldn’t be disputable you read that also if you consider it is an institutional event that transpires there to get doctrine off course it doesn’t happen by a group of believers preaching and believing the word but it’s an institutional deception paul was foretelling

either way I’m okay if We disagree on this , hope in the future we can find more unity in faith
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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People in CC who have no bible school training distort the scriptures daily.
And today people who have Bible school training promote false doctrines and apostatize daily. All the well-know apostates are theologians and professors in seminaries (or bishops and archbishops). And every fundamentalist Bible school has been compromised over the last few years. Check it out for yourself.

Since the 19th century it is the Christian seminaries (primarily in Germany) which became the centers for attacks on the Bible, the Gospel, and Bible doctrine. Dean John W. Burgon (and others) in England exposed this in the 19th century, and showed how German skeptics had influenced British theologians. Others in the USA exposed unbelief, skepticism, and apostasy in the early 20th century, when the battle between the Fundamentalists and the Liberals rocked Christianity. In the end the Fundamentalists had to leave the liberal seminaries.

But again during the 20th century there was a decline in almost all the Bible colleges and seminaries in the States. This has all been documented in the battle for biblical inerrancy in several books. Which brings us back to the fact that A SEMINARY EDUCATION IS NO GUARANTEE OF FAITHFULNESS to the Word of God. Quite the opposite. Many believing young Christians have had their faith shattered by attending bible schools and seminaries. And in any event Christ did not authorize the substitution of sound Bible teaching with meaningless academic degrees.