is bible the word of God

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FollowHisSteps

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Feb 15, 2019
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Debate for the sake of debate is not the goal but facts are here and speak for themselves.Inquest,slavery,colonialisation,crusade,holocaust,wars for profit are done by whom?Today in western society we see all kind of sad evils like depression,homicide,pronography,child sex,drinking,divorces,out of wed children,fights why?BEcause the only guidance is religion but christianity(not christ)led followers towards sin and more sin by creating concept of"Jesus died for our sinsIslam on the other hand creates and maintains a culture of spirituality.which basically starts from self control,coming from accountability concept,then moral incentive then morality and then spirituality.
You don't have to agree with me.You are to think what you think is right.In Quran God many times says "if we wanted we would have made every one Muslim"but we wanted to see how people fear an unseen God and thus try to self control themselves so make life easy for other human beings.
Good luck.
The trouble with your list is it is worse in countries that do not even ask what is going on.
Islam was involved in slavery from its beginning to the present day. Slave armies what fuelled the ottoman
empire, and these empires colonised everything they could get their hands on, conquering and possessing
everything in the name of religion, and was quite happy to commit genocide from the very beginning with
Muhammed killing all the men of one tribe for daring to oppose him.

And all the sins and evils are just as prevalent in islamic culture as anywhere.
And much of the problems in the west are growing because of the abandonment of a moral focus.
What the west has is a sense of truth and discovery of injustice, no matter how flawed, things only
improve if you are honest and start looking at what is actually going on.

What many muslim countries claim is they are the shinning example of how one should live, except the
real statistics are never kept or the proposition proven, because simply it is not true. Unless one starts
to get honest and document peoples experiences, things are always much worse than you imagine.

By the way of course everyone has their own opinion, that is how it should be.
 

FollowHisSteps

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Jay Smith demonstrates there is not just one Quaran but many

 

mjkhan

Junior Member
Nov 1, 2017
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"no one is good but God alone"

"I AM the Good Shepherd"

What do you think, is He evil or good?
Is He a liar or is He God?

He expects us to figure it out. He spoke in parables and hid Himself so that the blind would be even more blind and those who are granted to see, will see all the more.

"no man ever spoke like this"
NO Muslim will ever say any bad name to Jesus.He was not bad and not evil.Only Quran is the divine book that confirms Jesus his mission and ministry but doesn't call him God which he himself never said in clear words.He preached whole life monotheism.He came only for Jews while Prophet Muhammad came for whole mankind.(jews and gentiles alike)
You have to know difference between proof and explanation.If someone tells you that I drink and tells because he saw me in front of bar.Is that proof.May be I was there as is bus stop and I get off to change for another bus,or may be my friend lives near the bar or may be there is good convenience store that I go to do shopping sometimes.But proof is if you see me drinking or if I say I do or if Breath analyser confirms it.So Jesus never said I am God so there is no proof he is God.Yes he is mighty messenger of God which bible says and QUran say.DOn't read Quran that will not make any dent in its status.God bless you
 

FollowHisSteps

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Interesting answer to the versions of the Koran.

It is our limited understanding of the verses, they could mean this or that, the variations add to the
meaning of the book. So here is the problem as I said before, something is claimed to be preserved
except what is preserved has different forms and meanings.

But if you write something down in more than one form, it is not the same.
With a translation, the meaning could be debated, but one sentence is not the same with different
words. If the sentence exists in two forms, it was spoken in two different times and written down
at different points, therefore is different.

The meaning could be the same, but it is different.
This in reality is very similar to how the gospels are looked at. The same situation is described
differently by each gospel though sometimes the same, to bring out different perspectives and points.

So if one claims the bible has a problem with this approach, then so has the Koran. It is not one version,
as scripture attempts to be, but many.

So highly and sensitive are muslims to this point, they say things like, this is childish to point out, something
not worthy of consideration. What this actually means is this is crucial to the authenticity of the Koran and
its authority, because if one sentence has more than one form in arabic, how far do the versions deviate when
the claim is none do, which is clearly not true. And muslims would not dare ask or consider this point
because it would bring doubt on the Koran, so probably they will never actually study to find out, until
someone else comes and does it for them, lol.
 

Sipsey

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Sep 27, 2018
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surprisingly though neither nor the Bible says about him saying"I am GOd,or worship me" but surely says him to be prophet.Muslims get confused when see chrisitanity based on what he didn't say nor preached and neglect of what he did say and preached.He sai I came ot revive the law,and never ate pork but christians have no worry about this.But any way this is thier business.What was the first miracle Jesus performed?
NO Muslim will ever say any bad name to Jesus.He was not bad and not evil.Only Quran is the divine book that confirms Jesus his mission and ministry but doesn't call him God which he himself never said in clear words.He preached whole life monotheism.He came only for Jews while Prophet Muhammad came for whole mankind.(jews and gentiles alike)
You have to know difference between proof and explanation.If someone tells you that I drink and tells because he saw me in front of bar.Is that proof.May be I was there as is bus stop and I get off to change for another bus,or may be my friend lives near the bar or may be there is good convenience store that I go to do shopping sometimes.But proof is if you see me drinking or if I say I do or if Breath analyser confirms it.So Jesus never said I am God so there is no proof he is God.Yes he is mighty messenger of God which bible says and QUran say.DOn't read Quran that will not make any dent in its status.God bless you
Once again, the dividing line between you and Christians is how you describe Jesus. He was not a good guy role model and prophet. He never said that, the Bible doesn’t say that, Muslims do. So, your proof is a book written 600 years after the New Testament, that contradicts our Scripture, and the only excuse is that your book is right. Your proof is lacking, not ours.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
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consonant variations within Korans This establishes the differences are substantial

 

FollowHisSteps

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Feb 15, 2019
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Let us think about variations of meaning that muslims dismiss.

Imagine if Jesus said, "You are the road, the word and the joy" instead of
"I am the way , the truth and the life"

So much of crucial statements by Jesus are exact and precise to a degree where peoples
faith is tested because they are so demanding.

But in the Koran, there is no such tightness or preciseness except they claim it is only
one version. This is a complete different way of dealing with truth and meaning.
But then dismissing Gods revelation with the word corruption shows 100% the lack of
respect these guys have for truth and meaning.
 

theanointedwinner

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Nov 6, 2018
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The Christian Bible is the most misunderstood book throughout history

If Muslim want to find truth, are they willing to give up the Koran for the sake of finding truth?
 

mjkhan

Junior Member
Nov 1, 2017
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Let us think about variations of meaning that muslims dismiss.

Imagine if Jesus said, "You are the road, the word and the joy" instead of
"I am the way , the truth and the life"

So much of crucial statements by Jesus are exact and precise to a degree where peoples
faith is tested because they are so demanding.

But in the Koran, there is no such tightness or preciseness except they claim it is only
one version. This is a complete different way of dealing with truth and meaning.
But then dismissing Gods revelation with the word corruption shows 100% the lack of
respect these guys have for truth and meaning.
If you present these kind of explanations in court of law, on different issues in life Judge will throw them out.But for Jesus who is much bigger you accept what you want and reject what you want.That is fine.
 

Mii

Well-known member
Mar 23, 2019
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I read bible,I have red letter one.I find lot of contradictions the most bothersome r Paul's contradictory writings yet who never met Jesus.what a shame.Plz give Jesus respect.
What specific contradictions? I'll admit that Paul is a bit of an odd character but you don't think the Damascus road experience has any credibility? I think his heart was in the right place but his "mind" was not and Yeshua stepped in. I think anyone that has met him unequivocally would necessarily change. That change seems evident.

Paul is someone I have a good bit of difficulty with so I'm open to discussing it. Preferably from a neutral ground. I'm blessed with a doubting nature about what I read. I stand by the authority of the word but question earthly men, which leads to further seeking in a way that grows me considerably I believe (although at times it is quite frustrating).

Also of note regarding Paul to consider is Acts 1:21-26
 

Mii

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Mar 23, 2019
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But for Jesus who is much bigger you accept what you want and reject what you want.That is fine.
I will also say he is bigger. Let us accept John 1:1 as accurate, then of course. The revealed word is all that is safe for a believer to know. There is an enemy. I believe Yeshua WILL show us when we are ready to know more about him but we have physical limitations as well as fleshly limitations that remain in our present state. Consider the man who thought to purchase the ability to lay hands on people for them to receive the Spirit for money. Sometimes it is a heart issue.
 

posthuman

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Jul 31, 2013
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NO Muslim will ever say any bad name to Jesus.He was not bad and not evil.Only Quran is the divine book that confirms Jesus his mission and ministry but doesn't call him God which he himself never said in clear words.He preached whole life monotheism.He came only for Jews while Prophet Muhammad came for whole mankind.(jews and gentiles alike)
You have to know difference between proof and explanation.If someone tells you that I drink and tells because he saw me in front of bar.Is that proof.May be I was there as is bus stop and I get off to change for another bus,or may be my friend lives near the bar or may be there is good convenience store that I go to do shopping sometimes.But proof is if you see me drinking or if I say I do or if Breath analyser confirms it.So Jesus never said I am God so there is no proof he is God.Yes he is mighty messenger of God which bible says and QUran say.DOn't read Quran that will not make any dent in its status.God bless you
the difference between proof & explanation.

is Jesus good?

you say: '
He was not bad and not evil'

Jesus says: '
no one is good but God alone'

now you have proof, and you must in your heart answer His own question:

"why do you call Me good?"

He is the word, and the word is alive, a sharp sword, quick and powerful, cutting even to soul and spirit.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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Why do you not understand what I am saying?
It is because you cannot hear My word.
(John 8:43)

it is useful to ask, who does Christ say this to?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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If you present these kind of explanations in court of law, on different issues in life Judge will throw them out.But for Jesus who is much bigger you accept what you want and reject what you want.That is fine.
you accept Allah even though Allah has not parted the very fabric of the universe, stuck down his head to show you his face, and spoken audibly directly to you that he is god.

but this Jesus of Nazareth has literally given me a new spirit and changed my very soul. i believe Him. He is alive
 

Endoscopy

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2017
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Is bible inerrant and word of God?
In the original language of the Bible it is inerrant. Translations can have errors. Also older translations have problems because of changes in the language. KJV has this problem. Below is the issues with KJV.

Problems with the KJV

Because of the changes in the English language between 1611 to today, a number of words occur in the King James that make zero sense to most people today. These include the following nuggets that you will find scattered here and there:

Almug
Algum
Charashim
Chode
Cracknels
Gat
Habergeon
Hosen
Kab
Ligure
Neesed
Nusings
Ouches
ring-straked
sycamyne
trow
wimples, ….

In addition knowledge of nature has advanced greatly since 1611. The King James translators translated some animal names into animals that in fact we now have pretty good reason for knowing don’t actually exist:

unicorn (Deut. 33:17)
satyr (Isa 13:21);
dragon (Deut 32:33) (for serpent)
cockatrice (Isa 11:8),
arrowsnake (Gen 49:11, in the margin).

Moreover,, there are phrases that simply don’t make sense any more to modern readers: Phrases that no longer make sense:

ouches of gold (Exod. 28:11);
collops of fat (Job 15:25);
naughty figs (Jer 24:2);
ien with (Jer. 3:2);
the ground is chapt (Jer 14:4);
brazen wall” (Jer 15:20);
rentest thy face (Jer. 4:30);
urrain of the cattle (Exod. 9:2);

And there are whole sentences that are confusing at best, virtually indecipherable (or humorous)

And Jacob sod pottage (Gen 25:29)
And Mt. Sinai was altogether on a smoke (Exoc. 19:18)
Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing (Ps. 5:6)
I trow not (Luke 17:9)
We do you to wit of the grace of God (2 Cor. 8:1)
Ye are not straitened in us, but ye are straitened in your own bowels (2 Cor. 6:12)
He who letteth will let (2 Thes 2:7)
The words of the wise are as goads, and as nails fastened by the masters of assemblies, which are given from one shepherd (Eccles. 12:11)


Other sentences make sense, but would today be considered somewhat problematic – at least for the sacred Scripture. My favorite is the one that refers one who: “Pisseth against the wall:…. 1 Sam 25:22, 34, I Kings 14:10!
NIV uses the word man.
 

dcontroversal

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Dec 12, 2013
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Yes u r right bible has everyone writing in it so we don't know if a certain line is divine or by enemy of God.That is the point.Thank you.
HAHA false......and that in and of itself proves the validity of the bible......but your Islamic blindness keeps you from seeing the truth.......
 

dcontroversal

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Dec 12, 2013
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you accept Allah even though Allah has not parted the very fabric of the universe, stuck down his head to show you his face, and spoken audibly directly to you that he is god.

but this Jesus of Nazareth has literally given me a new spirit and changed my very soul. i believe Him. He is alive
Allah is Satan........and a deceiver to boot.....
 

mjkhan

Junior Member
Nov 1, 2017
169
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What specific contradictions? I'll admit that Paul is a bit of an odd character but you don't think the Damascus road experience has any credibility? I think his heart was in the right place but his "mind" was not and Yeshua stepped in. I think anyone that has met him unequivocally would necessarily change. That change seems evident.

Paul is someone I have a good bit of difficulty with so I'm open to discussing it. Preferably from a neutral ground. I'm blessed with a doubting nature about what I read. I stand by the authority of the word but question earthly men, which leads to further seeking in a way that grows me considerably I believe (although at times it is quite frustrating).

Also of note regarding Paul to consider is Acts 1:21-26
Different bibles,greek,catholic,kjv then revised editions,they are not bothersome?
 

mjkhan

Junior Member
Nov 1, 2017
169
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Why would we want to read the words of a deceiver and a devil......
See now u say this without any proof but after reading it you will be able to say with reference.But what if your suspicion on Quran clears that would need grief counselling!