FreeGrace2 said:
Why do you quote this verse? It's not about election or it would have mentioned election. It is about how one is saved; which is THROUGH FAITH.
No I didn't say that. Please pay attention. I have said that election isn't to salvation, which you believe it is.
Of course grace is associated with salvation. Duh.
Why do you think Eph 2:8 is "clear as can be" regarding election, since the word isn't even mentioned??
Yes, election is by grace as well, but remember your argument to me about all my verses. You dismissed all of them on the basis of linking service to election even when the verse didn't mention election. However, as I pointed out, in EVERY example, the service was directly linked to those who were chosen. And now you're trying to do the very same thing. That's hypocritical.
Sure. But election is a different issue. You just won't admit it.
Let me show you how "linkage" works appropriately.
Acts 9:15 - But the Lord said to Ananias, “Go! This man is my chosen instrument to proclaim my name to the Gentiles and their kings and to the people of Israel. OK, this is as clear as it can get. Jesus told Ananias that Paul was His "chosen instrument" and even included the purpose of this election: "to proclaim My Name to the Gentiles". Service.
Now, let's see how Paul himself viewed his election to this specific service.
Acts 20:24 - However, I consider my life worth nothing to me, if only I may finish the race and complete the task the Lord Jesus has given me - the task of testifying to the gospel of God’s grace.
Acts 22:10 - "'What shall I do, Lord?' I asked. "'Get up,' the Lord said, 'and go into Damascus. There you will be told all that you have been assigned to do.’
Acts 22:14, 15 - 14 “Then he said: ‘The God of our ancestors has chosen you to know his will and to see the Righteous One and to hear words from his mouth. 15 You will be his witness to all people of what you have seen and heard.
Acts 26:16 - ‘Now get up and stand on your feet. I have appeared to you to appoint you as a servant and as a witness of what you have seen and will see of me.
Acts 27:23 - Last night an angel of the God whose I am and whom I serve stood beside me
Rom 1:9 - God, whom I serve with my whole heart in preaching the gospel of His Son, is my witness how constantly I remember you in my prayers at all times; and I pray that now at last nay God’s will the way may be opened for me to come to you.
Rom 15:17 - Therefore I glory in Christ Jesus in my service to God.
Rom 15:25 - Now, however, I am on my way to Jerusalem in the service of the Lord’s people there.
1 Cor 3:5 - What, after all, is Apollos? And what is Paul? Only servants, through whom you came to believe—as the Lord has assigned to each his task.
1 Cor 4:1 - This, then, is how you ought to regard us: as servants of Christ and as those entrusted with the mysteries God has revealed.
2 Cor 4:5 - For we do not preach ourselves, but Jesus Christ as Lord, and ourselves as your servants for Jesus’ sake.
2 Cor 11:8 - I robbed other churches by receiving support from them so as to serve you.
Gal 1:10 - A I now trying to win the approval of men, or of God? Or am I trying to please men? If I were still trying to please men, I would not be a servant of Christ.
Gal 1:16 - to reveal his Son in me so that I might preach him among the Gentiles, I did not consult any man
Eph 3:7,8,9 7 I became a servant of this gospel by the gift of God’s grace given me through the working of His power 8 Although I am less than the least of all the Lord’s people, this grace was given me: to preach to the Gentiles the boundless riches of Christ, 9 and to make plain to everyone the administration of this mystery, which for ages past was kept hidden in God, who created all things.
Col 1:25 - I have become its (the Church) servant by the commission God gave me to present to you the word of God in its fullness— direct reference to Acts 9:15. Also v.23
1 Tim 1:12 - I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who has given me strength, that he considered me trustworthy, appointing me to his service.
1 Tim 2:7 - And for this purpose I was appointed a herald and an apostle—I am telling the truth, I am not lying—and a true and faithful teacher of the Gentiles.
2 Tim 1:9 - He has saved us and called us to a holy life—not because of anything we have done but because of his own purpose and grace. This grace was given us in Christ Jesus before the beginning of time,
2 Tim 1:11 - And of this gospel I was appointed a herald and an apostle and a teacher.
How could it be any more clear than these verses from Paul's own mouth?
He considered his election as an appointment to service, and repeatedly refers to himself as a servant of Christ.
I rest my case. There is NO mention that Paul was elected to salvation. There ARE verses that he was elected to be a servant.
Why do you quote this verse? It's not about election or it would have mentioned election. It is about how one is saved; which is THROUGH FAITH.
No I didn't say that. Please pay attention. I have said that election isn't to salvation, which you believe it is.
Of course grace is associated with salvation. Duh.
Why do you think Eph 2:8 is "clear as can be" regarding election, since the word isn't even mentioned??
Yes, election is by grace as well, but remember your argument to me about all my verses. You dismissed all of them on the basis of linking service to election even when the verse didn't mention election. However, as I pointed out, in EVERY example, the service was directly linked to those who were chosen. And now you're trying to do the very same thing. That's hypocritical.
Sure. But election is a different issue. You just won't admit it.
Let me show you how "linkage" works appropriately.
Acts 9:15 - But the Lord said to Ananias, “Go! This man is my chosen instrument to proclaim my name to the Gentiles and their kings and to the people of Israel. OK, this is as clear as it can get. Jesus told Ananias that Paul was His "chosen instrument" and even included the purpose of this election: "to proclaim My Name to the Gentiles". Service.
Now, let's see how Paul himself viewed his election to this specific service.
Acts 20:24 - However, I consider my life worth nothing to me, if only I may finish the race and complete the task the Lord Jesus has given me - the task of testifying to the gospel of God’s grace.
Acts 22:10 - "'What shall I do, Lord?' I asked. "'Get up,' the Lord said, 'and go into Damascus. There you will be told all that you have been assigned to do.’
Acts 22:14, 15 - 14 “Then he said: ‘The God of our ancestors has chosen you to know his will and to see the Righteous One and to hear words from his mouth. 15 You will be his witness to all people of what you have seen and heard.
Acts 26:16 - ‘Now get up and stand on your feet. I have appeared to you to appoint you as a servant and as a witness of what you have seen and will see of me.
Acts 27:23 - Last night an angel of the God whose I am and whom I serve stood beside me
Rom 1:9 - God, whom I serve with my whole heart in preaching the gospel of His Son, is my witness how constantly I remember you in my prayers at all times; and I pray that now at last nay God’s will the way may be opened for me to come to you.
Rom 15:17 - Therefore I glory in Christ Jesus in my service to God.
Rom 15:25 - Now, however, I am on my way to Jerusalem in the service of the Lord’s people there.
1 Cor 3:5 - What, after all, is Apollos? And what is Paul? Only servants, through whom you came to believe—as the Lord has assigned to each his task.
1 Cor 4:1 - This, then, is how you ought to regard us: as servants of Christ and as those entrusted with the mysteries God has revealed.
2 Cor 4:5 - For we do not preach ourselves, but Jesus Christ as Lord, and ourselves as your servants for Jesus’ sake.
2 Cor 11:8 - I robbed other churches by receiving support from them so as to serve you.
Gal 1:10 - A I now trying to win the approval of men, or of God? Or am I trying to please men? If I were still trying to please men, I would not be a servant of Christ.
Gal 1:16 - to reveal his Son in me so that I might preach him among the Gentiles, I did not consult any man
Eph 3:7,8,9 7 I became a servant of this gospel by the gift of God’s grace given me through the working of His power 8 Although I am less than the least of all the Lord’s people, this grace was given me: to preach to the Gentiles the boundless riches of Christ, 9 and to make plain to everyone the administration of this mystery, which for ages past was kept hidden in God, who created all things.
Col 1:25 - I have become its (the Church) servant by the commission God gave me to present to you the word of God in its fullness— direct reference to Acts 9:15. Also v.23
1 Tim 1:12 - I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who has given me strength, that he considered me trustworthy, appointing me to his service.
1 Tim 2:7 - And for this purpose I was appointed a herald and an apostle—I am telling the truth, I am not lying—and a true and faithful teacher of the Gentiles.
2 Tim 1:9 - He has saved us and called us to a holy life—not because of anything we have done but because of his own purpose and grace. This grace was given us in Christ Jesus before the beginning of time,
2 Tim 1:11 - And of this gospel I was appointed a herald and an apostle and a teacher.
How could it be any more clear than these verses from Paul's own mouth?
He considered his election as an appointment to service, and repeatedly refers to himself as a servant of Christ.
I rest my case. There is NO mention that Paul was elected to salvation. There ARE verses that he was elected to be a servant.
