Not By Works

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
2,073
546
113
I just find that people that adopt this stance that salvation must be proven or the person is not saved confuse me, just like the the "salvation can be lost" group are confusing.............first they argue one way and then when they hit a wall they back peddle and try another direction, hit another wall.....I do not know why I end up with the headache, it should be them with all the walls they keep hitting. :D
Reflections are interesting things, who is actually speaking the truth and who is walking
on a lie? When everything is defined from ones own reference points, the only way of knowing
is to check everyones reference points. The side who cannot do this, are the ones who are wrong.

Self deception is the cruelest irony, because everything within ones own logic works to hide
the truth. And the reason is because another perspective will cause a change, which ones mind
and emotions cannot tolerate.

I found in Christ though, when I went in search of truth, took a route that seemed not to make sense
I returned to find Christ Himself had gone down this path, and spoke the language of clarity and
total vulnerability and overcoming with no hidden aspects or fears. I do not know why I feared so
much, or wondered how I might change, or that there was more to know which I had not seen.

It is clear, in obedience is life, because through it we see who we are, and our boundaries, and how
to build the Kingdom in our hearts and cleanse ourselves from the delusions of this world.
 

FollowHisSteps

Well-known member
Feb 15, 2019
2,073
546
113
Which is the biggest deception, to make people believe there is no way out, or that
Christ alone does everything and we just have to enjoy the ride?

Even more ironic these things are also true, but in different contexts and ways.
Only in Christ can we find the way, but by this way we are empowered to walk the
path and work through our issues with the light of the gospel and love shinning
brightly ahead.

I read a study of people who pursued mindfulness, the becoming more aware of
ones emotions and unresolved issues. It turns out without the cross and knowing
one is loved and held safe, people literally fall apart and need serious medical support
to just cope. In reality seeing the truth destroys them, and being in the dark gives them
a force to drive forward. So those who live in darkness and hide their inner conflicts do
so for good reasons, until Jesus arrives. But only if you have faith and actually believe He
is the Son of God, the deliverer of our souls. You will be shot to peices if you cannot do
this and you see yourself. Jesus was not kidding about building your house upon a rock,
and if you are on the rock, others will collapse and wash away while you go from one
state of glory to the next.

Thank you Jesus that in you we find healing, rest and direction for our efforts, Amen.
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
37,455
9,814
113
Well.....it amazes me that men/women can say that their work help save themselves and or keep them saved.....I do not understand how a gospel that detracts from Christ and places glory upon oneself can be swallowed hook, line and sinker....the bible is clear....we are saved, justified, sanctified and sealed by FAITH without ANY WORKS or DEEDS of the LAW......and those claiming good works as their ticket GET CAST and CHRIST never knew them even though they called JESUS LORD and done many wonderful works in his name.......

FAITH plus anything = not saved and NO entrance into the KINGDOM
 

UnderGrace

Senior Member
May 8, 2016
6,739
3,393
113
Well.....it amazes me that men/women can say that their work help save themselves and or keep them saved.....I do not understand how a gospel that detracts from Christ and places glory upon oneself can be swallowed hook, line and sinker....the bible is clear....we are saved, justified, sanctified and sealed by FAITH without ANY WORKS or DEEDS of the LAW......and those claiming good works as their ticket GET CAST and CHRIST never knew them even though they called JESUS LORD and done many wonderful works in his name.......

FAITH plus anything = not saved and NO entrance into the KINGDOM
No headache there ...LOL:)
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
37,455
9,814
113
I always liked Fran, no matter her current screen name and look forward to her return.
So, in your mind the sites rules mean jack and it is o.k. to break them? She was banned for a particular reason the first time and then broke the rules a second time....so....how far can we take this.....?????
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
6,472
2,155
113
Reflections are interesting things, who is actually speaking the truth and who is walking
on a lie? When everything is defined from ones own reference points, the only way of knowing
is to check everyones reference points. The side who cannot do this, are the ones who are wrong.

Self deception is the cruelest irony, because everything within ones own logic works to hide
the truth. And the reason is because another perspective will cause a change, which ones mind
and emotions cannot tolerate.

I found in Christ though, when I went in search of truth, took a route that seemed not to make sense
I returned to find Christ Himself had gone down this path, and spoke the language of clarity and
total vulnerability and overcoming with no hidden aspects or fears. I do not know why I feared so
much, or wondered how I might change, or that there was more to know which I had not seen.

It is clear, in obedience is life, because through it we see who we are, and our boundaries, and how
to build the Kingdom in our hearts and cleanse ourselves from the delusions of this world.
but you are not searching for truth, you are searching for conformation.

if you really cared about truth, you would accept the definition of the word SIN, and not refuse it, so you can fake thought yourself into thinking you can be sinless while still in the flesh.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
26,738
5,067
113
64
Florida
So, in your mind the sites rules mean jack and it is o.k. to break them? She was banned for a particular reason the first time and then broke the rules a second time....so....how far can we take this.....?????
No, don't believe it is right to violate site rules but I did find her amusing and refreshing. Personally, I hate to see anyone banned regardless of their views, or even quit the site for that matter. For some peeps that leave it feels like a death in the family.
 

UnderGrace

Senior Member
May 8, 2016
6,739
3,393
113
No, don't believe it is right to violate site rules but I did find her amusing and refreshing. Personally, I hate to see anyone banned regardless of their views, or even quit the site for that matter. For some peeps that leave it feels like a death in the family.
Well, when you are personally attacked for your beliefs you may feel differently, although I agree that when some have left I wish they had not.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
26,738
5,067
113
64
Florida
Well, when you are personally attacked for your beliefs you may feel differently, although I agree that when some have left I wish they had not.
Oh, I have indeed been attacked numerous times for my personal beliefs. I am not saying I condone her forum decorum but only was stating that I found her to be amusing, her views refreshing and that I miss her as I also miss many others that are no longer with us. Personal attacks are never called for but, please understand, we are family here and sometimes things can get a little out of hand and heated. Still, that is no excuse for poor behavior. I have said some things that I have regretted too in my posts that may have hurt or offended another member. I average 1 apology a month on this site. Believe me, I'm certainly not an angel but I do love God and try my best but at times I fail miserably and for that I am sorry.
 

Guojing

Active member
Jan 12, 2019
711
151
43
I just find that people that adopt this stance that salvation must be proven or the person is not saved confuse me, just like the the "salvation can be lost" group are confusing.............first they argue one way and then when they hit a wall they back peddle and try another direction, hit another wall.....I do not know why I end up with the headache, it should be them with all the walls they keep hitting. :D
Its called making a circular argument. :)
 

UnderGrace

Senior Member
May 8, 2016
6,739
3,393
113
Oh, I have indeed been attacked numerous times for my personal beliefs. I am not saying I condone her forum decorum but only was stating that I found her to be amusing, her views refreshing and that I miss her as I also miss many others that are no longer with us. Personal attacks are never called for but, please understand, we are family here and sometimes things can get a little out of hand and heated. Still, that is no excuse for poor behavior. I have said some things that I have regretted too in my posts that may have hurt or offended another member. I average 1 apology a month on this site. Believe me, I'm certainly not an angel but I do love God and try my best but at times I fail miserably and for that I am sorry.
I think you are being way too hard on yourself, I do not think I have read one post that was offensive by you.:)

As for the "refreshing views" umm no... works salvation does not do it for me.
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
37,455
9,814
113
but you are not searching for truth, you are searching for conformation.

if you really cared about truth, you would accept the definition of the word SIN, and not refuse it, so you can fake thought yourself into thinking you can be sinless while still in the flesh.
You can forget it......a religionist that is bound by their own refusal to see and acknowledge truth will ride that train straight off the rails......
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
37,455
9,814
113
No, don't believe it is right to violate site rules but I did find her amusing and refreshing. Personally, I hate to see anyone banned regardless of their views, or even quit the site for that matter. For some peeps that leave it feels like a death in the family.
Believe it or not....I somewhat liked her, but <---And that is a big one.....She was constantly embellishing what we said, or changing what we said or being very deceptive about what we said.... and when she went bye bye the 1st time....SHE, on purpose, done some very hurtful things, and openly admitted to attempting to get us all banned and the thread shut down........and this last TIME actually made comments about me having guns and being glad I did not know where she lived like I would come look her up and do something stupid and SHE made these comments the day of the shooting in New Zealand when some 50 people were killed and another 40 or so wounded.....it was totally uncalled for.......
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
37,455
9,814
113
I think you are being way too hard on yourself, I do not think I have read one post that was offensive by you.:)

As for the "refreshing views" umm no... works salvation does not do it for me.
I have never had a personal problem with @tourist ........maybe we have disagreed a few times possibly......but no issues as far as i can remember....but I have had jet lag about 44 times the last 4 years with 22 trips to AU and back HAHAH
 

dcontroversal

Senior Member
Dec 12, 2013
37,455
9,814
113
This is a personal testimony.....When I moved to get my life right, was studying the bible about 60 hours a week, going to seminary to catch UP on my bible knowledge from the wasted years......I was driving back to Little Rock, Arkansas from Pine Bluff one night and was scanning the radio and the song came on....Close My Eyes Forever.....and I will never forget the sinking gut feeling of sadness that overcame me thinking about the LOST and how they will have their eyes shut forever in the mists and darkness forever.....I knew then I had to make a stand for the LORD and witness to as many people as I could......the end is near and the lost will be in darkness forever....let your heart break for these people and step up to the plate and let the chips fall where they may fall!!!!!