Mystery, Babylon the Great - earthly Jerusalem?

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was Mystery, Babylon the Great - earthly Jerusalem?


  • Total voters
    24
  • Poll closed .
Mar 18, 2011
2,540
22
0
That is exactly the problem, thank you! You are trying to interpret this Prophetic Text in the Scriptures, concerning Mystery Babylon the Great Whore (as well as the rest of Prophetic Texts) by looking around the world today, and saying; LOOK isn't this all the fulfilling of Scripture? O My God! I'm going to go jump off a cliff! Who put this garbage in your heads? All the modern day false prophets; Hal Lindsey for one, has for 30 plus years, spewed this stuff out of his mouth, when are people like you going to say enough is enough. I know that he is not the latest and greatest of these evil men, but your 30 yrs old and he has been doing this before you were born; so I get it!!!! I get it!!! You've been saturated with this filth. I heard this crap 50 yrs ago by the fear-mongers in the church of that day. Not all prophecy has been fulfilled,....the glory of the Lord will fill the earth as the water covereth the sea.... etc...... and there is a strand in Revelation that leads through today. But you must interpret Scripture with Scripture, in the contexts of the Covenant, of God and His people. Because it will never matter what the future holds in the 21st Century, if you misinterpret this; that is, what it meant to whom it was written to and why! Most of the horrible things in the book of Revelation was still in these people's foreseeable future, in 50 and 60 ad. I'll talk to you later, I've got to go find that cliff!
:) I always smile in my heart when I see you've responded brother. First I'd like to tell you that I was not saturated with any of these thoughts by Hal Lindsay or anyone. Unlike many people here I don't read others thoughts and retain them as my own. I in no way see this as "lets jump off a cliff material" in actuality I find a great comfort in knowing that the worse things get here the closer Jesus is to returning. Matthew 24:22 "And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened." Here we have no flesh would survive these cataclysmic events. This is a far larger scale than any one city. Then we have this.
[SUP]"37 [/SUP]But as the days of Noah were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be."

it goes on to say that people were still just going about their merry lives without a clue as to what was coming. To this day we have many people, even you Excalibur who would teach us that without a doubt those times are behind us, I know that you believe the scripture is clear in these things. However there are those of us whom it is clear on the opposite end.
[SUP]43 [/SUP]But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

[SUP]44 [/SUP]Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh."

remember this brother. Scripture was written in such a way as to remain a mystery to those who do not allow the Holy Spirit to guide their wisdom. Scripture in itself is not enough to decide the true meanings behind it. Clearly the bible states that in the days Jesus returns there will be a large number of believers who do not expect His return
Matthew 25:

[SUP]2 [/SUP]And five of them were wise, and five were foolish.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]They that were foolish took their lamps, and took no oil with them:
[SUP]4 [/SUP]But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]While the bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept.

There is nothing that I believe that I was taught by man. I simply don't give humans enough credit to sway that which an intimate relationship with Jesus produces. As children and servants of God we will only answer to Him, and as long as I stand in good conscience on that day then I have succeeded in everything I've ever hoped to accomplish.

God guide us all brother.
 

vic1980

Senior Member
Apr 25, 2013
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Luke 16:29
"Abraham replied, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.'
How does this connect with the days they are here ?

Revelation 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

and this

Revelation 11:6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

Seems they will be given authority to do this on the spot, unlike moses and elijah God granted it for a sign

Revelation 11:7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.

Revelation 11:8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

Revelation 11:9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.

Revelation 11:10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.

When messiah went to the cross , the Jewish nation was falling apart , even those in the temple knew things where changing for the worst when they cast lots for many years, 40 YEARS OF WARNINGS according to the Bible,Talmud and history. moses warned the jews ahead, saying they will be destroyed if they did not belive Acts 3:23 they had 40 years warning

thee Good news of Christ ,the word of God continue to move forward, in these events in time and has never stop


Historically it does not seem as a celebration ,40 years after christ was crucify 40 years to the day in 70AD? Rome herself was in a power stuggle leading up to these events who will be leadership, even titus himself was not celebration Titus reportedly refused to accept a wreath of victory, as he claimed that he had not won the victory on his own, but had been the vehicle through which their God had manifested his wrath against his people.[SUP] titus fullfilled thee warnings moses gave instruction about :)[/SUP]

Revelation 11:11 And after three days and an half the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.

Revelation 11:12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.

this has to be physical ,not spiritual ,their enemies beheld them just as the men of Galilee witness Jesus ascension into heaven. i belive it will be as in Acts 1:11

Caesar ??? Rome ??? Vespasian??? titus ??? The unbeliving Jews??? fullfilled this wow seriously :eek:
 
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vic1980

Senior Member
Apr 25, 2013
1,653
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Revelation 11:6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

way way diffrent, from the testimony we have of moses and elijah and the prophets of the OT

God Bless...
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
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How does this connect with the days they are here ?

Revelation 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

and this

Revelation 11:6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

Seems they will be given authority to do this on the spot, unlike moses and elijah God granted it for a sign

Revelation 11:7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.

Revelation 11:8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

Revelation 11:9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.

Revelation 11:10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.

When messiah went to the cross , the Jewish nation was falling apart , even those in the temple knew things where changing for the worst when they cast lots for many years, 40 YEARS OF WARNINGS according to the Bible,Talmud and history. moses warned the jews ahead, saying they will be destroyed if they did not belive Acts 3:23 they had 40 years warning

thee Good news of Christ ,the word of God continue to move forward, in these events in time and has never stop


Historically it does not seem as a celebration ,40 years after christ was crucify 40 years to the day in 70AD? Rome herself was in a power stuggle leading up to these events who will be leadership, even titus himself was not celebration Titus reportedly refused to accept a wreath of victory, as he claimed that he had not won the victory on his own, but had been the vehicle through which their God had manifested his wrath against his people.[SUP] titus fullfilled thee warnings moses gave instruction about :)[/SUP]

Revelation 11:11 And after three days and an half the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.

Revelation 11:12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.

this has to be physical ,not spiritual ,their enemies beheld them just as the men of Galilee witness Jesus ascension into heaven. i belive it will be as in Acts 1:11

Caesar ??? Rome ??? Vespasian??? titus ??? The unbeliving Jews??? fullfilled this wow seriously :eek:
don't have the energy at the moment to do an OT-hebraism search.
please do it yourself.
recall that John was actually Elijah.
anyways
love zone
 
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plussizedstickbug

Guest
Zone thank you for this thread. And thank you all for participating in it. I have not used the internet at all until 2008. Even then I only used it for bills and my shopping. I can not lay things out like you all do. I can not gather the scriptures like you all do. I am not a person educated in ministry or any education past high school years ago.
It makes no difference to me about the person and their personal feelings. I pay that no mind.
I find useful seeing the scriptures laid out in order to what they correlate and regard to.
This gives me a chance to hear see and have a mind and heart that accepts it.
I am not looking for a rejection of it but for it to be laid out so I can also see it.
If I see the scripture I believe the scripture above all else even my own feelings.
The pros the cons the separate ideas or opinions does not effect me.
It shows the scriptures of each one.
In the end I chose the scripture that is laid out and what it says.
You all can do that.
You all have done that.
Not all can.
Thanks so much unto all.
Peace of mind comes from the scriptures.
It is hard to even study our own selves when we do not have the talent to lay out the scripture like that.
I want to be sure what I believe.
You all are great all of you are.
Thanks.
 
R

RachelBibleStudent

Guest
you are a legend in your own mind.
you haven't caught me in a single lie.
i haven't lied.

you live in denial.
that would be......your issue.
listing all of the lies you have been caught in would be off topic for this thread...though technically this entire thread really owes its existence to your serious character flaws in the first place...

however in an attempt to keep things on topic i will just point out the lies you have been caught in on this particular thread...

in this post you claimed that references that don't line up word for word are 'direct quotations'...-by definition- that claim is false...

in this post you make the absolutely -delusional- claim that 'everyone in the world' except me sees that revelation 11:8 refers to jerusalem...a claim which is easily shown to be a brazen lie by the votes against that view in the poll and the posts against it in this thread...

in this post you rewrite a passage from daniel 9 as you claimed i saw it...when in reality i don't hold to that view of daniel 9...and you -knew that- because we had discussed it before...

there are also the numerous times in this thread where you have insinuated that i believe babylon is the vatican...which is -not- my belief as i have explained many times...

there are also a few other lies of yours that i will omit because they were only tangentially related to the topic of this thread or otherwise off topic entirely...

but from what i have already listed...that is four lies from you in twenty pages...on average -a lie every five pages-

and that is just on one thread out of your over 21,000 posts...

i rest my case...
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
such desperation.
:rolleyes:
yawn
so you call it 'desperation' to insist on interpreting scripture according to what it -actually says- as opposed to what you -wish it says-?

God isn't sloppy in his use of language...he didn't inspire ezekiel and john to choose specific and -different- words just so that 2,000 years later you could blur the lines and equivocate their words to pretend they are talking about the same thing...
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
LOL rachel....my 'humiliation'?
some people are capable of realizing when they are embarrassing and discrediting themselves...evidently you aren't one of them...
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
So that would mean the two witnesses already came, were slain, resurrected and were taken up to Heaven? Do you believe they were the law and the prophets, or others, or they haven't come yet?
the law and prophets are in books...books don't lie dead...nor do they come back to life...and the law and prophets were not and cannot be removed to heaven either...

now i am going to include a copy of part of a response i posted when you mentioned this same question earlier...

the two witnesses are called lampstands...

revelation 11:4..."These are the two olive trees and the two lampstands that stand before the Lord of the earth."

what lampstands symbolize is defined for us in chapter one...

revelation 1:20..."As for the mystery of the seven stars which you saw in My right hand, and the seven golden lampstands: the seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches."

so the two witnesses who are two lampstands would be two churches...

interestingly there are two churches that jesus does not criticize in chapters two and three...smyrna and philadelphia...
at the end of that post i had also pointed out the interesting coincidence of the 'synagogue of satan' also being associated with smyrna and philadelphia...
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
Acts 10
[SUP]39 [/SUP]And we are witnesses of all things which He did both in the land of the Jews and in Jerusalem, whom theykilled by hanging on a tree. [NKJV]

[SUP]39 [/SUP]We ·saw [witnessed] what Jesus did in [[SUP] [/SUP]the region/country of] Judea and in Jerusalem, but the Jews in Jerusalem [[SUP] [/SUP]they] killed him by hanging him on a ·cross [[SUP]L[/SUP]tree]. [Expanded Version]


[SUP]39 [/SUP]And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree: [KJV]

Why even mention Jerusalem, because Luke is making a point of what the Jew did to Christ in Jerusalem, just because it wasn't within the city walls doesn't make it not Jerusalem.
grammatically speaking this passage does -not- say that jesus was crucified in jerusalem...

looking at the text using the rules of grammar...the prepositional phrase 'in jerusalem' refers back to 'all the things which he did'...it is -those things- that happened in jerusalem according to acts 10...not the crucifixion itself...

peter mentioned jerusalem because in the same sentence he had just mentioned the things jesus had done...and jesus did many of those things in jerusalem...

and finally being outside the city walls -does- mean jesus was no longer in jerusalem...earlier in this thread i had posted proof from scripture that to be outside the walls of a city means that you are not in the city...the most important proof was the fact that a person who killed someone accidentally could be executed by the 'avenger of blood' right up until he was taken into the gate of a city of refuge...he wasn't saved just by coming within walking distance of the city...

in fact john himself writes in his gospel that jesus was crucified -near- jerusalem...near jerusalem and -in- jerusalem are mutually exclusive...so he was no longer in jerusalem when he was crucified...
 
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Married_Richenbrachen

Guest
Thanks Rachel. I probably skipped over your earlier response, because I was waiting for a response from Zone. I think I'm fairly familiar with the eschatology you talk about - its pretty popular these days. I was more interested in hearing from Zone, as I hadn't heard what she said before, and she seems quite level headed.

at the end of that post i had also pointed out the interesting coincidence of the 'synagogue of satan' also being associated with smyrna and philadelphia...
That certainly is an interesting point that I'd never noticed before. So the true churches can be noted by their opposition to the Judaisers, perhaps?
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
Thanks Rachel. I probably skipped over your earlier response, because I was waiting for a response from Zone. I think I'm fairly familiar with the eschatology you talk about - its pretty popular these days. I was more interested in hearing from Zone, as I hadn't heard what she said before, and she seems quite level headed.

That certainly is an interesting point that I'd never noticed before. So the true churches can be noted by their opposition to the Judaisers, perhaps?
actually now that i think about it i am pretty sure i had originally posted that in response to something someone else said...user names longer than ten letters often all look the same to me...

i know only a handful of other people who agree that the two witnesses are two churches...so i don't think it is all that popular...

i am not inclined to think that the 'synagogue of satan' refers to judaizers...christ only tells john to write that those of the synagogue of satan falsely claim to be jews...he never says they ever claimed to be christians...which is what judaizers claim to be while they preach their judaistic legalism...
 
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Married_Richenbrachen

Guest
i am not inclined to think that the 'synagogue of satan' refers to judaizers...christ only tells john to write that those of the synagogue of satan falsely claim to be jews...he never says they ever claimed to be christians...which is what judaizers claim to be while they preach their judaistic legalism...
If not Judaisers, maybe present day Israel, then? I think Israelis claim to be Jews, but mostly I think they are Europeans and Khazars, right? (Of the Jewish religion, obviously).
 
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RachelBibleStudent

Guest
If not Judaisers, maybe present day Israel, then? I think Israelis claim to be Jews, but mostly I think they are Europeans and Khazars, right? (Of the Jewish religion, obviously).
you can search the forum for my opinion on the khazar idea...it is another settled issue i don't feel inclined to revisit yet again...

regarding the synagogue of satan...i wouldn't identify them with present day israel either...i lean towards thinking the synagogue of satan was a reference to something specifically in the first century...

maybe they are those jews who engaged in things like the worship of angels that are mentioned elsewhere in the new testament...an 'angel' that accepted worship could only be one of satan's angels...the sole exception being 'the angel of the lord' who was a preincarnate appearing of christ in old testament times...
 
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vic1980

Senior Member
Apr 25, 2013
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DO NOT SKIP ONE SINGLE PART OF IT, READ IT COMPLETELY THANKS :)

After re-read the original post , most of the scripture posted was fullfilled before the events in 70 AD

Isaiah 1:9- Captives carried to Babylon

Jeremiah 7:34- Exile to babylon

Isiaiah 1:7- Destruction of first temple,Juda,Jerusalem as written in Jeremiah

Lamentation 1 - She has become a slave exile to babylon

Jeremiah 2 - They did not fear God

Jeremiah 3- Again they did not fear God

Jeremiah 5 - Gather them against you from every side the destruction of the first temple

Jeremiah 22- House became desolated/they worship other Gods example Queen of heaven

Jeremiah 23- Jeremiah was speaking upon the false prophets that lie to the people in his lifetime

Ezekiel 23- burn up there houses/ distruction of first temple

Jeremiah 36: 29And thou shalt say to Jehoiakim king of Judah, Thus saith the LORD; Thou hast burned this roll, saying, Why hast thou written therein, saying, The king of Babylon shall certainly come and destroy this land, and shall cause to cease from thence man and Beast? 30Therefore thus saith the LORD of Jehoiakim king of Judah; He shall have none to sit upon the throne of David: and his dead body shall be cast out in the day to the heat, and in the night to the frost. 31And I will punish him and his seed and his servants for their iniquity;and I will bring upon them, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and upon the men of Judah ,all the evil that I have pronounced against them; but they hearkened not.

Jeremiah 44 The word that came to Jeremiah concerning all the Jews which dwell in the land of Egypt, which dwell at Migdol, and at Tahpanhes, and at Noph, and in the country of Pathros, saying, 2Thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel; Ye have seen all the evil that I have brought upon Jerusalem, and upon all the cities of Judah; and, behold, this day they are a desolation, and no man dwelleth therein. 3Because of their wickedness which they have committed to provoke me to anger, in that they went to burn incense, and to serve other gods, whom they knew not, neither they,ye,nor your fathers. 4Howbeit I sent unto you all my servants the prophets, rising early and sending them, saying, Oh, do not this abominable thing that I hate. 5But they hearkened not, nor inclined their ear to turn from their wickedness,to burn incense unto other gods. 6 Wherefore my fury and mine anger was poured forth, and was kindled in the cities of Judah and in the streets of Jerusalem; and they are wasted and desolate,as at this day. 7Therefore now thus saith the LORD, the God of hosts, the God of Israel; Wherefore commit ye this great evil against your souls, to cut off from you man and woman, child and suckling, out of Judah, to leave you none to remain; 8 In that ye provoke me unto wrath with the works of your hands, burning incense unto other gods in the land of Egypt,whither ye be gone to dwell, that ye might cut yourselves off,and that ye might be a curse and a reproach among all the nations of the earth? 9Have ye forgotten the wickedness of your fathers, and the wickedness of the kings of Judah, and the wickedness of their wives, and your own wickedness, and the wickedness of your wives, which they have committed in the land of Judah, and in the streets of Jerusalem? 10They are not humbled even unto this day, neither have they feared, nor walked in my law , nor in my statutes, that i set before you and your fathers.11Therefore thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel; Behold, I will set my face against you for evil, and to cut off all Judah. 12And I will take the remnant of Judah, that have set their faces to go into the land of Egypt to sojourn there, and they shall all be consumed, and fall in the land of Egypt; they shall even be consumed by the sword and by the famine: they shall die, from the least even unto the greatest, by the sword and by the famine: and they shall be an execration, and an astonishment, and a curse, and a reproach. 13 For I will punish them that dwell in the land of Egypt,as I have punished Jerusalem, by the sword, by the famine, and by the pestilence: 14So that none of the remnant of Judah, which are gone into the land of Egypt to sojourn there, shall escape or remain, that they should return into the land of Judah, to the which they have a desire to return to dwell there: for none shall return but such as shall escape.

The Stubbornness of the People
15Then all the men which knew their wives had burned incense unto other gods,and all the women that stood by, a great multitude,even all the people that dwelt in the land of Egypt, in Pathros, answered Jeremiah,saying,16 As for the word that thou hast spoken unto us in the name of the LORD, we will not hearken unto thee. 17But we will certainly do whatsoever thing goeth forth out of our own mouth, to burn incense unto the queen of heaven,and to pour out drink offerings unto her, as we have done, we, and our fathers, our kings, and our princes, in the cities of Judah, and in the streets of Jerusalem: for then had we plenty of victuals, and were well, and saw no evil. 18But since we left off to burn incense to the queen of heaven, and to pour out drink offerings unto her, we have wanted all things, and have been consumed by the sword and by the famine. 19And when we burned incense to the queen of heaven, and poured out drink offerings unto her, did we make her cakes to worship her, and pour out drink offerings unto her, without our men?


The Final Judgment
20Then Jeremiah said unto all the people, to the men, and to the women, and to all the people which had given him that answer, saying, 21The incense that ye burned in the cities of Judah, and in the streets of Jerusalem, ye, and your fathers, your kings, and your princes, and the people of the land, did not the LORD remember them, and came it not into his mind? 22So that the LORD could no longer bear, because of the evil of your doings, and because of the abominations which ye have committed; therefore is your land a desolation, and an astonishment, and a curse, without an inhabitant, as at this day. 23Because ye have burned incence, and because ye have sinned against the LORD, and have not obayed the voice of the LORD, nor walked in his law,nor in his statutes, nor in his testimonies; therefore this evil is happened unto you, as at this day.

Jeremiah 52


The Fall of Jerusalem Recounted
(Psalm 74:1-23; Psalm 79:1-13)
1Zedekiah was one and twenty years old when he began to reign, and he reigned eleven years in Jerusalem. And his mother's name was Hamutal the daughter of Jeremiah of Libnah. 2And he did that which was evil in the eyes of the LORD, according to all that Jehoiakim had done. 3For through the anger of the LORD it came to pass in Jerusalem and Judah,till he had cast them out from his presence,that Zedekiah rebelled against the king of Babylon. 4And it came to pass in the ninth year of his reign, in the tenth month, in the tenth day of the month, that Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon came, he and his army, against Jerusalem, and pitched against it, and built forts against it round about.5So the city was besieged unto the eleventh year of king Zedekiah. 6And in the fourth month, in the ninth day of the month, the Famine was sore in the city, so that there was no Bread for the people of the land. 7Then the city was broken up, and all the men of war fled,and went forth out of the city by night by the way of the gate between the two walls, which was by the king's garden; (now the Chanldeans were by the city round about:) and they went by the way of the plain. 8But the army of the Chaldeans pursued after the king, and overtook Zedekiah in the plains of Jericho; and all his army was scattered from him. 9Then they took the king, and carried him up unto the king of Babylon to Riblah in the land of Hamath; where he gave judgment upon him. 10And the king of Babylon slew the sons of Zedekiah before his eyes: he slew also all the princes of Judah in Riblah. 11Then he put out the eyes of Zedekiah; and the king of Babylon bound him in chains, and carried him to Babylon, and put him in prison till the day of his death.


The Temple and the City Burned

12Now in the fifth month, in the tenth day of the month, which was the nineteenth year of Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon, came Nebuzaeadan,captain of the guard,which served the king of Babylon, into Jerusalem, 13And burned the house of the LORD, and the king's house; and all the houses of Jerusalem, and all the Houses of the great men, burned he with fire: 14 And all the army of the Chaldeans, that were with the captain of the guard,brake down all the walls of Jerusalem round about. 15Then Nebuzaradan the captain of the guard carried away captive certain of the poor of the people, and the residue of the people that remained in the city, and those that fell away, that fell to the king of Babylon, and the rest of the multitude.16But Nebuzaradan the captain of the guard left certain of the poor of the land for vinedressers and for husbandmen.

These historical events sould reminds us, of something that occur in 70 Ad by a man name titus does it not miss zone.Twice it has been completely surrounded by it enemy to for its distruction , twice it's temple has fallen by her enemy, twice it has been burn to the ground with fire... it has been desolated twice, twice the survivors where taken away to another country exile, that is why it cannot be mystery Babylon the Great.

Now in this age Jerusalem it is built up once again ,but without the temple because Jesus clearly said your house is left unto you desolate, thee Jew's called it The house of the LORD the Temple, it was earthy Jerusalem Glory to all the nations nothing like it back then. But Jesus made a better temple of belivers in the holyspirit that represents the true temple that is not made with hands of man as we have written in the book of acts :) now onto a ...

Summary
The Temple Solomon built was destroyed by fire on the 9th or 10th of Ab in 585 or 586 B.C. (depending on which biblical scholar is doing the research). Just 656 or 657 years later on the 9th of Ab in 70 A.D., the Temple that Herod built was also destroyed.

The destruction of both Solomon's Temple and Herod's Temple on the 9th of Ab seems to indicate that, when God's patience comes to an end with his chosen people, he removes his presence and the physical symbolism of his presence from among them to be a witness to future generations that there is a price to pay for disobedience to him .

If the punishment of the great prositute ,that sits on many waters that fornificated with the kings of the earth, is the same as the events when they destroy the temple the first time around, that does not seem to fit a great wrath of God by the context we have in the bible.

God bless you all in Jesus mighty name
 

vic1980

Senior Member
Apr 25, 2013
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reminder of past events

"What was the Babylonian captivity/exile?"

The Babylonian captivity or exile refers to the time period in Israel’s history when Jews were taken captive by King Nebuchadnezzar II of Babylon. It is an important period of biblical history because both the captivity/exile and the return and restoration of the Jewish nation were fulfillments of Old Testament prophecies.

God used Babylon as His agent of judgment against Israel for their sins of idolatry and rebellion against Him. There were actually several different times during this period (607-586 B.C.) when the Jews were taken captive by Babylon. With each successive rebellion against Babylonian rule, Nebuchadnezzar would lead his armies against Judah until they laid siege to Jerusalem for over a year, killing many people and destroying the Jewish temple, taking captive many thousands of Jews, and leaving Jerusalem in ruins.

As prophesied in Scripture, the Jewish people would be allowed to return to Jerusalem after 70 years of exile. That prophecy was fulfilled in 537 B.C., and the Jews were allowed by King Cyrus of Persia to return to Israel and begin rebuilding the city and temple. The return under the direction of Ezra led to a revival among the Jewish people and the rebuilding of the temple.

Under the reign of King Nebuchadnezzar II, the Babylonian Empire spread throughout the Middle East, and around 607 B.C., King Jehoiakim of Judah was forced into submission, becoming a vassal to Nebuchadnezzar (2 Kings 24:1). It was during this time that Nebuchadnezzar took many of the finest and brightest young men from each city in Judah captive, including Daniel, Hananiah (Shadrach), Mishael (Meshach) and Azariah (Abednego). After three years of serving Nebuchadnezzar, Jehoiakim of Judah rebelled against Babylonian rule and once again turned to Egypt for support. After sending his army to deal with Judah’s revolt, Nebuchadnezzar himself left Babylon in 598 B.C. to deal with the problem. Arriving in Jerusalem around March of 597 B.C., Nebuchadnezzar laid siege to Jerusalem, taking control of the area, looting it, and taking captive with him Jehoikim’s son, Jehoiachin, his family, and almost all of the population of Judah, leaving only the poorest people of the land (2 Kings 24:8-16).

At that time Nebuchadnezzar appointed King Zedekiah to rule as his representative over Judah, but after nine years and still not having learned their lesson, Zedekiah led Judah in rebellion against Babylon one final time (2 Kings 24–25). Influenced by false prophets and ignoring Jeremiah’s warnings, Zedekiah decided to join a coalition that was being formed by Edom, Moab, Ammon and Phoenicia in rebellion against Nebuchadnezzar (Jeremiah 27:1-3). This resulted in Nebuchadnezzar again laying siege to Jerusalem. Jerusalem fell in July 586 B.C., and Zedekiah was taken captive to Babylon after seeing his sons killed before him and then having his eyes plucked out (2 Kings 25). At this time Jerusalem was laid to waste, the temple destroyed and all the houses burned. The majority of the Jewish people were taken captive, but, again, Nebuchadnezzar left a remnant of poor people to serve as farmers and vinedressers (2 Kings 25:12).

The books of 2 Chronicles and 2 Kings deal with much of the time leading up to fall of both the Northern Kingdom and Judah. They also cover the destruction of Jerusalem by Nebuchadnezzar and the beginning of the Babylonian captivity. Jeremiah was one of the prophets during the time leading up to the fall of Jerusalem and the exile, and Ezekiel and Daniel were written while the Jews were in exile. Ezra deals with the return of the Jews as promised over 70 years before by God through the prophets Jeremiah and Isaiah. The book of Nehemiah also covers the return and rebuilding of Jerusalem after the exile was over.

The Babylon captivity had one very significant impact on the nation of Israel when it return to the land- it would never again be corrupted by the idolatry and false gods of the surrounding nations. A revival among Jews took place after the return of the Jews to Israel and the rebuilding of the temple. We see those accounts in Ezra and Nehemiah as the nation would once again return to the God who had delivered them from their enemies.

Just as God had promised through the prophet Jeremiah, God judged the Babylonians for their sins, and the Babylonian Empire fell to the armies of Persia ., once again proving God’s promises to be true.

The seventy-year period of the Babylonian captivity is an important part of Israel’s history, and Christians should be familiar with it. Like many other Old Testament events, this historical account demonstrates God’s faithfulness to His people, His judgment of sin, and the surety of His promises.


 
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doulos

Guest


yes, according to some, God is pleased with prayers stuck into the cracks of a Roman Wall.
no king but Caesar.

Jesus doesn't come into this at all for those who just plainly reject that He was crucified outside the camp - STILL part of that great city, Mystery Babylon the Great Harlot, earthly Jerusalem. where HE WAS CRUCIFIED.

oh but that's a mystical world-city-something.
no, not Jerusalem.

Matthew 23:38
See, your house is left to you desolate.

or maybe He meant to say

Whatever 23:38
See, your house is left to you temporarily desolate, and in the 'end-times' it will be restored and i'll be pleased with the fact you did not know the time of your visitation.

and a few chapters prior to that, He surely didn't mean this:

Matthew 21:43
The Parable of the Wicked Tenants
42Jesus said to them, "Did you never read in the Scriptures, 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone; THIS CAME ABOUT FROM THE LORD, AND IT IS MARVELOUS IN OUR EYES '? 43"Therefore I say to you, the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a people, producing the fruit of it.
As this discussion is about mystery Babylon and not about how one is saved I must ask why stray from the topic? Can you show us where someone in this thread other then you said
God is pleased with prayers stuck into the cracks of a Roman Wall.
no king but Caesar
If not then why derail the thread by changing the subject?
Is it because of your inability to admit your error you feel the need to use the despicable tactic of misrepresenting (I.E. lying about) what some one else believes in order to confuse the issue and take the focus off your Scripturally bankrupt argument?


Zone you say mystery Babylon is Jerusalem. Scripture tells us Jerusalem is a holy city.
Neh_11:1 And the rulers of the people dwelt at Jerusalem: the rest of the people also cast lots, to bring one of ten to dwell in Jerusalem the holy city, and nine parts to dwell in other cities.
Dan_9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
Rev_11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

So I ask Zone could “MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH” be holy? If not then how could mystery Babylon be the holy city Jerusalem? After all if the holy city of Jerusalem is (as you say) Babylon then wouldn’t that also make Babylon a holy city?


Rev 18:24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

Zone did Jerusalem exist when Cain slew Abel? Does Jerusalem contain the blood of those killed in the recent attack that occurred in the mall in Kenya? If not then how could Babylon be a literal city? Is there any literal city that has existed from the time Cain slew Abel that still exists today and on into our future?
 
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doulos

Guest
listing all of the lies you have been caught in would be off topic for this thread...though technically this entire thread really owes its existence to your serious character flaws in the first place...

however in an attempt to keep things on topic i will just point out the lies you have been caught in on this particular thread...

in this post you claimed that references that don't line up word for word are 'direct quotations'...-by definition- that claim is false...

in this post you make the absolutely -delusional- claim that 'everyone in the world' except me sees that revelation 11:8 refers to jerusalem...a claim which is easily shown to be a brazen lie by the votes against that view in the poll and the posts against it in this thread...

in this post you rewrite a passage from daniel 9 as you claimed i saw it...when in reality i don't hold to that view of daniel 9...and you -knew that- because we had discussed it before...

there are also the numerous times in this thread where you have insinuated that i believe babylon is the vatican...which is -not- my belief as i have explained many times...

there are also a few other lies of yours that i will omit because they were only tangentially related to the topic of this thread or otherwise off topic entirely...

but from what i have already listed...that is four lies from you in twenty pages...on average -a lie every five pages-

and that is just on one thread out of your over 21,000 posts...

i rest my case...
Rachel don’t let it bother you. Those who are diligently seeking the truth will see through the despicable tactics employed by Zone. They will see that she resorts to misrepresnting (I.E. lying about) the beliefs of others in order to discredit them. It’s not really your problem, it is her problem. After all she is the one who will be held accountable for those misrepresentations (I.E. lies), not you.
 
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doulos

Guest
This does not link Mystery Babylon to the 21st Century?
This was what was to soon come upon Old Covenant Israel!
In the destruction of the once Holy City Jerusalem.
There is no link to these Scriptures and the 21st Century, and that is my point!
The link I have to share with you is the destruction of the City and Temple in 70 ad.
It wasn't just about 70AD nor is it just about a future place. For the following verse to be true Babylon cannot be constrained by time or location.

Rev 18:24And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.
For Babylon to contain the blood of all slain upon the earth she had to exist from the time Cain slew Abel on into our future when the last person to be slain upon the earth is slain. This effectively rules out the possibility that Babylon is a literal city.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
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listing all of the lies you have been caught in would be off topic for this thread...though technically this entire thread really owes its existence to your serious character flaws in the first place...

however in an attempt to keep things on topic i will just point out the lies you have been caught in on this particular thread...

in this post you claimed that references that don't line up word for word are 'direct quotations'...-by definition- that claim is false...

in this post you make the absolutely -delusional- claim that 'everyone in the world' except me sees that revelation 11:8 refers to jerusalem...a claim which is easily shown to be a brazen lie by the votes against that view in the poll and the posts against it in this thread...

in this post you rewrite a passage from daniel 9 as you claimed i saw it...when in reality i don't hold to that view of daniel 9...and you -knew that- because we had discussed it before...

there are also the numerous times in this thread where you have insinuated that i believe babylon is the vatican...which is -not- my belief as i have explained many times...

there are also a few other lies of yours that i will omit because they were only tangentially related to the topic of this thread or otherwise off topic entirely...

but from what i have already listed...that is four lies from you in twenty pages...on average -a lie every five pages-

and that is just on one thread out of your over 21,000 posts...

i rest my case...
THAT'S IT?

:)

mmmmkay then:rolleyes:
good work rachel.