For Sabbath keepers, How does obedience to the Sabbath affect your Salvation?

[JaumeJ]

I see by the exchange that some are under the impression using the Internet is some kind of infraction of the Sabbath. There is nothing wrong at all with using the Internet for good. I believe edification in the Lord is good at any level. It is good to keep in contact with friends and family, especially those who have problems and need support.

Does anyone pay attention to what Yeshua would do on the Sabbath? It seems everyone is hung up on the ritualistic and rabbinical dictates of the commandment with no understanding of the spirit of it shown by our Lord and Master's example.

So some people who have that warm and fuzzy system of religion wish to impost their own irresponsible manners of following Yeshua, Jesus, in place of obeying commandments. That is a very easy and trial less way. I obtain great joy in obeying in every way possible and in every way I understand..........please try not to label this as being legalistic, I know I am nothing without the grace afforded by the Blood of Yahweh's Lamb.

 

[secularhermit]

(...) There is nothing wrong at all with using the Internet for good. I believe edification in the Lord is good at any level. It is good to keep in contact with friends and family, especially those who have problems and need support. (...). Please try not to label this as being legalistic, I know I am nothing without the grace afforded by the Blood of Yahweh's Lamb.

Although I don´t know what his name is, a tiger won´t say things like that. None of us can´t be saved without the afforded blood God´s Lamb paid.

 

[SarahM777]

Exactly.
It's you who said using internet would cause someone else to sin.
So are you for the law?
If you are for the law but you are not able to follow completely then why pointing fingers?
If you are for the law, know one cannot be perfect and need the savior then why would you accuse anyone who couldn't follow the law completely? Isn't you the same?
If you are not for the law then why are you questioning those who are for the law?
Why don't you let them deal with the law giver directly?

I'm not the one saying I'm following the Sabbath according to your sense of following the Sabbath. So you're OK with the guy at the internet service having to work on the Sabbath correct? So then is it OK for you to go to a restaurant on the Sabbath and the cooks and waitresses have to work to serve you? What about the guy that's working overtime at a factory? Or are they breaking the Sabbath? What is your definition of what the Sabbath is or is not? And then what is it to truly obey the Sabbath?

 

[Isdaniel]

Then why are you on the internet causing OTHERS to have to work so you can internet service? Aren't causing someone else to sin which is just as wrong as if you yourself did it?

It is lawful to do good on the sabbath days this is a verse you should look at hmmmm

 

[Isdaniel]

Jesus was risen at the time he appeared - first to Mary Magdalene early the first day of the week. Compare with John 20:14-17. No proof here for a Sunday resurrection!! Mark is merely stating the time of Jesus' appearance and not of his resurrection, which agrees with John's account. Mark 16:9-10
9. ¶ Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.
10. And she went and told them that had been with him, as they mourned and wept.

 

[Isdaniel]

Thankies for this information i love truth and this is truth
there were two sabbaths as you said
truth is truth people need to put aside their belief and look at the jewish culture and figure it out
Matthew 28 says it all they came on the closing hrs of the saturday, the first day did not come as yet , yet we see that Jesus was not there when they came to see the tomb

The word dawn there means begining like the dawn of a new year or something

thankies from NT

Sunday keeper glad that you are not bias and see truth is truth

 

[Isdaniel]

The two problems I see people having here are these.

1. people are trying to put our modern western views on a eastern culture. when you push 72 hours you show you have no clue what Jesus words meant to those with whom he spoke.

2. Trying to separate the high day Sabbath from the 7th day Sabbath. If you look at both Luke and John they follow the same order of events. John focuses on the Feast Sabbath and Luke on the 7th day Sabbath but they are both on the same day. They both happen straight after the 14th when Jesus died. and they are both directly followed by the first day.

Go read the order of Luke and then John and you will find they follow the same pattern. Jesus dies. he is put in the tomb the Sabbath comes then the first day.

Oh yeah and:

3. people are assuming that the women in Luke are the same as the Mary's in Mark. but if you read the context the Mary's are with the women so it is the women who prepare before the Sabbath, it is the Mary's that buy after the Sabbath. two different groups who were together at the cross and also came together the first day.

Blessings.

[h=3]John 11:9[/h]King James Version (KJV)

9 Jesus answered, Are there not twelve hours in the day? If any man walk in the day, he stumbleth not, because he seeth the light of this world.

 

[Isdaniel]

Isdaniel, could it be that the night didn't go anywhere and the fact was the Jews custom was to calulated their days the way we do numbers. Income tax time we round to the nearest dollar, $2,000.50 becomes 2,001. Even when it was applied to only a part of a day, the Jews referred to it as a whole. This is why we can't count 72 hours, from the time Jesus died to the time he raised from the dead. I Samuel 30:12, 13 A man was found, he had not eaten any bread, nor drunk any water, for three days and three nights. Verse 13 the man said his master left him, because three days ago he fell sick. Where is the third night?

On what day did david spoke to the man the third day or not ?
[h=3]1 Samuel 30:12-13[/h]King James Version (KJV)

12 And they gave him a piece of a cake of figs, and two clusters of raisins: and when he had eaten, his spirit came again to him: for he had eaten no bread, nor drunk any water, three days and three nights.
13 And David said unto him, To whom belongest thou? and whence art thou? And he said, I am a young man of Egypt, servant to an Amalekite; and my master left me, because three days agone I fell sick.

 

[morninglory]

He's not the only one. And can you please tell me where any of the Apostles explained to the gentiles HOW to keep the Sabbath? One very major detail is that the Jews marked the days from SUNSET to SUNSET, The Romans marked the days from MIDNIGHT to MIDNIGHT. If the Sabbath was meant for the gentiles to keep in the same manner as the Jews why did they leave out any mention of the difference in HOW the days were marked?

Sarah, The first thing to keep in mind, is that the Apostles were preaching out of the old testament, so that is where the information about the Sabbath would have come from. You are right about the Romans marking the day from sunset to sunset, but they did not have seven day weeks either, they had Ides and Nones, fifteen and thirty day segments, so no Sabbath. They also did not have lunar months, their months were set according to the pagan gods of the seasons, so no new moons.. They feasted regularily in honor of the pagan gods, and they did not have restrictions on what was eaten or drank. So take another look at Col.2.16 "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the NEW MOON, or of THE SABBATH DAYS".


Notice also Acts 16.21 says, the Apostles were teaching customs which were not lawful for Romans to receive or observe, and Acts 10.28, it was unlawful for a Jew to keep company with, or come unto one of another nation, in reference to the handwriting of ordinances that were against the Gentiles.

Also, where Ex.12.1, 31.13-17 show God gave Israel their own calendar of feasts and Sabbaths to seperate them from the pagan nations, Paul says in Gal.4.8-10 "Howbeit, when ye knew not God, ye did service to them that by nature are no gods -- ye observe days, and months, and times and years, I am afraid for you, lest I have bestowed labour in vain".

Also Acts 13.42 "and when the Jews were gone out of the synagog, the Gentiles besoght that these words might be preached to them the NEXT SABBATH DAY". Acts 16.13 "and on the SABBATH we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made--". Acts 17.2 "and Paul, as his manner was, went into them, and three SABBATH days reasoned with them out of the scriptures".

Hashem Tzidkeinu

 

[weakness]

Exodus 16:4 Then said the lord unto Moses, Behold I will rain bread from heaven for you; and the people shall go out and gather a certain rate every day, that I may prove them, whether they will walk in my law, or no.(5) And on the sixth day they shall prepare that which they bring in; and it shall be twice as much as they gather daily(25) And Moses said, eat that today; for today is a Sabbath unto the lord: today you shall not find it in the field(26) Six days ye shall gather it; but on the seventh day ,which is the Sabbath, in it there shall be none.(27) And it came to pass that there went out some of the people on the seventh day to gather, and they found none.(28) And the Lord said how long refuse thee to keep my commandments and my laws?​ The people would not enter the Lords rest!! Is this the first mention of the Sabbath after Genesis and the lord resting on the seventh day? Does any one Know?

 

[just-me]

It is lawful to do good on the sabbath days this is a verse you should look at hmmmm

I see you're singing a hymn. hmmmm? LOL Love ya brother! Pun intended, and I agree with that verse.

 

[Karraster]

The Sabbath Rest is Holy and precious. How great is our God that He would command us to rest from our burdens every 7th day of every week? No worries, they are laid at Jesus' feet. No honey do list, no guilt for setting aside your chains of the world that compel you to work work work, mow that grass, keep up with the Jones'? A blessing and my special "date" with God. It strengthens me to face the slings and arrows of the world the other 6. Like the #7 represents, it is perfect! It is Holy! It is a sign between God and me. Wow!

 

[danschance]

For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes. Romans 10:4 NASB

This verse and many others explain to me that Christ is the end to enslavement to the law.

23But before faith came, we were kept in custody under the law, being shut up to the faith which was later to be revealed. 24Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith. 25But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor. Gal 3:23-25 NASB

This verse says we were shut out from grace while the law was in effect. Now that Christ died and rose from the grave the we are no longer under the tutor of the law. People who claim we must still be under the law are in direct opposition to these verses.

14For He Himself is our peace, who made both groups into one and broke down the barrier of the dividing wall, 15by abolishing in His flesh the enmity, which is the Law of commandments contained in ordinances, so that in Himself He might make the two into one new man, thus establishing peace, 16and might reconcile them both in one body to God through the cross, by it having put to death the enmity. Eph 2:14-16

Tearing down the dividing wall which was the curtain separating the Holy of Hollies was a clear act of removing the enmity or law of ordinances.

 

[Hizikyah]

Those that have truly accepted Messiah, the Law of Yahweh is in their heart:

Yeremyah 31:33, "After those days, says Yahweh: I will put My Law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; minds, and I will be their Father, and they will be My people."

8451. torah torah: direction, instruction, law Original Word: תּוֹרָה Part of Speech: Noun Feminine Transliteration: torah
Phonetic Spelling: (to-raw') Short Definition: law

because the enmity has been abolished, not the Law:

I want to point out that the words that are in italics are ADDED:

Ephesians 2:15-16, (NKJV), "having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity. "

Not only does the next verse tell us what was abolished, but when you remove the ADDED words the meaning changes.

Ephesians 2:15-16, "Abolishing the enmity the Law, the Commandments, and the Ordinances, through His own flesh, in order to create in Himself one new man from the two; making peace, That would reconcile both in one body to Yahweh through the sacrifice--having killed the enmity through Himself."

What was killed? Very clear, the ENMITY. Is do not not kill enmity? Is do not steal enmity?

enmity is:
Thayer's (New Testament Greek-English Lexicon)

Feminine of G2190; hostility; by implication a reason for opposition:—enmity, hatred.

The opposition to Yahweh's instructions was abolished, not the Law it's self.

Yeremyah 31:33, "After those days, says Yahweh: I will put My Law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; minds, and I will be their Father, and they will be My people."

It is impossible to have HIS LAW written on your heart if you are in oppisition (enmity) to it, so the ENMITY was abolished.

however the carnal CAN NOT subject themselves to Yahweh's Law:

Romans 8:6-8, "For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. Because the carnal mind is enmity against Yahweh; for it his not subject to the Law of Yahweh, nor indeed can be. So then, those who are of the flesh cannot please Yahweh."

Again:

"I will put My Law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts"

 

[Karraster]

Resting on Sabbath shows me how unworthy I am, and how great and merciful is God, who gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believe in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

 

[Hamster]

So you say submitting to Yahweh is submitting to Babylon? WOW, let me guess, celebrating Bablonian rituals like christmas is the way to praise?

Isayah 56:1-7, "This is what Yahweh says: Keep the judgments, and do justly; for My salvation is near, soon, to come, and My righteousness to be revealed. Blessed is the man who does this, and the son of man who lays hold on it; who keeps the Sabbaths without polluting; defiling, them; and keeps his hand from doing dany evil. Do not let the son of the Gentile, who has joined himself to Yahweh, speak, saying; Yahweh has utterly separated me from His people. Nor let the eunuch say; Behold, I am a dry tree. For this is what Yahweh says: To the eunuchs who keep My Sabbaths, and choose those things which eplease Me, and hold fast to My covenant: I will give to them, in My House, even within My walls, a place and a Name equal to that of sons and of daughters; I will give them the Name of The Everlasting: YAHWEH; which will not be cut off. Also the sons of the Gentile who join themselves to Yahweh, to serve Him, and to love the Name of Yahweh, to be His servants--everyone who keeps the Sabbaths without polluting; defiling, them and who holds fast to My covenant--I will bring them to My holy mountain, and make them joyful in My House of prayer..."

Was His righteousness revealed? Did he enter into his peace? The command to keep the Sabbath of rest is over!

 

[Hizikyah]

Was His righteousness revealed? Did he enter into his peace? The command to keep the Sabbath of rest is over!

you and babylon say it is over or changed, Yahweh or Yahshua never say this one single time, just the oppisite, they say it will never change:

Luke 16:17, "But it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one yodh of the Law to fail."

however evil will make the masses think it has been changed:

Daniyl 7:25, "And he will speak great words against Yahweh, and will wear out; mentally attack to cause to fall away, the saints of Yahweh, and think to change times and Laws..."

"Times" is word # 2166 - Hebrew Word Study (Transliteration-Pronunciation Etymology & Grammar - 1) a set time, time, season

 

[gotime]

Then why are you on the internet causing OTHERS to have to work so you can internet service? Aren't causing someone else to sin which is just as wrong as if you yourself did it?

Come now that is not a valid argument.

You are adding to the law of God, making the law a burden. Our using the internet is not the cause of those people working. Plus you missus the commandment.

It Says:

"nor thy stranger that is within thy gates"

I don't know about you, but I don't have these guys living in or at my house in my care. I am glad you do not make the laws or else I would not be able to drink water from the tap or turn a light switch on.

I hope you get the point, The Sabbath you are trying to teach is a burden like what the Jews did. We obey the law of God not the traditions of man.

 

[SarahM777]

Sarah, The first thing to keep in mind, is that the Apostles were preaching out of the old testament, so that is where the information about the Sabbath would have come from. You are right about the Romans marking the day from sunset to sunset, but they did not have seven day weeks either, they had Ides and Nones, fifteen and thirty day segments, so no Sabbath. They also did not have lunar months, their months were set according to the pagan gods of the seasons, so no new moons.. They feasted regularily in honor of the pagan gods, and they did not have restrictions on what was eaten or drank. So take another look at Col.2.16 "Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the NEW MOON, or of THE SABBATH DAYS".


Notice also Acts 16.21 says, the Apostles were teaching customs which were not lawful for Romans to receive or observe, and Acts 10.28, it was unlawful for a Jew to keep company with, or come unto one of another nation, in reference to the handwriting of ordinances that were against the Gentiles.

Also, where Ex.12.1, 31.13-17 show God gave Israel their own calendar of feasts and Sabbaths to seperate them from the pagan nations, Paul says in Gal.4.8-10 "Howbeit, when ye knew not God, ye did service to them that by nature are no gods -- ye observe days, and months, and times and years, I am afraid for you, lest I have bestowed labour in vain".

Also Acts 13.42 "and when the Jews were gone out of the synagog, the Gentiles besoght that these words might be preached to them the NEXT SABBATH DAY". Acts 16.13 "and on the SABBATH we went out of the city by a river side, where prayer was wont to be made--". Acts 17.2 "and Paul, as his manner was, went into them, and three SABBATH days reasoned with them out of the scriptures".

Hashem Tzidkeinu

So why doesn't Paul ever deal with errors creeping in on the Sabbath either to the church at Corinth or at Rome? Remember the Jews were expelled from Rome. Errors would have crept in just because people would have misunderstood the different measuring of the days,because the church at for a time would have been almost all gentiles and not Jews.
Once the Jews starting coming back it would have been a source of contention if the Gentiles were required to keep the Sabbath because many would NOT have been keeping the Sabbath in the same manner as the Jews because of the cultural DIFFERENCES in measuring the days. Think how people in this day believe that the Sabbath is from midnight to midnight and sunset to sunset. Do you honestly believe that many of the Gentiles in that wouldn't have the same thing and yet Paul says not a word to the church at Rome about it,even though those errors would have crept into the church at Rome because of the cultural differences and due to misunderstandings alone? Do you think it would have been left out if they were suppose to keep the Sabbath?

 

[Hizikyah]

Shaul did not talk about every matter in every letter, are you sure we have every letter he wrote?

Yahweh's calendar was kept comonly until about the 16th century, that is where "April Fools Day" came from, those who kept Yahweh's calendar, which starts around April were called fools, so to think everyone was ignorant of it in the 1st century is not realistic.

You use false precepts to debate your points.