Dualism, the doctrine of a disassociated identity

[Stunnedbygrace]

thank you for asking, I am not giving you a snarky response. my answer is - I do not believe in " sin separation " . to me, this is a dangerous way to think, because it makes it easy to excuse or overlook sin, instead of confessing and repenting.

the guide I use is " knowing to do good and not doing so", that is easy to identify if one is missing the mark or not.

I don't think you're being snarky, don't worry.
You're post seemed to be a complaint that a poster claims to not willfully or habitually sin.
And I wondered why that would cause a complaint.
I don't willfully or habitually sin, so I didn't understand why you were objecting to its being said.
And I supposed that you also do not willfully or habitually sin so...I was confused. Happens a lot!

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

All sin is by choice......is it not? When Peter cussed and denied the Lord did he do so knowing it was sin?.....and did he lose his salvation.....NOPE.......

When David numbered the people did he not know it was sin? Did he lose his salvation...NOPE.....

just saying....!

I think that...no, all sin is not willful(by choice).
I think this was explained by Paul when he said he does what he doesn't want to do. He wills to do one thing but then sometimes does the opposite of what he wills to do. So if he wills not to do it but does do it, then it isn't him willfully sinning but rather sinning AGAINST his will, because he finds his will very willing to not sin but finds his flesh weak.

So for instance, I do not want to murder, I understand Gods' definition of murder, that if I have anger in my heart I have already murdered, and what I will is to NOT do it. But sometimes the anger rises up so quickly that I don't even have time to think about it. And even human courts recognize heat of the moment murder is a different thing than willful and premeditated murder and the penalty is much more severe when it is intentional, thought out and willful. Do you see what I'm saying?

 

[gb9]

Read post #129 it confirms by their own words what many in this cult believes.

please notice that on this very thread, I was asked a question, I answered the question, politely, and there was no attacking or accusing. try that sometime.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

I'm not saying it's not sin, I'm saying it's not sin for us to commit them. Actually I don't say that, Paul says it.

Romans 5:13 KJV
(For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

KJV, good morning.
I looked for so long for this thread to share some wisdom God gave to me concerning this matter we were discussing, in which you said that coveting IS sin, but that when you covet you are not sinning because the law has been done away with, although it may not be expedient for you.

He gave me some of the old and some of the new and fit them together.

In Mathew 5, Jesus says He did not come to do away with even the least law within all the law and prophets. He said He came to fulfill the law. And He says that whoever annuls the law and teaches others to do so too will be called least in the kingdom of heaven and that whoever does the law and teaches it will be called greatest because our righteousness must exceed the righteousness of the Pharisees.

He then proceeds to preach the law. He goes over murder, adultery, and even some of the mosaic law. There are at least six points where He preaches on the law. But, He reveals, in that preaching, that the law is for the inside of our cup, in spirit and truth, not for the outside as the Pharisees taught.

He wasn't annulling the law (those were His own words.) He was saying the law is spiritual and good and that those who keep it in spirit and truth and teach it in spirit and truth will be called greatest.

So to say that coveting is sin but that we aren't sinning when we do it is not what He said in Mathew 5. It is lacking some understanding and it is using an apostles words to annul our Lords' words to us. (Which would send the apostle shrieking, don't you know!)

And when He teaches in Mathew, He says: all of the law and the prophets. So while I may not yet understand the spirit of the law on not wearing wool with linen, it has not been annulled. I just haven't known the spirit of it yet, for the inside of my cup.

To say that we do not sin when we covet makes it necessary to then also explain that when we murder we also do not sin. Otherwise, you are taking one of the ten laws and saying it has been annulled but that another of the ten laws has not been annulled, and there definitely is no proof to this claim anywhere in scripture. It also is not proved in our conscience or even to our general sense of common sense. So to argue that when we covet we are not sinning may slide past the notice of some but to claim that when we murder we do no sin will not pass by in the same way. I will make a prediction that you will not find a single, solitary man in here who will agree with that. I could be wrong and be surprised that someone agrees, but I don't think that will be the case.

The righteousness of the Pharisees was the law for the outer man. This is what they taught was righteousness. They didn't hear God when He said, they always err inside, in their heart or when He said, I desire truth in the inward parts.

But our righteousness must exceed their righteousness, and the way it does is by spirit and truth - the law for the inside of the cup. But to claim that there is no longer the outward righteousness of the Pharisees and also no longer an inward righteousness, is to leave a man with no righteousness at all and no way to it. (I am not pouring milk down anyones throat here and that should be apparent so I am hoping we don't need to go over our initial gift of being covered by Christs' righteousness because no one is saying He won't put swaddling clothes on a baby!)

How is it possible that we have come to the point where...the righteousness of the Pharisees is now more righteous than ours when we believe and teach that coveting is sin but I'm not sinning when I covet?? This is holding the truth in unrighteousness and it is claiming to see when one can't see. The only comfort I can take is to grasp at: will be called least in the kingdom of heaven. Because to be called least is infinitely better than to be told, I never knew you.

He also showed me Psalm 1. "...but his delight is in the law of the Lord and in His law he meditates day and night. He will be like a tree firmly planted by streams of water which yields its fruit in season and its leaf does not wither..."

The psalmist was not saying he meditates on how delightful it is to not wear wool with linen. He was rejoicing at some light that showed him the spirit of the words of the law in his inner man. God had shown this psalmist some of the spirit and truth of law and he was delighting in it.

I can take a stab at the spirit of no wool with linen. It just occurs to me...
Wool comes from a lamb and linen is manmade and woven strands.
It sounds similar to taking off your shoes to approach God because you must be covered, but not with a covering you provide for yourself but the covering of a lamb.

Anyway, I wanted to share this all because Jesus said: anyone who annuls the least point of the law and teaches others to do so also will be called least in the kingdom but anyone who does the law and teaches others to do the same will be called greatest.

 

[PeterJens]

How is it possible that we have come to the point where...the righteousness of the Pharisees is now more righteous than ours when we believe and teach that coveting is sin but I'm not sinning when I covet??

Amen. When holiness and purity are abandoned as empty goals, the yeast of the
teaching becomes we are chosen, so let us be practical, our hearts are impossible
to control, so if you have this passion, let it rip, you can do nothing else.

That is the way of the pharisees, and their hypocracy, and why their faith had no
power.

This is why holiness and emotional truth matter, but until you are purified by the
Holy Spirit and your heart is changed, how can you even perceive the words, they
appear literally impossible. I know it is not impossible because of the apostles and
my own life. This is though a long walk, sowing and reaping and not a simple statement
of 5 minutes.

Now for me to say this some call this boasting, as if it is a prize in a race, rather than
the fulfillment of promise. The whole spiritual warfare in the heavenlies is about this
very issue.

There can be no compromise here, because it is the nature of God and His desires
in righteousness. Justice only works if freedom and truth are possible. Jesus's walk
of being without sin is only stunning if the walk is our walk yet he walked it that way.

I could say who am I to comment on such issues, so enormous they are, yet to not
would be to deny Jesus and who I am. Even as a teenager, this was visible to me.

So in humbleness and not condemnation, as followers of Christ how have you missed
this?

 

[Ihsomiet]

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge... of wisdom. Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your understanding. For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, says the Lord. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts. All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are likened to opinionated sand. No house can stand on ideas that come and go except the Rock of the Word of God, which stands the test. See that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, according to the tradition of men and the basic principles of the world rather than Messiah. And focus not on earthly, demonic wisdom, but the wisdom from above, which is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, open to reason, full of mercy and good fruits, impartial, not hypocritical. And the fruit of righteousnes is sown in shalom by those who make shalom.... Do not conform to this world but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, so that you may discern what is the will of God--what is good and acceptable and perfect.

Pr 1:7, 9:10, 3:5; Is 55:8-9; Rom. 3:23; Matt. 7:24-29; Col. 2:8; James 3:17-18; Rom. 12:2