Mystery, Babylon the Great - earthly Jerusalem?

[ProphetExcalibur]

Vic, I don't understand your point or reasoning here? Jerusalem is where Jesus was crucified!
He was beaten, whipped, paraded, mocked, and the order to crucify Him came from within the City
Walls of Jerusalem, they led Him outside the city walls where the Romans crucified criminals;
but He was crucified in Jerusalem. Just because it was outside the City Walls, it was still the City proper.
I know people want to argue a point until their the last man standing, but Jesus was not led to a neighboring community.
Basically by the Governor of the region or City of Jerusalem, the order was given to Crucify Him!

 

[zone]

was this comment directed at me, or the 20+ people that do not agree that Jerusalem is Mystery Babylon the Great? These thread / forums are open for the public to discuss diff views on the bible ,perhaps one can dismiss themself these feeling by not creating threads with poles if there views do not match there personal views idea on the bible ?

who are the two witness to you ?

Picking up my cross, and keep on Following Christ peace

vic, i don't care if 1,000 people said Jerusalem was not that great city - where The Lord was crucified, and i was the only one who did. Islam is making the very same claims as those who deny Jerusalem was the great city - and that the Lord was crucified there - based on the same faulty error (LIE).

 

[zone]

AFTER THE GOLDEN CALF INDIGNATION, REJECTED BY THE PEOPLE - GOD REMOVED HIMSELF FROM THEIR PRESENCE - AND WAS MET BY THE MEDIATOR - MOSES - OUTSIDE THE CAMP.

and yet He still gave his Only Son.
who also was rejected, and was also sent OUTSIDE THE CAMP.

because GOD LOVED HIS PEOPLE AND GAVE HIS ONLY SON. in Jerusalem.
NOWHERE ELSE.

Exodus 32:25-28
And when Moses saw that the people had broken loose (for Aaron had let them break loose, to the derision of their enemies), 26then Moses stood in the gate of the camp and said, “Who is on the LORD’s side? Come to me.” And all the sons of Levi gathered around him. And he said to them, “Thus says the LORD God of Israel, ‘Put your sword on your side each of you, and go to and fro from gate to gate throughout the camp, and each of you kill his brother and his companion and his neighbor.’” And the sons of Levi did according to the word of Moses. And that day about three thousand men of the people fell.


Exodus 33:7-11
"Now Moses used to take a tent and pitch it outside the camp some distance away, calling it ‘the tent of meeting.’ Anyone inquiring of the Lord would go to the tent of meeting outside the camp. And whenever Moses went out to the tent, all the people rose and stood at the entrances to their tents, watching Moses until he entered the tent. As Moses went into the tent, the pillar of cloud would come down and stay at the entrance, while the Lord spoke with Moses. Whenever the people saw the pillar of cloud standing at the entrance to the tent, they all stood and worshiped, each at the entrance to his tent. The Lord would speak to Moses face to face, as a man speaks with his friend. Then Moses would return to the camp, but his young aide Joshua son of Nun did not leave the tent"


....

of all the Books written to peoples concerning the new covenant, WHO would know what outside the camp meant?
would it be.....Hebrews?

Hebrews 13
11For the flesh of these animals, whose blood The High Priest brought to The Holy Place for the sake of sins, was burned outside of the camp. 12Because of this, Yeshua also suffered outside of the city to sanctify his people by his blood. 13We also, therefore, should go out to him outside of the camp, while we bear his reproach 14For we have no city here that abides, but we look for that which is coming. - Aramaic Bible in Plain English

(For we have no city here that abides, but we look for that which is coming - oh...i thought there was a coming 1,000 year kingdom in that city)

......

still preaching the gospel to Israel here:

Acts 2
29“Brothers, I may say to you with confidence about the patriarch David that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day. 30Being therefore a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him that he would set one of his descendants on his throne, 31he foresaw and spoke about the resurrection of the Christ, that he was not abandoned to Hades, nor did his flesh see corruption. 32This Jesus God raised up, and of that we all are witnesses. 33Being therefore exalted at the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he has poured out this that you yourselves are seeing and hearing. 34For David did not ascend into the heavens, but he himself says,

“‘The Lord said to my Lord,
Sit at my right hand,
35 until I make your enemies your footstool.’

36Let all the house of Israel therefore know for certain that God has made him both Lord and Christ, this Jesus whom you crucified.”

37Now when they heard this they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Brothers, what shall we do?” 38And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself.” 40And with many other words he bore witness and continued to exhort them, saying, “Save yourselves from this crooked generation.” 41So those who received his word were baptized, and there were added that day about three thousand souls.

Acts 2 ESV


still Israel:

Acts 6
Seven Chosen to Serve
1Now in these days when the disciples were increasing in number, a complaint by the Hellenistsa arose against the Hebrews because their widows were being neglected in the daily distribution. 2And the twelve summoned the full number of the disciples and said, “It is not right that we should give up preaching the word of God to serve tables. 3Therefore, brothers,b pick out from among you seven men of good repute, full of the Spirit and of wisdom, whom we will appoint to this duty. 4But we will devote ourselves to prayer and to the ministry of the word.” 5And what they said pleased the whole gathering, and they chose Stephen, a man full of faith and of the Holy Spirit, and Philip, and Prochorus, and Nicanor, and Timon, and Parmenas, and Nicolaus, a proselyte of Antioch. 6These they set before the apostles, and they prayed and laid their hands on them.

7And the word of God continued to increase, and the number of the disciples multiplied greatly in Jerusalem, and a great many of the priests became obedient to the faith.

Stephen Is Seized
8And Stephen, full of grace and power, was doing great wonders and signs among the people. 9Then some of those who belonged to the synagogue of the Freedmen (as it was called), and of the Cyrenians, and of the Alexandrians, and of those from Cilicia and Asia, rose up and disputed with Stephen. 10But they could not withstand the wisdom and the Spirit with which he was speaking. 11Then they secretly instigated men who said, “We have heard him speak blasphemous words against Moses and God.” 12And they stirred up the people and the elders and the scribes, and they came upon him and seized him and brought him before the council, 13and they set up false witnesses who said, “This man never ceases to speak words against this holy place and the law, 14for we have heard him say that this Jesus of Nazareth will destroy this place and will change the customs that Moses delivered to us.” 15And gazing at him, all who sat in the council saw that his face was like the face of an angel.

and possibly the best New Testament history lesson for the Israelites (see entire chapter):

Acts 7
....30“Now when forty years had passed, an angel appeared to him in the wilderness of Mount Sinai, in a flame of fire in a bush. 31When Moses saw it, he was amazed at the sight, and as he drew near to look, there came the voice of the Lord: 32‘I am the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob.’ And Moses trembled and did not dare to look. 33Then the Lord said to him, ‘Take off the sandals from your feet, for the place where you are standing is holy ground. 34I have surely seen the affliction of my people who are in Egypt, and have heard their groaning, and I have come down to deliver them. And now come, I will send you to Egypt.’

35“This Moses, whom they rejected, saying, ‘Who made you a ruler and a judge?’—this man God sent as both ruler and redeemer by the hand of the angel who appeared to him in the bush. 36This man led them out, performing wonders and signs in Egypt and at the Red Sea and in the wilderness for forty years. 37This is the Moses who said to the Israelites, ‘God will raise up for you a prophet like me from your brothers.’ 38This is the one who was in the congregation in the wilderness with the angel who spoke to him at Mount Sinai, and with our fathers. He received living oracles to give to us. 39Our fathers refused to obey him, but thrust him aside, and in their hearts they turned to Egypt, 40saying to Aaron, ‘Make for us gods who will go before us. As for this Moses who led us out from the land of Egypt, we do not know what has become of him.’ 41And they made a calf in those days, and offered a sacrifice to the idol and were rejoicing in the works of their hands. 42But God turned away and gave them over to worship the host of heaven, as it is written in the book of the prophets:

“‘Did you bring to me slain beasts and sacrifices,
during the forty years in the wilderness, O house of Israel?
43 You took up the tent of Moloch
and the star of your god Rephan,
the images that you made to worship;
and I will send you into exile beyond Babylon.’

44“Our fathers had the tent of witness in the wilderness, just as he who spoke to Moses directed him to make it, according to the pattern that he had seen. 45Our fathers in turn brought it in with Joshua when they dispossessed the nations that God drove out before our fathers. So it was until the days of David, 46who found favor in the sight of God and asked to find a dwelling place for the God of Jacob.a 47But it was Solomon who built a house for him. 48Yet the Most High does not dwell in houses made by hands, as the prophet says,

49 “‘Heaven is my throne,
and the earth is my footstool.
What kind of house will you build for me, says the Lord,
or what is the place of my rest?
50 Did not my hand make all these things?’

51“You stiff-necked people, uncircumcised in heart and ears, you always resist the Holy Spirit. As your fathers did, so do you. 52Which of the prophets did your fathers not persecute? And they killed those who announced beforehand the coming of the Righteous One, whom you have now betrayed and murdered, 53you who received the law as delivered by angels and did not keep it.”

The Stoning of Stephen
54Now when they heard these things they were enraged, and they ground their teeth at him. 55But he, full of the Holy Spirit, gazed into heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God. 56And he said, “Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God.” 57But they cried out with a loud voice and stopped their ears and rushed togetherb at him. 58Then they cast him out of the city and stoned him. And the witnesses laid down their garments at the feet of a young man named Saul. 59And as they were stoning Stephen, he called out, “Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.” 60And falling to his knees he cried out with a loud voice, “Lord, do not hold this sin against them.” And when he had said this, he fell asleep.

Acts 7 ESV


are we still in Israel here?
in Judea?
was this event in Jerusalem?

or was Stephen stoned in The Vatican or the United Nations?
is this event real? was the city real?

"Then they cast him out of the city and stoned him."

were they any less responsible because it was outside the city?
SERIOUSLY?

 

[vic1980]

AFTER THE GOLDEN CALF INDIGNATION, REJECTED BY THE PEOPLE - GOD REMOVED HIMSELF FROM THEIR PRESENCE - AND WAS MET BY THE MEDIATOR - MOSES - OUTSIDE THE CAMP.

and yet He still gave his Only Son.
who also was rejected, and was also sent OUTSIDE THE CAMP.

because GOD LOVED HIS PEOPLE AND GAVE HIS ONLY SON. in Jerusalem.
NOWHERE ELSE.

Exodus 32:25-28
And when Moses saw that the people had broken loose (for Aaron had let them break loose, to the derision of their enemies), 26then Moses stood in the gate of the camp and said, “Who is on the LORD’s side? Come to me.” And all the sons of Levi gathered around him. And he said to them, “Thus says the LORD God of Israel, ‘Put your sword on your side each of you, and go to and fro from gate to gate throughout the camp, and each of you kill his brother and his companion and his neighbor.’” And the sons of Levi did according to the word of Moses. And that day about three thousand men of the people fell.


Exodus 33:7-11
"Now Moses used to take a tent and pitch it outside the camp some distance away, calling it ‘the tent of meeting.’ Anyone inquiring of the Lord would go to the tent of meeting outside the camp. And whenever Moses went out to the tent, all the people rose and stood at the entrances to their tents, watching Moses until he entered the tent. As Moses went into the tent, the pillar of cloud would come down and stay at the entrance, while the Lord spoke with Moses. Whenever the people saw the pillar of cloud standing at the entrance to the tent, they all stood and worshiped, each at the entrance to his tent. The Lord would speak to Moses face to face, as a man speaks with his friend. Then Moses would return to the camp, but his young aide Joshua son of Nun did not leave the tent"


....

of all the Books written to peoples concerning the new covenant, WHO would know what outside the camp meant?
would it be.....Hebrews?

Hebrews 13
11For the flesh of these animals, whose blood The High Priest brought to The Holy Place for the sake of sins, was burned outside of the camp. 12Because of this, Yeshua also suffered outside of the city to sanctify his people by his blood. 13We also, therefore, should go out to him outside of the camp, while we bear his reproach 14For we have no city here that abides, but we look for that which is coming. - Aramaic Bible in Plain English

(For we have no city here that abides, but we look for that which is coming - oh...i thought there was a coming 1,000 year kingdom in that city)

......

still preaching the gospel to Israel here:

Acts 2
29“Brothers, I may say to you with confidence about the patriarch David that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day. 30Being therefore a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him that he would set one of his descendants on his throne, 31he foresaw and spoke about the resurrection of the Christ, that he was not abandoned to Hades, nor did his flesh see corruption. 32This Jesus God raised up, and of that we all are witnesses. 33Being therefore exalted at the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he has poured out this that you yourselves are seeing and hearing. 34For David did not ascend into the heavens, but he himself says,

“‘The Lord said to my Lord,
Sit at my right hand,
35 until I make your enemies your footstool.’

36Let all the house of Israel therefore know for certain that God has made him both Lord and Christ, this Jesus whom you crucified.”

37Now when they heard this they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Brothers, what shall we do?” 38And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself.” 40And with many other words he bore witness and continued to exhort them, saying, “Save yourselves from this crooked generation.” 41So those who received his word were baptized, and there were added that day about three thousand souls.

Acts 2 ESV


still Israel:

Acts 6
Seven Chosen to Serve
1Now in these days when the disciples were increasing in number, a complaint by the Hellenistsa arose against the Hebrews because their widows were being neglected in the daily distribution. 2And the twelve summoned the full number of the disciples and said, “It is not right that we should give up preaching the word of God to serve tables. 3Therefore, brothers,b pick out from among you seven men of good repute, full of the Spirit and of wisdom, whom we will appoint to this duty. 4But we will devote ourselves to prayer and to the ministry of the word.” 5And what they said pleased the whole gathering, and they chose Stephen, a man full of faith and of the Holy Spirit, and Philip, and Prochorus, and Nicanor, and Timon, and Parmenas, and Nicolaus, a proselyte of Antioch. 6These they set before the apostles, and they prayed and laid their hands on them.

7And the word of God continued to increase, and the number of the disciples multiplied greatly in Jerusalem, and a great many of the priests became obedient to the faith.

Stephen Is Seized
8And Stephen, full of grace and power, was doing great wonders and signs among the people. 9Then some of those who belonged to the synagogue of the Freedmen (as it was called), and of the Cyrenians, and of the Alexandrians, and of those from Cilicia and Asia, rose up and disputed with Stephen. 10But they could not withstand the wisdom and the Spirit with which he was speaking. 11Then they secretly instigated men who said, “We have heard him speak blasphemous words against Moses and God.” 12And they stirred up the people and the elders and the scribes, and they came upon him and seized him and brought him before the council, 13and they set up false witnesses who said, “This man never ceases to speak words against this holy place and the law, 14for we have heard him say that this Jesus of Nazareth will destroy this place and will change the customs that Moses delivered to us.” 15And gazing at him, all who sat in the council saw that his face was like the face of an angel.

and possibly the best New Testament history lesson for the Israelites (see entire chapter):

Acts 7
....30“Now when forty years had passed, an angel appeared to him in the wilderness of Mount Sinai, in a flame of fire in a bush. 31When Moses saw it, he was amazed at the sight, and as he drew near to look, there came the voice of the Lord: 32‘I am the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham and of Isaac and of Jacob.’ And Moses trembled and did not dare to look. 33Then the Lord said to him, ‘Take off the sandals from your feet, for the place where you are standing is holy ground. 34I have surely seen the affliction of my people who are in Egypt, and have heard their groaning, and I have come down to deliver them. And now come, I will send you to Egypt.’

35“This Moses, whom they rejected, saying, ‘Who made you a ruler and a judge?’—this man God sent as both ruler and redeemer by the hand of the angel who appeared to him in the bush. 36This man led them out, performing wonders and signs in Egypt and at the Red Sea and in the wilderness for forty years. 37This is the Moses who said to the Israelites, ‘God will raise up for you a prophet like me from your brothers.’ 38This is the one who was in the congregation in the wilderness with the angel who spoke to him at Mount Sinai, and with our fathers. He received living oracles to give to us. 39Our fathers refused to obey him, but thrust him aside, and in their hearts they turned to Egypt, 40saying to Aaron, ‘Make for us gods who will go before us. As for this Moses who led us out from the land of Egypt, we do not know what has become of him.’ 41And they made a calf in those days, and offered a sacrifice to the idol and were rejoicing in the works of their hands. 42But God turned away and gave them over to worship the host of heaven, as it is written in the book of the prophets:

“‘Did you bring to me slain beasts and sacrifices,
during the forty years in the wilderness, O house of Israel?
43 You took up the tent of Moloch
and the star of your god Rephan,
the images that you made to worship;
and I will send you into exile beyond Babylon.’

44“Our fathers had the tent of witness in the wilderness, just as he who spoke to Moses directed him to make it, according to the pattern that he had seen. 45Our fathers in turn brought it in with Joshua when they dispossessed the nations that God drove out before our fathers. So it was until the days of David, 46who found favor in the sight of God and asked to find a dwelling place for the God of Jacob.a 47But it was Solomon who built a house for him. 48Yet the Most High does not dwell in houses made by hands, as the prophet says,

49 “‘Heaven is my throne,
and the earth is my footstool.
What kind of house will you build for me, says the Lord,
or what is the place of my rest?
50 Did not my hand make all these things?’

51“You stiff-necked people, uncircumcised in heart and ears, you always resist the Holy Spirit. As your fathers did, so do you. 52Which of the prophets did your fathers not persecute? And they killed those who announced beforehand the coming of the Righteous One, whom you have now betrayed and murdered, 53you who received the law as delivered by angels and did not keep it.”

The Stoning of Stephen
54Now when they heard these things they were enraged, and they ground their teeth at him. 55But he, full of the Holy Spirit, gazed into heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God. 56And he said, “Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God.” 57But they cried out with a loud voice and stopped their ears and rushed togetherb at him. 58Then they cast him out of the city and stoned him. And the witnesses laid down their garments at the feet of a young man named Saul. 59And as they were stoning Stephen, he called out, “Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.” 60And falling to his knees he cried out with a loud voice, “Lord, do not hold this sin against them.” And when he had said this, he fell asleep.

Acts 7 ESV


are we still in Israel here?
in Judea?
was this event in Jerusalem?

or was Stephen stoned in The Vatican or the United Nations?
is this event real? was the city real?

"Then they cast him out of the city and stoned him."

were they any less responsible because it was outside the city?
SERIOUSLY?

"Then they cast him out of the city and stoned him." I agree with this because scripture back it up, if it did not i would not continue replying to you sister zone

Book of numbers & Joshua cleary identifies the city being in the middle, pastureland being outside the city. These cities where fortified cities with entrances/gates, six city of refuge that were fortified cities with entrances in Israel aswell as the City of Jerusalem.

Thee Six city of refuge where fortified cities, as well as the city of Jerusalem, to be inside you had to enter her gates to leave you left out her gates.

Book of Jeremiah explain this aswell when the Lord spoke to him to stand in the gate of the children of the people, where by the kings of Judah come in, and by the which they go out, and in all the gates of Jerusalem.

King David also has given us a clear discription in the book of psalms of the city of Jerusalem which he called "The House of the Lord" a clear discription one had to be within thy gates to be in the city ,even the palaces where within the wall of the city of Jerusalem.

Jesus was crucify outside the wall of the city of Jerusalem outside the gates in a place called Golgotha yes or no ?
in the pastureland of Jerusalem where the location of Golgotha was at that time "near the city" ? English & Spanish version on John 19:20 clearly state the samething ,english "near the city" spanish "cerca de la cuidad" now we have stephen same thing outside the city, the entrace gate to go in and out as we have scripture to back this up in the books of Numbers,Joshua,Jeremiah,Psalms i do not read greek so i can't say anything on John 19:20 in that language, I am just sharing what is written in the bible it's not my scripture .

Israel,Judea,Jerusalem are all there, I just don't understand why it is written as the "Great city where the Lord was Crucified"
If there are other scripture in the bible ,that tell us the definition of enterining a city and leaving a city? It's like living in miami and living in the city of miami, two diffrent things there many places in miami that have there own city.

I understand the diffrence, between earthly Jerusalem and the apostale people who rejected Jesus. I ask earlier on why it was written in that discription, because there scripture to distinguish the diffrence on what measurments a city has and bondaries on where your no longer inside a city "Great city where the Lord was Crucified" i'll just pray on this

I still cannot agree that Mystery Bablon the Great was Jerusalem , Due to the facts that there are still blood of martyrs & saints of Jesus Christ after the events of 70Ad and the fall of roman empire.

zone: or was Stephen stoned in The Vatican or the United Nations?

vic1980: that made me lol seriously

God bless you sister zone and everyone in Jesus mighty name peace

 

[RickShafer]

Prophecy can be figurative?
Who knew?
What idiots.

 

[Abiding]

whats the point? implications? whats the mystery?
is it a mystery if its Jerusalem?

I know the answer...but wanted a newer review about the point please.

 

[RickShafer]

You will get it if you read Rev. 17 and 18.
What 'city' rules over the kings of the earth? (Does Jerusalem rule over China....has it ever?)
And so many others to even be mentioned in history had not heard of it, or the three religions it fosters.

 

[RickShafer]

God does this on purpose.
He always gives a material facade to mislead those walking by sight.
He does it with intent.
Why?
Take a wild, wild, wild guess.

 

[vic1980]

Hebrews 13:12 Because of this, Yeshua also suffered outside of the city to sanctify his people by his blood.= Jesus Christ outside of the city agree

Acts 7:58 Then they cast him out of the city and stoned him. = Stephen cast out of the city agree

Revelation 11:8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified = now it can be fullfilled ------- time------ gap

Scripture clearly states Jesus was crucified outside of Jerusalem walls outside the city. As we have a understandnng of scripture in Numbers,Joshua,Jeremiah, psalms, & thee Book of Acts , that jerusalem is a city that is compact together only way you are inside the city its by the gates of the city. Also in John 19:20 when he was crucified was near the city in spanish and english .Some year's later after the events of 70 Ad, in Jerusalem there was built a church added to the old city called The holy sepulchre church, they claim that is where he was crucified the place called Golgotha and build a new wall & a new gate that was not part of the original structure of the old city, making it now thee city where our lord was crucify fullfilled , some many many years ago after the events of 70 Ad, and now the time gap lol------------- Now the 2 witnesses And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city can be fullfilled .There is your newer review about the point

Still do not see the connection, on how earthly Jerusalem can be Mystery Babylon the Great N00ooooo just No!!!

God bless you all

 

[Married_Richenbrachen]

Mystery Babylon is still with us, isn't she? So I couldn't vote, because although I believe Mystery Babylon is Jerusalem (and also the Pharisees around the world who practice the Babylonian religion), she is still with us, and hasn't yet been exposed for the harlot she is, and destroyed by the Beast (the nations?) upon which she rides.

I am definitely not certain of this, but it makes more sense to me that Jerusalem is Babylon rather than Rome, because Rome isn't the mother of prostitutes (Israel was married to God first), and my understanding is that Roman Catholicism is a daughter of Judaism/Babylonian Talmudism, rather than the other way around.

 

[RaptureDate]

Could be America, if Rev 18 is the detail of the 7th (short) world empire described in Rev 17 then America very much fits the bill and would be the "snare" that comes on all the earth that Jesus talks about in Luke. See linkedIn Group "Jesus Returns" or www.rapture-date.com

 

[Bookends]

Could be America, if Rev 18 is the detail of the 7th (short) world empire described in Rev 17 then America very much fits the bill and would be the "snare" that comes on all the earth that Jesus talks about in Luke. See linkedIn Group "Jesus Returns" or www.rapture-date.com

If your so called Rapture doesn't happen when you say, 2017-2018, are you willing stop your date setting and leave the man made theories of dispensationalism? If this doesn't happen, will you admit this site or those who teach such things are false teacher(s) and prophet(s)?

 

[Married_Richenbrachen]

Was there a continuation thread for this one, or did the topic sort of just die in the water?

I believe good exegesis shows that Babylon is Jerusalem (or Israel) rather than Rome, America etc. However, I was interested in the belief that much of this has already taken place, and how that is reconciled with other details, like the 2 witnesses being slain, then raised up to Heaven, and all the merchants weeping and wailing when they saw the smoke of Babylon's burning, etc.

How much of Revelation has already occurred, and how much is yet to occur? I would be very interested to continue this thread, either here or in another one.

 

[doulos]

Neh_11:1 And the rulers of the people dwelt at Jerusalem: the rest of the people also cast lots, to bring one of ten to dwell in Jerusalem the holy city, and nine parts to dwell in other cities.
Dan_9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
Rev_11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
Rev 18:24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

I find it sad that many would claim the holy city of Jerusalem is mystery Babylon. Obviously mystery Babylon which according to Scripture is “ the mother of harlots and abominations of the earth” is not holy so it can’t be a holy city which effectively eliminates the holy city of Jerusalem. Nor can it be a literal city for there is no literal city that has existed from the time Cain slew Able on into our future when the last person to be slain on this earth is slain. There is no literal city that can meet the requirement of having the blood of all slain upon the earth. I don’t claim to have all the answers but I suspect mystery Babylon might be a conglomeration of false religions or a system that is based on power, greed, envy and lust which is what drives people to commit murder.

May God bless your studies!

 

[Bookends]

You will get it if you read Rev. 17 and 18.
What 'city' rules over the kings of the earth? (Does Jerusalem rule over China....has it ever?)
And so many others to even be mentioned in history had not heard of it, or the three religions it fosters.

Earth = Land. At one time God did reside in the temple in Jerusalem, and at one time Jerusalem was on top. Did God choose any other city in which to reside it, if only temporary.

BTW, Good luck waiting for your ONE city to rule the world...I'll be waiting to see it.

 

[gocardinals25]

I believe that God showed me that mystery babylon was America when he first came to me

 

[zone]

Neh_11:1 And the rulers of the people dwelt at Jerusalem: the rest of the people also cast lots, to bring one of ten to dwell in Jerusalem the holy city, and nine parts to dwell in other cities.
Dan_9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
Rev_11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
Rev 18:24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

I find it sad that many would claim the holy city of Jerusalem is mystery Babylon. Obviously mystery Babylon which according to Scripture is “ the mother of harlots and abominations of the earth” is not holy so it can’t be a holy city which effectively eliminates the holy city of Jerusalem. Nor can it be a literal city for there is no literal city that has existed from the time Cain slew Able on into our future when the last person to be slain on this earth is slain. There is no literal city that can meet the requirement of having the blood of all slain upon the earth. I don’t claim to have all the answers but I suspect mystery Babylon might be a conglomeration of false religions or a system that is based on power, greed, envy and lust which is what drives people to commit murder.

May God bless your studies!

you've never been able to read Daniel 9 without making that 70th week a magic week; and without having unbelieving jews who are hostile to the gospel saved by some merciful blinding.

you know...that 70th week where the decree for it's destruction was mentioned; the roman-jewish wars were mentioned; and the desolation of it is mentioned.

no, you need Jerusalem to be holy and God's city today because you need him to be ticked off at the DOR, calling it the AOD.

you will never understand God was through with earthly Jerusalem in 70AD.

 

[zone]

yes, according to some, God is pleased with prayers stuck into the cracks of a Roman Wall.
no king but Caesar.

Jesus doesn't come into this at all for those who just plainly reject that He was crucified outside the camp - STILL part of that great city, Mystery Babylon the Great Harlot, earthly Jerusalem. where HE WAS CRUCIFIED.

oh but that's a mystical world-city-something.
no, not Jerusalem.

Matthew 23:38
See, your house is left to you desolate.

or maybe He meant to say

Whatever 23:38
See, your house is left to you temporarily desolate, and in the 'end-times' it will be restored and i'll be pleased with the fact you did not know the time of your visitation.

and a few chapters prior to that, He surely didn't mean this:

Matthew 21:43
The Parable of the Wicked Tenants
42Jesus said to them, "Did you never read in the Scriptures, 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone; THIS CAME ABOUT FROM THE LORD, AND IT IS MARVELOUS IN OUR EYES '? 43"Therefore I say to you, the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a people, producing the fruit of it.

 

[ProphetExcalibur]

Was there a continuation thread for this one, or did the topic sort of just die in the water?

I believe good exegesis shows that Babylon is Jerusalem (or Israel) rather than Rome, America etc. However, I was interested in the belief that much of this has already taken place, and how that is reconciled with other details, like the 2 witnesses being slain, then raised up to Heaven, and all the merchants weeping and wailing when they saw the smoke of Babylon's burning, etc.

How much of Revelation has already occurred, and how much is yet to occur? I would be very interested to continue this thread, either here or in another one.

This thread and others like it, is probably far from over, because of the wide division of the camps that are here.
One camp believing in some manner, that earthly Jerusalem was and is Mystery Babylon the great; and the other camp spiritualize and mystify this city to be something in the unforeseen future.

The problem lies here: The ancient Prophets of Israel foretold of a Great and terrible day of the Lord! They referred to it as the end of days and the last days. What they seen and could not comprehend, and what horrified them, was that the only world they ever knew was going to come to an end. This was not the physical world but the 7 day creation covenant in Adam, a time when Old Covenant Israel would no longer be God's chosen people! Christ Jesus became the New Adam, and the New Creation. { Now what does this have to do with Mystery Babylon and the question at hand? } If you understand what the great and terrible day of the Lord is, you cannot separate it from it's (the prophecy in Revelation) being fulfilled in real time as it was being written. In the prophecy it says about Jesus, Who, .....Is, and Was, and Is to Come.... Some of these things had just taken place, some were taking place, and some were still yet to come, before 70 ad. If however you have been taught that the great and terrible day of the Lord, has to do with the end of God's creation proper, or the physical universe. Then you were also taught, or you are really forced, to spiritualize or mystify everything else and cast it into the future also. Now! Anyone can be the Antichrist or the man of sin, anyone or thing can be the 2 witnesses, Anything can be Mystery Babylon the Great Whore, Any one can be the 2 Beasts, anything can be the mark of the Beast 666, anything can be the 4 horsemen of the Apocalypse, now nothing is connected to this time of Jesus, the destruction of the Temple in 70 ad, or Old Covenant Israel in general. So, now the Catholic Church in Rome, or Islam, or the USA is Mystery Babylon; or the Pope, or a pretending Jew, or someone from Islam is the Antichrist, etc.......... Once these false images of Covenant Prophecy has been set in people's minds it is almost impossible for them to be removed.

 

[RachelBibleStudent]

Jesus doesn't come into this at all for those who just plainly reject that He was crucified outside the camp - STILL part of that great city, Mystery Babylon the Great Harlot, earthly Jerusalem. where HE WAS CRUCIFIED.

'outside the camp' is not part of the camp
'outside the gate of jerusalem' is not part of jerusalem

you have been shown numerous times from the scriptures that jesus cannot be said to have been crucified in jerusalem...but evidently you -just don't care- what God's word says...