Jews

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Jan 19, 2013
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#81
(Robin)
Well now you have ... and it's not as clear and straight forward as you think ...
Pause a moment ... I'm simply stating a fact, not questioning your commitment.
Just give it a try ... find the verse that says "Bride of Christ" ... and if you can't
then pause again, and ponder ... have you just assumed something about scripture,
perhaps, even, you've been taught something that isn't exactly factual ... it is possible, right?
Or perhaps, you are not well enough informed of Scripture to know that
the bride (Rev 21:9) of the Lamb, Jesus Christ (Jn 1:19) is the bride of Christ (Eph 5:31-32)?
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#82
(Robin)
Good evening Flob ... and yes, I'm aware of that verse ...it's a figure of speech, so be careful there,
such figures are used for particular reasons, particular ideas, and should never be streached beyond
their intended purpose ... Paul had a particular idea to get across, here, and we should limit our
perception of his use of this particular figure to only what he was specifically talking about ... that is,
we shouldn't take it any further than Paul used it, we shouldn't be trying to make it read ..."Bride of Christ" ...
Your hermeneutic is faulty. . .
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#83
(Robin)
Yes ... never said differently; that is you are most correct ... correct about the many verses that "bride" can be found,
but the question was: where does scripture specifically say ..."Bride of Christ" ...
Faulty hermeneutic. . .

Bride of the Lamb (Rev 21:9).
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#84
(Robin)
Interesting verses there, Prove-all ... I've been playing with them for some years now, and think I have an idea about them,
that I've seen no one else take to ... that is, I'm not compleatly sure, but allow me to try and explain my idea ....
You are right. . .that is a real torque of the Scriptures to make them fit your theology.

Bride of the Lamb (Rev 21:9) settles the question.




 
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Jan 19, 2013
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#85
(Robin)
Believe you are talking about where it says "Bride of the Lambkin" ...
Revelations uses may figures of speech, and special words ..."Lambkin" ...being one

Again, this is God speaking, through His word ... would not God choose His words carefully?
You phish-tuttle my questioning the non-existent phrase ... it's not exact, but surely close enough ...
So then, are you suggesting that God isn't careful with His selection of words ... that He rambles?

But you are correct, there is a bride, the Bride of the Lambkin ... but we are clearly called the
Body of Christ, so might God be talking about two different things, here?
We are the body of Christ because of the two-in-one enfleshment (Eph 5:31) of the marital union between Christ and his bride (Eph 5:28-33), as all husbands and wives are made one flesh.

You do not understand Eph 5:25-33.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#86
(Blondieindahouse)
To that I ask: Where do you see the word trinity? But yet it is inferred right?

(Robin)
I try my hardest to never "infer" anything about God's word ...so no,
I cant find the word "trinity" in scriptrue,
so I really dont know what that means ... God didn't tell me ...
The NT is replete with references to three divine persons, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, all with attributes possessed only by deity.

You seem somewhat Scripturally uninformed, perhaps you should carefully consider them here.

any number of men have tried to define this
for me, but I've found that there's as many subjective definitions as there are men trying to explain this ...

On the nature of God
... I'm not sure, nor can I exaclty determine it from what I find in the scriptures,
so I'll just have to chalk that one up (my spiritual ignorance) as yet another failure (sin) that went to the
cross with Christ ... Thank you Father.
But the Bible is filled with the nature of God. . .what belief system is causing you to miss it?
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
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#87
Yes we are Israel. By Jesus we have been grafted into Israel as was foretold in the Old Testament and testified to in the New Testament.
Let's see your proof for that one. Quote me one verse where Gentile Christians are called Israel. Show me one verse, even in Romans 11 that says "grafted into Israel."

And let's see those OT prophesies, not prophesies about blessings coming to Gentiles, not prophesies about Gentiles becoming saved & belonging to God, but where they will ever become "Israel."
 
F

flob

Guest
#88
Peace be upon the Israel of God--------isn't that Paul's word to the churches in Galatia,
about the church, the saints, in general? you could say the 'universal church'
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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#89
But the "ten lost tribes" are found in the Bible after the exile, in

1) prophecies relating to the return from exile
---Jer 3:18, 31:27, 31 (where "Israel" is the northern kingdom of the ten tribes)
-ok lets go check some of those verses to see shall we.

[# 1] Jer 3:
18In those days [the house of Judah] shall walk with [the house of Israel],
and they shall come together out of the land of the north to the land that I have
given for an inheritance unto your fathers.

-so does northern kingdom Israel have its land or capital back that was promised?
lets go back one verse

17At that time they shall [call Jerusalem the throne of the Lord]; and
[all the nations] shall be gathered unto it, to the name of the Lord, to Jerusalem:
[neither shall they walk [any more] after the imagination of their evil heart].

-so do all the nations gather to Jerusalem, and call it the throne of the Lord?
no not hardly, near future verses says all nations will gather for battle in the area.
mabe you should turn the t.v. on, like iran calling Jerusalem little satan, and u.s. big satan.

For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken,
and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; [and half of the city ]shall go forth into captivity,
and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

- above verse has not happened yet, or did this battle above take place.
and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, keep a watch on Jerusalem.

-the vatican wants a 2 state solution, currenty sidding with palastine, most europe wants it.
when have they ever made nice to them?. no they want the Holy city themselves and making waves.

Jer 31:
27Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will sow the house of Israel [and]
the house of Judah with the seed of man, and with the seed of beast.

31Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with
[the house of Israel], and with [the house of Judah]:

-future verses , to both houses, After those days

33But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel;
[After those days], saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it
in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

- you really need to learn the phrase After those days occures, or in the latter days.
the law goes in there hearts, what law is it for Israel?

34And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother,
saying, Know the Lord: for they shall [all know me], from the least of them unto the greatest
of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and [I will remember their sin no more].

-so no more teaching the gospel,everyone least to the greatest shall [all] know the Lord.
mabe we should look outside , in this current evil world to see, nope that one not know the lord.

I'm sure our commander in chief does not know the Lord personally, [all] would include him.
it says [all know the Lord] so are Obamas sins been forgiven, remembered no more.

38Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that [the city shall be built] to
the Lord from the tower of Hananeel unto the gate of the corner.

-has the city been rebuilt again without us knowing it ?

39And the measuring line shall yet go forth over against it upon the hill Gareb, and shall compass
about to Goath. And the whole valley of the dead bodies, and of the ashes, and all the fields unto
the brook of Kidron, unto the corner of the horse gate toward the east, shall be holy unto the Lord;

[it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever].

-can you show me a picture of the horse gate standing now? holy unto the Lord
if these verses have happened , we would see the city, never to be thrown down for ever.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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#90
The bibe is clear.......if we are of the household of faith we are of the seed and stock of Abraham and hiers according to promise....Galatians contains a good allegory on the subject! as well as numerous other books!
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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#91
---Eze 37:15-22 (where "Ephraim" is the northern kingdom of ten tribes]
--see Is 7:17 for use of "Ephraim")
[1]
Eze 37:15-22

- the start of the chapter talks about bringing the dead back to life.
go back a few verses and see graves[of dead people]are opened.

12Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, O my people,
I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves,
and bring you [into the land of Israel].

13And ye shall know that I am the Lord, when I have opened your graves,
O my people, [and brought you up out] of your graves,

14And shall put my spirit in you, and ye shall live, and I shall place you in your [own land]:
then shall ye know that I the Lord have spoken it, and performed it, saith the Lord.

-this is a resurection from the graves, not God opening peoples eyes to see the truth.
the 2 sticks are not one now, and only [the jews] can be seen in plain view today.

16Moreover, thou son of man, take thee one stick, and write upon it,

For Judah, and for [the children of Israel] his companions:

then take another stick, and write upon it,

For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim, and for all [the house of Israel] his companions:

17And join them one to another into one stick; and they shall become one in thine hand.

19Say unto them, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I will take the stick of Joseph, which is in
the hand of Ephraim, and the tribes of Israel his fellows, and will put them with him, even with
the stick of Judah, and make them one stick, and they shall be one in mine hand.

-the children of Israel will be joined to the house of Israel, 2 different peoples.

27My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
28And [the heathen] shall know that I the Lord do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary
[shall be in the midst of them for evermore].

-do the current heathen know God santctifys Israel, is Gods sanctuary there now,
does the dome of the rock site where the temple mount is,
poor Jerusalem has no friends left, and the heathen wants them whipped out.

23Neither shall they [defile themselves any more] with their idols, nor with their detestable things,
nor with any of their transgressions: but I will save them out of all their dwellingplaces, wherein
they have sinned, and will cleanse them: so shall they be my people, and I will be their God.

24And [David my servant shall be king over them]; and they all shall have one shepherd:
they shall also walk in [my judgments], [and observe my statutes, and do them.]

-this one should seal it , David is not sitting on his throne over them, on this earth, in Jerusalem.

25And they shall dwell in [the land] that I have [given unto Jacob] my servant, wherein your fathers
have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's
children [for ever]: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever.

-why in the future will they be observing Gods statues and judgements, that David loved?
house of Israel does not current dwell in Samaria, there capital , that God gave there fathers.


My people hath been lost sheep: their shepherds have caused them to go astray,
they have turned them away on the mountains: they have gone from mountain to hill,
they have forgotten their restingplace.
 

crossnote

Senior Member
Nov 24, 2012
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#92
Peace be upon the Israel of God--------isn't that Paul's word to the churches in Galatia,
about the church, the saints, in general? you could say the 'universal church'
Not quite...

And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.
(Gal 6:16)

The word 'and' (kai) distinguishes between 'them' and the Israel of God.

Who is the 'them'?

Ans: The Church (Believing Jews and Gentiles) who 'walk according to this rule'.
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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#93
The bibe is clear.......if we are of the household of faith we are of the seed and stock of Abraham and hiers according to promise....Galatians contains a good allegory on the subject! as well as numerous other books!
yes the bible is clear about the promise of the one seed,

but the bible gives promises to a physical nation Isreal, called the birthrite.

about a physical nation that God said would spread across the world, not a spirit nation.

yes we have a new covenent, but the things to come, about decendents of the old nation still stands.
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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#94
2) return from exile - Ezra 6:17
-lets backup the time frame here to, the house of Israels captivity

2 Kings 17
5Then the king of Assyria came up throughout all the land, and went up to Samaria, and besieged
it three years. In the ninth year of Hoshea the king of Assyria took Samaria,

and carried Israel away into Assyria,
and placed them in Halah and in Habor by the river of Gozan, and in the cities of the Medes.


22For the children of Israel walked in all the sins of Jeroboam which he did;they departed not from them
23Until the Lord removed Israel out of his sight, as he had said by all his servants the prophets.
So was [Israel] carried away out of their own land to Assyria [unto this day].

-In 721-718 b.c. Israel was “carried away out of their own land to Assyria”
18Therefore the Lord was very angry with Israel, and removed them out of his sight:
there was none left but the tribe of Judah only. -Judah only remained.

20And the Lord rejected all the seed of Israel, and afflicted them, and delivered them
into the hand of spoilers, until he had [cast them out of his sight].
21For he rent Israel from the house of David; and they made Jeroboam the son of Nebat king:
and Jeroboam drave Israel from following the Lord, and made them sin a great sin.

“For the children of Israel walked in all [the sins of Jeroboam] which he did;

- do a study about the sins of Jeroboam, did like father before,and father before him...,
the reason Israel was deforced, and Judah followed after, it was always about
Gods statues and judgements or there forfathers tradations.

Isaiah 8:17: “And I will wait upon the Lord,
[that hideth his face] from the house of Jacob[sinning Israel, or in sin] and without God.

-Wherever you see the name “Israel,” or “house of Israel,” or “Samaria,” or
“Jacob,” or “Rachel,” or “Ephraim” and or "Manasseh" used in prophecy,
It never refers to the Jews, but to Israel

Amos 9:8-9
“Behold, the eyes of the Lord God are upon the sinful kingdom [house of Israel]
[Judah had not yet sinned], and I will destroy it -the kingdom, or government,
not the people, from off the face of the earth, lost from mans view and idenity.

For, lo, I will command, and I will sift [the house of Israel] among [all nations],
like as corn is sifted in a sieve, yet shall not the least grain fall upon the earth”

-the house of Israel was sifted among all nations, not the house of Judah.

Hosea 3
4For the children of Israel shall abide many days without a king, and without a prince,
and without a sacrifice, and without an image, and without an ephod, and without teraphim:
5Afterward shall the children of Israel return, and seek the Lord their God, and David their king;
and shall fear the Lord and his goodness in the latter days.

2 Samuel 7:14
I will be his father, and he shall be my son. If he commit iniquity, I will chasten him with
the rod of men, and with the stripes of the children of men:

Judah, that it did worse then its brother did, and deforced them too.

- about a 130 years later, the house of Judah goes captive to Babylon.
after they where warned time an again, about Gods sabbaths, and bringing goods to sell.

-we will skip Jeremiahs great commision for now, but one question would be,
why did he hookup with the former kings daughters, and where did he go with afterwards?

- now we have the return from captivity of Judah, back to Jerusalem.
but for Davids sake, and Gods Holy name, we can even see the jews return.

5And also let the golden and silver vessels of the house of God, which Nebuchadnezzar took forth
out of the temple which is at Jerusalem, and brought unto Babylon, be restored, and brought again
unto the temple which is at Jerusalem, every one to his place, and place them in the house of God.

Ezra 1:5
“Then rose up the chief of the fathers of Judah and Benjamin, and the priests, and the Levites
the tribe of Judah, or the house of Judah, together with remnants of Benjamin and Levi,
who constituted the children of Israel, returned at that time, not the lost ten tribes.

Ezra 6:
7Let the work of this house of God alone; let the governor of [the Jews] and the elders of
the Jews build this house of God in his place.

14And the elders of [the Jews builded], and they prospered through the prophesying
of Haggai the prophet and Zechariah the son of Iddo.

And they builded, and finished it, according to the commandment of the God of Israel,
and according to the commandment of Cyrus, and Darius, and Artaxerxes king of Persia.

[Ezra 6:17]
And offered [at the dedication of this house of God] an hundred bullocks,
two hundred rams, four hundred lambs;
and for a sin offering [for all Israel], twelve he goats, according to the number of the tribes of Israel

- the children of the captivity made the offering for all the tribes of Israel, -only twelve goats,
it does not say that all Israel was there, a sin offering was made by jews, in all there behalf.

- Ezra 6:17 is not the return from exile of the house of Israel to Jerusalem.
the current visible Jews are not the lost ten tribes.
 
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B

Brother_J_BELGIUM

Guest
#95
since Jesus was a Jew ( king of the Jews) are we Jews?
Actually, He came for the Jews to be the King of the Jews but they rejected Him. So the gospel was preached to the gentiles, to us. So, no, we're not Jews because we don't follow the laws of Moses but the law of freedom in Christ. Also, the Bible mentions a couple of times that the converted believers (who were both Jews and gentiles) "were called Christians for the first time" in some city. I don't know where it says that but it does. So the Bible itself says that we're Christians (and some of us) no longer Jews. We were gentiles, and now we're Christians, simple as that. It's in the Bible.
 

prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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#96
3) NT - Ac 26:7, Jas 1:1

How could they be lost?
- I guess because Jesus said they where lost, and hidding his face from them.

Matthew 10:
5These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying,
Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:

-go not to gentials, the city of Samaritan had been transplanted by other people,
the ones Paul said was dogs where not jews or Isreal, in the town there.

6 But go rather to [the lost sheep] of [the house of Israel].
7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand........


23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you,
Ye shall not have gone over [the cities of Israel], till the Son of man be come.

- so where did [the Apostiles go] to proclaim the kingdom of God is at hand, repent ye...
is the Son of man come on clouds, back to gather his people[when Shiloh comes]

[Matthew 15:24]
But he answered and said, I am not sent [but] unto [the lost sheep] of [the house of Israel].

- the jews and gentials where right there among them,
but Jesus sent a message to the lost sheep of [ the house of Israel].

-[Ac 26:7]
Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come.
For which hope's sake, king Agrippa, I am accused of the Jews.

-so Pauls hope is in the promises given to the 12 tribes, does in no way inply they where
anywhere in the area with him, or talked to them.


-[James1:1]
James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ,
to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.

-here it says scattered abroad, only clue, no p.o. box number.
where did this letter go? does not say the lost ten anywhere close to them.
the jews where right there, was not to them or new gentials.

-so even Jesus says there are lost sheep,ten tribes, house of Israel way after
the children of babalyion captivity returned

the new church is never called the house of Israel.
comfirming that the 2 sticks where not together at time of Christ.
 
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prove-all

Senior Member
May 16, 2014
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#97
- I cringe when people call the jews dogs, because they think Paul did,
but Paul did not call jews dogs, recorded here these heathen where transplanted.

23
Until the Lord removed Israel out of his sight, as he had said by all his servants the prophets.
So was Israel carried away out of their own land to Assyria unto this day.



24And the king of Assyria brought men from Babylon, and from Cuthah, and from Ava, and from Hamath, and from Sepharvaim, and placed them in the cities of Samaria instead of the children of Israel: and they possessed Samaria, and dwelt in the cities thereof.


25
And so it was at the beginning of their dwelling there, that they feared not the Lord:
therefore the Lord sent lions among them, which slew some of them.


26
Wherefore they spake to the king of Assyria, saying, The nations which thou hast removed, and placed in the cities of Samaria, know not the manner of the God of the land: therefore he hath sent lions among them, and, behold, they slay them, because they know not the manner of the God of the land.

28Then one of the priests whom they had carried away from Samaria came and dwelt in Beth–el,
and taught them how they should fear the Lord.

29Howbeit every nation made gods of their own, and put them in the houses of the high places
which the Samaritans had made, every nation in their cities wherein they dwelt.


30And the men of Babylon made Succoth–benoth, and the men of Cuth made Nergal, and the men of Hamath made Ashima,
31And the Avites made Nibhaz and Tartak, and the Sepharvites burnt their children in fire to Adrammelech and Anammelech,
the gods of Sepharvaim.

32So they feared the Lord, and made unto themselves of the lowest of them priests of the high places,
which sacrificed for them in the houses of the high places.


33They feared the Lord, and served their own gods,
after the manner of the nations whom they carried away from thence.

34Unto this day they do after the former manners: they fear not the Lord,
neither do they after their statutes, or after their ordinances,
or after the law and commandment which theLord commanded the children of Jacob,
whom he named Israel;

 
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Jan 19, 2013
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#98
Elin said:
3) NT - Ac 26:7, Jas 1:1

How could they be lost?
- I guess because Jesus said they where lost, and hidding his face from them.

Matthew 10:
5These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying,
Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:

-go not to gentials, the city of Samaritan had been transplanted by other people,
the ones Paul said was dogs where not jews or Isreal, in the town there.

6 But go rather to [the lost sheep] of [the house of Israel].
7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand........


23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you,
Ye shall not have gone over [the cities of Israel], till the Son of man be come.

- so where did [the Apostiles go] to proclaim the kingdom of God is at hand, repent ye...
is the Son of man come on clouds, back to gather his people[when Shiloh comes]

[Matthew 15:24]
But he answered and said, I am not sent [but] unto [the lost sheep] of [the house of Israel].

- the jews and gentials where right there among them,
but Jesus sent a message to the lost sheep of [ the house of Israel].

-[Ac 26:7]
Unto which promise our twelve tribes, instantly serving God day and night, hope to come.
For which hope's sake, king Agrippa, I am accused of the Jews.

-so Pauls hope is in the promises given to the 12 tribes, does in no way inply they where
anywhere in the area with him, or talked to them.


-[James1:1]
James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ,
to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.

-here it says scattered abroad, only clue, no p.o. box number.
where did this letter go? does not say the lost ten anywhere close to them.
the jews where right there, was not to them or new gentials.

-so even Jesus says there are lost sheep,ten tribes, house of Israel way after
the children of babalyion captivity returned

the new church is never called the house of Israel.
comfirming that the 2 sticks where not together at time of Christ.
Nothing in the above speaks of 10 tribes of Israel lost in the exile.
 

valiant

Senior Member
Mar 22, 2015
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#99
-ok lets go check some of those verses to see shall we.

[# 1] Jer 3:
18In those days [the house of Judah] shall walk with [the house of Israel],
and they shall come together out of the land of the north to the land that I have
given for an inheritance unto your fathers.

-so does northern kingdom Israel have its land or capital back that was promised?
the house of Judah and the house of Israel certainly returned to the Exile and settled peaceably in the land until gradually they took it over. By the time of Jesus they were one nation.


lets go back one verse

17At that time they shall [call Jerusalem the throne of the Lord]; and
[all the nations] shall be gathered unto it, to the name of the Lord, to Jerusalem:
[neither shall they walk [any more] after the imagination of their evil heart].

-so do all the nations gather to Jerusalem, and call it the throne of the Lord?
all nations (every nation under heaven) gathered to the Temple at Pentecost and they certainly called it the Name of the Lord.

no not hardly, near future verses says all nations will gather for battle in the area.
mabe you should turn the t.v. on, like iran calling Jerusalem little satan, and u.s. big satan.
and maybe you should read the inter-testamental history of Jerusalem.

For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken,
and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; [and half of the city ]shall go forth into captivity,
and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
this happened in 70 AD - above verse has not happened yet, or did this battle above take place.
and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, keep a watch on Jerusalem.
yes it did.


31Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with
[the house of Israel], and with [the house of Judah]:

-future verses , to both houses, After those days.
the new covenant was established in the upper room and confirmed in Hebrews..

33But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel;
[After those days], saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it
in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
fulfilled in Hebrews.

- you really need to learn the phrase After those days occures, or in the latter days.
the law goes in there hearts, what law is it for Israel?
after those days simply mean 'later' as does 'in later days'

34And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother,
saying, Know the Lord: for they shall [all know me], from the least of them unto the greatest
of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and [I will remember their sin no more].
fulfilled in the Jewish church per Romans 11.12-24.

-so no more teaching the gospel,everyone least to the greatest shall [all] know the Lord.
mabe we should look outside , in this current evil world to see, nope that one not know the lord.
but all the true Israel know the Lord.

I'm sure our commander in chief does not know the Lord personally, [all] would include him.
it says [all know the Lord] so are Obamas sins been forgiven, remembered no more.
but it did not say every man in the world. Come to that, do you know the Lord?

38Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that [the city shall be built] to
the Lord from the tower of Hananeel unto the gate of the corner.

-has the city been rebuilt again without us knowing it ?
It was rebuilt in Nehemiah's time.

39And the measuring line shall yet go forth over against it upon the hill Gareb, and shall compass
about to Goath. And the whole valley of the dead bodies, and of the ashes, and all the fields unto
the brook of Kidron, unto the corner of the horse gate toward the east, shall be holy unto the Lord;
occurred in Nehemiah' time

[it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever].

-can you show me a picture of the horse gate standing now? holy unto the Lord
if these verses have happened , we would see the city, never to be thrown down for ever.
olam does not literally mean 'for ever'. it means into the hidden future'. And Jerusalem survived into the hidden future as far as the Jews were then concerned.
 
Dec 18, 2013
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Let's see your proof for that one. Quote me one verse where Gentile Christians are called Israel. Show me one verse, even in Romans 11 that says "grafted into Israel."

And let's see those OT prophesies, not prophesies about blessings coming to Gentiles, not prophesies about Gentiles becoming saved & belonging to God, but where they will ever become "Israel."
Romans 11 indeed shows we be now grafted into Israel if you want even the word grafted. Even those that do not believe this and how they shalt be broken off the tree be they of the natural branches or the branches grafted in, this too is written therein. Who be the olive tree Paul speaketh of in Romans 11? As mentioned by others all ready Galatians is good for the point and of course there is Ephesians as well.

As for the Old Testament, aside from that which others have cited, the most famous instance be the blessing of all nations through Abraham it is written. As for Gentiles being saved and belonging to God, therefore then they hath ceased to be Gentiles, but have become part of Israel, for there is only Israel and the sons of the bondwoman in whom there is no inheritance. Nevertheless go to and consider Ruth and what she said unto Naomi.