God's Chosen People per Romans 11

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SovereignGrace

SovereignGrace

Senior Member
#161
Dec 28, 2016
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#161
Spurgeoncy said:
Were they saved by it 50 years before his resurrection?
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Absolutely. However, they were looking towards the cross. Once Christ rose from the tomb, He defeated Satan. He fulfilled the Law, as the Law demanded perfection, and Christ was the only One who could live a life of perfection.

To say that those who were saved after His resurrection, but died before ~ AD70 and the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple, were saved under the Law, has made Christ's cross work of none effect to them, imo.
 
Spurgeoncy

Spurgeoncy

Banned
#162
Dec 13, 2016
744
6
0
#162
SovereignGrace said:
Absolutely. However, they were looking towards the cross. Once Christ rose from the tomb, He defeated Satan. He fulfilled the Law, as the Law demanded perfection, and Christ was the only One who could live a life of perfection.

To say that those who were saved after His resurrection, but died before ~ AD70 and the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple, were saved under the Law, has made Christ's cross work of none effect to them, imo.
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Where does the Bible say this?
 
Spurgeoncy

Spurgeoncy

Banned
#163
Dec 13, 2016
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#163
Sometimes we can over theologize.....

For Jesus to be resurrected from the dead, he obviously had to die first.

When he said: "It is finished" he was announcing his own death.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#164
#164
KJV1611 said:
What was it when Paul, being an Israelite, was CHOSEN by God even though God had cast Israel away? It was life from the dead.
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The context if rom 11 is nations (Isreal vs Gentile) not individuals though.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#165
#165
KJV1611 said:
I don't argue that there's a remnant, Paul is a remnant and there is still a remnant today. Israel was cast away, but there is and always been a remnant of flesh Israel that will be saved... they are God's CHOSEN people... the remnant is, not flesh Israel.
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Then there is absolutely no reason to call them a remnant, Just do like every other nation. And have them intigrate into society so there is nothing left. They are just Christians. Period.

The reason you keep a remnant, is because you have plans for that nation still,.

Which is Paul's argument, God is not done with Isreal (the nation) inspite of the fat ISRAEL (the nation NOT individuals) rejected him.

going back to the point, Rom 11 is about a nation NOT individuals.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#166
#166
KJV1611 said:
Romans 11:5-6 KJV
Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.
[6] And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

When Paul was writing this there was a remnant according to the ELECTION of GRACE. Not election of the FLESH but election by the GRACE of God. Verse 6 stregthens the idea of casting Israel away... NO MORE BY WORKS. A new covenant is replacing the old covenant.
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works never saved anyone, So this "reason" to say God cast away a nation, is flawed.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#167
#167
zone said:
you know how crippling the dispie system is.
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A lot less crippling that the preternatural/Amil system is. Which says God does not keep his promises.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#170
#170
SovereignGrace said:
Soooo, ppl were being saved by the Law for ~ 50 years after the Christ's resurrection? :confused: o_O
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No one was ever saved by the law. In the history of mankind, pre death or post death of Christ.

so again, What this'd line of reasoning, it makes no sense.
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#172
#172
SovereignGrace said:
Absolutely. However, they were looking towards the cross. Once Christ rose from the tomb, He defeated Satan. He fulfilled the Law, as the Law demanded perfection, and Christ was the only One who could live a life of perfection.

To say that those who were saved after His resurrection, but died before ~ AD70 and the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple, were saved under the Law, has made Christ's cross work of none effect to them, imo.
Click to expand...

To say anyone was EVER saved by the law (since Hebrews emphatically states otherwise, And Paul reaffirms in Gal 3) is just not factual
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#173
#173
Spurgeoncy said:
Sometimes we can over theologize.....

For Jesus to be resurrected from the dead, he obviously had to die first.

When he said: "It is finished" he was announcing his own death.
Click to expand...
True, The terms literally mean "paid in full" (it was a judicial term well known in the day) To me it was Christ affirming, the job of salvation is complete.

The resurrection is Gods way of assurance, as it proves the father accepted Jesus payment of coin "in full"
 
prove-all

prove-all

Senior Member
#174
May 16, 2014
5,977
400
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#174
eternally-gratefull said:
No one, Israel, or gentile, was ever saved by the law.
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Question,

how many people died by not following Gods laws and statues and judgements?

-


Jeremiah 10:23 (KJV)

O Lord, I know that the way of man is not in himself:
it is not in man that walketh to directhis steps.



Luke 4:4 (KJV)

And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written,
That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.​
​
​
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
#176
#176
prove-all said:
Question,

how many people died by not following Gods laws and statues and judgements?

-


Jeremiah 10:23 (KJV)

O Lord, I know that the way of man is not in himself:
it is not in man that walketh to directhis steps.



Luke 4:4 (KJV)

And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written,
That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.​
​
​
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How many were made ALIVE by following his commands and statutes?

if I die, and am not saved, what does it matter?

if I go out, get drunk drive and die, I died because I did not love.. I was self centered..

But this has no bearing on my eternal life.

I guess I do not understand the question.
 
KJV1611

KJV1611

Banned
#178
Nov 23, 2013
13,684
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#178
eternally-gratefull said:

Then there is absolutely no reason to call them a remnant, Just do like every other nation. And have them intigrate into society so there is nothing left. They are just Christians. Period.

The reason you keep a remnant, is because you have plans for that nation still,.

Which is Paul's argument, God is not done with Isreal (the nation) inspite of the fat ISRAEL (the nation NOT individuals) rejected him.

going back to the point, Rom 11 is about a nation NOT individuals.
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I recently built a deck on my house. I went to Home Depot and bought a large quantity of 5 1/4 deck boards. After I installed all the deck boards needed to complete the deck, I had 20 boards left over. My project was done and I burnt all the cut pieces and scraps BUT I didn't burn the remnant because they were still good boards.
 
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