CHRIST THE CHOSEN ONE, THE ELECT OF THE FATHER

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
Luke 8:12 "Those beside the road are those who have heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their heart, so that they will not believe and be saved.

The parable of the sower depicts four conditions of the hearts of born again people.

No, the first soil were unbelievers. Jesus was clear about that.

Luke 8:12 - Those along the path are the ones who hear, and then the devil comes and takes away the word from their hearts, so that they may not believe and be saved. Jesus couldn't have been more clear.

My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me, and I give unto them eternal life, and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

As I have told you before, if you keep applying some of the salvation (deliverance) scriptures to eternal deliverance, they will teach eternal deliverance is accomplished by good works.

I would NEVER make that mistake. I know full well that eternal salvation is based on the single condition of believing in Jesus Christ as Savior.

I have, also, told you that a person who has his eternal inheritance secured, and does not have the knowledge of what Jesus accomplished for them on the cross

This makes no sense. How do you know what you claim here?

can be delivered (saved) from their ignorance by the preaching of the gospel.

You are really confused. You are trying to apply being saved from ignorance by the very means of attaining eternal salvation.

When Paul preached the gospel, he led many to eternal salvation.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
Acts 4:12 "And there is salvation in no one else; for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must be saved.

Yes, this verse is fitting for both types of deliverances: Eternally by being born again IN CHRIST, and those that have been born again can be delivered in many different ways as they sojourn here in this world.

In the Bible, when salvation is NOT about eternal soul salvation, then it ALWAYS is in reference to deliverance/rescue from temporal dangers. But NEVER "ignorance of doctrine", as your last post claimed.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
Acts 16:31They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household."

Have you forgotten, I have already explained this one to you. The keeper of the prison was already born again.

I reject your opinion. You have NO basis for such a claim. He wanted to know how to be saved. So he wasn't born again at all.

Your ideas of being saved and being born again are quite foreign to the Bible.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I feel sure that we have discussed God changing the stony heart to a fleshy heart in the new birth. In these two verses, the heart is the new fleshy heart received in the new birth.

I've already told you that. The changing of fa stony heart to a fleshy heart is describing regeneration.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.

You believe not because you are not of my sheep. My sheep hear my voice, and I give unto them eternal life (John 10:26-28)

Why do you think citing these verses has any relevance to Rom 1:16? Can you explain yourself?

Understanding the gospel is not the cause of eternal salvation

One must be able to understand BEFORE they can believe it. Believing the gospel results in eternal salvation. The "cause" of eternal salvation is God Himself. 1 Cor 1:21.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;

I have already told you, this is Jesus faith, not yours.

I don't believe your claims. I gave you a long list of verses on salvation and eternal life that prove that salvation and eternal life are on the basis of our believing in Jesus Christ. But you seem very confused about that.

If you can remember the things we have already discussed, could you give me the courtesy of not discussing it again?

When you keep repeating your unbiblical opinons, I WILL discuss them again.

I do not mind repeating, if you do not remember.

You don't need to repeat any of your unbiblical opinions.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
2 Tim 3:15 and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

I do not know what Timothy's age was when he was born again, nor do I know the age that I was when I was born again. It must have been so far back in my youth, that I can not remember. Timothy would have to had been born again, in order for the scriptures to make him wise.

Thanks for another example of how confused and unbiblical you are. See the bolded words above? You left out the MOST IMPORTANT words; "for salvation". Why did you do that?

It seems to me you have the calvinistic and unbiblical notion that people are born again BEFORE they express saving faith in Christ.

Well, go ahead and prove that with a verse that SAYS that.

The deliverance Paul is referring to is a deliverance Timothy received by having been in Christ by his regeneration, and the faith which is in Christ Jesus is the faith he received as a fruit of the indwelling Holy Spirit when he was born again.

Nonsense. Tim heard the gospel message as a youth, believed it and was born again because he believed.

There are far many more scriptures referring to deliverances the born again receive here in this world, than there are that refer to eternal deliverance.

You seem to have no discernment about which verses mean what. Just your own opinion on everything.

And believing from our heart the gospel is the means to salvation and regeneration.

With your unbiblical meaning about "salvation", you can make any verse say anything you want it to say.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
1 Peter 1:9 obtaining as the outcome of your faith the salvation of your souls.

1 Pet 1:2 tells us who Peter is speaking of, and is the elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father.

Peter was writing to SAVED people. They had believed on the Lord Jesus Christ and were saved, regenerated.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
John 3:15-16 15 so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life. 16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

They believe not because they are not of his sheep.

You are missing the whole point. Your statement is a FALSE cause and effect. They are not of His sheep because they believe not.

Proven by John 10:9.

Only his sheep hear his voice.

Of course. Unbelievers don't. Until the resurrection. John 5:28,29

In order to harmonize the scriptures, you would have to conclude that the word "world" in John 3:16 would have to be the world of believers only

That is a faulty conclusion. The "world" NEVER means a subset of the human race, but rather, ALL of the human race.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Only those that have been born to the new spiritual life can understand, and believe in the things of the Spirit.

Right. But the gospel message is a message of trust. It isn't spiritual. Believing the gospel results in eternal soul salvation.

 

[oyster67]

Right. But the gospel message is a message of trust. It isn't spiritual. Believing the gospel results in eternal soul salvation.

To believe or not to believe. That is the choice we must all make.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
Right. But the gospel message is a message of trust. It isn't spiritual. Believing the gospel results in eternal soul salvation.

To believe or not to believe. That is the choice we must all make.

Yes, sir! Every human has been given the ability to understand the gospel message. That leaves the choice of whether they believe it or not.

And it really begins with believing that God exists. Rom 1:19-21. And no one has any excuse for missing that.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

FreeGrace2 said:
Romans 2:28,29
28 A person is not a Jew who is one only outwardly, nor is circumcision merely outward and physical.
29 No, a person is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a person’s praise is not from other people, but from God.

Believing Jews have been.

[QUOTE[ Jesus says that they are of their father the devil.

That's the unbelieving Jews.[/QUOTE]


I believe that you are repeating the same things that I have just told you.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

To believe or not to believe. That is the choice we must all make.

Yes, that is a choice that the born again people have to make. Salvation=deliverance. The born again person can be delivered (saved) while he sojourns here on earth, by believing the finished work of Christ.

If you do not rightly divide the deliverance (salvation) scriptures, and apply all of them to mean eternal deliverance, they will tend to make you believe that eternal deliverance is accomplished by your good works, such as: believing, accepting, confessing, praying, walking in God's ways, etc. These are some of the good works that the born again child of God does.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

FreeGrace2 said:
Right. But the gospel message is a message of trust. It isn't spiritual. Believing the gospel results in eternal soul salvation.

Yes, sir! Every human has been given the ability to understand the gospel message. That leaves the choice of whether they believe it or not.

And it really begins with believing that God exists. Rom 1:19-21. And no one has any excuse for missing that.

Look around, you can see that there must be many who does not believe that God exists. (Psalms 14:1, 42:10, 53:1, 79:10)

Psalms 78:22 - If a person would be honest about it, We all, at times, have, in our weakest moments, wondered if there was a God , as these Israelites did.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
Right. But the gospel message is a message of trust. It isn't spiritual. Believing the gospel results in eternal soul salvation.

Yes, sir! Every human has been given the ability to understand the gospel message. That leaves the choice of whether they believe it or not.

And it really begins with believing that God exists. Rom 1:19-21. And no one has any excuse for missing that.

Look around, you can see that there must be many who does not believe that God exists. (Psalms 14:1, 42:10, 53:1, 79:10)

Correct. And Rom 1:19-21 says that they have no excuse. Do you understand what that means? It means they CAN believe in Him on the basis of creation alone. From that, those who seek Him (Acts 17:27) He's not far away.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

FreeGrace2 said:
Acts 4:12 "And there is salvation in no one else; for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must be saved.

In the Bible, when salvation is NOT about eternal soul salvation, then it ALWAYS is in reference to deliverance/rescue from temporal dangers. But NEVER "ignorance of doctrine", as your last post claimed.

Rom 10:1-3. These men of Israel/Jacob (spiritual Israel) had a zeal of God, which the ungenerate do not have. These were new born babes in Christ, who were still feeding upon the milk of the word, and were ignorant of the knowledge of what Jesus had accomplished for them on the cross.

There are many of the elect on this forum that are in the same situation, being babes in Christ and have not the knowledge of God's righteousness displayed by his Son on the cross.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Luke 8:12 "Those beside the road are those who have heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their heart, so that they will not believe and be saved

John 8:47 - He that is of God heareth God's words, ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God. If those beside the road heard God's words they were of God. They just had a heart condition.

John 8:47 is a contradiction to your interpretation of Luke 8:12. If, in your theory, there is contradicting scriptures, then you are not interpreting them right. All of the scriptures must harmonize before the truth of Christ's doctrine is revealed

If many, of God's, lost, elect children, would give up on trying to give mankind the power to deliver themselves, and give God all of the credit for eternally delivering them by his sovereign grace, without any help from mankind, they could live a more satisfying life, as they sojourn here in this world, instead of being the "lost sheep of the house of Israel".

 

[ForestGreenCook]

Correct. And Rom 1:19-21 says that they have no excuse.

Many of God's elect children refuses to believe that God, does many harsh actions in chastening his children. There misunderstanding that God can do very terrible things in his harsh chastenings, that to many seem unloving, but chastening is a form of God's love toward us.

Romans 1 is written to the called of Jesus Christ to be saints. Verse 19 says "that which may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it unto them" verse 21, Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; (most of God's elect are not glorifying God, by giving power to mankind to deliver himself eternally)

Verse 26- For this cause (previous verses pointing out their transgressions) God gave them up unto vile affections.

Until we can see ourselves, in our fleshly nature, as these saints described in Rom 1, we have not humbled ourselves, before God, as we should.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Rom 10:1-3. These men of Israel/Jacob (spiritual Israel) had a zeal of God, which the ungenerate do not have. These were new born babes in Christ, who were still feeding upon the milk of the word, and were ignorant of the knowledge of what Jesus had accomplished for them on the cross.

I don't understand this. If they were "new born babes in Christ", that means they were believers in Christ. So what do you suppose they didn't know about Jesus accomplished for them on the cross?

There are many of the elect on this forum that are in the same situation, being babes in Christ and have not the knowledge of God's righteousness displayed by his Son on the cross.

How can a person being IN Christ yet not having the knowledge of what Christ did on the cross? That doesn't make sense.