Need clarity regarding this Predestination thing and something related to an election?

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Milee777

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Dec 24, 2018
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Again, if I could raise one from the dead, I would go around and raise others, too. Also, when was the last time someone walked on water?

By the logic used by some on here, if Peter walked on water, so can they.
Yes!! God saved me!! Now THAT'S a miracle!!

Soli Deo Gloria
But do u have an inner desire that what happened in Jesus's times happen today also?
 

Milee777

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Dec 24, 2018
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So
Yes. However, He has placed people in the body to guide the body. But He is the ultimate leader.
So a Church without Him as a leader... and without His presence and guidance and where people instead of God are glorified .. Is a church which needs a kick... Aint it.
 

Sackcloth-N-Ashes

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Oct 25, 2018
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But do u have an inner desire that what happened in Jesus's times happen today also?
Yes, but my bigger desire is to know the bible theologically, exegetically and contextually. I just don't see paralyzed(para and quadriplegic) people walking again just by someone laying hands on them. I also do not see terminally ill people being healed instantly. I desire to see these things happen, but I have a bigger desire to see God's will fulfilled.
 

Sackcloth-N-Ashes

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Oct 25, 2018
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So

So a Church without Him as a leader... and without His presence and guidance and where people instead of God are glorified .. Is a church which needs a kick... Aint it.
No. They need disbanded. That is not a NT church but some sort of social club. He is the head of His church, and an assembly of people who He is not the head of, is not a NT church.
 
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See Matthew 11:21,23
Thanks, I forgot about this one. Not sure why it did not come up in my search.

I think these are extreme cases. And go with the other verses we spoke about. Remembering that Sodom and Gemorrah will know they deserve their fate. Which is why it will be worse for Israel. Because their attitude was they deserved the right to be entered in. And will be cast out.

I believe if we look, Like in the 400 years God Told abraham his people would have to wait, because the sin of the ammorite was not yet complete, because their was still hope for them. There was still people following God and others who would come to God.After 400 years, they came to a state of unbelief that Nothing God could have done (except for maybe sending them Christ in the flesh) could convince them to repent. They were without hope (lets not forget Rahab, Out of all the people. A sinner (prostitute) knew Gods power. And did not chose to go against it. Risking her own life. And God saved Her!

I also think of Ninevah, A sinful nation, Whom God sent Jonah kicking and screaming, who repented. I think we have witnessed this over the centuries where God has sent missionaries in dangerous areas and people have Come to God.

Granted, As in your example. If Jesus came to those cities. Sodom would still be here today, and The others would have repented. But thats an extreme example s it not? I think jesus going to any nation and doing what he did. Other than a nation whi thinks they are Gods people because of how great they are. Could get many to repent. But is God going to do this for all nations? Plus if we think, look at all th egentiles who repented at Pauls preaching, BECAUSE Christ came to Israel.

I hope this makes sense, sorry took so long, been a busy few days.
 
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So you dont believe that God still speaks in a still small voice...like a whisper..
The HS was sent to convict the world of sin rightousness and judgment,

They do nto believe in the power of God to change hearts, by his word, and get people ready for the word when it comes. They believe he has to regenerate them first.
 
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Check Todd White... Healings still take place. You can check on net about him. He prays for people and for their healing and many get healing right there... And his videos are there on Youtube. Lifestyle Christianity is his ministry.
Be careful my friend, Most of these have been proven as fraudulent money hungry people trying to get people to empty their pockets in the name of God offering then a false hope.
 
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Well, either I am insane and do not have the Spirit of Truth, or God imputed his salvation, faith, divine love, understanding of the truth, and every burning desire to please him. I never sought it out. Never believed enough to care to ask for it. 20 years later istill scratch my head and am beside myself at the changes in desires and many other things i have been compelled to fulfil. Imputed but not imposed because it is the best thing that will ever happen to me in the flesh. He draws with such compelling grace that if I didn't do the things he compelled me to do it sucked to the point of almost unbearable. ...just speaking fr om personal experiance. What about Paul? He didn't have much choice?
Paul had a choice, He could have still rebelled.

If anyone thinks they had no choice. I do not think they understand the character of God.
 
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We cannot raise all of our relatives from the dead to spend extra time with them... I believe to discern whom to raise from the dead.. that is to discern God's will regarding a person, we need God's guidance.
The last time someone was raised from the dead..?well, There are testimonies about it on the net. Why would someone fake this one... When it is glorying Jesus.
Is it though?

Jesus used those miracles to draw people to him, Especially in this 1st centuryt, Because he was tryign to build a church out of basically 11 leaders and spread it to the world.

Does God need to do miracles to draw people to him today? Well maybe in some third world countries. But I would not suspect many of these so called holy roller churches today are Gods work.
 
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So are you ever gonna believe in a miracle in your life....
We had a sister who had a serious lung disease, and also 2 spots on her lung, she was said to be terminal. We as a group prayed for her for a few months, Askign for Gods will to be done. The girl in question went back for a follow up visit. And she was completely healed of these things. The doctors could not explain it.

That was a miracle. Done because of the prayer of people. I believe this is how God does things today.
 
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But do u have an inner desire that what happened in Jesus's times happen today also?
For me. No, Why would I? What purpose would it serve?

Again, As jesus said, A wicked and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, and non will be given to it.
 

Hevosmies

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Sep 8, 2018
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I will try to answer this as precisely as I can my friend. Notice who and at what time 1 and 2 Corinthians were written. If you read through Acts of the Apostles, you will notice that Paul's writings cover that time when the Acts of the Apostles was written. Look at all that transpired during this 'Apostolic Age'...

Spirit comes upon them and they speak with new tongues(Acts 2).
Ananias and Sapphira die after lying to the Holy Spirit(Acts 5).
Peter raises Dorcas from the dead(Acts 9).
Paul raises Eutychus from the dead(Acts 20).
Peter heals a crippled man(Acts 3).
Paul is bit by a snake and receives no harm whatsoever(Acts 28).
Cornelius receives a vision from an angel(Acts 10).
Peter is rescued from prison by an angel(Acts
Apostles released from prison by an angel(Acts 5).
Stephen sees Jesus right before he dies(Acts 7).
Paul is knocked to the ground and has a conversation with Jesus(Acts 9).
Peter walks through a street and his shadow heals them it comes across(Acts 5).
And there are many more that I have not even mentioned. It was during this time Paul wrote 1 and 2 Corinthians. These sign gifts were part of the Apostolic Age, and it helped to confirm the church in her beginning.

John, James, and Peter also wrote during this time. Look at something James wrote...

Effective Prayer

13 Is anyone among you suffering? He should pray. Is anyone cheerful? He should sing praises. 14 Is anyone among you sick? He should call for the elders of the church, and they should pray over him after anointing him with olive oil in the name of the Lord. 15 The prayer of faith will save the sick person, and the Lord will restore him to health; if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven. 16 Therefore, confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, so that you may be healed. The urgent request of a righteous person is very powerful in its effect.(James 5)

Now, my whole life, I have witnessed churches practicing the laying on of hands, even before I was saved. I have witnessed churches laying hands on sick people, some use oil some do not. I have seen them have prayer cloths(a gross misapplication of Paul's doing in Acts 19) given. In James, he said these who have hands laid upon them WILL save this sick person and the Lord WILL restore their health. I have yet to see any healed. Also, it says any sins they committed, they will be forgiven them. James gives a guarantee that those who are sick will be healed and brought back to health.

Seeing how this does not work today makes me believe this, as well as the other sign gifts, ceased when the last Apostle died.
Thanks for answering brother.

I agree that not everyone is always healed. I believe it depends on God's will. I have seen some healed, and some not healed. I have been healed myself (DOCTOR VERIFIED) but there is a bunch of stuff I HAVENT been healed from.

I dont know how God operates or where, and its none of my business really.

“And this is the confidence that we have in Him, that if we ask anything according to His will, He hears us.” - 1 John 5:14
 
Mar 14, 2011
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Thanks for answering brother.

I agree that not everyone is always healed. I believe it depends on God's will. I have seen some healed, and some not healed. I have been healed myself (DOCTOR VERIFIED) but there is a bunch of stuff I HAVENT been healed from.

I dont know how God operates or where, and its none of my business really.

“And this is the confidence that we have in Him, that if we ask anything according to His will, He hears us.” - 1 John 5:14
According to his will Amen.

Thats why when we pray. Even for healing, it must be in according with Gods will. God may not will to heal a persons so his answer may say no. We have to trust him no matter how he answers
 

Macabeus

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Dec 27, 2018
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They are his sheep. His born again children. They hear the gospel after they have been born again.
Not according to Ephesians 2:14 and Romans 10: 9 and forward.

Faith comes by hearing

Justification through faith.

Hearing, faith, justification, in that order. Do you hold to regeneration BEFORE justification temporally. I hold them to be similtaneous. For how can a condemned sinner who is unjustified be called a child of God and an holy one/ saint, which is what regeneration makes us

Somebody prove me wrong from scripture...
 

ForestGreenCook

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Jul 8, 2018
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Not according to Ephesians 2:14 and Romans 10: 9 and forward.

Faith comes by hearing

Justification through faith.

Hearing, faith, justification, in that order. Do you hold to regeneration BEFORE justification temporally. I hold them to be similtaneous. For how can a condemned sinner who is unjustified be called a child of God and an holy one/ saint, which is what regeneration makes us

Somebody prove me wrong from scripture...
It was Christ Jesus that justified us eternally and that was done by his faithfulness to go to the cross (Gal 2:16). We do not justify ourselves. Those that he died for are justified and they will all be in heaven with him, ever last one that he died for.
 

ForestGreenCook

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Jul 8, 2018
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Not according to Ephesians 2:14 and Romans 10: 9 and forward.

Faith comes by hearing

Justification through faith.

Hearing, faith, justification, in that order. Do you hold to regeneration BEFORE justification temporally. I hold them to be similtaneous. For how can a condemned sinner who is unjustified be called a child of God and an holy one/ saint, which is what regeneration makes us

Somebody prove me wrong from scripture...
"Saved" in Romans 10:9 is not eternal salvation. Paul is talking to some men of Israel (children of God) who have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. Salvation, according to Greek translation means "a deliverance". and there is a deliverance to the child of God when he comes unto a knowledge of the truth. He is delivered as soon as the Holy Ghost within him reveals the truth of how that Christ has delivered him eternally and he doesen't have to go about trying to establish his own righteousness. Some on this forum are in need of that deliverance.
 

Macabeus

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Dec 27, 2018
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It was Christ Jesus that justified us eternally and that was done by his faithfulness to go to the cross (Gal 2:16). We do not justify ourselves. Those that he died for are justified and they will all be in heaven with him, ever last one that he died for.
Justification is the judicial act of the Father, who declares a guilty sinner righteous based on the merits of Christ's sinless life and atoning death through faith.

A. Justificatiin is the act of God

B. On the basis and merits of Christ

C faith is the condition

D. Having heard the Gospel and bieving, we are sealed with the Spirit

The apostle Paul declares that justification is by faith, that God justifies those who believe through the propitiation of Christ. Being justified by faith we have peace with. Having heard the Word, you believed, and having believed you were sealed with the Holy Spirit ( Ephesians 2:14), by grace you are saved, through faith (Ephesians 2:9), to him that does not, but believes on God who justtifies the ungodly (Romans 4), etc.
 

Macabeus

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Dec 27, 2018
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"Saved" in Romans 10:9 is not eternal salvation. Paul is talking to some men of Israel (children of God) who have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge. Salvation, according to Greek translation means "a deliverance". and there is a deliverance to the child of God when he comes unto a knowledge of the truth. He is delivered as soon as the Holy Ghost within him reveals the truth of how that Christ has delivered him eternally and he doesen't have to go about trying to establish his own righteousness. Some on this forum are in need of that deliverance.
Righteousness is based on the merits of Christ's work, and is granted freely to those who believe and trust in the Atonement in the Life He gave for us/on our behalf That is the focal point of the book of Romans.