Jesus, being the form of God, said to Jews "you have not seen His form." Why?

MyrtleTrees · Jun 16, 2020

Also see this verse:
Heb 1:8

8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
KJV
This is one of the passages that helps to explain that Jesus was a part of the godhead of the ONE GOD there is. And NO ONE BUT GOD is to be worshiped.
Matt 4:10

10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.
KJV

MyrtleTrees · Jun 16, 2020

garee said:

Jesus was God come in the form of human flesh. Jesus, The Spirit, and the Father are just 3 parts to the one true God that He is. There is no other true God, but God Almighty. I wouldn't call that "blasphemy" to have God come in the form of human flesh. To me, the word, "blasphemy" has to do with sin, and God is not able to sin. It's true He was in a form that was much less glorious than Himself as completely and only God is in heaven. It's true that Jesus showed high respect for HIs Father part in heaven. He did that - I believe, to be an example to us in how we should think of God. We should always trust and revere God above ourselves, in other words "our flesh."

biker · Jun 16, 2020

biker said:

John 14:

ܐܡܪ ܠܗ ܦܝܠܝܦܘܣ ܡܪܢ ܚܘܢ ܐܒܐ ܘܟܕܘ ܠܢ
8 Philipus {Philip} said unto Him, “Maran {Our Lord}, show us Aba {The Father}, and it is enough for us.”

ܐܡܪ ܠܗ ܝܫܘܥ ܗܢܐ ܟܠܗ ܙܒܢܐ ܥܡܟܘܢ ܐܢܐ ܘܠܐ ܝܕܥܬܢܝ ܦܝܠܝܦܐ ܡܢ ܕܠܝ ܚܙܐ ܚܙܐ ܠܐܒܐ ܘܐܝܟܢܐ ܐܢܬ ܐܡܪ ܐܢܬ ܚܘܢ ܐܒܐ
9 Eshu {Yeshua} said unto him, “I’m with you all this time, and you haven’t known Me Philipa {Philip}? Whoever sees Me, has seen Aba {The Father}, and how do you say, ‘Show us Aba {The Father}?’

^
Physical Image or Express Image of the Father

John 4:

ܐܠܐ ܐܬܝܐ ܫܥܬܐ ܘܗܫܐ ܐܝܬܝܗ ܐܡܬܝ ܕܣܓܘܕܐ ܫܪܝܪܐ ܢܣܓܕܘܢ ܠܐܒܐ ܒܪܘܚܐ ܘܒܫܪܪܐ ܐܦ ܐܒܐ ܓܝܪ ܕܐܝܟ ܗܠܝܢ ܗܘ ܣܓܘܕܐ ܒܥܐ
23 But, the hour comes, and now is, when The Shariyre Sagude {The True Worshipers} will bow down to Aba {The Father} in The Rukha {The Spirit} and also in The Shrara {The Truth}. For, Aba {The Father}, He seeks Sagude {Worshipers} like these.

ܪܘܚܐ ܗܘ ܓܝܪ ܐܠܗܐ ܘܐܝܠܝܢ ܕܣܓܕܝܢ ܠܗ ܒܪܘܚܐ ܘܒܫܪܪܐ ܘܠܐ ܕܢܣܓܕܘܢ
24 For, Alaha {God} is The Rukha {Spirit}, and those who bow down to Him, it is right that they should bow down in The Rukha {The Spirit} and in The Shrara {The Truth}.”

^
Spirit Form or Invisible Image of the Father

We can see the Father in 2 forms, 1 being the physical Image of the WORD, the other is Spirit.

Basically, Jesus is telling the Jews, they are BLIND, even when He was the physical Image to the Invisible Spirit Father (Express Image).

I want to RETRACT this answer ^ here:

I believe Jesus was not talking about seeing Him in Person, I believe Jesus was talking about seeing Him in His true form as the WORD. It's in the form of the WORD that is the exact Express Image to the Invisible God, not the manifested flesh body used for our Sacrifice.

This is why He told the Jews they could not SEE the true form of Himself.

biker · Jun 16, 2020

If Jesus revealed His true form as the WORD, the pureness/awesomeness/the light alone would have destroyed all looking at Him. Even us now who are saved and joint-heirs of God, we would disintegrate in the true presence of the WORD. But once we make it to Glory, we shall Behold Him in ALL that He truly is!

Peterlag · Jun 16, 2020

MyrtleTrees said:

Also see this verse:
Heb 1:8

8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
KJV
This is one of the passages that helps to explain that Jesus was a part of the godhead of the ONE GOD there is. And NO ONE BUT GOD is to be worshiped.
Matt 4:10

10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.
KJV

I don't see what you see.

MyrtleTrees · Jun 16, 2020

Peterlag said:

Why? Well, here are some verses that show that Jesus was to be worshiped:
Heb 1:6

6 And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him
KJV

Matt 2:11

11 And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him: and when they had opened their treasures, they presented unto him gifts; gold, and frankincense, and myrrh.
KJV

Matt 14:33

33 Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God.
KJV
And here are some verses where those who were not God, forbid others who thought to worship them - to not do so:
Rev 19:10

10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.
KJV

Acts 10:25-26

25 And as Peter was coming in, Cornelius met him, and fell down at his feet, and worshipped him.

26 But Peter took him up, saying, Stand up; I myself also am a man.
KJV

Acts 14:14-15

14 Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, heard of, they rent their clothes, and ran in among the people, crying out,

15 And saying, Sirs, why do ye these things? We also are men of like passions with you, and preach unto you that ye should turn from these vanities unto the living God, which made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and all things that are therein:
KJV
In the above passage, the pagan people of the area were about to worship Paul & Barnabus, because they guessed they must be gods, because of the miracles they had performed.

MyrtleTrees · Jun 16, 2020

And here's some verses that helps show that "God's begotten Son" refers to Jesus:

1 John 5:20

20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
KJV
John 3:16

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
KJV
And notice how the High Priest claimed that Jesus was worthy of death by claiming to be "the Son of God" - meaning "God."
Matt 26:63-66

63 But Jesus held his peace. And the high priest answered and said unto him, I adjure thee by the living God, that thou tell us whether thou be the Christ, the Son of God.

64 Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.

65 Then the high priest rent his clothes, saying, He hath spoken blasphemy; what further need have we of witnesses? behold, now ye have heard his blasphemy.

66 What think ye? They answered and said, He is guilty of death.
KJV
This shows that their law system imposed a death sentence upon anyone claiming to be God. Their problem was that they didn't know He was God. So that's why they thought He was guilty of that crime.

MyrtleTrees · Jun 16, 2020

MyrtleTrees said:

And here's some verses that helps show that "God's begotten Son" refers to Jesus:

1 John 5:20

20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

KJV

John 3:16

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

KJV

And notice how the High Priest claimed that Jesus was worthy of death by claiming to be "the Son of God" - meaning "God."

Matt 26:63-66

63 But Jesus held his peace. And the high priest answered and said unto him, I adjure thee by the living God, that thou tell us whether thou be the Christ, the Son of God.
64 Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.

65 Then the high priest rent his clothes, saying, He hath spoken blasphemy; what further need have we of witnesses? behold, now ye have heard his blasphemy.

66 What think ye? They answered and said, He is guilty of death.

KJV
This shows that their law system imposed a death sentence upon anyone claiming to be God. Their problem was that they didn't know He was God. So that's why they thought He was guilty of that crime

Also, notice below, how God's Spirit is addressed as "Jesus" - several times in the Bible in reference to miracles that took place through God's power:
Acts 3:16
16 And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.
KJVActs 3:16
16 And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.
KJVActs 3:16
16 And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.
KJV
Acts 3:19-20

19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
KJV
Comment: The passage above refers to the fact that God's Spirit is also referred to as the Spirit of Jesus. Jesus was no longer on the earth, at this point.
John 14:17-18

17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
KJV
Comment: See here, how Jesus said He would come again to them in a form that could be in them? Meaning, He'd be able to communicate with them and help and guide (Romans 8:14) them in daily life, without His being physically present with them.
John 14:16-17

16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
KJV
Comment: See how He had to be absent from them in order to be able to be present with them just in the form of God's Spirit?
Rom 8:14

14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
KJV
Comment: Here you can see how sometimes God's Spirit is just called "The Spirit of God?" - in the Bible. Another important fact that this verse brings out, is that no one can born of God (esteemed by God as being His own, and headed for eternal life in heaven after this life), wthout being led by God's Spirit.
Rom 8:15-17

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
KJV
Comment: Those who serve God - belong to HIm and God promises them eternal life in heaven with Him after this life - John 3:15.
Gal 4:5-7

5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.

7 Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.
KJV
Comment: Those who have God's Spirit guiding their lives, belong to Him, and are heirs - meaning they will inherit the riches of eternal life with God in heaven after this life is over.

garee · Jun 16, 2020

MyrtleTrees said:

Coming in a form for a one time demonstration is not blasphemy .Attributing the work of the father to the Son is.

Yes flesh typified as sinful must be used during that one time demonstration of the father and the Son . The letter of the law death was useless .The demonstration provided the law of faith making the law after perfect. Separate from one another death. We walk by the faith of Christ the eternal not seen. Just as Jesus .Having the power of God in his body of death .Not of him . He said His own flesh profits for zero.

I see that more two working as One God. Jesus the prophet apostle was sent with the words of His father not of his own self, or the Father of His own. Jesus did not do the will of his own flesh .To deny one is to deny the other

When approached in worship kneeling down. One person called Jesus the apostle Good Master. He would not deny the father and commit blasphemy . He turned and said one is our Good Master, God .

Attributing the work of God not seen to human flesh is blasphemy. It was forgivable when the Son of God, Jesus was here. Peter was forgiven when he rebuked Jesus .Therefore not taking it into account Jesus was sent by the father with the words of the father. Like all apostles prophets, priest . That demonstration of the father and Son working together in prefect harmony and submission is over. Never again will he appear in the flesh. No need if we walk by faith. One demonstration is all that was propmised .

He is reigning here on earth. Some are looking for second coming. But the Holy Spirit who holds together all things has never left. The creation would collapse. He will leave on the last day. Then it will collapse

Dino246 · Jun 17, 2020

garee said:

Where is that in Scripture?

garee said:

Again, where is that in Scripture?

Funkus · Jun 17, 2020

I think it helps to understand Jewish theology which is very anthropomorphic, God is spoken of as having hands, eyes, a face, a heart. This to me is superior to Greek abstractions. I feel God permits us to relate to him through the body that we have, so because we have a heart we know God has one and so on. I think the hearers in John 5 would have understood that the pharisees hadn't seen God with this in mind, they failed to represent God accurately to the people. Jesus was doing this. In Him God was visible but only for those with 'eyes to see', this extended even to his body because the Father shaped that body.

Put it another way. The New Age teaches God has no personality, which has the effect of destroying any chance of a relationship with God. You can't love something that can't love you back. Maybe that's the mistake the pharisees made too i don't know. anyway this visibility of God and personality is so essential and Jesus kind of makes it totally impossible to get wrong?

garee · Jun 17, 2020

Dino246 said:

Its there we have discussed. You simply deny. Just as Peter who walked by sight (no faith) when presented with the gospel (below)

Having no spiritual understanding it confused Peter who desired eternal Jewish flesh that will never die as shown with the lie as a oral tradition he spread around town about John, chapter 21. Jesus never said the flesh of John will never die. Peter loved glorying in the flesh of mankind. The serial denier.

From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day. Mathew 16: 21

Again hiding the spiritual understanding of the parable from Peter.. in order to teach his children how to walk by faith (the gospel)

The Lord rebuked Satan, Not Jesus the Son of man who did not do his "own will" like all apostle sent with word form the father. The will of the flesh. . .corrupted flesh . has no power") . Giving words to his prophet and apostle Jesus.

The Lord not seen forgave Peter of his blasphemy against the things seen, Jesus the temporal .

Its the results of trying to make the corrupted flesh and blood in which Jesus says profits for , nothing zero, into God. God is not a man . When Jesus disappeared that window of opportunity ended , blasphemy against the unseen Spirit of Christ is not forgivable.

Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee. But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me (the unseen Lord) , Satan: thou art an offence unto me(the unseen Lord): for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.Mathew 16: 22-23

The Lord commanded that Satan get behind him not seen .Not Peter seen. The mark of the antichrists. . . attributing the work of God not seen to mankind seen, the temporal

Dino246 · Jun 17, 2020

garee said:
Coming in a form for a one time demonstration is not blasphemy .Attributing the work of the father to the Son is.
and...
Attributing the work of God not seen to human flesh is blasphemy.

Dino246 said:
Where is that in Scripture?
and
Again, where is that in Scripture?

garee said:

That's just silly. When you're asked for Scripture, all you provide is snark. The truth is that there is no Scripture to support your assertions.

cv5 · Jun 17, 2020

https://biblehub.com/nkjv/exodus/24.htm

MyrtleTrees · Jun 17, 2020

garee said:

True, God's 3 roles are not to be confused with each other. God wants us to recognize them all. But all His 3 parts represented the deity of God. And God is just one God. And it would be blasphemy to call Jesus "only human." And blasphemy to not acknowledge the deity of Jesus.
1 John 2:22

22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
KJV

1 John 4:3

3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
KJV

garee · Jun 18, 2020

MyrtleTrees said:

The focus is on the two. Whoever has not the father the eternal not seen and the Son the temporal seen. They have neither. The one time demonstration of the mutual work of two working as one is over.

Denying Christ the Holy Spirit of God not seen has never been forgivable . Denying Jesus the Son of man the apostle prophet the temporal who lived in a corruptible body just as ours was forgivable when he was here.

Deity is another word for spirit. The essence of life not seen . In that way all sons of God have the Spirit of Christ in them but the power is not of us just as it was not of Jesus 's flesh and blood . That same flesh and blood in which he said it prophets for nothing.

Its the unseen Spirit that works to quicken our new heart and spirit .His word Spirit (let there be) and behold new life. .
My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one. Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him. Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me? The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods? If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken; Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God? If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him. John 10 :29 -38

Jesus the apostle, prophet never did his own will, the will that he was tempted to do all through his life. .

Those same kind of faithless men who walked after the temporal corrupted. What the eyes see, when they did see a miracle (sign seekers). Jesus said to them who made him into a circus seal ( do a miracle and then we will beleive). without a sign as a wonderment you will not.

Then it was OK to make men into deities, gods in the likeness of men.

Our God is not a man .

We as sons of God are rather created in his likeness (no form) as new creatures, having a new spirit that will not die. We will receive our new incorruptible bodies, no one has yet. .

It becomes will we rightly divide or walk after what the eyes see?

Either the gospel .Words of Spirit life, giving words of power to his apostles, prophets ( Stand upright on thy feet.) or we blaspheme God and attribute the work to the corrupted hands of mankind.

And there they preached the gospel. And there sat a certain man at Lystra, impotent in his feet, being a cripple from his mother's womb, who never had walked:The same heard Paul speak: who stedfastly beholding him, and perceiving that he had faith to be healed, Said with a loud voice, "Stand upright on thy feet". And he leaped and walked. And when the people saw what Paul had done, they lifted up their voices, saying in the speech of Lycaonia, The gods (deities) are come down to us in the likeness of men. And they called Barnabas, Jupiter; and Paul, Mercurius, because he was the chief speaker.Acts14: 7-12

garee · Jun 18, 2020

Dino246 said:

LOL That's silly. Where is the scripture to support your idea that God is a man?

It would seem you are still trying to make God into a man. And Jesus the Son of man a daysman . A Catholic teaching. The abomination of desolation .

Job would seem to disagree. He knew that God that worked in Him is where he received the power to beleive. That it was not of these earthen bodies of death Just as Jesus knew, the same.

Jesus did not try and justify his own self rather gave glory to the unseen father. His own mouth would condememed him if he took on the glorying of his corrupted flesh . He said God alone is the one Good teaching Master. . The Lord that rebukes giving words to his prophets like Jesus'. Get behind me Satan (the unseen eternal one) not Peter seen the temporal .

Our father, the one Good Master taught the Son of man every thing necessary as a apostle prophet. He had no power of his own.

Job 9:20 If I justify myself, mine own mouth shall condemn me: if I say, I am perfect, it shall also prove me perverse.

Job 9:32-33 For he is not a man, as I am, that I should answer him, and we should come together in judgment. Neither is there any daysman betwixt us, that might lay his ( corrupted) hand upon us both. . . . . . .(God not seen and man seen)

Dino246 · Jun 18, 2020

garee said:

LOL That's silly. Where is the scripture to support your idea that God is a man?

It would seem you are still trying to make God into a man. And Jesus the Son of man a daysman . A Catholic teaching. The abomination of desolation .

Job would seem to disagree. He knew that God that worked in Him is where he received the power to beleive. That it was not of these earthen bodies of death Just as Jesus knew, the same.

Jesus did not try and justify his own self rather gave glory to the unseen father. His own mouth would condememed him if he took on the glorying of his corrupted flesh . He said God alone is the one Good teaching Master. . The Lord that rebukes giving words to his prophets like Jesus'. Get behind me Satan (the unseen eternal one) not Peter seen the temporal .

Our father, the one Good Master taught the Son of man every thing necessary as a apostle prophet. He had no power of his own.

Job 9:20 If I justify myself, mine own mouth shall condemn me: if I say, I am perfect, it shall also prove me perverse.

Job 9:32-33 For he is not a man, as I am, that I should answer him, and we should come together in judgment. Neither is there any daysman betwixt us, that might lay his ( corrupted) hand upon us both. . . . . . .(God not seen and man seen)

Instead of saying, "It would seem you are...",

QUOTE ME.

Prove your accusations with evidence. I'm not going to respond further to the slander you invent from thin air.

garee · Jun 18, 2020

Dino246 said:

It would seem you are ? I offered scriptures .

Its you that says Job 9 has nothing to do with anything making everything I offer irrelevant .

Where is the scripture that literally declares eternal God is a corruptible man and we can serve more than one Good teaching Master ?

Dino246 · Jun 18, 2020

garee said:

You made accusations against me; prove your accusations with quotations of MY words. You can't prove them by quoting Scripture.

Jesus, being the form of God, said to Jews "you have not seen His form." Why?

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